md90fan
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:36 am

Just wondering, lately it seems lately that JB is doing really good out of BOS well AA and DL are kinda slow to catch up and are letting JB beat them. Well they let JB take over? Just tell me what you all think  Smile
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
SonOfACaptain
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:52 am

So is everybody just leaving US alone?

-SOAC
Non Illegitimi Carborundum
 
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chrisnh
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:09 am

Why would ANYONE invest in the stock of a company that just GIVES BUSINESS away to the competition? These carriers, I guess, have concluded that to compete and fight is the wrong way to go. I'll be looking for a "free share of AA or DL stock with my next purchase of Shredded Wheat."
 
FL1TPA
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:14 am

Honestly I don't think anyone needs to give B6 more room. Have you seen thier ticket counters and gate space in BOS? It's E-N-O-R-M-I-G-A-N-T-I-C!

FL1TPA
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffin' glue."
 
SRQCrosscheck
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Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:25 am

B6 might be a victim of their own success. Everyone loved them when they had their own security portal in Terminal E; you never had to wait. Now they're busier and in C; maybe not so rosy anymore?
 
navairjax
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:41 am

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 1):
So is everybody just leaving US alone?

Considering the route structure at B6, I don't think CO, NW, and US are exactly as much of a target as AA, DL, and UA. Yes there is an impact for all but I'd say if any LCC at BOS is targeting US it would be FL, not B6.
 
FlyPNS1
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 5:17 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 2):
These carriers, I guess, have concluded that to compete and fight is the wrong way to go.

Maybe these carriers have finally started to realize that being number one in marketshare isn't so important. Or maybe they've realized it isn't worth fighting for all the $99 transcon leisure fare crowd.

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 2):
Why would ANYONE invest in the stock of a company that just GIVES BUSINESS away to the competition?

What if the business you are giving away is business you can't make money on? Is Nordstrom's giving away business by not trying to sell all their clothes for cheap like Walmart?
 
positiverate
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 5:58 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 2):
Why would ANYONE invest in the stock of a company that just GIVES BUSINESS away to the competition? These carriers, I guess, have concluded that to compete and fight is the wrong way to go. I'll be looking for a "free share of AA or DL stock with my next purchase of Shredded Wheat."

On what are you basing this comment? On this?

Quoting MD90fan (Thread starter):
Just wondering, lately it seems lately that JB is doing really good out of BOS well AA and DL are kinda slow to catch up and are letting JB beat them. Well they let JB take over? Just tell me what you all think

He gives no stats or any evidence to back up his claim, including passenger loads, yields, etc.
 
N1120A
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:07 am

Quoting Navairjax (Reply 5):
Considering the route structure at B6, I don't think CO, NW, and US are exactly as much of a target as AA, DL, and UA

I don't think UA is particularly a target. UA does hub flights, which will always be popular in a large business market like BOS, so they are pretty safe.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
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chrisnh
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Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:32 am

Rick Pitino, when he was coaching the Boston Celtics, was livid in a press conference, trying to defend his team against mounting criticism. "Folks...Larry Bird is not walkin' through that door. Kevin McHale is not walkin' through that door either." His point was clear: Those days are over, so stop complaining about the way things are now.

Airlines are the same way. The legacy carriers are going through all sorts of gyrations--big jets down to little lawn darts; pulling out of cities entirely--in futile attempts to maximize profits. The message to them is JUST as clear: "Folks...those $1,000 transcon fares aren't walkin' through that door."

I'm sorry, but if the LCCs can get you from sea to shining sea for $99 don't tell ME that $1,000 is really what I ought to be paying. My job isn't to fund an out-of-whack cost structure. If some carrier can do it for $99, then that becomes the new price floor. It becomes what people are willing to pay. It becomes the VALUE for that service. The legacy carriers are shedding whatever differentiation they earned along the way (pillows, anyone?), so they need to provide their service at the $99 end of the spectrum...not the $1,000 end. That extra $900 is buying you nothing, anyway.

If the legacy carriers are just biding their time until we start accepting $1,000 fares again, they're snapping. The genie is out of the bottle...folks.
 
FlyPNS1
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 8:38 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 9):
I'm sorry, but if the LCCs can get you from sea to shining sea for $99 don't tell ME that $1,000 is really what I ought to be paying. My job isn't to fund an out-of-whack cost structure. If some carrier can do it for $99, then that becomes the new price floor. It becomes what people are willing to pay.

I don't think the legacies expect fares to return to $1,000. However, I think they are starting to realize they can't serve everyone. They have to find a niche. DL would much rather have their BOS-ATL flights filled with passengers going to high yield international markets OR secondary markets that LCC's can't reach, then filled with $59 fares to FLL or $99 to PHX. Of course, DL will still have to offer some cheap fares, but the quantity will be far fewer. If DL tries to compete head to head with B6 solely on price, they will never succeed as DL's costs just can't get as low as B6.

Take a look at Continental. They provide limited service to BOS, so does that mean they aren't competitive? No. It just means CO has realized they don't need to be BIG in every market they serve. In fact, outside of IAH, CLE, EWR and GUM, CO is a relatively small player in practically every market. All they offer are flights to the hubs. Despite being such a small player, CO has faired better than most and will probably return to sustained profitability first.
 
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jfklganyc
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:08 am

""Folks...Larry Bird is not walkin' through that door. Kevin McHale is not walkin' through that door either." His point was clear: Those days are over, so stop complaining about the way things are now"


Bravo Chris! Well said. Welcome to my Respected Users list.

PJ
 
panam330
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:55 pm

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 1):
So is everybody just leaving US alone?

Ever heard of Southwest  Wink?

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 10):
CO is a relatively small player in practically every market. All they offer are flights to the hubs.

Except for LAX. They offer some XJT flights to Mexico.
 
positiverate
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 9):
Rick Pitino, when he was coaching the Boston Celtics, was livid in a press conference, trying to defend his team against mounting criticism. "Folks...Larry Bird is not walkin' through that door. Kevin McHale is not walkin' through that door either." His point was clear: Those days are over, so stop complaining about the way things are now.

Good analogy. Like the legacy CEO's who have come and gone taking their golden parachutes and leaving the industry in the state it is in today, Pitino took his $50 million and bolted after posting a 102-146 record. In his wake he left a once proud franchise which has been a wreck ever since.
 
md90fan
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Fri Jan 20, 2006 1:47 pm

Hopefully we'll see DL do some expanding out of BOS  Smile
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
vegasplanes
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Fri Jan 20, 2006 3:53 pm

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 10):
I don't think the legacies expect fares to return to $1,000. However, I think they are starting to realize they can't serve everyone. They have to find a niche. DL would much rather have their BOS-ATL flights filled with passengers going to high yield international markets OR secondary markets that LCC's can't reach, then filled with $59 fares to FLL or $99 to PHX. Of course, DL will still have to offer some cheap fares, but the quantity will be far fewer. If DL tries to compete head to head with B6 solely on price, they will never succeed as DL's costs just can't get as low as B6.

Take a look at Continental. They provide limited service to BOS, so does that mean they aren't competitive? No. It just means CO has realized they don't need to be BIG in every market they serve. In fact, outside of IAH, CLE, EWR and GUM, CO is a relatively small player in practically every market. All they offer are flights to the hubs. Despite being such a small player, CO has faired better than most and will probably return to sustained profitability first.

CO has some nice hub cities in that the Business crowd and O/D is very large in EWR and IAH, CLE serves as a decent place to stop going from East to West through non-hub cities.

Based on the description of DL from the above quote, it sounds a lot like Pan Am with something like North Central, Southern, or Ozark mixed in. Serve the international destinations and smaller markets with no LCC competition. My point is that at present time, DL does not have the high yield market, the pricing power is gone, UA could not make a lousy $ 5 fare increase stick last weekend, how is DL going to capture the high yield business if they reduce their frequencies and major markets served, while providing less service than say, B6. In terms of entertainment, B6 has DL nailed, Song has the entertainment but needs a first class cabin if DL is going to try to cater to the high yield crowd of business travelers, they are going to want frequency and access to lots of destinations, which currently DL and all other other like carriers, AA, UA, NW, have. Their problem is that their costs are completely out of line for the current business environment.
 
DL787932ER
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Fri Jan 20, 2006 4:24 pm

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 15):

Gee, aggressively cut costs and bring the Song coach product into mainline with the addition of first class. I wonder why no one at DL ever thought of that.  Yeah sure
F L Y D E L T A J E T S
 
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kc135topboom
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sat Jan 21, 2006 7:29 am

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 14):
Hopefully we'll see DL do some expanding out of BOS



Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 16):
Gee, aggressively cut costs and bring the Song coach product into mainline with the addition of first class. I wonder why no one at DL ever thought of that.

That could help DL to at least compete better with B6, than AA can. I think DL as a good opportunity in BOS, if they can take advantage of it. The key in BOS, as it is in most markets, is the business travel, not the leasure travel.
 
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chrisnh
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sat Jan 21, 2006 9:00 am

Not helping Boston is the fact that people are moving away from the city and Massachusetts. Population statistics bear that out, and there's not a real positive spin you can put on that. The area is NOT a magnet for corporations, except for those already in the region. And even with those corporations willing to stay, there isn't a whole lot of expansion going on. Extreme Liberalism in Massachusetts chases corporations away; Politicians pay lip service to businesses, but only because they want to play Robin Hood with all that tax revenue. Oppressive taxation at the corporate level and the personal level (Yeah! Where do we sign up???) is the cherry on top of a cake that includes cold/lousy weather and a very high cost of living.

If the key to the whole thing is business travel, then Boston's fortunes are not that great in terms of expected expansion. KEEPING what we have should be the focus; not any grand visions of expansion.

The high-tech boom isn't coming back through that door, folks. The high-tech boom is in the rear-view mirror, and so too are the salaries that went with those jobs. Still, home prices are unaffordably high and taxes and fees (at least in Massachusetts) do nothing but go up. The math isn't working for a lot of people. They say, "Why should I live here if my salary has rolled back yet my cost to live here keeps going up and up?" That is why RTP (Carolinas) and Texas and the whole sunbelt continue to blossom at the expense of the northeast and New England.

I live in New Hampshire, and the effects of all this are seen here, too. Manchester Airport will see a steep falloff in traffic as 2006 lawn darts replace 2005 mainliners.

Against all this are the airlines: Is this their view of Boston and New England? A has-been region that will be lucky to hold on to the service it has?

I'm a resident of this region, certainly, but I'm also trying to be pragmatic and view things as others from outside the area would. Boston has alot to offer, yes, but it's also a city that calls itself 'The Hub' in a sort of 'the-world-revolves-around-us' sort of way. Of course, that is laughable. But all the politicians in Boston and Massachusetts go mix up all that Kool-Aid and then go drink it all themselves.

 Wink

Chris in NH
 
md90fan
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:46 am

Well DL added BOS-SAV/BNA and SRQ/NAS lately  Smile

What markets does DL have the highest market share on outta BOS? ATL,CVG,FLL?
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
SESGDL
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:03 am

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 19):
What markets does DL have the highest market share on outta BOS? ATL,CVG,FLL?

ATL, CVG, SLC, LGA, MCO, FLL, PBI, RSW, BOS, and TPA. There may be more but that's all I can think of at the moment.

Jeremy
 
tinpusher007
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:53 am

Well, now DL is trying to give away its terminal space away to the competition. Why did they build the damn thing so big if they didn't need all that space? Moreover, could DL not do the same thing in BOS as they are doing at LGA, eg ORD, MIA and DFW? Could they find a way to make int'l ops work even if they have to use Terminal E? AA is leading the int'l market right now out of BOS.
"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
 
iflyatldl
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 4:13 am

DL built Terminal A with the concept/idea that they could expand both domestically and internationally out of BOS. The original conception was to try to get all the Skyteam members under one roof as it were. To make connections more seamless, etc. It just really isn't beneficial to CO or NW to move their operations to terminal A which in a lot of ways is a shame, because it's really a lot of under utilized real estate. And the way the international arrivals are set up at Logan, it's really not much of a benefit to move AF, AZ and KL over there.
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
tinpusher007
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:20 am

Its a beautiful terminal...I had the opportunity to pass through it last spring.
"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
 
hawk44
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:36 am

Quoting MD90fan (Thread starter):
Just wondering, lately it seems lately that JB is doing really good out of BOS

Really tell us how helijet airways is doing in BOS?  Yeah sure

Hawk44
Never under estimate the power of US
 
skyyblue
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:23 pm

Quoting SRQCrosscheck (Reply 4):
Everyone loved them when they had their own security portal in Terminal E; you never had to wait. Now they're busier and in C; maybe not so rosy anymore?

So people dont like us anymore because we changed terminals??? People are accustomed to waiting a few minutes in a security line, I don't think it's an issue.
 
supa7E7
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Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:57 pm

How many daily departures does B6 do from BOS? I doubt they are among the leaders at BOS.
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
MarshalN
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 4:13 pm

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 18):
Extreme Liberalism in Massachusetts chases corporations away; Politicians pay lip service to businesses, but only because they want to play Robin Hood with all that tax revenue. Oppressive taxation at the corporate level and the personal level (Yeah! Where do we sign up???) is the cherry on top of a cake that includes cold/lousy weather and a very high cost of living.

Wow, dude, you must be really bitter that you're not living in MA, because it sure isn't nearly as bad as you say it is. We almost got rid of personal taxes, and thank god we didn't because if we did, how are you going to pay for school/roads and all that other stuff you come to expect from your government? By selling alcohol?
 
ikramerica
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 4:24 pm

The only people who defend massachussets are the people who live there. everyone else can see the forest for the trees. and BTW, what you guys call a republican governor would be a democrat governor in many other states.

but back on point, B6 can take more and more traffic from BOS, but it will only hurt the area in the long run if other carriers cut their international services as a result. just my opinion. then of course when B6 starts going bankrupt in the next few years, which stations will close or downsize first?

this flame bait message posted by someone who lived in boston for 4 months and would never want to live in the area again after the experience.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
apodino
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:05 pm

Quoting BoeingBus (Reply 26):
DUDE, you are on crack. Liberalism? We have had a Republican governor for the last 16 years

Who has very little power in MA because the Legislature is always controlled by democrats who enjoy a veto proof majority in both houses. And even if they can get something through, you have a supreme court who legislates from the bench. They need serious reform in that state as there is so much corruption in the legislature its a joke.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 29):
BTW, what you guys call a republican governor would be a democrat governor in many other states.

Romney is a conservative republican who is right in line with many other republican governors, Bill Weld was a RINO, Republican in Name only who was nominated for an ambassadorship to mexico and got filibustered by Jesse Helms. But most republicans in MA would be democrats in states like TX or GA. Romney would still be a republican in these states.


That being said, Continental and Northwest apparently have looked at moving to A to join their skyteam partner and both said it would create more problems than it would solve. The idea was for it to be a skyteam airline with Air France, Air Jamaica, Alitalia among others in the terminal with Delta. The problem is that Massport won't let customs be built anywhere but E, which is innefficient for a BOS type airport, since the Bus isn't the most efficient way, and BOS won't spend money to build a tram like many other airports have done. Hence, they pumped money into a new building, and its not being used. Very much like the new terminal in DFW, although its being utilized somewhat more.
 
iflyatldl
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:59 pm

I'll be through there on Tuesday. Have they opened any restaurants besides the Harpoon Brewery on airside? I know there's au bon Pain, but that's landside/ticketing.
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
srbmod
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:28 am

Quoting MD90fan (Thread starter):
Just wondering, lately it seems lately that JB is doing really good out of BOS well AA and DL are kinda slow to catch up and are letting JB beat them. Well they let JB take over? Just tell me what you all think

I didn't realize Helijet Airways flew out of Boston, as B6 is the code for JetBlue, not JB (Which is Helijet Airways). So perhaps you should either use the correct codes or don't use them at all, as when someone puts SW down for Southwest Airlines, AT for AirTran (or ATA) or JB down for JetBlue instead of the correct codes ( WN, FL, B6) it makes them look stupid to some folks.
 
boeingguy1
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:23 am

Quoting Hawk44 (Reply 24):
Really tell us how helijet airways is doing in BOS?

People like this annoy me. So he got the code for Jet-Blue wrong, instead of writing B6 he wrote JB. Give people a break and stop acting so above-everyone else  Wink
Gatwick South! Id rather crash in Brighton!
 
hawk44
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:38 am

Quoting Boeingguy1 (Reply 34):
People like this annoy me. So he got the code for Jet-Blue wrong, instead of writing B6 he wrote JB. Give people a break and stop acting so above-everyone else

Did you read the thread title? But why put JB and B6?

I'm not acting above anybody else but why put a code that is not used by the airline but follow it up by the actual code?

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 33):
I didn't realize Helijet Airways flew out of Boston, as B6 is the code for JetBlue, not JB (Which is Helijet Airways). So perhaps you should either use the correct codes or don't use them at all, as when someone puts SW down for Southwest Airlines, AT for AirTran (or ATA) or JB down for JetBlue instead of the correct codes ( WN, FL, B6) it makes them look stupid to some folks.

Thank you welcome my respected users

Hawk44
Never under estimate the power of US
 
COfaninBOS
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Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:45 am

I was born in Texas but got out as soon as I could.

Massachusetts is the BEST place to live. Solid public education. Broad support for the environment. Clean, safe cities. History preserved rather than torn down for strip malls. Decent public transportation. Very little gun violence. True equality for ALL citizens. The Cape and Islands. The Berkshires. Harvard, MIT, Williams, Amherst, Tufts, Boston U, Boston College, Northeastern, Wellesley, Mount Holyoke, Smith, Brandeis, Wheaton and a host of other top notch colleges and universities.

I moved here by CHOICE and LOVE IT.
 
srbmod
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:41 am

Quoting Boeingguy1 (Reply 34):


People like this annoy me. So he got the code for Jet-Blue wrong, instead of writing B6 he wrote JB. Give people a break and stop acting so above-everyone else

And you really help your case by your use of Jet-Blue. It's JetBlue (no space between the Jet and Blue.).
 
B6FA4ever
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:02 am

Quoting Supa7e7 (Reply 27):
How many daily departures does B6 do from BOS? I doubt they are among the leaders at BOS.

well at least for today we are running 41 flights. so its daily avg is in the low 40's for our winter sked.

~B6FA4ever
 
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:16 am

Quoting MD90fan (Thread starter):
Just wondering, lately it seems lately that JB is doing really good out of BOS well AA and DL are kinda slow to catch up and are letting JB beat them. Well they let JB take over? Just tell me what you all think

Delta just built a new terminal and has added flights. You have absolutely nothing to base this claim on.

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 9):
I'm sorry, but if the LCCs can get you from sea to shining sea for $99 don't tell ME that $1,000 is really what I ought to be paying. My job isn't to fund an out-of-whack cost structure. If some carrier can do it for $99, then that becomes the new price floor. It becomes what people are willing to pay. It becomes the VALUE for that service. The legacy carriers are shedding whatever differentiation they earned along the way (pillows, anyone?), so they need to provide their service at the $99 end of the spectrum...not the $1,000 end. That extra $900 is buying you nothing, anyway.

Well, I guess I'll be the only one to challenge this.

People who think like you are part of the reason why the industry is in the shape it's in. I challenge you to name one other service where the consumer demands the product for less than what it costs to produce? I don't give a crap if it's an LCC or not, NO AIRLINE makes money on those "rock bottom" fares.

I blame the carriers to the extent that they should not even offer those ridiculous fares to begin with, because it's detrimental to the industry as a whole. Your comment "it becomes what people are willing to pay" is a shining example of what's wrong with the equation. You think you're entitled to it, while you lose track of exactly what business in this country are based on, capitalism. An entity creates a product, sells it to a market for more than what it took to create it, to make a profit, and make more products. There's nothing wrong with that, it's the American way.

I'm "willing to only pay" $5000 for a 2006 Nissan Pathfinder, but I'm not kidding myself to think that I'm going to get it for that. That's not how it works.

I hate to bust this myth, but flyers don't deserve low fares all the time. They deserve fair fares, and I'm sorry, but if you want to buy a ticket on a flight with only two seats left, and you have to pay $1000, that's fair, whether you like it or not. It's called supply and demand. This applies to every other industry, but what I'll never understand is why only the airlines catch so much hell for it.

B
 
Fleet Service
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:29 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 29):
his flame bait message posted by someone who lived in boston for 4 months

Wow, four whole months! I'll bet you've got the accent and everything too...

What kind of feel for a place can you have after four months?
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
boeingguy1
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Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:12 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 37):
And you really help your case by your use of Jet-Blue. It's JetBlue (no space between the Jet and Blue.).

Thanks for proving my point.
Gatwick South! Id rather crash in Brighton!
 
supa7E7
Posts: 1360
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 2:05 am

Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:22 am

Quoting B6FA4ever (Reply 38):
well at least for today we are running 41 flights. so its daily avg is in the low 40's for our winter sked.

~B6FA4ever

Yeah, the B6 BOS scene is smaller than DL, US and AA, which each have 100+ flights per day, mostly mainline.
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
flyjetstar
Posts: 678
Joined: Fri Feb 03, 2006 6:37 am

Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:24 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 33):
I didn't realize Helijet Airways flew out of Boston, as B6 is the code for JetBlue, not JB (Which is Helijet Airways). So perhaps you should either use the correct codes or don't use them at all, as when someone puts SW down for Southwest Airlines, AT for AirTran (or ATA) or JB down for JetBlue instead of the correct codes ( WN, FL, B6) it makes them look stupid to some folks.



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 37):

And you really help your case by your use of Jet-Blue. It's JetBlue (no space between the Jet and Blue.).

Do you think you need to get out more? Does it really matter? When you read the post and the ones that follow you can tell he was talking about JetBlue. People like you who give those who make mistakes a hard time take the enjoyment out of using this site as an opportunity to learn from those who know more.
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 9:38 am

Quoting Flyjetstar (Reply 43):

Do you think you need to get out more? Does it really matter? When you read the post and the ones that follow you can tell he was talking about JetBlue. People like you who give those who make mistakes a hard time take the enjoyment out of using this site as an opportunity to learn from those who know more.



Quoting Boeingguy1 (Reply 41):

Thanks for proving my point.

And the newcomers come in and try to make a name for themselves by bashing on the old timers. If it wasn't me who pointed it out, it would have been some other person who may not have been so nice about it. If you can't take constructive criticism from longtime members, then perhaps you might as well delete yourself from the site.

This is dragging the thread seriously off track, even more so with the introduction of politics into this discussion. If you want to have a political discussion about Massachuetts Politics, go discuss it over in the Non-Aviation forum, not in here. It's this kind of garbage that's ruining this forum.
 
DCA-ROCguy
Posts: 3890
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2000 5:03 am

RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 10:30 am

I hate to bust this myth, but flyers don't deserve low fares all the time. They deserve fair fares, and I'm sorry, but if you want to buy a ticket on a flight with only two seats left, and you have to pay $1000, that's fair, whether you like it or not. It's called supply and demand. This applies to every other industry, but what I'll never understand is why only the airlines catch so much hell for it. B

Airlines catch hell when they gouge because, like it or not, air travel isn't an entirely private thing. It's an essential part of modern life, and has the quality of a public good, even if it is privately provided. Supply and demand is not the only principle in operation. Airlines that gouge are rightly resented by consumers and communities and officials, whose economies depend upon reasonably priced air travel. The idea that legacy carriers are owed autonomy to charge what they please is what's a myth.

The beautiful thing is, it's the private marketplace that works to ensure that this public good is reasonably priced. We consumers took it in the chute from legacy carriers when they didn't have much LCC competition in the '90s. We said to hell with that once options became available. We're voting with our feet and our computer mouses. Sorry you don't like that.

Maybe if legacy carriers hadn't gouged vulnerable markets so badly in the '90s, they wouldn't have opened themselves up for the LCC revolution of this decade. Consumers rightly expect reasonable if not always rock-bottom airfares for something that is not simply a luxury. And we choose them where they're available. That's fair, that's right, and that's what the market is increasingly dictating. Airlines' portion is to adjust or lose out.

Jim
Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
 
flyjetstar
Posts: 678
Joined: Fri Feb 03, 2006 6:37 am

RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 10:56 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 42):
And the newcomers come in and try to make a name for themselves by bashing on the old timers. If it wasn't me who pointed it out, it would have been some other person who may not have been so nice about it. If you can't take constructive criticism from longtime members, then perhaps you might as well delete yourself from the site.

Sorry but I am not trying to make a name for myself and I didn't realise that as a long term member you had rights I as a newbie don't.
 
Guest

RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 11:04 am

Quoting DCA-ROCguy (Reply 43):
Airlines catch hell when they gouge because,

Gouging is your word. It's a nice spin, but I'm not buying it. Why don't we all demand lower gas prices? We "need" that too don't we? It's interesting to me that there's no outrage over Exxon-Mobile making record profits, but every one still piles on the airlines who are financially unstable, hell even JetBlue isn't going to post a gain this year!

On flight 123 there's a short supply of seats from ABC-XYX. This would be due to great demend for that flight. Therefore a higher fare is justified. You call it gouging, I call it capitalism.

You can say what you like, but again, I challenge you to name one other service where the consumer demands the product for less than what it costs to produce. It's just not logical.

And LCC's shouldn't be your hero. They don't make money off the $49 fares either.

B
 
DCA-ROCguy
Posts: 3890
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RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 11:31 am

Gouging is your word. It's a nice spin, but I'm not buying it. Why don't we all demand lower gas prices? We "need" that too don't we? It's interesting to me that there's no outrage over Exxon-Mobile making record profits, but every one still piles on the airlines who are financially unstable, hell even JetBlue isn't going to post a gain this year!

Air travel doesn't cost to produce what the legacy carriers were charging in the '90s. Contracts were expensive, work rules often lax, cost control in general was loose. JetBlue, Southwest, etc., proved that air travel often doesn't have to cost what legacy carriers wanted to charge for it. Legacy carrier 1990's pricing was gouging. What's spin is your claim that legacy carriers are owed autonomy from LCC competition, to keep prices as high as they want.

Last I checked, there was lots of outrage over oil companies making excessive profits. But there's no "LCC oil industry" out there to discipline pricing. The market hasn't come up with a solution, so we pay more for oil.

On flight 123 there's a short supply of seats from ABC-XYX. This would be due to great demend for that flight. Therefore a higher fare is justified. You call it gouging, I call it capitalism.

Capitalism does the fare disciplining. If legacy carrier X overcharges, and the route can support an LCC, then the LCC comes in and disciplines fares.

You can say what you like, but again, I challenge you to name one other service where the consumer demands the product for less than what it costs to produce. It's just not logical.And LCC's shouldn't be your hero. They don't make money off the $49 fares either. B

Air travel is available at the cost the market makes available. You mouth the typical line of network carrier unions and managements: air travel costs what we say it should cost! Fact is, on lots of routes, it doesn't, as AirTran, JetBlue, and Southwest have proven. Complain to the banks who keep funding legacy carrier overcapacity through multiple bankruptcies. That's what drives fares below sustainable levels.

And no one has said either a) that carriers have any obligation to charge $49 fares all the time, or b) that LCC's do that. All airlines are businesses and price the product to make money at their cost structure. Even if legacy carrier overcapacity were pared back, and LCC's raised fares a little (Neeleman said last week that a $10 increase would wipe out JetBlue's losses), the average airfares would still be far below ridiculous 1990's ripoff levels.

Airlines are free to offer higher fares, and find out if consumers still buy them.

People always want a product for less than it costs if they can get it. The question is, is the industry allowed to right its costs and pricing to allow profitability? The banks propping legacy carriers through multiple bankruptcies is what has what produces unsustainable fares.

On topic: Massport just might find it cheaper to build customs in A, and then build them in B to keep AA happy, than have DL use bankruptcy to reject their leases and stick M. with a big chunk of a white elephant to pay for.

Jim
Need a new airline paint scheme? Better call Saul! (Bass that is)
 
LH423
Posts: 5868
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:13 am

Quoting SRQCrosscheck (Reply 4):
Now they're busier and in C; maybe not so rosy anymore?

Actually, they're really in a better position now than they were in Terminal E. Before they had to share the security checkpoint with Northwest domestic. Now, they only have to share it with one Continental gate, plus a few Conti Express Beech 1900s (19 seats each) and some Cape Air Cessna 402s (what, like 8 seats each). Otherwise, B6 controls one pier at Terminal C and the only people waiting to get through security are B6 passengers. Anyway, there's no way B6 could operate the schedule they do on the 2-3 gates they had at Terminal E. Actually, I remember towards the end of their stay in E, they had to utilize international gates for some of their early-morning departures.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13730
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: Are AA/DL Gonna Give BOS To B6?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:27 am

Quoting Fleet Service (Reply 38):
Wow, four whole months! I'll bet you've got the accent and everything too...

What kind of feel for a place can you have after four months?

Are you kidding?

You can get a really good sense of the people and the general atmosphere in less time. 4 months gives you exposure to the bureaucracy and draconian laws that a visitor might not experience. Cops that kept pulling me over for having california plates, which they claimed "weren't legal" in the PR of M being only the beginning.

Oh, and i visit friends there a lot as well. And i'm good with accents and did learn to mimic Bostonians in that time, at least. The only people I find friendly are the ones who aren't natively from Massachusetts. There is a reason the rest of the country has the slang term "Massholes" after all...

But someplace friendly, full of great people, usually doesn't take more than a week to warm up to, let alone 4 months.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.

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