FlyDeltaJets
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Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:06 pm

Today at LGA a pax aboard Spirit Airlines enroute from NAS began getting unrully and trying to open the door. What do you guys think this trend is about?
The only valid opinions are those based in facts
 
BG777300ER
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:09 pm

Probably scared of flying or maybe be he remembered that he forgot to go and see the Statue of Liberty before leaving.
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aerorobnz
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:13 pm

I think it is to do with how much society relies on substances/prescribed drugs to solve their ailments/problems, when they go without them for a few hours (as they do while flying) their bodies can't handle it and they go spastic.
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
FlyGuyClt
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:17 pm

Quoting Aerorobnz (Reply 2):
I think it is to do with how much society relies on substances/prescribed drugs to solve their ailments/problems, when they go without them for a few hours (as they do while flying) their bodies can't handle it and they go spastic.

That is one of the problems. Another one is . (And getting my fire extinguisher out for protection.) With fares this low. What do you expect? Not all value fares are purchased by the trash of society. But the airplane is looking more and more like an episode of "Cops". Attacks on crew members are up by roughly 30% year over year according the an air marshal two weeks ago.

Safe Flying  Smile
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FlyDeltaJets
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:24 pm

Quoting FlyGuyClt (Reply 3):
That is one of the problems. Another one is . (And getting my fire extinguisher out for protection.) With fares this low. What do you expect? Not all value fares are purchased by the trash of society. But the airplane is looking more and more like an episode of "Cops". Attacks on crew members are up by roughly 30% year over year according the an air marshal two weeks ago.

So what you are saying is that just because people save money they are unrully, I have heard that the richest of people save the most money, I trump didn't have his own plane he would probably be on Song too.
The only valid opinions are those based in facts
 
MKandiah
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:19 pm

Perhaps flying is no longer a particularly enjoyable experience.
 
roadrunner165
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 3:01 pm

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Thread starter):
What do you guys think this trend is about?


In my humble opinion, I don't believe there is a upward 'trend' with regard to crazy passengers on airplanes. Sure, occurrences like this are happening more often, but there are also more people flying today then at any other time in history. More passengers flying means a higher percentage of potential crazy people on board. I personally think the media is just making a big deal out of every little accident.

Adam
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 5:35 pm

Stress levels in a very pressure situation these days.
regds
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ZSOFN
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 6:26 pm

With the low cost "revolution" many more passengers are first time or infrequent and inexperienced flyers, and perhaps this lends cause to the larger number of instances of this sort of behaviour...
 
notdownnlocked
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:25 pm

Of course as you lower the fare you lower the threshold of society of those aboard your planes. 2nd class fares=2nd class people aboard your planes. Example: If I lower the fare to one half bottle of MadDog20/20 wine with a promise of transportation to the beach you can bet I can get everybody on skid row onto my planes. That is what the industry is going towards today. It is the same as Ryanair and chairman O'Leary when he speaks about the unwashed masses aboard his planes. Please don't reply to me about how it is everybody's God given right to fly. If that is the case it also our given right to all own houses with BMW's and Porches parked in the driveways.
 
viv
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:33 pm

Too much alcohol and/or not enough nicotine.
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BDKLEZ
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:38 pm

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 9):
Of course as you lower the fare you lower the threshold of society of those aboard your planes. 2nd class fares=2nd class people aboard your planes.

How utterly patronising and condecending of you!

Just as it is not..

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 9):
everybody's God given right to fly

..it is also not exclusively for those of a more affluent background.

I would suggest that ZSOFN is more accurately hitting the target with his statement when he says...

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 8):
With the low cost "revolution" many more passengers are first time or infrequent and inexperienced flyers, and perhaps this lends cause to the larger number of instances of this sort of behaviour...

If only I had a Disrespected User list....
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
superhub
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:41 pm

BDKLEZ,

You disagree with those who argue that more people from less affluent backgrounds fly and hence we have more "air rage."

Just curious, why do you think there are more air rage incidents?

[Edited 2006-02-09 11:42:56]
 
ANother
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:44 pm

Isn't this also (partially) due to the way that the Media deals with this? 20 years ago you wouldn't even get 2 lines on page 92, now they fall overthemselves trying to be the first to report this sensational news. Now all A.nutters know that you can't (in 99.657% of cases - this has been debated to death already) open a door in flight, probably most of the unwashed masses know this too, but do the Media? Ha. It's there job to sell newspapers and/or airtime ... not to report News.
 
BDKLEZ
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:58 pm

Let me clarify.

It was actually Notdownlocked and not myself seemingly suggesting that as fares have lowered, it has enabled more folks to fly who have previously, for their own fiscal reasons, not been able to avail of such a service, and now that they are able to and being inherently "2nd class people", they have themselves brought down the general tone of on-board behaviour.

If this is what he/she is actually suggesting, I'm suggesting that his/her attitude needs addressing.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
BDKLEZ
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 7:59 pm

Quoting ANother (Reply 13):
It's there job to sell newspapers and/or airtime ... not to report News.

Totally agree.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
notdownnlocked
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 8:38 pm

I am not being condescending to anyone. Just stating the facts as I see them and have personally witnessed as you do here with todays headline example. No need for the bleeding hearts. I added my example to back up my opinion. Is it everyones right to fly? Lower the fares and you can get those that were already crazy onboard not those that go crazy once they are aboard.
 
notdownnlocked
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 8:46 pm

Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 11):

How lame are you. You say "just as it is not." I have to disagree with you a 100% there buddy. You lower the fare and you get those onboard that are crazy and less stable hence the example as in the title you get those that want to open the door and go outside and play when their aircraft is at 35k feet. I also would be so proud to be the 1st one on your disrespected list. Reread my example I gave you in reply 9.
 
bennett123
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:00 pm

I think that the class of passengers has gone down.

The point is that class and money are not the same.
 
Jumpseat70
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:02 pm

We had a man yesterday pay $1150.00 for a last minute ticket to CAE from MCI. He announced that he was a truck driver to all at the counter.

Later, when at Security, he wouldn't allow the TSA to check him, he was thrown out of the gatehouse. He came back to the counter and said there were too many people around and he didn't want to fly anymore. The guy was a "looney tune".

We have always had unruly passengers onboard airplanes. I can attest to that from my own colored history in this industry. Back then though, we kept it quiet. It was the policy. We didn't have cell phones and instant access to the press or places like this to incite opinion. But trust me I have broken up fights on airplanes, watched hookers ply their trade on my 707's, and had my life threatened more than once on a 747 when I took someone's booze away.

People don't change, they just metamorphosis.
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BDKLEZ
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:08 pm

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
I am not being condescending to anyone.

No? It sounded pretty much like that to me.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
No need for the bleeding hearts

It's called respect for others. I assume you'd have difficulty bringing yourself to have respect for anyone other than those who take home a similar salary to yourself.


Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
Lower the fares and you can get those that were already crazy onboard not those that go crazy once they are aboard.

You're repeating youself albeit using different words. It's still looking down your nose at people. So if the fares were kept higher then the crazies (ie folks who couldn't afford it) wouldn't bother because it's too expensive, is that what you're saying?

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 17):
You say "just as it is not." I have to disagree with you a 100% there buddy.

Yet again, another example of how "superior" you believe yourself to be which really is the fundamental problem here in your argument.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 17):
Reread my example I gave you in reply 9.

No need to as this is what I'm referring to in my reply 11.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
notdownnlocked
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 9:49 pm

Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 20):



Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 20):
Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
I am not being condescending to anyone.

No? It sounded pretty much like that to me.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
No need for the bleeding hearts

It's called respect for others. I assume you'd have difficulty bringing yourself to have respect for anyone other than those who take home a similar salary to yourself.


Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 16):
Lower the fares and you can get those that were already crazy onboard not those that go crazy once they are aboard.

You're repeating youself albeit using different words. It's still looking down your nose at people. So if the fares were kept higher then the crazies (ie folks who couldn't afford it) wouldn't bother because it's too expensive, is that what you're saying?

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 17):
You say "just as it is not." I have to disagree with you a 100% there buddy.

Yet again, another example of how "superior" you believe yourself to be which really is the fundamental problem here in your argument.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 17):
Reread my example I gave you in reply 9.

No need to as this is what I'm referring to in my reply 11.

Wow!!! You know my salary??? I thought only my wife and my coworkers and my supervisor knew my salary. Damn, I guess the cat is really out of the bag. That sucks and I am shocked?!?!? Who else knows what I make? Damn!!!
I have worked in this industry for a little while now and I see everyday the things that go on within the confines of my local airport and airline and I stand behind my words that when you lower the fare you permit second class people aboard. I never stated that ALL that pay lower fares are 2nd class people it's just that when you lower the fare to a certain level you allow 2nd and 3rd class people aboard. Just because someone makes less money than another doesn't mean they are less of a classy or dignified person and don't know how to conduct themselves in public. I know many that don't make much money yet they are perfectly content in life. Having money doesn't lead to class nor does not having money mean having no class. It merely means that when you lower the fares you set yourself up to welcoming any all aboard your aircraft. Lower the fares even more and you can get the bottom rungs of humanity on board your planes. Better yet, how about free flights for all. Who do you expect to show up to your ticket counter then and what would you expect of them at 35k feet?
 
Eirjet
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:01 pm

Quoting FlyGuyClt (Reply 3):
With fares this low. What do you expect?

So we are saying that 'crazy' people fly because of low fares?

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 18):
I think that the class of passengers has gone down.

Low fares has indeed opened up what was once a transport service reserved for the rich classes - however the class of passenger is no reflection of the unruly behaviour being witnessed on flights.

There have being many incidents of 'high-class' people behaving unruly during flight.

From what I read here, some believe that LCC stands for 'Lowlife Council Customers'.

LCC is not the cause for incidents like this, it is a lower standard of social behaviour and manners, this is found in both 'high-class' and 'low-class' people the world over.

Eirjet
Aviation has a 100% record, we've never left one up there......
 
contrails
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:16 pm

I think it's just indicative of the times we are living in. I can't speak for other countries, but in the United States craziness is pandemic.

Imo, each and every time someone pulls a stunt like this on a plane they should receive a hefty prison sentence so they can think about what they did.
Flying Colors Forever!
 
BDKLEZ
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:00 pm

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
Wow!!! You know my salary??? I thought only my wife and my coworkers and my supervisor knew my salary. Damn, I guess the cat is really out of the bag. That sucks and I am shocked?!?!?

A few lines of nonsense to make up for a discernable lack of valid content.
Snore.  zzz 

You must be under the infuence of alcohol or drugs because the following is what you have quoted; one statement directly after another.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
I stand behind my words that when you lower the fare you permit second class people aboard

OK, that's your opinion.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
I never stated that ALL that pay lower fares are 2nd class people

Yes you did. See above.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
it's just that when you lower the fare to a certain level you allow 2nd and 3rd class people aboard

Oh, and here we have it again.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
Lower the fares even more and you can get the bottom rungs of humanity on board your planes.

Who do think you are to feel you have the right to put anyone in such a box called "The bottom rung of humanity"? Yet again, and I shall quote myself...

Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 11):
How utterly patronising and condecending of you!

I think I have noticed your problem.

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 21):
have worked in this industry for a little while now and I see everyday the things that go on within the confines of my local airport and airline

I'd be interested to hear how your career has progressed having worked in the airline industry for "a little while now" or have you always worked within the confines of your "local airport and airline"?. I suspect you have, judging by your apparent lack of broad-based tolerance of others. Maybe you just need to get out more.

Quoting Treeny (Reply 23):
people seem to change the minute they step into an airport. They become stressed, impatient and nervous for some reason, as is the case at baggage claim for example....

I think guys if you found out why this change occurs, you'll also find the answer to this thread!!

Very interesting point, and one which I have considered also. I think it's possible that it's to do with lack of control and being entirely at the discretion of the airport/carrier as to what you are "subjected to" when you arrive at the airport.

Which check-in desk, which gate, where's security, why's the aircraft not here yet, the aircraft's late, I'm going to miss my meeting, there's only Diet Coke left left on board - I hate that stuff etc etc etc.

All of these are potential annoyances and the passenger in question is completely powerless to do anything about any of them. It's pure frustration and the only way do overcome that frustration as much as possible, is to arrive at the airport as early as possible and allow yourself plenty of time in order to get through these individual annoyances in as relaxed a mood as possible.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
muttley35
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Thu Feb 09, 2006 11:58 pm

In my humble opinion there are any number of reasons why peoples behaviour aboard aircraft has changed/is changing.
If you put aside those with mental health issues or those dependent on some substance or other then I believe behaviour aboard aircraft is just a reflection of the deterioration of peoples respect for each other in day to day life.
My wife works in our local highschool and the general attitude of a great number of the kids within that school is diabolical with the girls often the worse offenders.These kids will be the fare paying pax of the future and regardless of their backgrounds or income will probably still be in possession of that crap attitude.
As for a connection between income and behaviour I think at the upper end you have those who have a "you are here to serve me " and " I am better than you" attitude and at the lower end you have those who simply go around sticking two fingers up at everyone and anyone.
That leaves the rest of us who regardless of income or social standing just go about our business and try as much is reasonably possible to treat people and property with respect .
Markos
 
access-air
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 12:33 am

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 25):
know for a fact those that step through the airport doors and feel the breeze and smell of the terminal suddenly lose their senses and abilities for rational thought and conduct.

Enuff Said My Friend, Enuff Said!!!!

Access-Air
Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:52 am

Quoting FlyGuyClt (Reply 3):
But the airplane is looking more and more like an episode of "Cops". Attacks on crew members are up by roughly 30% year over year according the an air marshal two weeks ago.

I put it in the same category as road rage and other items that have popped up in US society in the past decade or so. It has nothing to do with the type of people flying.

Road rage isn't about a person's standing in society, neither is behavior on aircraft.

Instead US society in general has moved to more impulsive behavior, more do what I want and forget the rest of you, more do it and worry about the consequences later, and more emotional outbursts and reactions. Even the things people will talk about or say in public on a cell phone would never have been discussed where someone might overhear in the past.

I feel boundaries between public and private lives have blurred, as have the boundaries between thoughts and actions or thoughts and words. There seems to be less understanding that for people to get along in public there are ways of behaving and acting we all have to follow while in public.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
rdwelch
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:09 am

I actually had an incident on an NK flight DEN-FLL a couple of years back. Drunk pax tried to pay for a $5 drink with a $100 bill. F/A in advertenly gave insufficient change back, and the pax tried to have a shouting match with him in the back of the plane where I was sitting.

The pax then threw his napkin in the F/A's face. When this happened my buddy and I who are airline emps asked the F/A if he needed a hand and he accepted. My buddy goes 6'3" 250 and I'm 6'1" 240, so we proceeded to the front of the aircraft as fast as we could, (good thing this time there was no FAMs on board who thought we were rushing the cockpit), and got briefed by the other F/A's.

We then went to the pax, and identified ourselves as airline emps who were keeping an eye on him, and that any further outbursts or crew disruptions would warrent slightly "stronger" responses.

No other issues for the remainder of the flight until we got to FLL where BSO (LEO) and the FAA/TSA were waiting for the individual. We had to fill out a statement, and then spent a pretty cool fall afternoon in FLL's beaches.

As any airline employee could attest, it doesn't matter what airline we might be non-reving on, we are all in this together.

Gus
They say I have ADD, but they don't understand..Oh look! A chicken!
 
ctbarnes
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:20 am

I wonder if this has more to do with every single irregular incident getting over reported then it does with the actual prevelence of unruly behavior. My guess is that the actual number of incidents is really quite small, but it gets so blown up in the media that it leads people to (erroniously) think it is a far greater problem than it is.

Another think is that more people are flying today than did 30 years ago, so it makes sense that with more people flying there are going to be more incidents

My theory to air rage and other incidents such as these is that people have to surrender a significant amount of autonomy when they travel. You are literally putting your life in the hands of strangers. Most of this is done for safety reasons, and it is understandable, but if you are in a situation that is out of your control it also means that you become quite vulnerable, and how people cope with this vulnerability varies from person to person. If, in that situation you some how feel threatened, wheter it be something small such as rude treatment by an employee, or a delay on board an aircraft, often times it triggers a "fight or flight" response. You cannot flee, so you fight. Of course it also does not help that you're crammed into the cabin with less personal space than a german shepherd traveling in the cargo hold, or security procedures that treat every passenger as a potential criminal, or customer service policies that are about forcing passengers to comply with a myriad of rules, some necessary for safety of individuals and others around them, others which are unecessary or are arbitrary and simply add to the stress of air travel and are more for the convenience of the airline than for the needs of the customer.

It has nothing to do with race or social or economic class. It has everything to do with how people are treated at times of high (though not necessarily obvious) vulnerability. Air travel may be efficient as it is indespensible in the 21st century, but anyone who travels or works at an airport knows the environment is a pressure cooker.

Charles, SJ
The customer isn't a moron, she is your wife -David Ogilvy
 
starrion
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:23 am

"I put it in the same category as road rage and other items that have popped up in US society in the past decade or so. It has nothing to do with the type of people flying. "

Which would be the case if the air-rage incidents were on US carriers or on flights to the US.

There has been an increase in bad behavior all over. The UK has seen an upsurge in incidents as well. Here's my take on it.

1. More reporting. (Notice that I didn't say better reporting) Because of the internet and 24 hour media, every diversion is big news. What would have been a 2 line blurb in the "other news" section is now reported breathlessly as a "major air-rage" case.

2. Alcohol/substance abuse. Watch Airline. Watch the drunks get on the plane. Watch the really drunk get turned away. Now watch the only moderately drunk getting denied service.

3. Zero tolerance. People who act up do not get a free pass anymore. I'm sure the poeple who have been doing this for a while will tell you that in the past people got told to sit down and problems would get surpressed to avoid bad publicity. These days those people who are acting up have only a couple of opportunities to sit down and shut up before they get greeted by Marshalls at the exit ramp. Now feed that into item #1
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
rdwelch
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:23 am

Quoting Ctbarnes (Reply 31):
It has nothing to do with race or social or economic class. It has everything to do with how people are treated at times of high (though not necessarily obvious) vulnerability. Air travel may be efficient as it is indespensible in the 21st century, but anyone who travels or works at an airport knows the environment is a pressure cooker.

Father, well put. The entire process and enviroment lends itself to sensory overload. It's the ability of that individual to handle said stress that leads us to the incidents. Not their class.

Gus
They say I have ADD, but they don't understand..Oh look! A chicken!
 
satx
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:42 am

Quoting BG777300ER (Reply 1):
Probably scared of flying or maybe be he remembered that he forgot to go and see the Statue of Liberty before leaving.

 thumbsup 

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 9):
Of course as you lower the fare you lower the threshold of society of those aboard your planes. 2nd class fares=2nd class people aboard your planes.

Where is your First Class membership? I guess you're just a second-class punk like the rest of us then?
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:49 am

Quoting Starrion (Reply 32):
"I put it in the same category as road rage and other items that have popped up in US society in the past decade or so. It has nothing to do with the type of people flying. "

Which would be the case if the air-rage incidents were on US carriers or on flights to the US.

True, but I don't consider myself well-versed on current culture and behavior in the UK or some other countries that I don't deal with for work. So I don't feel qualified to comment on the actions of non-Americans in those areas.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
AEROFAN
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:10 am

Perhaps most of it is also due to the entitlement culture that we in American find ourselves. There are a couple of really crazy on meds people who fly, but my experience has been that most of the unruly idiots are people who just believe that the world is there to serve them, or just have had one too many.

Bear in mind as well, that air travel in USA is just mass transportation, while for some parts of the world it is still a big deal and thus attitudes reflect this subtle fact.
 
YYZYYT
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RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:17 am

I would say there is no increase in the behaviour, just more reporting, and I blame the internet.

These days, too much cable / online news capacity and too little actual news = more repoprting of anything which catches the public attention (like a scuffle on an airplane - how exciting!).

Also, web sites with forums, blogs, chat rooms means that information gets flashed around the world much faster than ever before. Prior to a-net, how many of us would ever hear of this incident? Only local airline employees, unless there was a two second mention in some local news story.

Now, thanks to a.net we have a spirited discussion involving 36 posts, from people in 8 countries (make that 37 from 9), all of whom know of the incident, and others like it, and are expressing opinions as to what happened, and how and why, not to mention who thinks what and is it is right or wrong, is A better than B, and when WILL Northwest DC-9's be retrofitted with winglets, etc. etc.

That's my .0260 CHF (currency conversion also courtesy of the internent)
 
rdwelch
Posts: 449
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:52 am

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:22 am

Quoting YYZYYT (Reply 37):
That's my .0260 CHF (currency conversion also courtesy of the internent)

clever.
They say I have ADD, but they don't understand..Oh look! A chicken!
 
bennett123
Posts: 7530
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 4:33 am

Eirjet

To repeat the point that I made before class and money are two entirely separate issues.

Look at the behaviour of some so called celebraties.
 
redneckslim
Posts: 91
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2005 5:02 am

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:06 am

Perhaps, my good fellow, the chap availed of one of those $10 knocking shoppe joy romps the morning of the flight, then whilst at the loo with willie in hand, started that "fire flow" that stays with a gentelman and just makes a flight out of the question! Most uncomfortible indeed!
 
jhooper
Posts: 5560
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 8:27 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 8:45 am

Just about every time I fly through New York, I see somebody copping an attitude. Sometimes it's the pax, sometimes it's the agent, usually it's both.
Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29929
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:01 pm

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 39):
To repeat the point that I made before class and money are two entirely separate issues.

Look at the behaviour of some so called celebraties.

 bigthumbsup 

Its the Individual Attitude that counts.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Markdirk
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:25 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:29 pm

This is not the first time on NK this has happend, it is near standard on flights to or from LGA. It is well known throughtout the NK flight attendants. Pax have urinated on f/a's, tried numerous times to open cabin doors in an attempt to get out while inflight, tried to attack crews during beverage service, and these are just what I have witnessed on my own flights. And NK management just doesn't care and IGNORES the problems! They care more about profitability on cheap fares than their employees, I personally have voiced my concerns to NK that "security" beyond just the flight attendants is necessary on these flights in and out of LGA as all these incidents have 99.9% occured in and out of LGA, but they just ignore the concerns and my and other NK f/a's pleas for help. Luckily this one made the news, thank goodness, now the world knows what $9.00 fares (ok, $39.00 maybe) structure allows to fly on NK. In the past these wacko's used to take the bus as the low fare was all they could afford and we all know in the past taking the bus was a scary experience because of it, but thanks to Spirit they now can fly, and yes the lower fares attract a lower class of clientele, the flip-flop/tube top/hair curler trailer trash of society that thinks taking your shoes off and walking throughout the aircraft barefoot and into the lav is OK!, or standing up during turbulence is just fine and would rather break their neck "as truely spoken to me on a recent flight by one of my rather large female pax", -rather break her neck? Wacko!!!!!!!

Flyers beware if you are sane, fly another airline to LGA, not Spirit as the flight attendants/ employees are in no way supported by NK corporate, other crew members or crews(as I once had a dead heading Nk pilot tell me he didn't want to get involved as two pax tried to kill each other in Spirit plus!!!) , or the airline in general or their union, when anything like this occurs, and would rather see the pax kill each other than get involved, this case was on the news though and as you heard the other pax on board subdued this crazy woman, Thank you Spirit Corporate for allowing these cheap crazy nutjob pax onboard our aircraft and for not supporting us (the f/a's) when the S+#% hits the fan. Just ask any Spirit flight attendant sometime about "Spirit flight #779 LGA-FLL", you will see, it is nicknamed "Flight 666" because of all the crazies on board and the total chaos not only pax start but the airline instigated! Flights on Spirit from or to LGA need "Security" and possibly a psychiatric unit to pre-evaluate each pax prior to boarding. Freaks!

Oh yes you bet I am bitter, after over 4 years of fighting to get help and anyone in NK corporate who can make a change, and myself watching a large man try to rotate the handle of the boarding door on an MD80 trying to get out while on approach to FLL from LGA at 5000ft over FLL and wrestling him down with the other crew and forcing him into a seat, I am pissed it is still happening and still NK does nothing to prevent it or support the safety of it's f/a's and sane pax!

Now the world knows, maybe now some change will come.
 
afconcorde1
Posts: 134
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2006 11:37 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:54 pm

Quoting Jhooper (Reply 41):
Just about every time I fly through New York, I see somebody copping an attitude. Sometimes it's the pax, sometimes it's the agent, usually it's both.

Everytime it's NY. (And I have every right to say that because I live in NY.)
Je pense, donc je vole Concorde!
 
ctbarnes
Posts: 3269
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 2:20 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:56 pm

Quoting Markdirk (Reply 43):
Now the world knows, maybe now some change will come.

Probably a futile gesture given their track record, but has anyone reported this to the FAA?

Charles, SJ
The customer isn't a moron, she is your wife -David Ogilvy
 
Markdirk
Posts: 48
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:25 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:26 pm

Quoting Ctbarnes (Reply 45):
Probably a futile gesture given their track record, but has anyone reported this to the FAA?

Any event on these flights which required assistance from the authorities was reported, by law it has to be, however on many occassions when we have had to make an emergency landing (to us"airline afficianados" an emergency landing, to corporate NK it's called a "route deviation") in MYR (or another NK station) because of an unruley passenger, NK "neglected" to have the authorities waiting for us upon arrival, they (the local NK station agents, we were lucky if they showed up!) just removed the disruptive pax from the aircraft and re-dispatched the flight. What happened to the pax? Was a report filed? We f/a's of NK have no idea, no one asked us any questions, no one took any reports from us, no one ever asked our names, we never hear another word about it, so probly no. NK does not want the authorities called, because "it looks bad for business!", The new CEO's favorite phrase is, "Spirit - Best Place to Work", and "Proud of what we do and proud of who we are", oh yeah and "The enemy does not wear a Spirit Uniform!". This may just give you an idea of the "ideals" of our illustrious disillusioned corporate department. If the enemy doesn't wear a Spirit uniform, then does he mean the enemy is our pax and the rest of the world? He never is very clear about things, and in NK's corporate culture we always get the same story, "Everything is great, we are doing so well, great future here" and bamm, there goes our retirement packages, wage freezes, job cuts, layoffs....etc, etc, etc... I just love the way corporate wears rose colored glasses to see everything, including disruptive abusive pax.
 
tmatt95
Posts: 476
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:31 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:57 pm

I don't understand how people are equating money with how people act . I hope that the people that have these opinions are not as shallow as they infer. Although there is a minority of people who are poor and seem to enjoy being unruly, the same can also be said about the richer "upper classes" as well. If someone needs to go somewhere, then they need to go there, they don't travel on planes for the fun of it). I think the rise in air travel has something to do about it, as more people travel, so there will be more people who like to behave in an unruly fashion from every corner of society.

Matt


P.s

Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 9):
2nd class fares=2nd class people aboard your planes.

Out of interest, what does a 2nd class person look like and in what ways is he/she different to a normal human being

[Edited 2006-02-10 15:59:31]
 
ctbarnes
Posts: 3269
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 2:20 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:12 am

Quoting Tmatt95 (Reply 45):
I don't understand how people are equating money with how people act . I hope that the people that have these opinions are not as shallow as they infer. Although there is a minority of people who are poor and seem to enjoy being unruly, the same can also be said about the richer "upper classes" as well.

I don't believe there is a correlation, particularly if you look at how many wealthy first-class passengers become total pricks when they board an aircraft.

Charles, SJ
The customer isn't a moron, she is your wife -David Ogilvy
 
notdownnlocked
Posts: 929
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2000 1:45 pm

RE: Why Are Pax Going Crazy?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:52 am

Quoting Tmatt95 (Reply 45):
Quoting Notdownnlocked (Reply 9):
2nd class fares=2nd class people aboard your planes.

Out of interest, what does a 2nd class person look like and in what ways is he/she different to a normal human being

Well I invite you to revisit post 41 and my previous post where I mentioned that if I gave tickets to those who would be willing to trade half a bottle of MD20/20 for a plane ticket what would you expect to happen aboard the plane. Don't try be act so God D*** politically correct that you f'in refuse to see the forest through the trees. Of course these people are human beings as you question but perhaps you should open your mind and see that once you lower the fares you allow any and all aboard. I learned a something good from an episode of SouthPark a while back, There's Gods and there's Clods. Too bad we can't all be the King of England or doctors or someone of the equivalent right? Somebody has to be the less intelligent and therefore less compensated and less mentally stable. Even if somebody refuses to join the rat race by choice, there are those that just don't have the willpower nor the intelligence to do it. Hence in society we have Gods and Clods. Fortunately we don't all possess the same IQ. I never said that all that make less money are 2nd class citizens it's just there are some that can help it and we really should encourage them to go out and play at 35k feet. This is how we get the yearly Darwin Awards. OTOH I would very much discourage someone from going out to play when the plane is at 500ft because that is at an altitude where someone or more can really get hurt and I guarantee it's more than just falling off the monkey bars.

Really want to see a second class citizen??? Perhaps you did this morning when you did your zombie walk to the bathroom after quieting your alarm to brush your teeth and looked up into the mirror before tearing out of your house to do whatever it is you do everyday.

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