AMS5280
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Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:16 pm

UA 1478 (with me in it) just landed in TPA, it took a while before the wheels hit the ground and the plane decelerated up to the end of the runway. Then it made a 180 turn on the runway, and taxied back to the nearest entrance to the taxiway. Is this standard procedure? I fly into TPA weekly and haven't landed this way before. It was 11.40pm and not very busy.
 
captaink
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:37 pm

Well on airports without parallel taxiways, it is done very often, either at the turning spot at the end of the runway, or depending on the size or weight of the airplane anywhere along the runway. This was the case in Grenada, my home. I am not sure about airports like TPA...
There is something special about planes....
 
ikramerica
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:42 pm

Sounds like you rolled all the way to the end, so you likely had no choice. I guess you could have tried to back up...  Wink
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cgagn
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:45 pm

Here in YXE, it's a regular occurance. Westjet 737s and Jazz CRJs regularly land on runway 09 or 27, and due to the only taxiway other than the ends of the runway being half way down, they regularly just miss it and have to 180 back rather than going all the way to the end.

C-GAGN
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jacobin777
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:48 pm

it happened to me a few years ago when I flew BD (737..yippy) a few years ago from LDS-LHR....we taxied onto the runway, did a full 180 then rumbled down the runway and rotated off...
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captaink
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:49 pm

I love being on the airplane when then do that... Sometimes they just use the momentum they had to spin around, then rev the engines slightly to taxi, or they come almost to a stop, rev the engines, spin around, then reduce thrust for taxi. Either way, I love to hear the engines when they do the 180 turn.
There is something special about planes....
 
mandargb
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:10 pm

I know it is done very routinely on lot of airports for take off.
So doing it for landing should not be a big deal if you dont have any alternative to taxi to the parking.
 
nudelhirsch
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:18 pm

Some airports do not have the taxiways for 'normal' taxiing. SXM for example on the far end. If you miss taxiway F you will hve to use the turn plate.

https://164.214.2.62/products/digitalaero/terminals/v0601/caribbean_south_america/princess_juliana_intl__tncm/tncm_arpt_dia.pdf

Other airports have that too, for example you can see the turn plate in FNC here:


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PanAm747
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:55 am

And also at SAN...when BA flew into our airport, both the 747-400 and the 777 were too wide to use the parallel taxiway, so an escort was given to the planes. They would leave their docking space, proceed to the active runway, taxi down ON the runway itself, make a 180 degree turn, and take-off. Landings involved the same procedure, only in reverse.

Watching a 777 make a complete pirouette at tiny SAN is an amazing site, second only to watching the fully fueled behemoth getting airborne off less than 10,000 feet of runway!!

BA will always be missed at SAN...  cry 
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Boeing744
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:11 am

I have done it every time I have flown to YKA, both on takeoff and landing. With the Dash8, I don't think we even go to the end of the runway after landing, we just turnaround right there.
 
planemannyc
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:43 am

A lot of small island airports have no parallel taxiway, so 180 turns are necessary. SXM is one, PPT, BOB, MOZ, HUH in French Polynesia required 180 turns on larger aircraft (the DHC-6 at Moorea (MOZ) did not need it as the aircraft used up only a fraction of the runway)

Best,

Wasim / Planemannyc
 
Nimish
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:25 am

At BLR doing a 180 on the active is very common. I find this rather strange, since they do have taxiways directly at the end of the end of either side of the runway, but ATC often forces a/c to enter the active runway from the middle, taxi to teh end, do a 180 and then take off. I've never seen it done on landing though.
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emiratesa345
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:32 am

This is also done in WRO. I'm not sure if it was done due to construction or if it is a regular occurance. I just remember it happening two years ago.

Mark
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positiverate
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:54 am

I believe it is called "back taxiing". I know in HVN they do it all the time if you are landing on runway 20. The taxiway at the end of 20 isnt able to handle CRJ's or the Dash-8's that go in there. When UA used to have 737-300 service to ORD, they used to do it as well.
 
NZCH
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:22 am

That has happened to me twice at Glasgow Prestwick in 2002, 2003 on a Ryanair 737-200 we landed and once we had stopped about 3/4 down the runway we just turned around did a 180 and went back up the runway, but we didn't turn off at the first possible exit we carried on until we got to the terminal, very strange and the first time the weather was really bad raining really hard and it was night about 9pm, our flight was delayed by an hour at Stansted.

Regards NZCH
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PM
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:28 am

It's commonplace at NBO.

At PNQ (go on - look that one up!) I watched a Jet Airways 737 do a 360 degree turn. I'd have loved to know what was being said between the cockpit and the tower!
 
Tango-Bravo
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:36 am

Quoting Planemannyc (Reply 10):
A lot of small island airports have no parallel taxiway, so 180 turns are necessary.

KTN (Ketchikan, AK) airport, located on Annette Island, can be added to this list. The only entrance to the runway (uphill from the terminal!) is at the south end, meaning flights landing south to north do a 180 degree turn to taxi back to the terminal, same procedure in reverse for takeoffs north to south.
 
wingflaps
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:50 am

It's also done at LTN, the jets using the turning circle. I once flew Suckling Airways to AMS on a Dornier 228. The Captain clearly decided the turning circle was too far and spun the plan around in the middle of the main runway, hit the throttles and we were off.
 
HT
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:50 am

Quoting Positiverate (Reply 13):
I believe it is called "back taxiing".

"backtracking"
-HT
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superhub
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:07 am

It was done on one of my B6 flights into OAK last year. It was around midnight and they were fixing some of the parallel taxiways. So we landed on Runway 29, turned around so we headed around 110 degrees and taxiied back
 
ffis34
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:28 am

hey hey,

yeah so flying ted over the summer we had to come back a day early from SFO because of a hurricane and they were closing TPA that day so TED DEN-TPA about 3 hours delayed we did that exact thing we landed 12:10ish at night give or take 10 minutes, its pretty common, hanging out on top of the parking garage one evening i saw 4 flights in row land and do this procedure, all 1320's and 737's though.

brad
 
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scbriml
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:09 pm

MLE in the Maldives doesn't have a taxiway at all! Just a runway and ramp next to the terminal, so every plane that lands there has to run to the end of the runway, do a 180 and taxi back to the ramp. The runway is located on a spit of reclaimed land, so from a distance it looks like the planes are taxying on water! crazy 
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doug_or
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:24 pm

Quoting HT (Reply 18):
backtracking

at least in the US the correct term is in fact back-taxi, as in "Piedmont 4441 back-taxi runway 34, exit at alpha, right on charlie to the gate".
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dartland
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:31 pm

I've "back-taxiied" at PHL to take-off on a US 733. I imagine we did it because the taxiways were filled with planes waiting to take-off, so when it was our turn, we used the runway for the last 500ft. of taxiing, then did a 180 and begain our take-off roll.
 
bond007
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:38 pm

Quoting AMS5280 (Thread starter):
UA 1478 (with me in it) just landed in TPA, it took a while before the wheels hit the ground and the plane decelerated up to the end of the runway. Then it made a 180 turn on the runway, and taxied back to the nearest entrance to the taxiway. Is this standard procedure? I fly into TPA weekly and haven't landed this way before. It was 11.40pm and not very busy.

The reason why it happened at TPA is that you landed on 18R and the parallel taxiway is closed for construction at the end of that runway. If you cannot land fairly short, then you have to do a 180 and back taxi.


Jimbo
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vtnyc
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:47 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 15):
t PNQ (go on - look that one up!) I watched a Jet Airways 737 do a 360 degree turn. I'd have loved to know what was being said between the cockpit and the tower!

I like that!!! A piroutte before take off!!!! PNQ=Pune, India.
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Silver1SWA
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 12:50 pm

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 8):
And also at SAN...when BA flew into our airport, both the 747-400 and the 777 were too wide to use the parallel taxiway, so an escort was given to the planes. They would leave their docking space, proceed to the active runway, taxi down ON the runway itself, make a 180 degree turn, and take-off. Landings involved the same procedure, only in reverse.

Watching a 777 make a complete pirouette at tiny SAN is an amazing site, second only to watching the fully fueled behemoth getting airborne off less than 10,000 feet of runway!!

BA will always be missed at SAN...

That was well before my time at SAN. Man, I wish I was at SAN during that time...

You still see "back taxis" on the active fairly often at SAN. Depending on who has pushed onto "Bravo" sometimes aircraft, especially WN 737s, will flip a 180 and exit at a taxiway they passed to avoid having to wait behind a plane that just pushed out.
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LTU932
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:02 pm

Add SJO to the list. It has a "turnaround area (if that's how it's called)" at the end of the RW 25 displaced threshold area. If RW 25 is active for departure, all aircraft exit through Alpha 1, taxi through the runway and do a 180 prior to takeoff. It's also not unusual for larger aircraft to roll out the full length of RW 07 and turn around before taxiing to the gate. However this practice will end once the Northwest taxiways Echo and Echo 1 are finally built (only downside of that is that this means the closure of SJO's favourite spotting place, the La Candela Restaurant  Sad).
 
ckfred
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:59 pm

I remember back taxiing after landing at YHZ flying on BEX's Saab 340s.
 
emrecan
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:21 pm

On my flight from Bucharest Otopeni to Istanbul by THY 737-800 last summer it happened.

Before us an Olympic Airways' 717 entered the runway and take off. Our 737-800 entered the runway then turned left and continued till the end of runway (may be 50m I am not sure). From here we made a 180 degree turn (end of the runway became the begining of the runway)

I guess our 737 and Olimpic's 717 entered the runway by using a different taxiway so that we had to make this 180 degree turn... It was also interesting that 717 has not taken off from the begining of the runway.
 
brokenrecord
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standa

Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:42 pm

It had to be done at BUF for a while last year qhile taxiway work was being done...
 
777STL
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:44 pm

I've seen it done at DRW and BNE.
PHX based
 
SATMFECRPTEXAS
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Wed Feb 08, 2006 12:22 pm

I was on a Continetal DC-9 in 1990 that made a 180 degree turn onto runway 29 before departure from LFT. The taxiway was too small at the end of the runway for our aircraft to even attempt to taxi on it. The runway was pretty short also. It was almost like vaulting into the air.
 
BR715-A1-30
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:34 pm

This actually happened to me twice on AirTran's 717... We had left the apron at GPT before a COEX ERJ, but due to weather in ATL, we had to hold, so we had to pull over and let the ERJ go first, then we got on the runway, and made a 180 and took off. Then in ATL the same night, We had to go around a DL 737-800 so we had to get on the runway and turn around and take off.
Puhdiddle
 
isitsafenow
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:42 pm

I've been through a few of those. Unless there is no turnoff at the end, they are done only when the guy(or girl) in the tower says its ok.
safe
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A300 American
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:03 am

Happens in CUZ as well (turnaround 180 degrees for take off)

Cheers
 
bond007
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:40 am

Boy......I wonder how long it'll take before every airport is listed  Smile

I think we've proved the point that at least one time, at probably every airport, somebody somewhere has done a 180 on the runway!


Jimbo
I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
 
captaink
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RE: Is Turning 180 Degrees On Active Runway Standard?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:15 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 8):
Watching a 777 make a complete pirouette at tiny SAN is an amazing site, second only to watching the fully fueled behemoth getting airborne off less than 10,000 feet of run

The RNY at GND is 9003ft, and we have weekly, 747, 777 and 767 flights and truly i agree that it is amazing to see these big airplanes at these really small airports...
There is something special about planes....

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