Wargo7772
Topic Author
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VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:51 pm

what are the chances that VS would join an alliance like oneworld, skyteam, or star. i think it would work out very well for them to join star but i just wanna know what you guys think.
 
superhub
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:55 pm

I don't know whether they will join one. But if they do, Star would be logical because they are partly owned by SQ. With BD also in Star, it could be a good opportunity for BD to partner with VS. There was some talk in this forum suggesting that VS should take over BD.

[Edited 2006-02-12 05:57:12]
 
BCAL
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 5:51 pm

Quoting Superhub (Reply 1):
There was some talk in this forum suggesting that VS should take over BD.

They will never merge under Sir Michael Bishop's and Branson's leadership. There is no love lost between them and they would refuse to work together. Besides, VS might be the better known brand but BD is the larger airline.
MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
 
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LTU932
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 6:11 pm

At this point in time, VS joining an alliance or merging with BD seems to be very unlikely. If they would join, it would definitely be a surprise, just like JL declaring its intention to join OW, even though they previously tried to stay away from joining any alliance. But hypothetically speaking, I'd agree with this:

Quoting Superhub (Reply 1):
if they do, Star would be logical because they are partly owned by SQ.

If I'm not mistaken, SQ has a 49% stake in VS, so it would definitely make sense then, but for now, this is all hypothetical. I doubt that SRB would want to choose the way of alliances.
 
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PM
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 6:35 pm

Quoting BCAL (Reply 2):
VS might be the better known brand but BD is the larger airline.

Really? In what sense? Surely VS has the greater turnover?
 
BCAL
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 6:59 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 4):
Really? In what sense

BD is the UK’s second largest full service scheduled airline who holds 12% of all take off and landing slots at London Heathrow and operate 1,700 flights a week. They have a fleet of 41 jet aircraft which have an average age of five years. VS holds 6% of all take off and landing slots at LHR and currently has a fleet (I believe) of 35 aircraft. Bearing in mind that VS is long-haul only, they probably have the higher turnover.

U2 has a larger fleet than both BD and VS. FR is Irish.
MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
 
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PM
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 7:09 pm

Quoting BCAL (Reply 5):
BD is the UK’s second largest full service scheduled airline

Isn't that what we're trying to establish?

Quoting BCAL (Reply 5):
Bearing in mind that VS is long-haul only, they probably have the higher turnover.

So, according to most sources, aren't they "bigger"? I believe that Virgin make it into FLIGHT's annual Top 100 airlines survey whereas I'm not sure that BD do.

Quoting BCAL (Reply 5):
They [BD] have a fleet of 41 jet aircraft ... VS ... currently has a fleet (I believe) of 35 aircraft.

American Eagle have more planes than Qantas but that hardly makes them the "larger" airline.

Obviously, there is more than one way to rank airlines (number of passengers, turnover, number of aircraft, etc.) but I understood that turnover was the most common measure. Hence my doubt that BD is "larger" than VS.

Put it this way: if you wanted to buy either (assuming they were for sale) which would cost the more?
 
zvezda
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 7:38 pm

BA would veto any VS application to join OW. BD would fight tooth and nail against VS joining Star. VS probably wouldn't want to join either for the same reasons. SkyTeam seems to me to be the only plausible alliance possibility for VS. Even more likely is that they will stay independent. I'm sure SQ would not want VS to join OW or SkyTeam.

Now, if BD were to go BK, then VS in Star would become much more likely.
 
BestWestern
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 8:55 pm

Quoting BCAL (Reply 5):
BD is the UK’s second largest full service scheduled airline

This is pure bmi drivel. BD is the UK's third largest carrier, and will shortly even lose this 'claim to fame', as they continue to decline, and virgin continues to grow. They are no long full service anyway. EasyJet is the UK's second largest carrier.

BD is Europes fastest declining major carrier in December 2005.

Virgin is profitable, as a respected brand, and as an airline punches far above its size. bmi is a lost, wet little puppy unwanted by its parents.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
Birdwatching
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 9:01 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 8):
EasyJet is the UK's second largest carrier.

Reat that quote again. BCAL was talking about "full service". Which easyJet is.... NOT.

Soren  santahat 
All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
 
BestWestern
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Sun Feb 12, 2006 9:10 pm

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 9):
BCAL was talking about "full service".

Since when is Bmi full service?

bmi is a lost, wet little puppy unwanted by its parents.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
aussiestu
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 3:59 am

I think VS should join OneWorld. Imagine all the comments on here then.  Wink  Smile
 
tcxdegsy
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 5:36 am

I wouldn't be surprised if SRB wanted to create his own alliance:
The Virgin Alliance: Virgin's Atlantic, Express, Blue, Nigeria and America! A couple of more new airline launches under his belt and he's covered all the continents he needs!
next flights: BA1441 0566 0581 1446 EDI-LHR-MXP-LHR-EDI
 
deltaflyertoo
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:30 am

Well TECHNICALLY they are already in Skyteam. The fact that I can book a VS seat from LAX, EWR or JFK to LHR through CO and Delta.com tells you a lot! And you can accrue miles on either of these airlines. I have also used my Skymiles to get a free coach seat to LHR on VS from LAX. So even though there is no official alliance, this link up has been made very easy for consumers to grasp and work with and is identical to the ones used in the alliances.
 
nwab787techops
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 10:44 am

I think VS is going to stay doing what they are doing. Using Skyteam (co) and Star (SQ). It's better for VS to have two then just one. Also, it's good for Skyteam and Star to have VS, being they are in LHR.
 
levg79
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:47 am

Quoting Wargo7772 (Thread starter):
what are the chances that VS would join an alliance like oneworld

None.

BA would not let them for obvious reasons.
A mile of runway takes you to the world. A mile of highway takes you a mile.
 
skymileman
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:48 am

I am not sure what makes me think this, but I have always thought Virgin Atlantic would be best suited to Star.
 
bombayhog
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:04 pm

Deltaflyertoo, no, they're not technically in Skyteam. I think what you mean to say is that in practice they might as well be. Big difference in meaning. "Technically" would mean that they are actually, truly an alliance member.
 
AEROFAN
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:34 pm

Why on earth would they want to join star. There's no benefit to them in this alliance.

I think VS should form an alliance with EK,SQ and B6. They can call it quality assured or some such
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:40 pm

Quoting Deltaflyertoo (Reply 13):
Well TECHNICALLY they are already in Skyteam. The fact that I can book a VS seat from LAX, EWR or JFK to LHR through CO and Delta.com tells you a lot! And you can accrue miles on either of these airlines. I have also used my Skymiles to get a free coach seat to LHR on VS from LAX. So even though there is no official alliance, this link up has been made very easy for consumers to grasp and work with and is identical to the ones used in the alliances.

I can book a seat on EVA air from YVR-TPE on Aircanada.com and get Aeroplan miles for it. That doesn't mean EVA is techinically in the STAR
Alliance. It's just code-sharing. Most major airlines do it.

Kris
 
brightcedars
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 9:10 pm

Of the current 3 major alliances I think VS would most likely lean towards Star Alliance if the ownership remains the same.

Star Alliance members and Virgin would benefit from pooling the Pacific thru several points East and maybe West, Air Canada and United Airlines would find a strong partner at Heathrow to counter the American Airlines-British Airways heavyweight and airlines like Lufthansa wouldn't see their intercontinental position threatened as Virgin Atlantic mostly serves the O&D needs of London. ANA would find a partner in London to counter the Japan Airlines-British Airways oneworld association as well as help them reduce the offer and increase yield like the former are currently busy doing. British Midland, if alive and not swallowed by Virgin by then, would get better yielding feeds for its domestic and neighboring countries network.

Actually, I'm not seeing any Star Alliance partner that wouldn't benefit from a strong partner at world's largest international (ratio of traffic) airport.
I want the European Union flag on airliners.net!
 
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ZSOFN
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 9:38 pm

I'm sure SkyTeam are eager to get hold of VS; it would greatly increase its longhaul presence out of LHR.

However look at VS' current partners: SQ, BD, SA (they've dropped the CE partnership). They're practically STAR already in many respects.

Besides, the STAR airlines are probably BA's biggest competitors, particularly out of LHR.
 
zvezda
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Mon Feb 13, 2006 10:15 pm

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 21):

However look at VS' current partners: SQ, BD, SA

Perhaps I was wrong about BD opposing a VS entry to Star. However, once US-EU Open Skies goes into effect, I expect to see LH long-haul ops out of LHR. Therefore LH might oppose a VS entry. That would be the kiss of death.
 
nzrich
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Tue Feb 14, 2006 7:00 am

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 21):
However look at VS' current partners: SQ, BD, SA (they've dropped the CE partnership). They're practically STAR already in many respects.

Dont forget VS has a partnership with Air NZ as well
"Pride of the pacific"
 
rmd11
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RE: VS To Join An Alliance?

Tue Feb 14, 2006 8:04 am

Quoting Wargo7772 (Thread starter):

I'd hope Star but thats just me
none