AT
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Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:36 pm

I am curious. Why is Song folding back in to Delta, it's parent company? It's only been a couple years that they've been operating, and if they are doing well, does it make sense to dissolve it?

Any comments?
 
RogerThat
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Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 12:13 pm

RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:44 pm

Delta needs Song's 757 back. Their domestic 767s are sloted for international flying. Not to mention, Song was making mincemeat of Delta.
 
AviationAddict
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:48 pm

I think there are a few reasons, but they all seem to be centered around DL's loss of revenue on the Song routes. They may have had a lot of customers, but the prices for the Song routes tended to be much lower than normal DL service, and when you combine that with the level of ammenities you were getting on Song the profit margin was being destroyed. Even though Song won't be around anymore as an idependent line, DL is planning to take many of the features of Song and incorporate them into the regular fleet, at least that's what I've heard.
 
Gatorman96
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Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2005 2:22 am

RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:49 pm

Check this thread. It has a lot of info about Song and why it is being
incorporated back into mainline.
RE: Song Officially Cutting Flights (by Dutchjet Feb 25 2006 in Civil Aviation)#ID2626011
 
phuebner
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:58 pm

Quoting RogerThat (Reply 1):
Delta needs Song's 757 back. Their domestic 767s are sloted for international flying. Not to mention, Song was making mincemeat of Delta.

Hahahahaha! I like that. What I found interesting is totally different than what is now happening..i.e. folding of Song. In the Jan 2006 issue of Airliners World, Delta announced plans to expand their 48 aircraft fleet to 100. The plan was for them to fly the long haul domestic flights so that Delta can concentrate on their international flights with the wide bodies. The paragraph that talked about this all of a sudden ended with the announced demise of Song in May 2006. No explanation given. The article did say that Song was profitable for them.

I think in a sense that the "legacy" carriers are just plain pissed because they are unable to compete with the LCC's.
Remember this, Your Body is a temple Not a pull toy!
 
SESGDL
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:15 pm

Quoting Phuebner (Reply 4):
Hahahahaha! I like that. What I found interesting is totally different than what is now happening..i.e. folding of Song. In the Jan 2006 issue of Airliners World, Delta announced plans to expand their 48 aircraft fleet to 100. The plan was for them to fly the long haul domestic flights so that Delta can concentrate on their international flights with the wide bodies. The paragraph that talked about this all of a sudden ended with the announced demise of Song in May 2006. No explanation given. The article did say that Song was profitable for them.

I think in a sense that the "legacy" carriers are just plain pissed because they are unable to compete with the LCC's.

There's a lot more to it than that. That article you read mentioned DL expanding Song to many markets with over 100 aircraft. This is still likely going to happen. DL will take many Song services (PTVs, leather seats, quick turnarounds, etc.) and merge them into DL, therefore having a "Song" experience on DL, with F-class and other typical DL amenities. The plan is to employ these aircraft on all 1,000+ mile domestic flights, likely using Song's 48 757-200s, and DL's 24 767-300s, as well as possibly 737-800s. Song was profitable for DL, but Song doesn't mix well with DL's refined business strategy to concentrate on higher yielding business routes in popular markets. DL's cutting focus on low-yielding leisure markets like Florida and concentrating more on international service and business markets.

Jeremy
 
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mariner
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:41 pm

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 5):
Song was profitable for DL,

Ouch. If Song was making money then mainline Delta must have been losing more money than we thought.

And none of this ties in with CEO Grinstein, who said, from the git-go, Song was going, then somehow he got talked out of it.

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
MajorNelson
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:45 pm

Its SUCH a shame. Song was so much more a pleasure to fly than mainline DL. The lightened-up atmosphere, F/A's who actually smiled and had fun, the colorful vacationy (a new word!) decor, the great IFE, the terrific fares , the ability to avoid messes like ATL and CVG .... Song will be missed.

[Edited 2006-03-06 06:46:43]
I turn Tops into Bottoms.
 
MKEdude
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Mon Mar 06, 2006 3:31 pm

Song was never intended to be a stand alone airline, nor were they to fly for a long period of time. Delta always intended to fold Song back into the main airline. Song was an experiment to try out different kinds of service on domestic routes. The reason for the new name was that if the carrier was a failure then the majority of passengers would not link Delta with it.

Remember many years ago when Nissan entered the U.S. market? They first entered under the Datsun label so that if they were a failure then the Nissan name would not be tarnished as well...same concept here.
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline." Frank Zappa
 
DL4EVR
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Tue Mar 07, 2006 5:54 am

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 5):
The plan is to employ these aircraft on all 1,000+ mile domestic flights, likely using Song's 48 757-200s, and DL's 24 767-300s, as well as possibly 737-800s.

Actually, their goal is to use them on 1750+ mile flights.
We Love To Fly And It Shows.
 
ord
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Tue Mar 07, 2006 6:58 am

Quoting MKEdude (Reply 8):
Remember many years ago when Nissan entered the U.S. market? They first entered under the Datsun label so that if they were a failure then the Nissan name would not be tarnished as well...same concept here.

This is not true. At the time, Datsun was the name used for passenger cars while Nissan was used for commercial vehicles. The change to Nissan occurred in 1982 because the company wanted to create a global brand like Honda and Toyota had already done. A company would never invest millions of dollars in launching a brand knowing if they succeed they would have to invest millions more to relaunch a new identity.

Quoting MKEdude (Reply 8):
The reason for the new name was that if the carrier was a failure then the majority of passengers would not link Delta with it.

Again, not true. It was named something other than Delta so it did not confuse the customer from a service expectations standpoint. If it was called Delta, people would have no idea if they would get a cramped coach seat with no entertainment or a roomy leather seat with individual IFE. There had to be a differentiating name since the products were different and there were different expectations and images from a customer standpoint. This is the same reason United calls it's all-economy class A320s Ted, even though most people know it's part of United.
 
WDBRR
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RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:39 pm

I flew on Song, the whole time I wished I booked on Jetblue.
I hated the circus interior with Purple, Green and Orange and
blue seats, the food prices were expensive and the whole
atmosphere and attitude seemed phony to me...even the
terminal (2) at JFK was a dump. what airport has quarter
arcade games right next to the gates (Pac-Man, etc).
TACKY. glad to see that train wreck go.
 
MajorNelson
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:26 am

RE: Why Is Song Folding Back Into Delta?

Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:46 pm

Quoting WDBRR (Reply 11):
I flew on Song, the whole time I wished I booked on Jetblue.
I hated the circus interior with Purple, Green and Orange and
blue seats, the food prices were expensive and the whole
atmosphere and attitude seemed phony to me...even the
terminal (2) at JFK was a dump. what airport has quarter
arcade games right next to the gates (Pac-Man, etc).
TACKY. glad to see that train wreck go.

Another one who takes himself too seriously. Loosen up a little.
I turn Tops into Bottoms.