StarAlly
Topic Author
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:21 pm

Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:50 am

My friend and I were talking about individuals who are wealthy enough to own airplanes. Well we were unsure of one thing when it comes to owning aircraft.

Can you leave at anytime or do you have to apply for certain departure arrival times?

So let's say Oprah is leaving Hawaii going to Santa Barbara. Can she leave at anytime or does she have to alert the airports X days in advance?

Hopefully someone can help answer! Thanks!!
Aaron Jason
 
starrion
Posts: 974
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 1:19 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 2:01 am

Wealthy enough to own an airplane?

Um, you can get a used cessna 152 for about 12K in the states. Admittedly a small airplane, but fully capable of flight.

Now if you are talking about a Business Jet or an airliner, then yes being wealthy is required.

If the flight is from a general aviation field with no restrictions then the pilot can simply call the tower when they are ready to depart.

At a high traffic airport, the flight may require some advanced notice to fit into the arrival/departure traffic, but only a very few airports are so congested that you would need any significant advanced notice.
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
socalfive
Posts: 474
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2001 5:37 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:00 am

...Well, and if it's X-country, file an appropriate VFR or IFR flight plan with Flight Service and GO. Then contact ATIS, Ground, Tower, Departure, FSS, and enroute center frequencies, pretty much like the big dogs do.
 
starrion
Posts: 974
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 1:19 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:16 am

I think he was asking what is required.

You are not required to file a flight plan if you are VFR. Absolutely a good idea, but not required.

Depending on where you are departing from there may not even be a need to talk to a tower or ATC either. Plenty of uncontrolled airports out there. And more than a few farmers still have the mown strip that they use to check the larger properties. Some of them don't even have radios.
Knowledge Replaces Fear
 
mustang304
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 1:35 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:33 am

If you fly in Class A airspace (>FL 18 = 18000Ft) in the USA, you gotta be on a IFR flight plan in the US. Also if you fly internationally, it takes a lot of the headaches out of the process. Air traffic control can usually process an IFR flight plan in 20-30 Minutes. Getting the IFR clearance varies by how busy the departure airport is and the route filed.
Since most business jets are a heck of a lot more effiecent at the FL30-40 range, they'll file an IFR flight plan.

The major advantage to general aviation is the flexibility of departures/arrivals and airport locations. It's "your" plane, so you go when you want and where you want.There is no TSA to deal with, mass boarding, and luggage claim to deal with and you can usually find an airport that is closer to your destination. It can really save a lot of time.

But then again, some of us like to fly on commerical aircraft as well.
 
StarAlly
Topic Author
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:21 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:04 am

Quoting Starrion (Reply 1):
Wealthy enough to own an airplane?

Um, you can get a used cessna 152 for about 12K in the states. Admittedly a small airplane, but fully capable of flight.

Ah ok cools. I'm not familiar with the cost of owning an airplane, but I did have my mind focused on biz jets.

Thanks everyone.

I had another question I meant to ask... What about space at the airport? Do they rent out space like parking spots? Anyone have any idea of the costs? Or maybe a website/link? Sorry for all the questions and posts, but the help is greatly appreciated!

[Edited 2006-03-31 20:14:02]
Aaron Jason
 
lapa_saab340
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2001 8:42 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:31 am

$12k for a 152? Without an engine perhaps...

Aircraft ownership is anything but cheap. While the smaller GA a/c are relatively affordable, there is much more to it than acquisition costs!
 
mustang304
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 1:35 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:12 am

They usually charge for parking/tie down depending on the Fixed Base Operator (FBO) and the airport.

If you go into a biz jet FBO, the FBO staff might come out with a red carpet, have a rental car nearby, ready to go, running with the A/C or heater on, and the trunk open. The FBO staff will carry the luggage to the car. If a limo is required, it will usually be parked fairly close to where the aircraft pulls up.

While the owner is doing whatever the owner does, the FBO will fuel the aircraft, get catering, clean the interior, service any systems that require it, park it in the hanger if needed, and give the pilots a place to hang out, check weather, get some sleep and relax. Most FBOs provide a "crew car" (if you can call it a car) for the pilots to run about in. Some of these services have charges, some are included with the purchase of fuel. It is kind of like a full service gas station.

On the other end, some smaller airports (without large FBOs) just have tie down spots for "transients". Some don't charge if your just there for the day, and some have a nominal overnight fee. Some don't charge at all. If you need fuel, you pump it yourself.
 
bond007
Posts: 4425
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 2:07 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 11:00 am

Quoting Mustang304 (Reply 7):
Some of these services have charges, some are included with the purchase of fuel. It is kind of like a full service gas station.

FBOs make money on fuel, and often if you don't buy a minimum fuel amount, they'll charge a 'ramp fee' which can run into the hundreds of dollars ... or even more.


Jimbo
I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 11:07 am

Quoting StarAlly (Thread starter):
So let's say Oprah is leaving Hawaii going to Santa Barbara. Can she leave at anytime or does she have to alert the airports X days in advance?

Alert them to what...?? Any pilot can fly at anytime. Just call Flight Services and give them the information as to were your going, what your flying, number of people and the colors of the plane. The only thing you would need to do is make sure the airport is open when you arrive....and if traveling international, that Customs is open.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
SX36
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 4:54 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 11:30 am

Quoting Starrion (Reply 3):
And more than a few farmers still have the mown strip that they use to check the larger properties. Some of them don't even have radios.

It's the cropdusters in the midwest that scare the crap outta me. They don't have radios, they tend to yank and bank alot during their application runs, and (per my experience) have no regard for the "rules of the road". On more than one occasion I have had a close call with a crop duster, and it gives me a whole new outlook on see and avoid.
NW, the only way out.....
 
socalfive
Posts: 474
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2001 5:37 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:20 pm

Quoting Starrion (Reply 3):
You are not required to file a flight plan if you are VFR. Absolutely a good idea, but not required.

Depending on where you are departing from there may not even be a need to talk to a tower or ATC either. Plenty of uncontrolled airports out there. And more than a few farmers still have the mown strip that they use to check the larger properties. Some of them don't even have radios.

 Yeah sure
Well I was referring to his reference of Oprah flying to Hawaii as the example which won't be departing on a 152 from a Farmer's newly mowed airstrip, a bizjet at very least is in order. In that event, in all other respects I'm correct.

If you're flying a 152, you're right about not needing to file a flightplan for VFR nor needing ATC to depart from uncontrolled airfields, you can pretty much fly one of those things right out of the back of a pickup truck. However, if the airfield has an FBO it will at very least have a Unicom which is used by the FBO to broadcast airport advisories of wind direction and active runway. All other times when the FBO is closed airplanes using the airport transmit "in the blind" to any other possible aircraft in the vicinity.
 
corey07850
Posts: 2335
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 4:33 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:28 pm

Quoting StarAlly (Thread starter):
Can you leave at anytime or do you have to apply for certain departure arrival times?

Short answer: Yes, you can leave any time you want

Long answer: Certain areas and airports may have delays imposed on the ATC Center where aircraft are assigned wheels-up times. So say Oprah in her G-V is flying from LA to NYC planning to depart at 8:00AM... If NY Center is so innundated with traffic they will hold aircraft on the ground for a certain amount of time... NY Center may assign a wheels up time of 8:45AM instead. Obviously this isn't much of a delay compared to you asking about notifying the airport days in advance, but it's still an occasion where you don't have total control of the flight times
 
StarAlly
Topic Author
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:21 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:07 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 9):

Alert them to what...?? Any pilot can fly at anytime.

Alert them for arrival, but you answered my question. Thank you.  Smile

Quoting Corey07850 (Reply 12):

Short answer: Yes, you can leave any time you want

Thank you.  Smile
Aaron Jason
 
N49WA
Posts: 61
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:06 pm

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:43 pm

We operate our Learjet as some of the previous posts described; a flight plan is filed and we launch whenever we are ready to go. The plane is based at VNY, and we use transient parking at destinations, or have agreements with FBO's.
When we film the Boeing delivery flights (a regular deal) our flight plan pretty much mimics that of the airplane we are filming, such as a new 767 we flew along side of from Washington to LAX last week. In these cases we fly from VNY and park on the Boeing ramp until they are ready to go, then break off and go back to Van Nuys while the 767 makes it's approach to LAX.
If it's new and quiet, I don't want to fly it.
 
ehrbear
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 4:45 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:49 pm

Aviation has never been an inexpensive endeavour, right from the beginning. An old joke is that if you want to make a small fortune in aviation, start with a large fortune. Of course, if you are someone like John Travolta, you can have a stable of aircraft. It must be nice.
 
socalfive
Posts: 474
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2001 5:37 am

RE: Question Regarding Private Planes

Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:07 am

Quoting Ehrbear (Reply 15):
Aviation has never been an inexpensive endeavour, right from the beginning. An old joke is that if you want to make a small fortune in aviation, start with a large fortune

OR, in other words...

"If it Flys, Floats, or F***ks, RENT IT!


-SoCal

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