phxplanes
Posts: 381
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:24 am

Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 1:28 pm

I read the article in the paper and there is now a post US Airways To Hawaii Having A Rocky Start (by Ballsdeep Jan 25 2006 in Civil Aviation) about how the flights to HNL from PHX are weight restricted. In the article it said they hope to change the max takeoff weight. They said they could add 10,000lbs. I dont understand how they can do this. If they plane can fly with more weight why cant they do it in the first place. What has to happen to add more weight and how long will it take.

Long question but thanks in advance
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 1:39 pm

Quoting Phxplanes (Thread starter):
They said they could add 10,000lbs. I dont understand how they can do this. If they plane can fly with more weight why cant they do it in the first place. What has to happen to add more weight and how long will it take.

It's basically about how much extra you want to pay Boeing for the certification paperwork authorizing the higher weights. It's not unlike buying a car with "standard" features, and then deciding (later) that you need some "optional" features...

For example, when SWA took delivery of our first 737-300s back in late 1984, the MTOW was 130,500. Some years later, loads and operational requirements dictated the need for a higher MTOW limit, and we paid Boeing $$$ for paperwork authorizing a new MTOW of 135,000. A few years later, there was a need to increase the MTOW again, and we ponied up $$$ for the current MTOW 139,000.

The MTOW I'm referring to above is the max structural TOW--which has nothing to do with runway length, temperature, etc...

[Edited 2006-01-26 05:54:16]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
ConcordeBoy
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Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:04 pm

Quoting Phxplanes (Thread starter):
I dont understand how they can do this. If they plane can fly with more weight why cant they do it in the first place.

Simple paperwork upgrade in this case.:
their aircraft already have the structural/engine ability to op at the weight they want... but the airline might not have the certification to run the aircraft at that weight.


In cases where the aircraft lack the necessary equipment, there's typically manufacturer (and/or aftermarket) PIPs available.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:11 pm

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 1):
For example, when SWA took delivery of our first 737-300s back in late 1984, the MTOW was 130,500. Some years later, loads and operational requirements dictated the need for a higher MTOW limit, and we paid Boeing $$$ for paperwork authorizing a new MTOW of 135,000. A few years later, there was a need to increase the MTOW again, and we ponied up $$$ for the current MTOW 139,000.

The MTOW I'm referring to above is the max structural TOW--which has nothing to do with runway length, temperature, etc...

Didn't you guys also do it with the 73Gs?
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OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:54 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 3):
Didn't you guys also do it with the 73Gs?

Yes, we did, and we also upgraded the engine thrust from 22,000 lbs. each to 24,000 lbs. each. I didn't mention is as I didn't want to confuse the issue (of increased structural weights and increased thrust) since it may have not been applicable in the case of HP's 757s...
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
Tristarsteve
Posts: 3359
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:04 pm

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 5:22 pm

BA B757 are restricted to 99700kg TOW. This is done for cost saving. All landing fees and parking fees are based on the aircraft MTOW. So you certify your aircraft at the max you need to save on the fees. The B757 MTOW is up at 130000kg but BA have no need for it on European flights.
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:28 pm

Quoting TristarSteve (Reply 5):
BA B757 are restricted to 99700kg TOW.

Were they restricted as such back when they were doing nonstop transatlantics?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Max Takeoff Weight For 757 Question?

Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:40 pm

Quoting TristarSteve (Reply 5):
The B757 MTOW is up at 130000kg but BA have no need for it on European flights.

Actually, the maximum MTOW for the 757-200 is 115,680kg. In fact, the 753 is only up to 123,600kg. The BA difference is not as much as you made it out to be.

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
since it may have not been applicable in the case of HP's 757s...

Well, their 757s were E4, not E4B powered, which means just over 40,000 pounds per side as opposed to over 43,000. I am not sure if they wanted the extra 3000 pounds in order to get the full MTOW
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss