Panther
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Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:01 pm

I been reading on other websites (www.airlinepilotcental.com) that JB is modifying the A322 winglets to bigger ones, maybe like EMB190 style.
 
icebird757
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:36 pm

We are suppose to have 2 A320s equipped with them. Once a/c will have Airbus winglets and the other a/c will have winglets from another company we are working with. If it works out with bigger winglets, the whole fleet will be retrofitted.
LGB....where you can watch the grass grow because the traffic is so slow.
 
bomber996
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:46 pm

What would these look like?

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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:51 pm

Quoting Bomber996 (Reply 2):
What would these look like?

Who wants to photoshop some AVP winglets onto an A320?
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
icebird757
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 12:55 pm

Take the blended winglets from the 737 and stick them on the A320.
LGB....where you can watch the grass grow because the traffic is so slow.
 
jetbluefan1
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:21 pm

What impact does this make on flying? Will it help with longer range through fuel efficiency? I'm not great with airplane builds and all the mechanical info so any input would be appreciated.

JetBluefan1
 
FriendlySkies
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:26 pm

Quoting Bomber996 (Reply 2):
What would these look like?

Probably ugly...
 
S12PPL
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:34 pm

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 6):
Probably ugly...

That's a pretty Good guess.... Wink

[Edited 2005-12-26 05:38:59]
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IAH744
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:37 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 3):
Who wants to photoshop some AVP winglets onto an A320?

couldnt find one, but i dont think it would look very good...

IMO they should buy a few of these and go international
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:39 pm

Quoting IAH744 (Reply 8):

IMO they should buy a few of these and go international

What you have just shown me is a really crappy 777 mod. Good job  Wink
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
IAH744
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:47 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 9):
What you have just shown me is a really crappy 777 mod. Good job

i didnt make it...
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:49 pm

Quoting Iah744 (Reply 10):
i didnt make it...

I didn't say you made it, I said you showed it to me  Wink
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werdywerd
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 1:56 pm

Will probably look something like this:

CLICK ON PHOTO TO ENLARGE


I used 737 Winglets. Quick Photoshop, nothing special.

Please note the original copyright holder of the original image. If this is not allowed please advise and I will remove at once. Thanks
 
jsposaune
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:02 pm

I dunno...I kind of like it!
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:06 pm

Actually I think from that angle it makes the A320 look like a very large Embraer 190.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
FriendlySkies
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:11 pm

I thought that was an E175 before I enlarged it...
 
jetbluefan1
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:11 pm

Yes, it definitely looks like an oversized E190. lol how funny

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APFPilot1985
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:19 pm

What really amuses me is that in a prior thread the Airbus fanboys were pointing out how the fact that the winglets had to be added to the 737NG's and the A320's already come with them was evidence of the Airbuses better design.
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:32 pm

http://rockymountainavphotos.com/Eric/basic_images/B6AVPwinglets.jpg

With Aviation Partners Boeing winglets.
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md90fan
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:37 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 14):
Actually I think from that angle it makes the A320 look like a very large Embraer 190.

I agree  Smile
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bigdrewfl
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:11 pm

Quoting JetBluefan1 (Reply 5):
What impact does this make on flying? Will it help with longer range through fuel efficiency? I'm not great with airplane builds and all the mechanical info so any input would be appreciated.

JetBluefan1

In the last pocket section we had Dave spoke about this, If effective it would give the A320 a bigger range. So it would eliminate the need for fuel stops or Capping flight for instance BUR. He also said it would save lots of money on fuel.
 
aircanada014
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:38 pm

yes it does look like a bigger version of E190
 
S12PPL
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:50 pm

Looks like crap....lol
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garpd
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:58 pm

Anyone thinking that AVP and Boeing are on the right track with their blended winglets?

I mean, the wingfences on the A320 are essentialy now a 20 year old design.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 4:00 pm

Looks good.What has the Studes prove.How Benificial.Whats Airbus's view.
regds
MEL
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 4:11 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 24):
Looks good.What has the Studes prove.How Benificial.Whats Airbus's view.

1- Studies haven't started

2- Don't know yet

3- See #2
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bigdrewfl
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 4:11 pm

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 24):
Looks good.What has the Studies prove.How Benificial.Whats Airbus's view.
regds
MEL

It was actually an independent company that brought this whole idea up, Jetblue spoke with airbus and the results show that it might very well be worth the try. So starting in a couple of months both Airbus and the independent company are going on a show off to see who can produce a better product. The winner gets to retrofit all Jetblue Planes!!!
 
GQfluffy
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:14 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 9):
What you have just shown me is a really crappy 777 mod.

Maybe more like a 767...but who's paying attention to the engines...
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TheSonntag
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:19 pm

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 6):
Probably ugly...

I guess it will be overweight, will never fly, will be too expensive, and there won't be a market for it  Wink
 
Mir
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:47 pm

It does look very much like an oversized E-Jet, which I think is a shame, because the 320 had a very nice distinctive shape, but if it saves money, I guess aesthetics comes second....

-Mir
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voodoo
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 8:15 pm

APFPilot1985 wrote:
What really amuses me is that in a prior thread the Airbus fanboys were pointing out how the fact that the winglets had to be added to the 737NG's and the A320's already come with them was evidence of the Airbuses better design.

I don't recall that but I do recall, ~10 years ago, Boeing unofficial spokeperson C.Maurin Faur (sp?) claiming on rec. or misc. transport.air-industry a similar argument of the 777s wing over that of the Airbus widebodies! Since then, of course, the 777 has sprouted raked tips and the 787 has blendeds. So even the superiority arguments appear to swing back and forth between A+B.
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Francoflier
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:05 pm

I find it ugly, but fortunately airlines CEOs don't base their judgement on that criteria...
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columba
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:10 pm

I think it gives the A320 an interesting look, I always thought that the A320 is a bit boring to watch.
So congratulations to Jetblue that they modernernising their workhorse and make it even more efficient.

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 28):
I guess it will be overweight, will never fly, will be too expensive, and there won't be a market for it

Good one  Wink
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tjwgrr
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 9:43 pm

Looks like an E190 on steroids!
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ChiGB1973
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Mon Dec 26, 2005 11:21 pm

Quoting JetBluefan1 (Reply 5):
What impact does this make on flying?

Landing in a crosswind will be a little more difficult.

M
 
Fly764
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 12:00 am

I think it looks nice, maybe this will help in avoiding fuel stops during the winter months : )
 
kaneporta1
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 12:54 am

I can confirm that Airbus is indeed working on blended winglets for the A320 after Jetblue's request. The height of the winglets will be 6'6. Flight testing will begin next year.
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MidnightMike
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 1:04 am

Quoting Kaneporta1 (Reply 36):
I can confirm that Airbus is indeed working on blended winglets for the A320 after Jetblue's request. The height of the winglets will be 6'6. Flight testing will begin next year.

Will be interesting to hear of the results, I know somebody in the Jetblue Maintainence Department, going to see if he has information that he would like to share.... Smile
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DLKAPA
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 1:30 am

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 27):
Maybe more like a 767...but who's paying attention to the engines...

I noticed that too, but to me it even looks like the engines were poorly photoshopped onto the frame.
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Jetmarc
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 1:53 am

I haven't heard about any of this at work! But I heard that jetBlue had looked at bigger winglets in the past, however, to compensate for the increase in weight of the winglets and the extra lift that would be generated, the wingspars would have to be reinforced and strengthened, therefore the cost would still outweigh the benefits. I hope this doesn't turn out to be another senario similar to the center fuel tanks we attempted to add! But if it all goes well, I say go for it! I've always been envious of those sleek winglets!!

Here's a link to an article on the new A320 winglets courtesy of Flight International.com...

Airbus Studies Large A320 Winglets

And this link provides a picture of the A340 winglet trials mentioned in the above link/article...

Awiator Winglet Ready for Tests
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flyorski
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:43 am

Quoting FLY764 (Reply 35):
maybe this will help in avoiding fuel stops during the winter months : )

That would be nice............

This could be the new 320 Craze. IF they work B6 will have an advantage. Less fuel always saves money and looks always take second place to the economics.

I would like to see a B6 787 though  Smile
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lightsaber
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:56 am

Quoting Panther (Thread starter):
We are suppose to have 2 A320s equipped with them. Once a/c will have Airbus winglets and the other a/c will have winglets from another company we are working with. If it works out with bigger winglets, the whole fleet will be retrofitted.

Wow. Thanks for the info. I was wondering if this would ever happen. I've been  flamed  for suggesting these winglets before. While the A320 is a great plane, its 20+ year old wing design can use a little help.

What I'm really curious to know about is how the winglets effect the aerodynamics with a high MTOW. In particular, do the winglets allow for the centerline tank to actually add range? Rumors I've heard suggest the A320 wing loses a disproportionate amount of efficiency near high MTOW (poor lift/drag ratio at high loadings). Theoretically, winglets should help mitigate this. Thus, winglets could improve range on two counts:
1. Their inherent efficiency.
2. By allowing the A320 to carry more fuel effectively.

I really would like to see a smaller transatlantic plane.  hyper  Alas, my crude calculations say that the A320 still won't have that range. Same calculations say an A319 will be able to do the job. Although, I'm not sure at an Easyjet spacing...

Lightsaber
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IAH744
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 3:04 am


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im still with the international theory...
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jacobin777
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 3:37 am

Quoting IAH744 (Reply 42):
im still with the international theory...

I think they'll go with the A330's and A350's first...then when they really need to pack 'em in, they will go with the A380-800 and A380-900...  Silly
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notbluejet
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 5:50 am

All these winglets have to do is guarantee BOS-LGB service with no fuel stops.... and i would say they are a success. They are not looking to go anywere new but simply optimize the current routes. No need to further test the limits of the A/C.
With the ACTS tank a bust a good winglet design would probably score the maker a good deal with B6 and many other airlines.
 
airbusA346
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:35 am

I really hate them  yuck   yuck 

Why do they need to wreck a good design any way.

Just my  twocents 

Tom.
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BritPilot777
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:20 am

I personally think it looks pretty good, makes the Airbus look even nicer!

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akjetBlue
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:34 am

Quoting GARPD (Reply 23):
Anyone thinking that AVP and Boeing are on the right track with their blended winglets?

I mean, the wingfences on the A320 are essentialy now a 20 year old design.

Wingfences from what I've been told were actually mainly designed to reduce vibrations during flight.

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 24):
Looks good.What has the Studes prove.How Benificial.Whats Airbus's view.
regds
MEL



Quoting Kaneporta1 (Reply 36):
I can confirm that Airbus is indeed working on blended winglets for the A320 after Jetblue's request. The height of the winglets will be 6'6. Flight testing will begin next year.

From the horses mouth B6 asked both Boeing and Airbus to develop an effective winglet for the A322. Guess two heads are better than one.
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MiCorazonAzul
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:36 am

It really isn't ALL about how it looks guys, although I think they look awesome. If the winglets provide some sort of benefit for our A320's then I am all in favor of it. Of course any decision made will be carefully studied by JetBlue.
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Alitalia744
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RE: Jetblue Modifying Minibus Winglets

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:49 am

Quoting Bigdrewfl (Reply 20):
In the last pocket section we had Dave spoke about this, If effective it would give the A320 a bigger range. So it would eliminate the need for fuel stops or Capping flight for instance BUR.

Maybe JetBlue nonstops can now go nonstop Smile
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