HPA320
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Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 4:26 pm

Guys,

I already know of:

Easyjet.com

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Ryanair.com

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Do you guys know more of these carriers in Europe?

Thanks,
America West Airlines. 1983-2005. The Journey Continues...
 
Beaucaire
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 4:34 pm

There are at least 50 Lowcost Airlines in Europe -only country without any Low Cost airline is France......

http://www.attitudetravel.com/lowcostairlines/europe/

http://www.etn.nl/lcosteur.htm
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
enrique07280
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:18 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 1):
There are at least 50 Lowcost Airlines in Europe -only country without any Low Cost airline is France

There is Air Turquoise in France flying it ATR between Marseille Reims Bordeaux and Nice! the only French low cost
 
teva
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:21 pm

Beaucaire, I do not think the first link you provide answers the question.
For example, I see what I know as a charter and non european airlin: Onur Air.
And it mentions Air Turquoise, from France. So, apprently, we do have one....
Teva
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Beaucaire
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:29 pm

Air Turqoise is a marketing developement tool financed by the CCI of Reims to promote the Champagne region.While the company appears to be a low-cost airline using ATR 42 aircraft,most of the money comes -as usual- from the local taxpayers money.
But they come as close to anything as Low Cost in France.
There are not international flights offered currently from any french "Lowcost " financed privately.
There was an attempt by Air Liberté Express three years ago but the project was killed with the dismantling of Air Liberté by JJCorbet and Erik de Vlieger...
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
egmcman
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:30 pm

You have mentioned the two largest lots of others off the top of my head here are some I can think of.

Jet2
BMI Baby
Wizz Air
SkyEuope
Air Berlin
Germanwings
flyBe
Vueling Airlines
Norwegian Air Shuttle
Flyniki
Hapag Lloyd Express
Thomson Fly
 
TriStar500
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:33 pm

Here http://www.ch-aviation.ch/lcc.php is a fairly accurate search engine for any low cost services within Europe.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
GSM763
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:33 pm

Ryanair
Easyjet
Flybe
Air Berlin
BMI Baby
Monarch Scheduled
Flyniki
Air Scotland
Flyglobespan
Jet2
Wizz Air
Sky Europe
Germanwings
Hapag Lloyd Express
Centralwings
Volare
Air Southwest
Transavia
Sterling
Aer Arran
Norwegian
Vueling

This list is far from Exhaustive.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:40 pm

You need only worry about Ryanair and easyJet: a lot, if not all, of the smaller, less well-run and profitable entities won't exist in the next couple/few years.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:59 pm

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 8):
You need only worry about Ryanair and easyJet: a lot, if not all, of the smaller, less well-run and profitable entities won't exist in the next couple/few years.

A bold statement. Here are just two others that are doing pretty well I think.


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RJ100
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:02 pm

Helvetic is a LCC too. But they aren't doing well.


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Regards,
RJ100
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shamrock350
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:07 pm

Aer Lingus is one!
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Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:08 pm

Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 9):
A bold statement.

And which will be eventually proven to be true. You'll have the two giants - Ryanair and easyJet - and perhaps a third or fourth smaller LCC. A lot will come and go - and be replaced by others which will come and go. Furthermore, I suspect that there will be only perhaps three major full-frills airlines in Europe - BA, AF/KL and LH - who will concentrate on connecting passengers, while LCCs will do a lot of the point-to-point flights.

[Edited 2006-01-08 13:10:01]
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 10:52 pm

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 8):
less well-run and profitable entities

I really don't think they are "less well-run" as for profitable, they did not get to the market the same time as FR and U2 which makes it more difficult to startup and indeed expand. i really think there is room for more then 2 LCCs in europe.
John Hancock
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:22 pm

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 13):
I really don't think they are "less well-run"

LOL. You research them and their networks. Generally, they don't have a particularly good businessplan - and it is poorly executed. Or they'll have a shallow financial pool which won't sustain low seasons or a lot of competition or both. Also, few people are going to possess the required level of leadership, ability and killer instinct for highly successful businesses - in any industry. Furthermore, a lot - but not all - of successful airlines have 'faces,' i.e. well-known founders/CEOs particularly to a lot of non-plane-nuts, like Herb at WN, MOL at FR and Stelios at U2, through public stunts, TV shows or plain advertising. I don't, for example, even know the CEO of almost all other airlines - and I'm keen on aviation.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
levent
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:44 pm

Ý am in Turkey right now. Tomorrow Ý will be flying Ýstanbul - Antalya with Onur Air and back with AtlasJet, just for fun. Ý will write a trip report about them later on.
Onur and AtlasJet operate as low cost carriers in Turkey, and seen that their base is Ýstanbul Ataturk airport (which is on the European side) they can defintely be regarded as European LCC`s!
Another LCC here is Pegasus Airlines. Their base is at the other Ýstanbul airport, Sabiha Gokcen. They offer flights throughout the country, and a bus service for pax to and from Ýstanbul. Ý don`t know whether other Turkish carriers such as Sky and Fly Air also offer budget flights or operate only charters.
Turkish Airlines now also has very good offers for domestic flights, by the way.
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:50 pm

Quoting Levent (Reply 15):
Ý am in Turkey right now.

Ý can see that... Ý remember struggling with those Turkish keyboards. Smile
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
levent
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 12:07 am

Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 16):
Ý can see that... Ý remember struggling with those Turkish keyboards.

Yeah, isn`t it annoying? Ý struggled to get logged onto yahoo mail and after fifteen minutes realised that Ý was typing the i without a dot instead of the i with a dot!  Smile
Have done some spotting this afternoon at Ýstanbul Ataturk, found a great spot under the approach path of runway 36 along the water. No problem with police or military at all.
 
egmcman
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 2:38 am

Quoting GSM763 (Reply 7):
Flyglobespan

They are not an lcc they are a low fares airline there is difference.
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 2:55 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 14):
LOL. You research them and their networks.

I work with a couple of LCC's in DUB so I know at least something about some LCC's and even now in the middle of the winter they are still full or almost full. Ryanair was losing money hand over fist before MOL and had a shallow financial pool. Most airline startups for the first number of years will have very little money, it's an expensive business and competition is expensive. Most high yield roots are taken particularly in western Europe and it would be suicide for any new or small LCC (or airline) to go against FR or U2.

All you have to do is look at U2 when it started services in DUB, FR ran them out.
John Hancock
 
RAFVC10
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 3:56 am

And what about www.skyscanner.com?
El dia que los gilipollas vuelen, no podremos ver la luz del sol!
 
GSM763
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 3:59 am

Quoting Egmcman (Reply 18):
They are not an lcc they are a low fares airline there is difference.

What is the difference?
 
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TK787
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:03 am

Quoting Levent (Reply 17):
Have done some spotting this afternoon at Ýstanbul Ataturk, found a great spot under the approach path of runway 36 along the water. No problem with police or military at all.

Hi Levent,
Also I have heard of a "SKY Cafe" on the other side of the runway, where lot of the IST spotters get their shots, from its terrace. Sounds a bit more civilized than the beach spot.
 
greenjet
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:42 am

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 19):
All you have to do is look at U2 when it started services in DUB, FR ran them out.

Just to be pedantic it was Go and not easyJet that Ryanair drove out. easyJet have never operated out of DUB - except for their maintenance visits.
 
Aisak
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:47 am

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 11):
Aer Lingus is one!

I wouldn't call Aer Lingus a LCC

Thought the LCC is quite relaxed, Aer Lingus:

DOES transfer bags to other flight (EI itself and onto other carriers) with all the advantages like two bags on connecting flights to long-haul flights....
DOES allow passengers to connect to other flights
DOES offer the use of departure lounges sapphire and emerald OW card holders
DOES offer the use of departure lounges to business and first passengers connecting to/from any OW flight
DOES fly to main airports like LHR instead of STN, BCN instead of GRO or FRA instead od HNN... just to say a few

and many other things that may come up... LCC shouldn't be called to every airline that only offers one class and charges you for food
Between Ryanair and Cathay Pacific there are many different shades of grey
 
Maersk737
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:49 am

Pearson is right, most of the LCC's are loosing money, closing down and starting up again  Smile

Cheers

Peter
I'm not proud to be a Viking, just thankfull
 
malmoaviation
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:56 am

France have High speed TGV trains. They are (sometimes) cheap and fast. Maybe that's why there is not so many LCC carriers in France?
 
TheSonntag
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 5:08 am

Germany has profitable LCCs, and both FR and EZY did not enter that market fast enough, so both Germanwings and HLX have become rather popular. EZY is doing better than 4U in SXF, that is true, but in important markets, EZY and FR came very late:

Northrine-Westfalia: 4U and HLX are strong, EZY exists but is in DTM, Air Berlin, LTU and Condor are also adding to the competition

Hamburg: FR is in Lübeck, here 4U also is very strong

Bavaria: Difficult market for LCCs.

So if FR and EZY want to dominate Europe, they must conquer Germany. FR tries so by expanding in HHN, but my guess is that Germanwings will survive. I am not so sure about HLX, but they also do rather well...
 
Delta777Jet
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 5:19 am

HLX: Will develop more and more into a charter airline like Hapag Lloyd flying to tourist destinations. Advertisments what they do are expensive and just bring them nothing. I think HLX will continue to dissappear as a low-cost carrier.

Germanwings: Will develop further with control from Lufthansa. They will bring Germanwings on the markets what they want to protect for the LH Group, but not sure if they really can make profits but for sure they will last long and I m quite sure they will kick Deutsche BA out of business soon.
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Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 7:30 am

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 19):
I work with a couple of LCC's in DUB so I know at least something about some LCC's and even now in the middle of the winter they are still full or almost full.

LOL. Yes, and probably having absurdly low yields - which is not sustainable. Anyone can fill any plane with very low prices. The issue is yield management.

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 19):
Ryanair was losing money hand over fist before MOL and had a shallow financial pool.

Yes, but thanks to unbelievably good - perhaps peerless - ability, leadership and determination, which not all airline CEOs will have, Ryanair is one of the most profitable airlines in the world.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 8:31 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 29):
Ryanair is one of the most profitable airlines in the world.

Living in Dublin and working in DUB I am fully aware that Ryanair is one of the most profitable airlines in the world, and I realize MOL is a great business man, but to dismiss all other LCC's besides U2 as not making a decent profit this time of year is absurd. I realize that they will not be making the same profit as your beloved FR as a % on it's turn over but they are still making a profit, you cannot deny that.
John Hancock
 
WexCan
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 8:39 am

Monarch anyone?


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[Edited 2006-01-09 00:39:59]
 
amhilde
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 3:03 pm

I just booked two Sterling tickets today for me and the boy for this summer CPH-FRA and MUC-CPH and we got a really good deal. Have they been hanging in there at CPH then?

Also- was reading today in the confirmation notice that they do BOB but you cannot consume food you didnt buy from them whilst on the plane. Sheesh, whats up with that?
Hang on tightly, Let go lightly
 
HBJZA
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 3:09 pm

Quoting Maersk737 (Reply 25):
DOES fly to main airports like LHR instead of STN, BCN instead of GRO or FRA instead od HNN... just to say a few

Maybe FR does but not all LCC are flying to "side" airports. EZY/EZS is most of the time flying the well known international airports.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 7:48 pm

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 30):
but to dismiss all other LCC's besides U2 as not making a decent profit this time of year is absurd.

Then PROVE to me - with verifiable statistics - that those other airlines are, as you said, making a "decent profit."

You seem to have forgotten that winter time is ordinarily an extremely hard time of year - which is offset by very good performances during the all-important summer. A lot of airlines - even the giants - have to substantially reduce their fares in order to attract would-be passengers during this period. This does, in theory, result in poor yields, although exceptions will occur. Now, I suspect that FR and U2 can certainly ride out the storm, probably AB too - they have big reserves - but I seriously doubt whether it is possible for start-ups, with little financial pools, to happily survive such periods. Furthermore, only the fit-and-healthy airlines survive - the aviation game is all about the survival of the fittest.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
rootsair
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 7:51 pm

Always thought that Fly Baboo DID NOT consider themselves a low cost !

Quoting RJ100 (Reply 10):
Helvetic is a LCC too. But they aren't doing well.

Theirprices added to fuel surcharge are waytoo high for an LCC

oh and haven't you noticed....99.9 % ofnew airlines seem to be LCC's

[Edited 2006-01-09 11:54:17]
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
TheSonntag
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 8:02 pm

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 34):

Profitable Airlines: 4U, Air Berlin and, maybe, HLX... German LCCs do rather well in a difficult market. HLX had problems in the beginning, but now they have found a good niche, even though they now serve mainly holiday destinations, with the exceptions of HAM and TXL out of CGN. I think they will survive...

DBA: Certainly an airline which everybody doubts, but to me they are the German USAirways: "Totgesagte leben länger", everybody says they are dead, and yet they had the fist ever profitable year last year... So I see a future for them.

Michael
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Mon Jan 09, 2006 8:15 pm

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 36):
Profitable Airlines: 4U, Air Berlin and, maybe, HLX...

Please submit appropriate authority regarding the net profit of each. One could say that you are, being a German, rather biased towards 4U, AB and HLX - all of which are German.  Wink

I am not saying that low-cost airlines in Europe besides FR and U2 are not profitable. Instead, I am saying that a lot will come-and-go with relative frequency, and thence be replaced by others which will come-and-go. It's the nature of almost all industries and businesses - evolution. Th

I just-so-happen to think that only FR and U2 will be the major players in terms of European LCCs, with other, 'come-and-goers' trying to find niches and getting scraps at the bottom.

A start-up airline, be it a low-cost carrier or otherwise, needs a hellava lot of investment; an exceedingly good businessplan - and a complete willingness to stick rigidly to it; a head which has extreme ability, leadership skills, killer instinct and motivation; and, if they are in a competitive market, to find a niche market which they themselves could exploit without trampling on the big boys' feet. And so on and on. Creating and running an airline is not like creating and running a corner shop.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
RJ100
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:27 am

No doubt, easyJet and Ryanair are the two leading LCCs in Europe. They are strong and have multiple bases in all over Europe.

Other LCCs in Europe started later, therefore most of the time only have bases in their home country. Their growth is therefore limited. While easyJet and Ryanair can lower its costs every year because of a massive growth, other LCCs are only able to defend the home market (like HLX, Germanwings etc.), therefore they will have a hard time in the coming months/years.

easyJet and Ryanair can lower its fares on certain routes (to/from Germany for instance) without going belly up while it could hurt their competitors massively because they are too small.

Air Berlin is another story, they have started early enough and are spread over many countries in Europe. I am sure they will do well in the future.

Another topic are also the companies from Eastern Europe (or basically Central Europe): SkyEurope, WizzAir etc. still losing money but with a really low cost basis. There is the chance that some of them will survive.

Of course there are always some niches where a LCC can operate for a time (like HLX). But what happens if one of the big carriers competes on that route? Then the smaller airline will lose.

And then there are some real joke LCCs such as Helvetic, doing everything wrong that can go wrong. Wrong cost base, wrong network, wrong tariff system.

Regards,
RJ100

[Edited 2006-01-09 16:28:02]
none
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:36 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 37):
I am not saying that low-cost airlines in Europe besides FR and U2 are not profitable.

You have said this in regards the winter months and I think you forget that I am in and around these airlines daily, I talk with the reps, we handle ticketing for them, I'm not going to go to the throws of trying to find out weather HLX or germanwings are profitable during the winter just to satisfy you. You have a very narrow perspective on the airline industry with only one certain LCC in your perspective, I think you'll find that the AB's and even FlyBe will be around for sometime

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 34):
even the giants

And you know yourself that this is a completely different topic then what is being discussed here and has no merit in a conversation about LCC's.

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 34):
Then PROVE to me

How about you PROVE to me they are NOT making a profit, I'm sure you'd get more satisfaction in finding out this information (weather they be profiting or losing money) then I ever will.
John Hancock
 
frequentflyer
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:37 am

Looks like France is underdeveloped LCC-wise... room for improvement there!
Take off and live
 
airbazar
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:52 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 12):
And which will be eventually proven to be true. You'll have the two giants - Ryanair and easyJet - and perhaps a third or fourth smaller LCC.

I agree somewhat that a lot of LCC's will die but I also think that there is room for a few more than 4 carriers. Europe is a larger market than the US and yet, less people still travel by plane today, than in the US. The potential market is uge and legacy carriers are just too expensive for the average folk.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:54 am

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 39):
I'm not going to go to the throws of trying to find out weather HLX or germanwings are profitable during the winter just to satisfy you.

LOL. Because you know you'd be wrong.  Silly And even if you were right, that does not mean that they'll last.

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 39):
You have a very narrow perspective on the airline industry with only one certain LCC in your perspective

Not at all. I just predict that very few will remain in the next 10 years. Sure, more will replace them or enter new markets, but then they too will go, to be replaced by others, etc. Disagree all you want - it'd be boring if we all agreed with one another. I am also relatively sure that in time they'll probably only be 3 full-frills major carriers left in Europe - probably BA, AF/KL and LH - and they'll concentrate on connecting passengers, with the low-cost carriers concentrating on point-to-point flying. I also predict more acquisitions.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
pelican
Posts: 2429
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:06 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 37):
Please submit appropriate authority regarding the net profit of each.

You're well aware that AB isn't a public traded corporation and therefore don't need to post exact numbers. So your question is rather pointless. It'll be hard to prove anything.

Generally you're right that many airlines won't survive, although it is a bold speculation to name a number of how many will survive.
My bet is Sterling will survive, too. The owners seem to have a lot of money.

pelican
 
BestWestern
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RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:07 am

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 19):
I know at least something about some LCC's and even now in the middle of the winter they are still full or almost full.



Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 30):
to dismiss all other LCC's besides U2 as not making a decent profit this time of year is absurd

Its not absurd.... There is room in Europe for only three major low cost airlines. The remainder will struggle, and the majority will go bankrupt. Just look at the US... Only Southwest, JetBlue and AirTran are surviving with others (frontier, spirit) struggling to grow beyond niche.

This winter is really tough for all carriers, with many expecting carriers to go to the wall, especially in the UK, where there is serious LCC overcapacity, especially in the midlands and the north of england. I understand that BmiBaby are really struggling ex BHX and MAN.

The majority of LCC's that start go bankrupt. Dont forget that. Scandinavia, Germany, France, Italy, Ireland and the UK have all seen LCC's go bankrupt over the last few years. This winter wont be any different. Many carriers are struggling, and making stupid moves now to ensure the cash doesnt dry up. Sky Europe, for example has been selling August Peak Weekend flights for €12 each way including taxes... Cash now is critical.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
Pe@rson
Posts: 16028
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:08 am

Quoting Pelican (Reply 43):
You're well aware that AB isn't a public traded corporation and therefore don't need to post exact numbers. So your question is rather pointless. It'll be hard to prove anything.

Coincidental, of course.

Quoting Pelican (Reply 43):
My bet is Sterling will survive, too. The owners seem to have a lot of money.

Ah, Sterling is Danish and where do you come from? Oh, Denmark.  Wink

You could have all the money in the world, but if you don't possess the right qualities to the right extent...
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
Pe@rson
Posts: 16028
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:11 am

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 44):
Its not absurd.... There is room in Europe for only three major low cost airlines. The remainder will struggle, and the majority will go bankrupt. Just look at the US... Only Southwest, JetBlue and AirTran are surviving with others (frontier, spirit) struggling to grow beyond niche.

This winter is really tough for all carriers, with many expecting carriers to go to the wall, especially in the UK, where there is serious LCC overcapacity, especially in the midlands and the north of england. I understand that BmiBaby are really struggling ex BHX and MAN.

The majority of LCC's that start go bankrupt. Dont forget that. Scandinavia, Germany, France, Italy, Ireland and the UK have all seen LCC's go bankrupt over the last few years. This winter wont be any different. Many carriers are struggling, and making stupid moves now to ensure the cash doesnt dry up. Sky Europe, for example has been selling August Peak Weekend flights for €12 each way including taxes... Cash now is critical.

Precisely.

You should listen to B.W.: he's a very well-respected transport consultant and aviation expert.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
egmcman
Posts: 729
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 6:28 pm

RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:18 am

Quoting GSM763 (Reply 21):
Quoting Egmcman (Reply 18):
They are not an lcc they are a low fares airline there is difference.

What is the difference?

In their advertising they market themselves as the low fares airline and serve TFS from STN which is sort of route a lcc wouldn't operate because of fleet utilisation.
 
Pe@rson
Posts: 16028
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:23 am

People wrongly perceive low-cost airlines as being low-fares airlines, when in fact the two are different, although you can obviously obtain low fares on low-cost carriers - but not all the time. You should read 'low-cost' as meaning 'in theory higher efficiency,' rather than an offeror of low fares. Furthermore, what is a low fare is rather subjective: to a billionnaire £100 would be nothing, but to someone who's unemployed it'd be an awful lot.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
BestWestern
Posts: 7202
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 8:46 pm

RE: Low Cost Carriers In Europe.

Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:26 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 46):
You should listen to B.W.: he's a very well-respected transport consultant and aviation expert.

Its going to my (very congested) head.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!

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