pzurita1
Posts: 1187
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2002 11:21 am

Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 5:49 am

We all know about MX plans to start flying to China by 2007. However, as it has been posted recently ( AeroMexico's International Expansion 06! (by Ghost77 Jan 26 2006 in Civil Aviation)#90 ) AM might also be considering flying to Asia (NGO to be precise) as soon as next May.

I believe both ventures have good chances to succes as they could target not only Asia-Mexico market, but also Asia-South America with efficent connections in MEX (avoiding difficult VISA regulations with both US and Canada set on almost every South American nation).

However I am (as always) a little bit skeptical about this AM plans. It seems they have not a/c to perform this route. They are getting two B777 in the next few months, but according to what has been said, they are going to be intensivly used in CDG, MAD, SCL and GRU runs. Moreover, isn't it May so close to start a service without any prior notice to the travel comunity?

So, I would like to ask you guys in Japan if you've heard something about this? May be someone working for the Chubu Airport could have some info about this.

If AM and MX really start serving Asia, there is no doubt MEX could become a gateway to Asia for Latin America. I can see connections to LIM, EZE, SCL, GRU, GIG, PTY, SJO.

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
AM744
Posts: 1435
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 7:30 am

I'm not holding my breath. I don't even see AM flying to London anytime soon, much less to Asia. Sounds good on paper though.
 
XA744
Posts: 630
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 7:34 am

Quoting AM744 (Reply 1):
I'm not holding my breath. I don't even see AM flying to London anytime soon, much less to Asia.

Now someone is making sense here ! You know what I mean, don´t you EddieDude ?

Regards
No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
 
ghost77
Posts: 4461
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 2:07 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 7:44 am

Quoting AM744 (Reply 1):
I'm not holding my breath. I don't even see AM flying to London anytime soon, much less to Asia.

Well, very truth! Thank you very much for making us touch the ground again!! If something new comes from AM; it would and could be EZE, GIG and BCN before anything!!!

Dreams for MXP/FCO, LHR, AMS, NGO and other will have to wait a little more, at least not until it's sold.

ghost77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
juventus
Posts: 2017
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:04 am

Quoting AM744 (Reply 1):
I don't even see AM flying to London anytime soon


I'm confident this year we'll hear the news about AM flying London.
 
N405MX
Posts: 1156
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:46 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:13 am

Quoting Juventus (Reply 4):
I'm confident this year we'll hear the news about AM flying London.

Hopefully if AM goes to NGO, why not MX to FRA or other german cities  Wink

Quoting Pzurita1 (Thread starter):
I believe both ventures have good chances to succes as they could target not only Asia-Mexico market, but also Asia-South America with efficent connections in MEX (avoiding difficult VISA regulations with both US and Canada set on almost every South American nation).

Agree

Quoting Pzurita1 (Thread starter):
However I am (as always) a little bit skeptical about this AM plans. It seems they have not a/c to perform this route. They are getting two B777 in the next few months, but according to what has been said, they are going to be intensivly used in CDG, MAD, SCL and GRU runs. Moreover, isn't it May so close to start a service without any prior notice to the travel comunity?

Also MX already is in talks with Baja California goverment for some facilites for the China flight.

Saludos
Life is what happens when you have other plans.....
 
anthsaun
Posts: 510
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:21 am

I used to live in Japan a few years ago and I don´t think NGO is a good start up for AM nor for MX. If a Mexican airline wants to land on Japan, the best options are NRT or KIX.

Also, May is too close. Business deals take a little longer than that.
Over 80 years in business say a lot about success
 
san747
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:06 pm

Quoting N405MX (Reply 5):

Also MX already is in talks with Baja California goverment for some facilites for the China flight.

Baja California? You mean a flight to Asia from TIJ???? What about SAN? We're kind of lacking in the intercontinental flights department...  grumpy 
Scotty doesn't know...
 
centrair
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:39 pm

First of all there has been no news from any of my contacts about this. Chubu Management has been courting carriers to start service, espcially ones with service to South America. We lost RG and then AA. UA has some service but the problem is that all those carriers would require travelers from South American nations to get U.S. transit visas which kills the route.

Quoting Anthsaun (Reply 6):
I used to live in Japan a few years ago and I don´t think NGO is a good start up for AM nor for MX. If a Mexican airline wants to land on Japan, the best options are NRT or KIX.

NRT...slot restricted.
KIX ... latin population a fraction of NGO.
NGO...Cheap landing and 24hr ops.

NGO has one of the largest concentrations of South Americans outside of South America. The Brazillian popuation alone is around 350,000 (nationwide) and rising. 2/3 of that population is in Chubu. Peruvian and Argentinian make up the next largest south american groups.

As of now, the whole idea of AM is just what we have seen on A.net. I heard it first on A.net.
Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
PITrules
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting San747 (Reply 7):
Baja California? You mean a flight to Asia from TIJ???? What about SAN? We're kind of lacking in the intercontinental flights department...

SAN's lack of service is probably a big reason why TIJ is being considered over MEX.
FLYi
 
adriaticus
Posts: 989
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:21 pm

Quoting San747 (Reply 7):
You mean a flight to Asia from TIJ???? What about SAN?

EddieDude may shed more light on this one, but I believe there wouldn't be traffic rights beyond the USA for a Mexican carrier.

TIJ makes very good sense as a stop in the way to the Far East; it would not only serve as a perfect technical stop at sea level, but could also capture O&D passengers related to the maquiladora industry as well as those heading all the way to MEX and connections (including those in Central and South America).

Let's remember the Asian market is the fastest-growing segment of the air transportation worldwide. It is late already, but Mexico better tap into that market before it is really way too late.

TIJ could also serve as a modest gateway. If flights coming from Asia make a stop there, you will start seeing AM/MX flights going from TIJ to other of the border cities or even city pairs: CJS/ELP, NLD/LRD (with no current non-stop service), even CUU, MTY or SLW could receive increased or non-existing frequencies on small, ERJ145's or A319's / F100's... And a tourist trap: a TIJ-CUN flight catering to visitors from the Far East.

Currently only JR makes a single daily nonstop TIJ-CUU, and A6 a daily nonstop TIJ-MTY... The market's there, folks. All these routes could feed widebodies to Asia.

Something else noone seems to take into consideration is cargo as a driver of these flights... The Mexico-Far East air cargo service is well underserved.

IMHO, If someone in AM or MX is doing its homework, they'd better think of Asia as a priority... Yes, even before LHR or FRA...

___Ad.

[Edited 2006-02-01 05:26:40]
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ghost77
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:30 pm

Thank you very much for your input Adria!!! I sometimes really don't know what to think... but I'm also confident market is there, but what stops MX or AM was CINTRA. Everything was about setting plans for the moment but no midterm or future plans for growth considering a 10 year basis plan!!!

At least I'm also confident MX will land in China, that will be seen in 2007 but still they'll get there!!!

ghost77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4050
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:05 pm

When AM opens service to NGO, I will open a bottle of Antiguo and celebrate. Too far fetched I think. LHR will happen prior.

-A.
Live, and let live.
 
Coronado990
Posts: 1312
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:24 am

Quoting San747 (Reply 7):
Baja California? You mean a flight to Asia from TIJ???? What about SAN? We're kind of lacking in the intercontinental flights department...

The SD County Airport Authority visited ANA in December for just that reason.
So things are in the works.
Uncle SAN at your service!
 
Marcus
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:27 am

If you go and visit TIJ airport you can allmost be sure that you will find passengers who live in San Diego taking flights to other parts of Mexico from TIJ, so the market is there but I do not know how big of a market this is.

This also happens in the opposite direction, for example, from TIJ there are no flights to Cabo......but there are flights from SAN direct.

I wonder if somewhere someone is keeping track of how many Southern California residents are taking flights from TIJ and how many "Tijuanenses" take flights from SAN.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
DCAYOW
Posts: 542
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:35 am

Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 13):
The SD County Airport Authority visited ANA in December for just that reason.
So things are in the works.

Yes, but the problem with SAN is a service only works with the 787 or A345/6 everything else you might want to use (e.g. 747, 777) is not economically feasible from SAN. TIJ with a comparable RWY length has the benefit of unconstrained departures (no Point Loma in the way) and therefore the 777 can be used.
Retorne ao céu...
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:39 am

Quoting Marcus (Reply 14):
I wonder if somewhere someone is keeping track of how many Southern California residents are taking flights from TIJ and how many "Tijuanenses" take flights from SAN.

= Has crossing the border become less burdensome? I crossed it once and remember the lines to be significant.

Cheers,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Coronado990
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:47 am

Quoting DCAYOW (Reply 15):
Yes, but the problem with SAN is a service only works with the 787 or A345/6 everything else you might want to use (e.g. 747, 777) is not economically feasible from SAN. TIJ with a comparable RWY length has the benefit of unconstrained departures (no Point Loma in the way) and therefore the 777 can be used.

ANA is getting the 787, right?
Uncle SAN at your service!
 
Trvlr
Posts: 4251
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:55 am

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 16):
= Has crossing the border become less burdensome? I crossed it once and remember the lines to be significant.

It depends on the time of day. During rush hour in the morning, getting into the United States can be hell, as many Tijuanenses are commuting across to jobs in San Diego. Conversely, at the end of the day, there is a huge influx of people back into Tijuana. Moreover, getting into the United States is always harder than getting into Mexico, just in general.

Nevertheless, both cities are continually working to facilitate the huge number of border crossings each day. I believe a new checkpoint was opened just a few months ago, which has greatly helped commute times.

Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 17):
Quoting DCAYOW (Reply 15):
Yes, but the problem with SAN is a service only works with the 787 or A345/6 everything else you might want to use (e.g. 747, 777) is not economically feasible from SAN. TIJ with a comparable RWY length has the benefit of unconstrained departures (no Point Loma in the way) and therefore the 777 can be used.

ANA is getting the 787, right?

I really wonder if ANA's recent 737-700ER order could affect SAN's prospects. Personally, I don't see the plane as being that economical, but it probably also has the legs to make it out of SAN.

Nevertheless, the 787 is obviously still SAN's best bet when it comes to future international service.

Aaron G.
 
Bartolo
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 2:03 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 1:38 am

Quoting Juventus (Reply 4):
I'm confident this year we'll hear the news about AM flying London.

This will definitely not happen.
 
mjt909
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 2:26 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:29 am

Quote:
= Has crossing the border become less burdensome? I crossed it once and remember the lines to be significant.

The busiest times at the borders are in the morning on weekdays (commuters heading to work) and the afternoons/evenings on weekends (shoppers/tourists heading back north). The Otay Mesa border crossing, which is right near TIJ airport, is never as bad as the main border crossing at San Ysidro. I've made it through there in as little as 10 minutes, or the longest an hour. Again it just depends on the time of day.

Quote:
TIJ makes very good sense as a stop in the way to the Far East

Keep in mind that there is a decent sized (and growing) Chinese population in TIJ. San Diego also has a large Chinese population, which normally drives to LAX when they need to fly to China.
 
Coronado990
Posts: 1312
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:12 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:47 am

Quoting Mjt909 (Reply 20):
Keep in mind that there is a decent sized (and growing) Chinese population in TIJ. San Diego also has a large Chinese population, which normally drives to LAX when they need to fly to China.

I always have to send San Diego people packing to LAX when traveling to Asia. There is such a large Asian population here and all we do is bolster L.A.'s numbers. It is really getting frustrating.  banghead 
Uncle SAN at your service!
 
N405MX
Posts: 1156
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:46 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting San747 (Reply 7):
Baja California? You mean a flight to Asia from TIJ???? What about SAN? We're kind of lacking in the intercontinental flights department...

The problem there will be like Centrair said, the VISA, as more the US ask for more stuff to mexicans, brazilians, etc, etc, etc, it´s easier to start a flight from TIJ that SAN.

Quoting Mjt909 (Reply 20):
Keep in mind that there is a decent sized (and growing) Chinese population in TIJ. San Diego also has a large Chinese population, which normally drives to LAX when they need to fly to China.



Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 21):
always have to send San Diego people packing to LAX when traveling to Asia.

Instead of overcrowd LAX, it can be done in TIJ.

Saludos
Life is what happens when you have other plans.....
 
ghost77
Posts: 4461
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:34 am

I was checking Boeing's numbers of the new B737-700ER!!! A MEX-LHR flights is 4.900nm, Boeing's new toy is capable of flying 5.510nm!!! AM perhaps later could consider in a way MEX-LON with B737ER!!!

ghost77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
MTY2GVA
Posts: 77
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:52 am

It would be very impractical to use the 737-700ER to fly to LON because the tanks use much of the cargo hold, plus I imagine from MEX as usual range is most probably punished because of the Hot and High. I love AM and I would love them to have all the cool birds, but unfortunately that's how it is.

Arriba Monterrey saludos desde Suiza
Tengo orgullo de ser del norte del mero San Luisito...
 
EddieDude
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 7:04 am

So guys, do you think that the officer of AM who told the reporter about AM's plans to fly to Japan estaba pedo and that this will not happen? It can't be, right?

Quoting Adriaticus (Reply 10):
I believe there wouldn't be traffic rights beyond the USA for a Mexican carrier.

AM used to have 5th freedom rights for MIA-MAD and MIA-CDG. When AM got planes that could fly to Europe non-stop from MEX, they dropped the connection at MIA. I don't know if those particular 5th freedom rights are still in effect or if they have been terminated, and I certainly don't know if there are others, but I guess Mexican carriers could apply for them and, depending on the city pairs, perhaps get them. I am thinking that a certain degree of discretion from the U.S. authorities would apply.

However, as it has been explained here, the issue here is that stopping in the U.S. is not interesting for many reasons: (i) TIJ is near the maquiladoras, which circumstance could provide steady numbers of passengers per flight; (ii) if AM is going to try to connect South America with Japan, the visa requirements of the U.S. government simply make a stop in SAN a bad idea; and (iii) why go through the hassle of applying for 5th freedom rights when the flight can be done from TIJ?

On a side note, speaking of traffic rights, I remember reading here that Mexican carriers have 5th freedom rights ex-YVR (or is it ex-Canada?), so a stop in YVR rather than in TIJ could be very interesting too (of course that would mean the end of AM-JL's partnership)... or going a bit farther, if AM wants to do MEX-YYZ, maybe they can do MEX-YYZ-NGO with the 772ER.

Finally, a question: can the 772ER really do TIJ-NGO and NGO-TIJ all year long? I am more concerned about nosewinds than about the airplane's specified average range. I believe MX had determined already that the -200ER was not a good choice for Asian flights and therefore decided to go for quads from Airbus.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
mike1974
Posts: 58
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:37 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:22 am

Interesting to know AM is looking into the Asian market. I guess this may have to do with the possibility of MX starting flights to China by 2007. Would be nice to see Mexico's metal in both Japan and China. I can also see a market being there for flights to Hong Kong and Taiwan. I though both of this airlines would never wake up and study markets other than the US and Latin America. Europe is another market than either airline needs to expand its network. Hopefully 2006 and 2007 will bring alot surprises for the Mexican aviation.
 
Marcus
Posts: 1666
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2001 5:08 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:40 am

In order to accommodate international flights TIJ would definitely need to expand the Customs area, as of right now it consists of 3 booths that all passengers regardless of the flight have to walk thru in order to get to the baggage claim area and then the exit..........Customs Inspections in TIJ consist of INM agents asking people "where are you from?" as they walk by and if they notice an accent they will stop you and ask for your passport.

Now TIJ airport is very small, crowded and not very well designed.......some modifications need to be done in order to cope with the increased traffic these "future" flight would bring.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
adriaticus
Posts: 989
Joined: Thu May 06, 2004 3:29 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:42 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 25):
I remember reading here that Mexican carriers have 5th freedom rights ex-YVR (or is it ex-Canada?), so a stop in YVR rather than in TIJ could be very interesting too

You hit the nail... What you read is true. AM can make it to Asia from YVR using the new B772ER's, and MX can jump from TIJ with whatever widebody they are looking into, the A330 or A343...

__Ad.
A300/18/19/20/21 B721/2 B732/3/G/8 B741/2/4 B752 B762/3/4 B772/3 DC8/9/10 MD11 TU134/154 IL62/86 An24 SA340/2000 E45/90
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:14 am

Quoting Pzurita1 (Thread starter):
I believe both ventures have good chances to succes as they could target not only Asia-Mexico market, but also Asia-South America with efficent connections in MEX (avoiding difficult VISA regulations with both US and Canada set on almost every South American nation).

Mexico does require VISA for many Latinamerican nationals, while it may be easier to transit MEX without a visa enroute to Europe or Asia, it's a hassle too.

Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 23):
I was checking Boeing's numbers of the new B737-700ER!!! A MEX-LHR flights is 4.900nm, Boeing's new toy is capable of flying 5.510nm!!! AM perhaps later could consider in a way MEX-LON with B737ER!!!

I know an airline which may be jumping up-n-down because the new B737-700ER.

Quoting MTY2GVA (Reply 24):
It would be very impractical to use the 737-700ER to fly to LON because the tanks use much of the cargo hold, plus I imagine from MEX as usual range is most probably punished because of the Hot and High. I love AM and I would love them to have all the cool birds, but unfortunately that's how it is.

MEX high altitude works against aircraftrange. Maybe B737-700ER to LON out of CUN or MTY instead?

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 25):
On a side note, speaking of traffic rights, I remember reading here that Mexican carriers have 5th freedom rights ex-YVR (or is it ex-Canada?), so a stop in YVR rather than in TIJ could be very interesting too (of course that would mean the end of AM-JL's partnership)... or going a bit farther, if AM wants to do MEX-YYZ, maybe they can do MEX-YYZ-NGO with the 772ER.

MEX-YYZ-NGO it too much of a huge detour, if Mexican airlines want to fly via Canada the choices are YVR (most desired) and YYC (alternate).

IMHO, TIJ-NGO (for the Maquiladoras and to catch some of SAN-Asia traffic) or even MTY-NGO (MTY is very industrial, high yield destination) could work; don't know if Ciudad Juárez / El Paso - NGO would be as attractive as the other 2 routes.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
centrair
Posts: 2845
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2005 3:44 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:31 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 25):
can the 772ER really do TIJ-NGO and NGO-TIJ all year long? I am more concerned about nosewinds than about the airplane's specified average range.

If it can do LAX-Asia, why not TIJ? Its only a 108nm difference. LAX-Japan is about 10 hours then a flight from TIJ would be about 11 or 11.5 hours. Not a huge difference. Of course in winter it could get to around 12 from westbound due to headwinds. I think it would be well within the abilities of a 772ER. If ANA can do LAX-NRT year round with a 777, then AM could do it as well from TIJ.
Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
MTY2GVA
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:18 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Thu Feb 02, 2006 7:16 pm

Even more simple if IAH-NRT (which I will be flying in two weeks  Smile ) works all year long then TIJ-NGO shouldn't be a problem.
Tengo orgullo de ser del norte del mero San Luisito...
 
ghost77
Posts: 4461
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 2:07 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 4:18 am

I think it would be more convenient for AM to go via LAP or TIJ. Remember Luis Echeverría frustrated attempt MEX-LAP-HNL-NRT with Dc8s.

Perhaps a MEX-TIJ-HNL-NRT/NGO/KIX?

I remember long ago our discussions on AM's B777s and soon everything will be real, MX A318s rumors, its real... F100 transfer to AeroCaribe, its real, AeroMexpress return will also soon be real, part of Cintra's sale took place, LCC's are flooding the market as promised... many things lately changing real fast!!!

AM will soon be back at Germany (at least with charters)!! AM will soon expand, MX will do it's own thing.

I think we are not dreaming, I'm confident that at least MX will put a step in China but I'm also crossing my fingers to see AM at Japan. I think mexican carriers are ready for that!!!

ghost77 APM
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
Coronado990
Posts: 1312
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:12 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 5:23 am

Quoting Marcus (Reply 27):
Now TIJ airport is very small, crowded and not very well designed.......some modifications need to be done in order to cope with the increased traffic these "future" flight would bring.

Building a full length taxiway to accommodate the heavies was an important modification that was just completed as can be seen in the only overview of TIJ I can find.


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LatinPlane
Posts: 2471
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 7:02 am

Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 32):
I think it would be more convenient for AM to go via LAP or TIJ. Remember Luis Echeverría frustrated attempt MEX-LAP-HNL-NRT with Dc8s.

LOL! Los años del cine de oro Mexicano! Or what?

Maybe one day there will be a MEX-HNL. I wonder why nobody has really explored the idea. I'm sure that Hawaii is or can be desirable destination for the Mexicans given the right marketing and packaging options.

 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2471
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 7:24 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 25):
So guys, do you think that the officer of AM who told the reporter about AM's plans to fly to Japan estaba pedo and that this will not happen? It can't be, right?

¡Mas bien fumo de la buena!

No, really, It can be done, but this will distract AM's ability to increase its market share in its already established markets. Does it really want to do that given that it will only have two 777s to work with?

I do see that they are able to identify a good opportunity given Varig's recent withdrawal from the Brazil - Japan market. NGO twice weekly would be specifically for the reason of tapping into this market, which is exactly what the article you posted said. And according to Bartolo, which seems to have good insight within the company, it is definitely what's on their minds.

Now, Bartolo, you said that we might be able to see something as close as May? The way Mexican airlines do things... I have might doubts, especially looking at AM's business strategy of sometimes being way too conservative, and even then making wrong decisions (like BOS).



 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 7:26 am

Quoting Latinplane (Reply 34):
Maybe one day there will be a MEX-HNL. I wonder why nobody has really explored the idea. I'm sure that Hawaii is or can be desirable destination for the Mexicans given the right marketing and packaging options.

Wealthy Mexicans might preffer to holiday in PPT instead of HNL.

Flying from México via HNL to Japan would add miles and make the route longer. The shortest route from México to Japan is from TIJ or from Ciudad Júarez; from both cities a route to Japan could get some U.S. passengers.
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adriaticus
Posts: 989
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 7:48 am

Quoting Ghost77 (Reply 32):
Perhaps a MEX-TIJ-HNL-NRT/NGO/KIX?



Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 36):
Flying from México via HNL to Japan would add miles and make the route longer. The shortest route from México to Japan is from TIJ or from Ciudad Júarez; from both cities a route to Japan could get some U.S. passengers.

In addition to this, a stop in HNL would entail 5th freedom issues, plus USA visa requirements for the pax. The competitive advantage of a stop within Mexico is not having to comply with these requirements.

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Bartolo
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 9:03 am

Hi Latinplane

Regarding start up time. I can tell you that AM can move very quickly when the decisions are made. We utilize third party handlers and have very limited facility needs. It can easily be done.
 
LatinPlane
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 9:51 am

Quoting Bartolo (Reply 38):
Regarding start up time. I can tell you that AM can move very quickly when the decisions are made. We utilize third party handlers and have very limited facility needs. It can easily be done.

Thanks for that Bartolo. Hoping that AM indeed makes it to Asia! I'm thinking that before the U.S. security measures were conceived after 9/11, this route was indeed one of/or the most profitable flight in VARIG's route map, according to some experts around here. Hence the reason why it should be covered via someone who can go without stopping in U.S.

 Smile LatinPlane
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ghost77
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 10:10 am

Quoting Bartolo (Reply 38):
Regarding start up time. I can tell you that AM can move very quickly when the decisions are made.

Hey Bartolo! Glad to know and seems we have finally an AM insider!! So, is it confirmed? You know something else on AM's 3rd B777?

ghost77 APM
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MTY2GVA
Posts: 77
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Fri Feb 03, 2006 9:03 pm

The Mexican President aboard TP-01 uses Hawaii as a technical stop when going to Asia ( at least when he went to Shangai for APEC). And when going to Europe they use the bermudas. I know this because my father has flown there aboard TP-01. But requiring a VISA to the US can be a problem compared to TIJ for flying to NGO.
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pzurita1
Posts: 1187
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RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:57 pm

Quoting Centrair (Reply 8):
The Brazillian popuation alone is around 350,000 (nationwide) and rising. 2/3 of that population is in Chubu. Peruvian and Argentinian make up the next largest south american groups.

I am completely amazed by the large amounts of both Brazilians and Peruvians in Japan. They are both among the fifth largest communities in Japan according the Immigration Bureau of Japana (Ministry of Justice). Brazil has 225,000 expats and Peru another 42,000 expats... I would have never thought it.

PZ
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N405MX
Posts: 1156
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:46 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 1:40 am

Quoting Latinplane (Reply 35):
No, really, It can be done, but this will distract AM's ability to increase its market share in its already established markets. Does it really want to do that given that it will only have two 777s to work with?

It can be done, but will be really restrictive, they´ll need more frames to get all the routes without problem or they will have some trouble like yesterday; AM001 was cancelled because the 767 to be used on the route was stuck in CDG (weather issues); I know, you don´t control weather, but in case you need the aircraft, lot´s of movements to be made (just like IJ last week in MTY).

Saludos
Life is what happens when you have other plans.....
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2471
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:27 pm

Quoting N405MX (Reply 43):
can be done, but will be really restrictive, they´ll need more frames to get all the routes without problem or they will have some trouble like yesterday; AM001 was cancelled because the 767 to be used on the route was stuck in CDG (weather issues); I know, you don´t control weather, but in case you need the aircraft, lot´s of movements to be made (just like IJ last week in MTY).

The 777s should be used to replace the old 762s on AM primary routes. If it wants to open new markets it needs more 777s, but I don't think its that easy to get those type of airframes just like that.

I know we're getting really far ahead of ourselfs with Nagoya, but I was thinking... AM could extend the flight to Seoul and benefit from Korean Air's feed!! Yes, I know that it would make many stops, but it definitely makes sense and it would almost guarantee a full plane crossing the the Pacific.

I mean, come on! If AM really wants to fly to Asia and make good use of Skyteam, fly to Seoul!!!


 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
N405MX
Posts: 1156
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:46 pm

RE: Aeromexico To NGO?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:32 pm

Quoting Latinplane (Reply 44):
I mean, come on! If AM really wants to fly to Asia and make good use of Skyteam, fly to Seoul!!!

Very interesting, and indeed, it could be usefull, as a lot of koreans are working in Mexico (just an example, PEMEX), so that route will be a really good one.

Saludos
Life is what happens when you have other plans.....

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