PK786
Topic Author
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 5:35 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:49 am

Hi
I like to know why PIA stop flying direct flights to USA and Canada.On web site they are showing but when i booked the flight for this month they are not direct they are stopping again at Manchester what a pain any info please thanks in advance.
 
GLAGAZ
Posts: 1844
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2004 5:42 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:54 am

Something to do with the US and security issues. They are happy for non-stop on USA-PAK but not PAK-USA.

Gaz
Neutrality means that u don't really care cos the struggle goes on even when ur not there, blind and unaware
 
airbazar
Posts: 6955
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 4:10 am

They may stop in Manchester but that is still a direct flight. Non-stop is a different thing. There's a whole list of reasons why a carrier would choose to fly a one-stop direct route rather than a non-stop route. My guess is as good as any: lack of demand, lack of aircraft for the route, lack of permission, etc.
 
ba747yyz
Posts: 371
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 2:55 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 4:16 am

It is a direct flight, but I suspect that it might have something to do with either traffic, or range. I know they still fly to YYZ, when I was arriving so was a large PIA flight, that was fun. Immigration trying to deal with 200-400 people that spoke little or no English, and yet they got less hassle than I did!
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 4:28 am

Quoting GLAGAZ (Reply 1):
Something to do with the US and security issues. They are happy for non-stop on USA-PAK but not PAK-USA.

that is correct, right now, the United States Govt isn't allowing direct nonstop flights from Pakistan due to security issues.

PK didn't address this situation prior to setting up their flight route..how typical of something like the PK management to do this.. sarcastic 

it stems from the fact many Pakistani leaders/politicians/etc. still think they don't have to go through security lines..

the Pakistan Government is working on solving this issue, but until then, the plane will have to make a stop in MAN...

Quoting BA747YYZ (Reply 3):
It is a direct flight, but I suspect that it might have something to do with either traffic, or range

I hope the 777-200LR isn't range restricted... spin 
"Up the Irons!"
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 4:37 am

The US Government isn't happy with security issues in Pakistan, hence the 772LRs have to do a splash and dash in Manchester on flights from Pakistan-USA.
USA-Pakistan is nonstop, and Pakistan-YYZ and v.v. is nonstop both ways.
In other words, the US government is paranoid, but thats for non aviation  Wink
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
ahlfors
Posts: 1281
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2000 1:44 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:09 am

So what, they land in MAN, everyone gets off the plane, goes through security, back on the plane and it takes off???
 
MajorNelson
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:26 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:21 am

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 2):
There's a whole list of reasons why a carrier would choose to fly a one-stop direct route rather than a non-stop route. My guess is as good as any: lack of demand, lack of aircraft for the route, lack of permission, etc.

In other words, you don't know the answer.
I turn Tops into Bottoms.
 
PK786
Topic Author
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 5:35 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:28 am

HI
They are showing on there web site the flights are direct non stop.But because Queen need more money in England so they have to stop and not only that if you are not citizen of USA you have to get a transit visa and you have to pay for it and then you have to go through the worse airport in the world MAN and go through the security again and get insulted for nothing.
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:32 am

Quoting PK786 (Reply 8):
because Queen need more money in England so they have to stop and not only that if you are not citizen of USA you have to get a transit visa and you have to pay for it and then you have to go through the worse airport in the world MAN and go through the security again and get insulted for nothing.

So you knew the answer all along then?
International Homo of Mystery
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:38 am

Quoting PK786 (Reply 8):
HI
They are showing on there web site the flights are direct non stop.But because Queen need more money in England so they have to stop and not only that if you are not citizen of USA you have to get a transit visa and you have to pay for it and then you have to go through the worse airport in the world MAN and go through the security again and get insulted for nothing.



Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 9):

So you knew the answer all along then?

lol..thats not what it is.........it is because of my comments which I mentioned previously... Smile

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
that is correct, right now, the United States Govt isn't allowing direct nonstop flights from Pakistan due to security issues.

PK didn't address this situation prior to setting up their flight route..how typical of something like the PK management to do this.. sarcastic

it stems from the fact many Pakistani leaders/politicians/etc. still think they don't have to go through security lines..

the Pakistan Government is working on solving this issue, but until then, the plane will have to make a stop in MAN...
"Up the Irons!"
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:42 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 10):
lol..thats not what it is.........it is because of my comments which I mentioned previously

Ah thank you, I get so easily confused  Wink
International Homo of Mystery
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:45 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 11):
Ah thank you, I get so easily confused  Wink

yah..i'm sure you get so easily confused...right..... if that's the case, did you know I have bridge to sell you in Brooklyn?  Wink
"Up the Irons!"
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:48 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 12):
did you know I have bridge to sell you in Brooklyn?

I've a wet suitcase full of Confederate bonds to buy it with!

To stay on topic, maybe we can do a deal while spotting a PIA landing at IAH.  Smile
International Homo of Mystery
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:19 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 13):

I've a wet suitcase full of Confederate bonds to buy it with!

I guess those are legitimate........ Smile

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 13):
To stay on topic, maybe we can do a deal while spotting a PIA landing at IAH.  Smile

suuuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrre......my bridge for your bonds...... Wink
"Up the Irons!"
 
PK786
Topic Author
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 5:35 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:28 pm

HI
I can sell you my country if you like lol.I just think PIA got stick with the planes so they can fly but then they got the planes now there is a problem good to be powerful company BOEING and the country USA ha ha.
 
lehpron
Posts: 6846
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 3:42 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:49 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
how typical of something like the PK management to do this..

What have they done before such that you gave them the 'typical' label?
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:51 pm

Quoting BA747YYZ (Reply 3):
Immigration trying to deal with 200-400 people that spoke little or no English

Were they coming from some other country, because every Pakistani person I have ever met speaks flawless English
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 1:00 pm

Quoting Lehpron (Reply 16):

What have they done before such that you gave them the 'typical' label?

if you knew anything of PK management, you would know at times, they are as competent as BD's management.... Wink

by the way, if you read my other posts, you would know I'm probably the biggest PK supporter on A.net.. spin 
"Up the Irons!"
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 5:25 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 17):
Were they coming from some other country, because every Pakistani person I have ever met speaks flawless English

You should try speaking with some of them that work in call centres for British companies then. It's like talking to a brick wall.  Angry
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
CO7e7
Posts: 2686
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2004 3:39 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 5:48 pm

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 19):
You should try speaking with some of them that work in call centres for British companies

and some American companies... try calling DELL's customer service!!! I bet you Kirkie, you'll consider shooting yourself by the time you hang up!  Wink

For me, it's one of the most frustrating things!!!
 
HS748
Posts: 621
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:01 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 5:51 pm

Quoting PK786 (Reply 8):
HI
They are showing on there web site the flights are direct non stop.But because Queen need more money in England so they have to stop and not only that if you are not citizen of USA you have to get a transit visa and you have to pay for it and then you have to go through the worse airport in the world MAN and go through the security again and get insulted for nothing.

You do know that you don't have to travel through MAN, don't you? If you don't like it, don't do it, nobody is forcing you, are they?
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 7:45 pm

Quoting CO7e7 (Reply 20):
and some American companies... try calling DELL's customer service!!! I bet you Kirkie, you'll consider shooting yourself by the time you hang up! Wink

For me, it's one of the most frustrating things!!!

Aye, but lets get back on topic  Wink
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
fiaz
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:34 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 10:01 pm

OK first of all
let me tell u guys why they stopped non stop flights to canada and it was not due to security reason i dunno aboiut the US but canada wasnt.....

the reason they stoped non-stop flight to yyz is because of lack of crew members, the uniion board for pilots in pakistan is urging PIA to increase salaries for the captains of the b777 team. Now yesterday my uncle who a captain of a b777 was suppose to fly into yyz with his family but did not because PIA decided to send in extra crew on the same flight (dead hours - where the do not work) until manchester and than from manchester to yyz they will take the flight.PIA is doing this because right now they have come to no agreement with their pilots....why do u guys think there have been so many delays with PIA flight into yyz lately ...sometimes 18hrs, somtimes 12 hrs...it has noting do with security its all the management and the pilots of PIA

Fiaz
 
behramjee
Posts: 4344
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Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 10:06 pm

The US Homeland Security, expressing its security concerns, has not permitted PIA to bring its nonstop flight to New York, sources in PIA informed Pakistan's The Nation newspaper. PIA flight Pk-711 is scheduled to fly to New York non-stop today. It is interesting to note that the route of PIA flight PK-721 leaving Lahore for New York last Sunday was changed at the eleventh hour due to unknown reasons. A delegation comprising officials from US main security agencies including Home Land Security and Traffic Safety Authority visited Pakistan recently and expressed their security concerns over the prevalent security measures at various International Airports.

The US security officials termed the security environment at Karachi and Islamabad Airports as worst where they believed that many influentials got away without security search and checks. They also said in the report that there were many entrance points on these airports. It is interesting to note that PIA announced its flight to New York without prior permission from the host country.

According to rules every airline was bound to seek prior permission to change the route from the country concerned. As per Immigration laws, Pakistanis travelling to US on transit flight and holding green cards issued before 1998 were required to get transit visa from UK Embassy in Pakistan, which required a week to get transit visa. Since PIA was repeatedly asking its passengers through press that PIA flight was operating non stop from Pakistan to New York it meant the said passengers were not required to get transit visa.

Now as the US authorities have refused to allow the PIA to bring its flight direct to New York those possessing green cards would have to manage their transit visas which was not possible for them to manage within limited time. Ultimately they would be off loaded at the Lahore Airport. PIA can fly nonstop from USA to Pakistan but not from Pakistan to USA. Source :

Source : http://nation.com.pk/daily/mar-2006/31/index9.php
 
jm017
Posts: 780
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 6:47 pm

Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sun Apr 09, 2006 11:44 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
that is correct, right now, the United States Govt isn't allowing direct nonstop flights from Pakistan due to security issues.

PK didn't address this situation prior to setting up their flight route..how typical of something like the PK management to do this.. sarcastic

it stems from the fact many Pakistani leaders/politicians/etc. still think they don't have to go through security lines..

I missed something. How does a stop in MAN help? Are they required to pre-clear in MAN?

[Edited 2006-04-09 16:50:16]
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
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Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:42 am

Quoting Jm017 (Reply 25):

I missed something. How does a stop in MAN help? Are they required to pre-clear in MAN?

you got me on that one...logically one would conclude that might be what needs to be done....get clearance in some sort of way...
"Up the Irons!"
 
ahlfors
Posts: 1281
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2000 1:44 am

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:52 am

Quoting Jm017 (Reply 25):
I missed something. How does a stop in MAN help? Are they required to pre-clear in MAN?

Apparently they just go through security again. Basically it means that anyone that might have gotten on the plane in Pakistan without a thorough security check will not be able to get even close to the US, as there is a second security check in the UK.
 
YULWinterSkies
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RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:23 am

Quoting Jm017 (Reply 25):
I missed something. How does a stop in MAN help? Are they required to pre-clear in MAN?

AFAIK no pre-clearance at MAN, but they (the US Homeland Security) have all the duration of the pakistan-MAN flights to find out who is onboard, and they can use the MAN stop as a security stop to kick out a doubtful pax without derouting the a/c or whatever, no matters the hassle for the 300 daily other pax onboard.
When I doubt... go running!
 
PK786
Topic Author
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 5:35 am

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 4:46 am

Hi
Thanks for the explaination BEHRAMJEE.Still its not right for the passangers on the last min to do that and they still have the web site claiming that they are flying non stop to USA and CANADA. MAN security have nothing to do that and i think US Immigration have enough time to do there job or let the plane wait at the ramp who cares like always if they find someone who is black list fine the airline and take care of the passangers.There are lot of ailines comes from Europe and they dont need time to stop any where or wait for the immigration or TSA to find ou the list.
 
jm017
Posts: 780
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 6:47 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 6:14 am

Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 28):
AFAIK no pre-clearance at MAN, but they (the US Homeland Security) have all the duration of the pakistan-MAN flights to find out who is onboard, and they can use the MAN stop as a security stop to kick out a doubtful pax without derouting the a/c or whatever, no matters the hassle for the 300 daily other pax onboard.

There has got to be a better way to do this than a stop in MAN. Maybe a strict policy forbidding stand-by passengers, earlier check-ins (say 4 hours), etc. Maybe if US Homeland security were more efficient in screening passengers.

It doesn't help that they continue to announce the flight as non-stop.
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
heathrow
Posts: 329
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:33 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:40 am

Is this also an issue with Air India? I know they do their JFK run via LHR, and they do their YYZ run via BHX.
 
boysteve
Posts: 887
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:02 am

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:57 am

Why is it safe for a direct Pakistan-UK flight to operate but not a direct Pakistan-USA. I don't understand
 
heathrow
Posts: 329
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:33 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:16 am

Quoting Boysteve (Reply 32):
Why is it safe for a direct Pakistan-UK flight to operate but not a direct Pakistan-USA. I don't understand

one word. Bush  Wink
 
jm017
Posts: 780
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 6:47 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:51 am

Quoting Boysteve (Reply 32):
Why is it safe for a direct Pakistan-UK flight to operate but not a direct Pakistan-USA. I don't understand

Only Homeland Security knows the answer to that one...

[Edited 2006-04-12 01:52:36]
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
planetime
Posts: 612
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:16 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Fri Apr 14, 2006 4:10 am

IS there a timeline which PIA is working on in order to bring back nonstop service back to New York? seems to me a big embarassment for PIA to do this before announcing anything.
 
subkk
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:00 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:29 pm

Quoting Heathrow (Reply 31):
s this also an issue with Air India? I know they do their JFK run via LHR, and they do their YYZ run via BHX.

AI dont operate the because they dont have aircraft with the range. Plus AI believe in operating a shuttle service that connects atleast 6 destinations in a single flight  Smile

Currently CO and AA operate directly from DEL to EWR and ORD. So the security checks are satisfactory for US DHS

Subbu
 
User avatar
Flying Belgian
Posts: 1906
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RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:28 am

AFAIK, Kenya Airways had the same trouble.

They wanted to to open a direct NBO-MIA route but they are still denied the access to the US due to security concerns at NBO.


FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
behramjee
Posts: 4344
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:37 am

Just to let you guys get to update...a PIA B 742 Combi bound for Houston from KHI via ISB and MAN took off from KHI landed in ISB and over there the Drugs Enforcement Unit of Pakistan Customs and the PIA Security team found 3 concealed brown jackets weighing a total 9.6 KG of HEROIN in the PIA jumbo's toilets.

What is scary is that this wasnt detected at KHI airport and plane took off with this heroin for USA via ISB-MAN.
 
behramjee
Posts: 4344
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:41 am

The link to the article is :

http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/apr2006-daily/10-04-2006/metro/k15.htm

The Drug Enforcement Cell (DEC) of Pakistan Customs along with the security staff of the Pakistan International Airline (PIA), detected more than 9500 grams of heroin that was concealed in jackets, in the cavities of three toilets of a PIA flight PK-719, said a press release on Sunday.

The flight had arrived from Islamabad early on April 8 and was bound for Houston USA via Manchester.
 
jacobin777
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Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

RE: Why Did PIA Stop Direct Flights To USA?

Sat Apr 15, 2006 2:57 am

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 39):
The Drug Enforcement Cell (DEC) of Pakistan Customs along with the security staff of the Pakistan International Airline (PIA), detected more than 9500 grams of heroin that was concealed in jackets, in the cavities of three toilets of a PIA flight PK-719, said a press release on Sunday.

at least it was found by PK and the Pakistani Govt. (DEC)... biggrin 
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