Halibut
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 5:06 am

Due to high fuel prices , the need for Ultra Long Range aircraft & Qantas's recent large Boeing order . SQ airlines needs to go with a large Boeing or all Boeing order in order to compete with there South Pacific counterpart . What Boeing currently offers are more fuel efficient ULR aircraft , some proven , some revolutionary " new 787 , 777-300 and now the 777-200LR " that I feel are needed to match Qantas's recent move . I feel Boeing has more to offer SQ due to SQ's unigue location & need for ULR aircraft .


http://www.axcessnews.com/modules/wfsection/article.php?articleid=7325

December 26, 2005


Singapore Airlines to Match Qantas Bid for Boeing Jets


By Randy Chen

SIA is considering buying more of Boeing's 777-200LR and a significant number of Boeing's new 787 Dreamliners along with up to six 747-Advance freighters. If the SIA order for Boeing airplanes comes through, it would push the US airplane manufacturer to the top manufacturer's slot against rival Arbus SAS this year.

Boeing's fuel-efficient 301-seat B777-200LR can fly 19 hours or more than 17,000 kms without refueling, a strong point in SIA's consideration in competing with Qantas Airlines

Halibut
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Stitch
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 5:21 am

Evidently SQ can't fly SYD-LHR without the approval of the Australian Government, so if QF can't make a case for it, Canberra will be sure that even if SQ could, they won't.  Smile

And Canberra shot down SQ's bid to fly direct from Australia to the United States, so SQ cannot launch SYD-LAX/SFO/ORD/DEN/IAD service to link up with UA's internal network.

So the 772LRs, if taken, will be to increase capacity on SIN-EWR/LAX and possibly launch more direct service to and from SIN-only. I hear heard SIN-JFK bounced around here - I guess to replace EWR but if an A345 can make it to EWR, I'd like to think it could get across the river to JFK, so maybe they want to serve both airports.
 
EWROwznj00
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 5:40 am

I thought the Frankfurt-JFK market was very profitable for Singapore, which is why they opted to put the non-stop to Newark, thus dropping the less profitable Amsterdam-Newark. Are the loads on Singapore-Newark good enough to merit an upgrade to the 777LR? What other routes would the 777LR be useful for? South America comes to mind, but is there demand for this, and can the 777LR do it non-stop?
Yes, there is a typo in my username. No need to point it out.
 
Halibut
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 6:15 am

http://www.etravelblackboard.com/index.asp?id=45179&nav=2

Boeing delivers first 777-300ER with fuel-efficiency enhancements to Air France
Thursday, December 01, 2005

The Boeing Company has delivered to Air France the first Boeing 777-300ER (Extended Range) airplane that includes enhancements that improve the overall fuel efficiency of the 777-300ER by 1.4 percent. This amount is in addition to the 2 percent fuel-burn improvement already proven in revenue service by the airlines that operate the 777-300ER.


Photo Credit: The Boeing Company
A 1.4 percent improvement in fuel efficiency on this airplane equates to an annual jet-fuel savings of approximately 200,000 gallons (757,000 liters).

"With fuel prices skyrocketing, we are excited that we were able to enhance the 777-300ER jetliner so it burns less fuel," said Lars Andersen, vice president for Boeing's 777 program. "Boeing took the initiative to make these changes based on discussions we had with our customers. I'm pleased that our largest 777-300ER operator, Air France, who was instrumental in working together with Boeing to help us make the airplane a reality, is the first to receive this new and improved 777-300ER.

Halibut
6 million Jews were slaughtered-Do you see Jews flying planes into buildings in Germany to kill 1000s of innocent, NO !
 
jacobin777
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Tue Dec 27, 2005 6:40 am

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 2):
What other routes would the 777LR be useful for? South America comes to mind, but is there demand for this, and can the 777LR do it non-stop

I wonder if SIN-ORD would need one, as its one of the .arger cities not being served by SIN..or maybe SIN-BOS?

..how about..SIN-DFW.....?
"Up the Irons!"
 
wedgetail737
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 6:48 am

The 777-200LR will allow Singapore Airlines to fly more people the same distance than the A345. I wouldn't be surprised if QF orders more ULR jets from Boeing.
 
QANTAS077
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:04 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
And Canberra shot down SQ's bid to fly direct from Australia to the United States, so SQ cannot launch SYD-LAX/SFO/ORD/DEN/IAD service to link up with UA's internal network.

not quite, it's expected that Canberra will allow SQ to fly BNE/MEl-USA but it won't grant access to Syd in the forseeable future.
 
kaitak744
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:08 am

The 777-200LR would allow ORD, BOS, SFO, LAX, and EWR nonstop. This alone is enough for 12 aircraft. Also, the 787-8 could be used to do YVR daily non-stop and some other Europen routes which they have non-daily service on.

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 2):
Are the loads on Singapore-Newark good enough to merit an upgrade to the 777LR?

Any route the A340-500 served is good do be replaced with the 777-200LR. Remember, the 772LR will also carry a significant amount of cargo to EWR which the A340-500 can't.

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b154/Kaitak744/A340-500.jpg
 
RichardPrice
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:10 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):

Out of interest, wheres that image from?
 
zvezda
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:11 am

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 2):
Are the loads on Singapore-Newark good enough to merit an upgrade to the 777LR?

Yes. So are the yields.

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 2):
What other routes would the 777LR be useful for? South America comes to mind, but is there demand for this, and can the 777LR do it non-stop?

Nonstop range with ETOPS180 or ETOPS207 for SIN-GRU would be about 9000nm. That's a lot farther than SIN-EWR and nearly as far as SYD-LHR. I think if SQ were to serve South America, it would be either via North America or via JNB.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
I wonder if SIN-ORD would need one, as its one of the .arger cities not being served by SIN..or maybe SIN-BOS?
SIN-ORD is next on SQ's list after SIN-SFO. SIN-BOS wouldn't make sense in anything larger than a B787-8 if that. IAD might make more sense than BOS, which has no Star Alliance feed.
..how about..SIN-DFW.....?

That's not only farther than SIN-EWR but would face more serious headwinds westbound DFW-SIN.

I think SQ would like to fly nonstop 2xLAX, 2xEWR/JFK, 1xSFO, 1xORD. I don't see any other North American nonstops for a while.
 
zvezda
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:15 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
Also, the 787-8 could be used to do YVR daily non-stop and some other Europen routes which they have non-daily service on.

SQ don't have permission to fly more than 3x weekly to YVR. Much of SQ's YVR revenue is for ICN-YVR, so there is little interest at SQ for nonstop service to YVR. The B787-8 can fly any of SIN-SFO/LAX/ORD/EWR, though it would be payload limited on the latter two.
 
AJRfromSYR
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:21 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 8):
Out of interest, wheres that image from?

I second that interest.
-AJR-
 
Xkorpyoh
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:26 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 9):
I don't see any other North American nonstops for a while.

maybe SIN -IAD to connect witht the UA hub?

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 9):
I think if SQ were to serve South America, it would be either via North America or via JNB.

it seems that MH is doing well with the KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE on a 747.
And EK has interest in flying to EZE too in the future. MAybe SQ has a market with a 777 via JNB
 
stirling
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:30 am

Boeing~SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With CF.?

Who and what is CF? Is that supposed to mean QANTAS? Or is it code for something else?
"C" is nowhere near "Q" on the keyboard, so I've ruled out a typo.....

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 8):
Out of interest, wheres that image from?



Quoting AJRfromSYR (Reply 11):
I second that interest.

And I third.
Delete this User
 
Scorpio
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Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:37 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 8):
Out of interest, wheres that image from?

I think it's pretty clear where it's from  Wink

For those of you for whom it isn't: it starts with a B and ends with -oeing...
 
Halibut
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RE: Boeing~SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With CF.?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:42 am

Quoting Stirling (Reply 13):
Boeing~SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With CF.?

Who and what is CF? Is that supposed to mean QANTAS? Or is it code for something else?
"C" is nowhere near "Q" on the keyboard, so I've ruled out a typo.....


Oops ! I meant QF .
  

Thanks Mods & Stirling .

Halibut

[Edited 2005-12-26 23:45:18]
6 million Jews were slaughtered-Do you see Jews flying planes into buildings in Germany to kill 1000s of innocent, NO !
 
PhilSquares
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RE: Boeing~SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With CF.?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:42 am

Quoting Xkorpyoh (Reply 12):
it seems that MH is doing well with the KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE on a 747

MH is bleeding on that route and they have been for years! It makes no sense at all for them to be flying that when the aircraft could be used on more lucrative city pairs.

Quoting Xkorpyoh (Reply 12):
maybe SIN -IAD to connect witht the UA hub?

With the feed UA has in LAX/SFO I don't think you'll ever see SIN-IAD non-stops.

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 2):
Are the loads on Singapore-Newark good enough to merit an upgrade to the 777LR?

The SIN-EWR flight has surpassed SQ's wildest dreams. The premium cabin always has a waiting list for people who want to upgrade from Y to J. One problem is the demand for premium cabin has been more than what SQ thought. In addition, due to the payload limitations on the 345, no F cabin was installed. In retrospect, that has proven to be a big mistake. There is a demand there and the product will sell. The 772LR allows for a F cabin as well as more J class.

With the loads on the SIN-LAX flight, you'll never see the 787-8 on there. Currently the 345 is flying over 85% load factor on that route. If anything there is a need for increased capacity. SFO has been rumored for a long time also, but with the lack of any more ULH aircraft, it's tough to do.
Fly fast, live slow
 
kaitak744
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RE: Boeing~SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With CF.?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:43 am

Quoting Stirling (Reply 13):
Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 8):
Out of interest, wheres that image from?



Quoting AJRfromSYR (Reply 11):
I second that interest.

And I third.

All right all right, calm down. I didn't make them my self.

There is no direct link, so I have to guide you how to get there.

http://777.newairplane.com/

Next, enter the site.
Then, on top, press "menu"
Then, press "the plane"
Then, press "comparisons"
Then, press on the blue dot on the aft fuselage.

Hope that helps.
 
RichardPrice
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:49 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 17):
All right all right, calm down. I didn't make them my self.

Wasnt implying anything of the sort, I was merely interested in the source.

You were after all breaching copyright  Smile

Thanks for the link!
 
keesje
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:01 am

The B772LR can carry 23% more revenue cargo then the A345, 11 vs 0,7 tonne, on a 301 passenger 18 hour flight (btw 21 more seats then The A345). This info comes from the Boeing site.

Where to start, or even more; who is the target public for this kind of info? I guess not airlines.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
zvezda
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:11 am

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 16):
With the feed UA has in LAX/SFO I don't think you'll ever see SIN-IAD non-stops.

There are a lot of eastern cities which UA serve via IAD but not via SFO/LAX, however, nearly all of those are served via ORD, which would make much more sense for SQ than IAD.

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 16):
With the loads on the SIN-LAX flight, you'll never see the 787-8 on there.

My suggestion was that SQ might consider 2x daily B787-8 for SIN-LAX.
 
Halibut
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:20 am

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/com...ge/0,5478,17665261%255E664,00.html

SIA aircraft buy-up
Geoff Easdown
27dec05

QANTAS rival Singapore Airlines is about to turn the heat up on the Australian flag carrier by matching its recent $US10 billion ($A13.7 billion) order for new aircraft.

Halibut
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anxebla
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:27 am

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 16):
There is a demand there and the product will sell. The 772LR allows for a F cabin as well as more J class.

Is it for sure right now an A345 replacement by the 772LR ... or is it just a rumor?
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zvezda
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:29 am

Quoting Anxebla (Reply 22):

Is it for sure right now an A345 replacement by the 772LR ... or is it just a rumor?

It's well-informed speculation.  Smile
 
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mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:34 am

Quoting Halibut (Reply 21):
SIA aircraft buy-up
Geoff Easdown
27dec05

I'm puzzled as to why SQ poured water on the press reports.

http://atwonline.com/news/story.html?storyID=3565

To me, it is blatantly obvious they will go with Boeing, just as it was equally obvious that Qantas would. Even Leahy predicted the Qantas deal.

Indeed, I can't see much point in Airbus even talking to Qantas for the next ten years or fifteen or so.

So why didn't Singapore just let the press reports ride?

cheers

mariner
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RichardPrice
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:40 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 24):
So why didn't Singapore just let the press reports ride?

Because ... nothings set in stone?  Smile

If SQ (or QF) had blown Airbus out at an early stage by saying Boeing had got it in the bag, they would have lost a huge bargaining chip - companies tend not to give their best discounts while they know they already have the deal. By playing down any decisions, they still get to play the two manufacturers off each other and create better terms in the process.

Plus during that process, the outsider may come up with an unbeatable deal jsut to win the order.
 
PhilSquares
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:47 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 20):
My suggestion was that SQ might consider 2x daily B787-8 for SIN-LAX.

Why? One SIN-LAX with the 772LR and the NRT-LAX flight would cover the market. I know there is a desire to increase SIN-EWR to a double daily, but there are no extra aircraft to do that.

ORD has been rumored, but the last tag on SQ tried didn't work too well. SFO-SIN non-stops have been rumored for quite a while too.

Quoting Anxebla (Reply 22):
Is it for sure right now an A345 replacement by the 772LR ... or is it just a rumor?

Nothing is cast in stone just yet, but remember SQ let their 5 345 options expire. They did try to find a leasing company to take them and then lease the aircraft for a 5 year term. However, no leasing company would make the deal attractive enough for SQ to do that.

My "guess" is the order will be the exercise of 777-300ER, 772LR, 787 and the 748F with options in each.
Fly fast, live slow
 
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mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:48 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 25):
If SQ (or QF) had blown Airbus out at an early stage by saying Boeing had got it in the bag, they would have lost a huge bargaining chip

Well, maybe. But every press report you read is saying that the deal is - almost - carved in granite, and that the only thing that change it is a huge price break by Airbus.

But that's been true all along. Whatever "big" discount Airbus has made has already been made, and from here on in, it will be chump change.

And (a) you know Boeing will match it and (b) the 787 is cheaper than the A350 anyway. So it all seems like an Oriental bazaar to me.

I also have to believe that SQ is "allowing" the press reports to happen - the news must have come from somewhere - even while they deny them on the other hand.

So - I'm puzzled. I can't work out quite which game SQ is playing today.

 Smile

cheers

mariner
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Stitch
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:50 am

Perhaps SQ wants to keep their competition guessing as to their eventual order until they're ready to finalize it. I am sure EK's 777 and QF's 787 orders have them "re-running the numbers", so to speak, to see how much of each plane they need to compete with those two companies on the various routes around the world.
 
anxebla
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:52 am

When I see the news about the SQ 345 replacement, I will believe it. But not before ...at the moment (Dec 27th, 2005) it is, still, a plain rumour. And no more.

I agree that could have for SQ a temptation to buy the 772LRs, but we must be careful, wait and see what happen on this matter.
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:53 am

Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 6):
Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
And Canberra shot down SQ's bid to fly direct from Australia to the United States, so SQ cannot launch SYD-LAX/SFO/ORD/DEN/IAD service to link up with UA's internal network.

not quite, it's expected that Canberra will allow SQ to fly BNE/MEl-USA but it won't grant access to Syd in the forseeable future.

If this happens then could we see SQ with there better product actually encouraging QF punters to fly via BNE or MEL on SQ?
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Stitch
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:57 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 30):
If this happens then could we see SQ with there better product actually encouraging QF punters to fly via BNE or MEL on SQ?

I guess it would be a mix of where you need to go (just SYD, or also BNE/MEL?) and whether you were wedded to One World or Star Alliance.  Wink
 
RichardPrice
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:06 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 27):
But that's been true all along. Whatever "big" discount Airbus has made has already been made, and from here on in, it will be chump change.

And (a) you know Boeing will match it and (b) the 787 is cheaper than the A350 anyway. So it all seems like an Oriental bazaar to me.

But thats exactly my point. If SQ blew Airbus out now, this wont happen. Hang on for a while longer, and both manufacturers may make proposals that will allow SQ to go back and demand more from each of them  Smile

Ever walked between two electronics stores or car dealerships, getting them to quote for an identical product, and going back to the other to see if he will lower his price? I have  Smile
 
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mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:18 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 32):
Ever walked between two electronics stores or car dealerships, getting them to quote for an identical product, and going back to the other to see if he will lower his price? I have  

Oh, absolutely. And haggled for carpets in Jaiselmer. This one still doesn't make sense to me, though.

It is - blatantly - Boeing's to lose. They all know this, and the many, many press reports over the past couple of days have only reinforced it.

So then SQ comes out with a very mild denial of the press reports, which wouldn't fool pussy - and certainly not Leahy.

The big deals have been done, there's maybe a few million here or there, but probably not even that - more like some non-cash sweeteners - but to haggle over those seems cheap, which SQ isn't.

I understand why they would deny the press reports - but why do it so do it so half-heartedly?

That's my puzzle.

cheers

mariner
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PhilSquares
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:44 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 33):
The big deals have been done, there's maybe a few million here or there, but probably not even that - more like some non-cash sweeteners - but to haggle over those seems cheap, which SQ isn't.

I understand why they would deny the press reports - but why do it so do it so half-heartedly?

There are a couple of things going on in the background. First, SQ will have a new Chairman come 1/1. So, nothing is going to get done until he has a chance to formally give his opinion. Secondly, it needs board approval for the purchase. That's not going to happen until January (mid). Finally, there are some on going talks about what to do with the 345. SQ doesn't feel there is a market for them, so it would appear as if the deal will involve re-marketing the 345.
Fly fast, live slow
 
PHXinterrupted
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:59 am

Quoting Keesje (Reply 19):
The B772LR can carry 23% more revenue cargo then the A345, 11 vs 0,7 tonne, on a 301 passenger 18 hour flight (btw 21 more seats then The A345). This info comes from the Boeing site.

Where to start, or even more; who is the target public for this kind of info? I guess not airlines.

No need to be bitter, Keesje. The 777LR is superior to the A345 and SQ is right to chose it.
Keepin' it real.
 
Gemuser
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:07 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 24):


Indeed, I can't see much point in Airbus even talking to Qantas for the next ten years or fifteen or so.

They will be back at Mascot in the new year. There is still the ULR requirement and more importantly for Airbus more A380 option conversions/orders. Although A380 requirements will not eventuate untill after the beast is in service, Airbus will be in QF face with options, test data, etc untill after EIS. Bet on it!

Gemuser
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mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:17 am

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 36):
They will be back at Mascot in the new year. There is still the ULR requirement and more importantly for Airbus more A380 option conversions/orders.

Sure, they'll be back at Mascot - if nothing else, they have to service the customer for the A380.

But the rest is an already done deal, the options exist, all anyone really has to do is pick up the phone.

And it is really tough to see QF going with the A340 for ULR, even supposing - which I don't - they go for ULR.

And yes, Qantas may want some more A320's for Jetstar, but that's "picking up the phone", too.

Apart from the A380's, as far as mainline Qantas and (international) Jetstar is concerned, the die is cast.

I can't think that Jetstar will have a two type fleet once the 787 deliveries replace the A330's.

cheers

mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:20 am

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 34):
There are a couple of things going on in the background.

I understand all of this, and it still doesn't clarify my puzzle. For example, the new chairman doesn't know what is going on, he will only find out on the 1st?

And if the A345's are going, they are going. that deicsion would have been made some time ago.

So I come back to my original question - why not just let the press reports ride? Why bother so halfheartedly denying them?

cheers

mariner
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:29 am

I wonder, why always saying "Fuel efficient 787/777", as if other airplanes were not made to be fuel efficient as well. When i read this in an article, i have the feeling the article is going to be a copy/paste of a Boeing press release.

Anyway, SQ guys are mature enough to make their own decisions considering their market.
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:33 am

Quoting PHXinterrupted (Reply 35):
The 777LR is superior to the A345 and SQ is right to chose it.

What means 'superior' ?

An aircraft is better or worse for a specific network, with a specific demand, with a specific mix of cargo/pax/range/turnaround time/etc.. Some Antonov are better than Airbus or Boeing on certain types of markets.

[Edited 2005-12-27 02:34:00]
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:33 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 38):
So I come back to my original question - why not just let the press reports ride? Why bother so halfheartedly denying them?

I think until the final decision is made by the board then the door is always open for both Airbus and Boeing.

Certainly the incoming CEO knows what's going on, but he isn't in yet. Business is done a little different here than perhaps other parts of the world. That's a big part of it.
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:37 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
Any route the A340-500 served is good do be replaced with the 777-200LR. Remember, the 772LR will also carry a significant amount of cargo to EWR which the A340-500 can't.

Does Singapore bring a lot of cargo into Newark? I though they brought most of their cargo into JFK. Plus, what kind of seating would they offer on the 777LR? Can Singapore offer a First Class on it, or will weight still be a problem?

I guess if the needs of the airline require the 777LR to go to Newark, they'll do it. I love watching the A345 descending over Middlesex County on finals to Newark, it's a gorgeous site. It would be something as well, seeing the 777LR come in over the NJ Turnpike. Where else would they deploy the A345? Or are they just going to dump them?
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:49 am

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 41):
I think until the final decision is made by the board then the door is always open for both Airbus and Boeing.

I'm fully ready to be proven wrong, but I don't think the door is open for Airbus.

Someone leaked all that stuff to the press, and I'd be fairly sure that it was someone at SQ.

The Wall Street Journal is fairly cautious about reporting rumors - or at least, business rumors.

I think the denial was simply going through the motions but - once again - why bother?

cheers

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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:54 am

Quoting EWROwznj00 (Reply 42):
I guess if the needs of the airline require the 777LR to go to Newark, they'll do it. I love watching the A345 descending over Middlesex County on finals to Newark, it's a gorgeous site. It would be something as well, seeing the 777LR come in over the NJ Turnpike. Where else would they deploy the A345? Or are they just going to dump them?

Yes, they will dump them. They have a good size fleet of 777-200ERs, -300s, -300ERs, and future -200LRs. It would make no sense to keep 5 A340-500s in that mix.
 
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:55 am

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 41):
Quoting Mariner (Reply 38):
So I come back to my original question - why not just let the press reports ride? Why bother so halfheartedly denying them?

I think until the final decision is made by the board then the door is always open for both Airbus and Boeing.

I agree with Phil. If no deal has been signed then they probably need to set the record straight and factual.
 
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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:58 am

Quoting Keesje (Reply 19):
The B772LR can carry 23% more revenue cargo then the A345, 11 vs 0,7 tonne, on a 301 passenger 18 hour flight (btw 21 more seats then The A345). This info comes from the Boeing site.

Where to start, or even more; who is the target public for this kind of info? I guess not airlines.

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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:58 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 43):
I'm fully ready to be proven wrong, but I don't think the door is open for Airbus.

I agree . However , " It ain't over til the Fat Lady sings ! "


Hhhhaaaaaaaahhhhh  hyper 

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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 11:04 am

Quoting Halibut (Reply 47):
I agree . However , " It ain't over til the Fat Lady sings ! "

Well, sometimes it is - but I think it is somewhat insulting to both manufacturers.

Quoting Halibut (Reply 47):
Hhhhaaaaaaaahhhhh   

I don't know what that means, sorry.

cheers

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RE: Boeing - SQ Must Buy Boeing To Compete With QF?

Tue Dec 27, 2005 11:07 am

If this all turns out to be true, then Boeing will have succeeded in creating a "domino effect" with their products. I am curious as to the extent of the spread of the effect.

I think this effect is part of the A380 business case in which airlines would be forced to buy A380 to keep up with their competitors in terms of amenities and low unit costs. Unfortunately for Airbus there are some stubborn dominoes ( namely in the UK, Hong Kong, Japan) that have refused to fall--at least yet.

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