MAH4546
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AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:23 pm

American Airlines will downgrade their daily Raleigh-London Gatwick flight to a 767-300ER starting 3 April 2006. While currently scheduled to revert to a 777-200ER on 1 September 2006, it is too early to tell. The route has been struggling lately despite being heavily subsidized, and is in danger of being discontinued.

In other AA/MAN news, Boston-Manchester service will run an extended summer season, from 3 April 2006 through 12 December 2006. Miami-Manchester service, which has not been the success that AA hoped for despite healthy loads, keeps on solidering on. The reduced schedule AA has implemented has seemed to help the route out. It has been uploaded, for now, to resume 14 December 2006, operating Thursday through Sunday.
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chrisnh
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:39 pm

Do we know if Boston-Ireland is coming back? Thanks to it being the closest U.S. gateway to Europe, airlines should do well with 757s out of Boston to 'thin' destinations. Where a 757 might be a bit unrealistic from other U.S. cities further south or west of Boston, it makes great sense for Boston. With good tailwinds, a nonstop from Boston to Shannon can be made in four hours plus. BOS-LAX is a six-hour run on a good day...and an ordeal on the 737s that AA uses now.

Chris in NH (who is old enough to remember piano-bar lounges on BOS-LAX DC-10s)

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MAH4546
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:47 pm

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 1):
Do we know if Boston-Ireland is coming back? Thanks to it being the closest U.S. gateway to Europe, airlines should do well with 757s out of Boston to 'thin' destinations.

It isn't leaving. It is year-round.
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N1120A
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:49 pm

How the hell can it be struggling? I mean, I see downgrading it to a 763ER so AA can use the 777 somewhere else, but if they sell even 1 seat, it makes money.
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:51 pm

Not saying AA should do this, but here is just a question I am wondering..

Could a 757 do RDU-LGW-RDU? if so, would it require the winglets and less seats to make the journey both ways?

Thank u...

As far as AA pulling off RDU-LGW.. it's pretty much expected. AA has pulled RDU down enough that I don't understand how the flight is still working. I'm sure that the conglomerate could get another airline to run the flight if it is desired to continue. To AA, I say.. oh well, buh-bye..
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1MillionFlyer
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:52 pm

If they daily subsidy from our Pharma friends in RDU was fixed price per departure, what have the higher fuel prices done to this "sure thing"?
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MAH4546
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:57 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 3):
How the hell can it be struggling? I mean, I see downgrading it to a 763ER so AA can use the 777 somewhere else, but if they sell even 1 seat, it makes money.

Higher fuel costs combined with reduced subisidies.

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 4):
As far as AA pulling off RDU-LGW.. it's pretty much expected. AA has pulled RDU down enough that I don't understand how the flight is still working.

The flight never relied on connections in the first place. The only connections that flights gets that are significant are low-yielding traffic from MIA to free-up MIA-LHR space for high yielding traffic.
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Molykote
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:01 pm

Quoting 1MillionFlyer (Reply 5):
If they daily subsidy from our Pharma friends in RDU was fixed price per departure, what have the higher fuel prices done to this "sure thing"?

Pardon my ignorance, but I know nothing about this route. Seeing RDU-LGW caught my eye and this post seems to allude that some interest is subsidizing the route.

Can someone fill me in?
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:02 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 4):
Could a 757 do RDU-LGW-RDU? if so, would it require the winglets and less seats to make the journey both ways?

It could be done with or without winglets.
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:08 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):
The flight never relied on connections in the first place.

I know. But as AA has been pulling routes from RDU left and right to beef up their "cash cow" Miami, I was wondering how long before they pull this one too. No big surprise. I would think that it would be a good route for Maxjet or Eos. Perhaps Glaxo could get BA to do the route..

Quoting N1120A (Reply 8):
It could be done with or without winglets.

Sweet.. could RDU-AMS/ORY/MUC work with a 757 or would they require a 767?
Aiming High and going far..
 
1MillionFlyer
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:09 pm

Quoting Molykote (Reply 7):
Can someone fill me in?

a major drug company subsidizes the route buy buying a minimum number of seats per flight every day for a fixed price per ticket
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MAH4546
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:12 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 9):
Perhaps Glaxo could get BA to do the route..

The problem is Glaxo and others aren't as willing to spend the money as they used to be. This isn't going to change if BA, who has higher fares and more premium seats to fill, flies the route.

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 9):
Sweet.. could RDU-AMS/ORY/MUC work with a 757 or would they require a 767?

RDU-MUC definitley no. RDU-CDG/AMS would likely require fuel stops on the west-bound service in all but the most ideal conditions.
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N1120A
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:13 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 9):
Sweet.. could RDU-AMS/ORY/MUC work with a 757 or would they require a 767?

With winglets maybe on the first two (though the flight would not be to ORY, it would be to CDG) and MUC would be a big stretch. In anycase, it will never happen.
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:16 pm

Quoting 1MillionFlyer (Reply 10):
a major drug company subsidizes the route buy buying a minimum number of seats per flight every day for a fixed price per ticket

Almost.. Several companies around RDU (including Glaxo, the most famous) provides a subsidy (allotment of funds) to AA to provide non-stop service to the London area from RDU. This subsidy basically provides AA a guaranteed break-even regardless if the plane goes out empty. Thus, on any seat purchased on the flight (whether full fare, deeply discounted, business, or first) becomes a profit for AA. In the past, RDU-LGW was also used as a backup for other London flights (DFW and MIA)...

Much like the London Conglomerate did with the RDU-LGW flight, there are other conglomerates looking at providing subsidies to other areas where non-stop opportunities from RDU are not available (LAX, SFO, SEA, FRA, CDG). Should AA discontinue their flight, I"m almost positive the conglomerate and RDUAA will be eagerly searching for a replacement.
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1MillionFlyer
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:37 pm

except that those subsidies need to be a floating scale over an operating period since costs can increase.

DO you know if Glaxo has agreed to pay more per seat?
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BigGSFO
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:44 pm

If RDU-LGW is cut, I wonder where AA will use the Gatwick slot.
 
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:54 pm

Quoting 1MillionFlyer (Reply 14):
except that those subsidies need to be a floating scale over an operating period since costs can increase.

DO you know if Glaxo has agreed to pay more per seat?

Wouldn't that lead to basically AA making the conglomerate pay whatever AA wants? I wouldn't do that either. Doesn't sound like a smart business move for the conglomerate. This has been a long standing agreement between AA and the conglomerate. AA can take it or leave it.. if they leave it, be gone... Perhaps Privatiar could do the LGW run..
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travisnc
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:54 pm

Everyone talks about how this flight relies completely on the Glaxo subsidies, but it's interesting to note that this flight averaged only 1.5 less people/flight than BA's BWI-LHR flight in 2004. I think that's pretty good considering the population of the Washington/Baltimore region is so much larger (even though there are several IAD-LHR flights) and the fact that flying to LHR allows so many more connections.

In 2003 the RDU-LGW flight even did better than Virgin's LAS-LGW flight. However LAS-LGW grew by 49% in 2004 to overtake RDU-LGW. RDU-LGW grew by 4%.

Also RDU-LGW averaged only 7 less people/flight than CVG-LGW. CVG, of course, has tons of feed because of their DL hub and they have a significantly larger population than the RDU area.

Switching to a 763 might be exactly what this route needs to keep it going.

Source: The UK Civil Aviation Authority
PDF: http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/80/airport...tl_Air_Pax_Route_Analysis_2004.pdf The US data starts on page 43.
 
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:57 pm

Quoting TravisNC (Reply 17):

Switching to a 763 might be exactly what this route needs to keep it going.

Has cargo decreased on this flight? I think that's one of the big reasons it was switch to the T7. I could be wrong, but just wondering...
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1MillionFlyer
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 1:58 pm

Awesome info Travis, Thanks for keeping A.net a place to learn.  Smile
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kanebear
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:30 pm

I'd bet very good money that this route is where the first 763s with the new J seats are going. That's a win, win. AA right-sizes the route, Glaxo and the rest get a VASTLY improved J product and everyone's happy.
 
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ERJ170
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:30 pm

Interesting tidbit of info from the Triangle Business Journal..

Quote "carriers serving RDU already have cut capacity to some markets to strike a better financial balance."

Sure decease capacity and let everybody flock to the only airline adding capacity. Perfect Business sense.

Quote "With RDU's load factors - the measure of how full a flight is - already averaging in the mid-80 percent range, that could make it hard for local passengers to find tickets for the flights in a price range they desire."

I don't know. If I were running an airline, I don't think i would want to let very many people get away. And there are still open opportunities out there that the LCC haven't competed on.

Quote "Back Aviation Solutions' Marty Graham, doesn't expect RDU to lose any existing carriers. But he does think it will be hard for the airport to attract new service at current pricing and capacity levels."

Is RDU priced too low to attract LCC? Huh? 80% load factor before the airlines started pulling flights.. and yet some say their was overcapacity. Hmmm..
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ss278
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:38 pm

Its the cargo which subsidises this route. The drug companies have major manufacturing facilities in Britain and have in the past bought up the enitre 777 cargo capacity to ship their drugs to the U.S. Thus most of the passenger revenue was pure gravy.

If AA is downgrading to a 767 then it would seem that the cargo revenue is perhaps declining. Should that cargo business ever go away, or decrease to the point where AA would actually have to have passengers on the flight to make it profitable, you can kiss the route good-bye.
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:10 pm

Hey TravisNC;

I would be very careful in interpreting the CAA traffic data. The data makes no mention of frequencies being offered in markets, so making statement like "xx people less/more per flight" is deceiving. In addition the size of aircraft and its seat capacity is important.
If you had the frequency information and then come up with a statistic saying carrier A operated a B747 with only 1 more person perflight then carrier B with a 767, the facts would then show a totaly different route performance then your post.

There are many of private sources plus a few public ones like the DOT that are much better providing traffic and revenue snapshots of routes.


For an example here are the 2004 load factors on the routes you mentioned.

AA RDU-LGW
Q1-47%
Q2-79%
Q3-68%
Q4-75%

BA BWI-LHR (note its LHR, not LGW per your post)
Q1-59%
Q2-73%
Q3-81%
Q4-77%

VS LAS-LGW
Q1-94%
Q2-87%
Q3-73%
Q4-88%

I could also dig up the average ticket prices, however my point being was you must be careful interpreting any data, and the CAA data only goes to prove the total direct passenger count between the cities. One cannot either rely on the change between the year over year either as that is directly related to the number of seats/flights being offered then a true reflection on the growth/decline of a market. For that you would need a proper O&D analysis.
The Virgin Vegas growth was very strong in 2004 simply as it operated more flights then in 2003.
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:17 pm

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 15):
If RDU-LGW is cut, I wonder where AA will use the Gatwick slot.

Gatwick has slots? Anyway, if they indeed do, I don't see AA doing anything to its LGW operation. If RDU-LGW is suspended, DFW-LGW will likely retain 3 daily nonstops, I can't see a fourth operating. I also don't see any other cities gaining service to LGW.

Jeremy
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:19 pm

Isn't it already a 763? The switch was made already last month.

PJ
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:56 pm

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 24):
If RDU-LGW is suspended ... I also don't see any other cities gaining service to LGW.

SJC and FLL are both "backup" cities for LGW service. Either one of them could probably support some kind of London service. I was surprised that neither got a route after PIT and STL were suspended. AA might want to transfer the authority and slot to one of those two.
 
sampa737
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Mon Dec 19, 2005 6:36 pm

If this flight is so heavily subsidized, doesn't it make it basically a charter in a sense? Drug companies have that much money to buy seats like this just to have a non-stop? No wonder drug prices are so..., okay, well that's another discussion on perhaps another website. Sorry.

Are there other routes in which companies do this? I have heard, though no sources I can quote, that much of the cargo on the MEM-AMS is loaded by Fed Ex. The flight depends on connections and passenger-wise would not survive if there were no connecting traffic.

Don't go off on me guys. I enjoy reading the threads and from time to time I chime in. Many of us in here are novices.  Smile

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Kahala777
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 3:11 am

Is RDU trading their 772 for a 763 so that LAX can maintain a 2nd departure to LHR?

KAHALA777
 
rdu777
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:12 am

JFKLGANYC,

The flight switched back to the 777 on Dec. 15th.
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:18 am

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 28):
Is RDU trading their 772 for a 763 so that LAX can maintain a 2nd departure to LHR?

KAHALA777

LAX-LHR 2x/daily is only seasonal....
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NLINK
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:55 am

It sounds like a good route for the all business class 737/32s airplane like the 1 daily IAH-AMS.
 
LambertMan
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:17 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 3):
How the hell can it be struggling? I mean, I see downgrading it to a 763ER so AA can use the 777 somewhere else, but if they sell even 1 seat, it makes money.

Just curious, but does anyone know for sure what the extent of the actual subsidies are? Obviously there has to be some sort of help given that RDU couldn't generate the necessary traffic to support a daily, year round 777 or let alone 763 to Europe.
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:23 am

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 26):
I was surprised that neither got a route after PIT and STL were suspended. AA might want to transfer the authority and slot to one of those two.

Since when did AA fly PIT-LGW?

Quoting LambertMan (Reply 33):
Just curious, but does anyone know for sure what the extent of the actual subsidies are? Obviously there has to be some sort of help given that RDU couldn't generate the necessary traffic to support a daily, year round 777 or let alone 763 to Europe.

I believe the deal had something to do with the drug companies guaranteeing a sell out of the premium cabins, which would promise a breakeven flight.
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2travel2know
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 9:50 am

If AA was to pull out of RDU-LGW, which airline would take that market? CO, NW, BA, VS? Because DL, US, UA have hubs quite near RDU...
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atrude777
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 10:06 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 34):
Since when did AA fly PIT-LGW?

It was an old US Airways route, then TWA bought it from US Airways and when AA took over they now own PIT-LGW.

Alex
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COEWR2587
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:12 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 26):

Is it me, or does anyone else not understand FLL-LGW? Would that do well?? SJC I think i can somewhat understand.
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:17 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
American Airlines will downgrade their daily Raleigh-London Gatwick flight to a 767-300ER starting 3 April 2006

Wait! AA is downgrading service from RDU?? THIS MUST BE DUE TO THE WRIGHT AMENDMENT CHANGES!! JUST LIKE THE LIMA, PERU REDUCTIONS!

I'm waiting for the press release from the DFW Airport Board to confirm this.

Rolling my eyes,

Bill
 
travisnc
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:29 pm

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 23):
Hey TravisNC;

I would be very careful in interpreting the CAA traffic data. The data makes no mention of frequencies being offered in markets, so making statement like "xx people less/more per flight" is deceiving. In addition the size of aircraft and its seat capacity is important.

Basically my point was that even though CVG & BWI serve much larger areas, CVG has tons of feed, and BWI-LHR allows much better connections, RDU does a pretty good job of keeping up on it's LGW route. I was mainly concerned with the number of passengers that's why I didn't mention any of the other variables. But, you are right the average fares, frequency, equipment used, etc, do have a big effect on the profitabilty of a flight. As far as I know LON-BWI/CVG/RDU were all scheduled for year-round, daily non-stop service in 2004.

Quote:
I could also dig up the average ticket prices, however my point being was you must be careful interpreting any data, and the CAA data only goes to prove the total direct passenger count between the cities.

If you have links to this information please post them. I, and I'm sure many others here, love looking over aviation data like that.

Quote:
BA BWI-LHR (note its LHR, not LGW per your post)

I did say BWI-LHR. One of my points was that BWI-LHR provides much more connectivity than RDU-LGW.

----------------------

I would like to ask anyone here on A.net if they can provide a link to information that shows the flight is subsidized. Everyone seems to take it as a given, but does anyone have any proof. It's quite possible that GSK does subsidize the flight, but I would like to see some source, outside A.net, that shows this and possibly provides details about the arrangement.

There are ~36 UK companies with offices in the RDU region (~174 in NC). It's possible that these companies including GSK support the flight without direct subsidies from GSK. Sony/Ericsson and The Body Shop have their US headquarters in the RDU area. The Oxford University Press, Kidde Fire Fighting, Invensys, and Misys Healthcare are four other UK companies that have operations near RDU.
 
masseybrown
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 12:57 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 34):
Since when did AA fly PIT-LGW?

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that they did. When US ceased flying PIT-LGW or when AA quit STL-LGW, somebody could have proposed using the abandoned authority for any of the allowed (but not operated) routes under Bermuda II. Two of these allowed but not operated routes are FLL and SJC to LGW.

I'm surprised that no airline has tried to transfer the authorities to another route. If AA is unhappy with RDU, that route vacancy could be another candidate for transfer. COEWR2587 thinks that FLL wouldn't work, but I think some frequency, maybe not daily or year-round, would work.

[Edited 2005-12-20 04:58:42]
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:01 pm

Your right, it is a 777 again. I was told it was a brief equipment change so the 777 could run the new India flight.

But it will go back to a 763 in the spring.

PJ
 
BigGSFO
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:27 pm

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 35):
If AA was to pull out of RDU-LGW, which airline would take that market?

Probably nobody. It's AA's slot and they can use it to any Bermuda 2 gateway. It's not up for grabs if AA pulls the flight. When AA pulled STL-LGW they simply used that Gatwick slot for a third DFW-LGW flight.

Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 36):
It was an old US Airways route, then TWA bought it from US Airways and when AA took over they now own PIT-LGW.

Correction. TWA operated this flight long before US Airways was US Airways (they were Piedmont and USAir then). TWA then transferred PIT authority to STL. US Airways applied for PIT-LGW on their own in the late 80's IIRC. That was their first flight into London (not counting PI's CLT-LGW). PHL-LGW was obtained when TWA sold (I think) the route to them a few years later.

Neither US or AA "owns the route" - no airline does. They own/lease the slot at Gatwick and can operate it to any US destination allowed under Bermuda 2.

[Edited 2005-12-20 05:30:17]

[Edited 2005-12-20 05:32:32]
 
supa7E7
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:49 pm

Maybe we should talk to our doctor about the RDU-LGW flight.
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legacyins
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:25 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 40):
Two of these allowed but not operated routes are FLL and SJC to LGW.

I do not believe SJC can serve LGW. SJC is covered under SFO, with regards to rights to the UK. When AA was interested in serving the UK from SJC, they wanted to fly into Stanstead. AA could not make the Paris route or TPE route work during the economic boon, I don't think there is a demand for this service now. SJC is no more than a blip now on AA's radar screen.
 
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RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Fri Dec 23, 2005 2:00 pm

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 43):
I do not believe SJC can serve LGW. SJC is covered under SFO, with regards to rights to the UK. When AA was

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf31/45705_web.pdf

The above is the DOT decision which gave AA backup authority to fly SJC-LGW. It also references the precedent for considering SJC a separate gateway for international flights. Upon rereading this, however, I have learned the point is moot because DOT said AA's authority, unless used, would lapse a year after the grant; it was never used and thus lapsed in 1999.

Sorry to drag this red herring across the path.
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Fri Dec 23, 2005 2:51 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 44):

The above is the DOT decision which gave AA backup authority to fly SJC-LGW. It also references the precedent for considering SJC a separate gateway for international flights. Upon rereading this, however, I have learned the point is moot because DOT said AA's authority, unless used, would lapse a year after the grant; it was never used and thus lapsed in 1999.

sux.....I wish AA made SJC a big hub again.. Sad
"Up the Irons!"
 
BigGSFO
Posts: 2219
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:27 am

RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Fri Dec 23, 2005 3:48 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 45):
sux.....I wish AA made SJC a big hub again..

So would I. Heck, I'd be happy if they just brought JFK, BOS, MIA and Hawaii back.
 
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legacyins
Posts: 1836
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 1:11 pm

RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Fri Dec 23, 2005 4:20 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 44):
Sorry to drag this red herring across the path.

Very interesting read. I stand corrected. In my opinion though, I do not believe AA would build up SJC again to the 1998 levels. SW and jetblue have a presence now and SJC has more than fifty percent of its' flights dedicated to LCC service.
 
AJMIA
Posts: 431
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:29 pm

RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Sat Dec 24, 2005 1:43 am

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 46):
So would I. Heck, I'd be happy if they just brought JFK, BOS, MIA and Hawaii back.

I imagine we will see a 4th daily MIA-SFO and maybe even a 5th before MIA-SJC returns.

IMHO I can see MIA-SAN, MIA-SEA, MIA-PHX and an early am MIA-LAS and MIA-DEN as MIA to the West expansion candidates before they try MIA-SJC again.

SJC-JFK with a 757 is probably the most likely to return.

AJMIA
Lady it's a jet... not a kite.
 
TWAAF9
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2004 4:47 am

RE: AA: RDU-LGW Becomes A 763 This Summer

Sat Dec 24, 2005 2:08 am

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 41):
Correction. TWA operated this flight long before US Airways was US Airways (they were Piedmont and USAir then). TWA then transferred PIT authority to STL. US Airways applied for PIT-LGW on their own in the late 80's IIRC. That was their first flight into London (not counting PI's CLT-LGW). PHL-LGW was obtained when TWA sold (I think) the route to them a few years later.

Additional Correction: TWA never flew PIT-LGW. However they did fly BWI-LGW and PHL-LGW, both of which authorities they sold to then US Air for $50 million around or after the sale of their Heathrow authorities to American in 1991.
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