lazyshaun
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How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:43 am

Just adding up all the previous orders, e.g.IB, SAA, VS, and take off how many have been delivereed, how many are left for each of these airlines?
How many did QR order and how many are EK maybe ordering?

Thanks for any replies...
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leftshoe
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:06 am

Airbus has a very comprehensive orders&deliveries spreadsheet.

Just go to http://www.airbus.com/en/corporate/orders_and_deliveries/ , scroll to the bottom of the page and use the link provided there.

It's not always totally accurate, but it gives you a very good overview over every Airbus model.

If you check the A340-600 on the Airbus website (http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a330a340/a340-600/), total orders and deliveries for the model were once listed there as well. But at least in my browser the box "Orders and Deliveries" on the left of the page is still there, but the figures are gone... Very strange...
 
lazyshaun
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:33 am

Thanks for that link, Leftshoe. I always found it hard to find an up-to-date orders/deliveries page on Airbus's site.
According to them IB have 1 left, SAA have none left and VS have 10, which I beleive they ordered about 4 or 5 months ago, and Thai have 2 A340 left, but I don't know if they are -500 or -600??
I could not find any info about the number of A346 QR ordered, can someone update me?

As a summary Airbus have 11 left to deliver, excluding QR's order.
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Cruiser
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:11 am

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 2):
As a summary Airbus have 11 left to deliver, excluding QR's order.

Does that 11 include the 3 for Air Canada which are listed? If so, those are indefinately on hold (and will be cancelled).

James
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lazyshaun
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:27 am

Cruiser, yes it does. Did AC order a346? definatly not a345?
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N328KF
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:32 am

Quoting Cruiser (Reply 3):
Does that 11 include the 3 for Air Canada which are listed? If so, those are indefinately on hold (and will be cancelled).

They have been cancelled for over a year. Strange that they're not off the books yet.
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
Cruiser
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:28 am

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 4):
Cruiser, yes it does. Did AC order a346? definatly not a345?

AC did order both the A345 ( x 2) and A346 ( x 3). There were some issues with the original order and Airbus put the order on hold indefinately. I cannot remember or find the exact reasons for it happening, but AC is able to cancel these planes without any penalty.

Quoting N328KF (Reply 5):

They have been cancelled for over a year. Strange that they're not off the books yet.

Some believe that they will remain on the books until the 777's actually begin arriving. Don't plan on these ever getting built though!

James
Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
 
AT502B
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:43 am

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 2):
As a summary Airbus have 11 left to deliver, excluding QR's order.

I thought LH had some more on order? I seem to remember them exercising some options.
I love the smell of jet fuel in the morning.
 
Arcano
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:12 am

Will the 343 still be in production in 2007 and 2008? Otherwise, maybe LAN could be a candidate if they change the order of the 2 343s remaining.

Regards )(
in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773, 380, 73G, 788, 789, 346
 
thaiaggie
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:15 pm

TG has one 345 and one 346 on order I believe
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Hirnie
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 2:15 pm

LH has 7 A346 left on order.
 
karan69
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:03 pm

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 2):
As a summary Airbus have 11 left to deliver, excluding QR's order.

There has to be some mistake 11 [10 VS + 1 IB] plus there are quite a bit from the likes of Thai, Lufthansa,Qatar
 
FlyPEGASUS
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:13 pm

Hi,
According to Airbus site, there are 59 Airbus A340-600 still to be delivered.
And those are (per customer):

18 Emirates
10 Virgin Atlantic Airways
7 Lufthansa
6 Aerolineas Argentinas
4 Etihad Airways
4 Qatar Airways
3 Air Canada
3 Intl Lease Finance Corp
1 Private Customers
1 Undisclosed
1 Thai Airways International
1 Iberia

Regards
 
FlyPEGASUS
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:22 pm

By the way, (and from the same source), there are only 5 A340-500 still to be delivered. And those are:

4 Etihad Airways
1 Thai Airways International

Regards
 
cuprita
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:42 pm

The IB A346 will be delivery this month.......with the registration EC-JUP.IB no want more A346....are looking the A380 and A350
PANASONIC DMZ-FZ5
 
cuprita
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:43 pm

Of course ...the 6 AR A346 is off
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FlyPEGASUS
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 6:47 pm

Hi Cuprita,

Quoting Cuprita (Reply 15):
Of course ...the 6 AR A346 is off

Didn't know that. Can you update me on that?
Thanks.
 
FlyPEGASUS
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 7:16 pm

The answer to my question regarding A346 order from AR is well answered in the folowing Discussion forum in "Reply 10"
RE: 787 Vs A350 In South America (by Marambio Mar 31 2006 in Civil Aviation)#ID2691779

Regards.
 
Matt72033
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:02 pm

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 2):
VS have 10



Quoting FlyPEGASUS (Reply 12):
10 Virgin Atlantic Airways

i make it 12!
 
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PM
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:15 pm

FlyPEGASUS

Thanks. My own figures are a little different. Going by published orders and commitments minus planes already built and flying, I get...

Emirates (18 x A346 + 2 to be leased from ILFC) (*)
Virgin Atlantic Airways (12 x A346)
Lufthansa (7 x A346)
Aerolineas Argentinas (6 x A346) (**)
Etihad Airways (3 x A345 + 4 A346)
4 Qatar Airways (4 x A346)
VIP (1 x A346)
Thai Airways International (2 x A345)
Iberia (1 x A346)

TOTAL : 4 A345 + 55 A346 = 59

(*) There's doubt over the status of all of these EK 'orders' and they've all been deferred in any case. There must be a question mark over whether any of these 20 (18? Fewer?) will ever be built.

(**) There must be still more doubt that these will ever be built.

I've written off the three Air Canada planes - whatever Airbus still have on their website.

Otherwise, it seems likely that all the others above will fly.

If they do - and if (IF!) there are NO MORE ORDERS for the A345 or A346 - the production run will be...

A345 Total 26
EK 10
SIA 5
Thai 4
Etihad 4
Air Canada 2
Qatar Government 1

A346 Total 87
VS 25
LH 17
SAA 9
IB 13
Thai 6
China Eastern 5
Etihad 4
Qatar 4
Cathay 3
VIP 1

An order from Qatar for another 20 or so would change things but that's far from guaranteed.

Otherwise, Airbus can pretty much bank on 113 A345/A346s flying but not necessarily any more.

It's pretty poor when you look at it like that.  Sad
 
cricket
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:18 pm

And of course the EK order is also been put on hold. Which means of the 59 - 27 may never get made.
A300B2/B4/6R, A313, A319/320/321, A333, A343, A388, 737-2/3/4/7/8/9, 747-3/4, 772/2E/2L/3, E170/190, F70, CR2/7, 146-3,
 
crewrest
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:35 pm

That's pretty rubbish when you look how many 773s are on order, looks like boeing's won this little battle in the war
 
RICARDOAB
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:43 pm

Anyone know who the VIP customer is?
 
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N328KF
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 10:56 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 19):
A345 Total 26


Quoting PM (Reply 19):
A346 Total 87

Compare that to 35 777-200LR orders and 189 777-300ER orders. You might, debatably, count 60 777-300 orders in there, too, since the A340-600 is the closest match to that airfame. Also, while not a passenger aircraft, there are 23 777 Freighter orders to help R&D amortization for the -200LR/-300ER.

[Edited 2006-04-12 16:02:04]
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
airbusA346
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:02 pm

I can see this thread turning in to a A vs. B war.

Between the 777 & A345/6

Does it matter, who has more orders: 'No'

Tom.
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:49 pm

Quoting AirbusA346 (Reply 24):
I can see this thread turning in to a A vs. B war.

Between the 777 & A345/6

Does it matter, who has more orders: 'No'

I don't see how you can say that. It does matter because the weaker product is the one that will need to be replaced sooner. This isn't a P.C. kiddie softball game where every team needs to be made to feel they did their very best, and where even last place gets some sort of award.
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
Lumberton
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:03 am

Hasn't Vijay Mallya of Kingfisher already said he's going to probably take some A340's?
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
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PM
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:14 am

Quoting AirbusA346 (Reply 24):
I can see this thread turning in to a A vs. B war. Between the 777 & A345/6. Does it matter, who has more orders: 'No'

Balfour (sometime British Prime Minister) once said, "Nothing matters much and very few things matter at all." It's a great quote but everything hinges on what you mean by "matter".

Does anything we discuss on A.Net "matter" much? Not really.

However, poor sales of the A345/A346 will "matter" to Airbus, its investors and employees (for fairly obvious reasons) while the relative success of the 773ER/772LR will "matter" to Boeing for similar reasons.

It is, incidentally, possible to take an interest in airliner sales and deliveries without necessarily taking sides, waving flags or celebrating / grieving at individual sales. But that the A340NG programme may stutter to a close before it sells even half as many as the (already unspectacular) sales total of the original A340 is a legitimate topic of interest on a site like this.

Does it "matter"? See above.

Is it interesting? Of course.
 
USADreamliner
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:39 am

Quoting FlyPEGASUS (Reply 16):
Quoting Cuprita (Reply 15):
Of course ...the 6 AR A346 is off

Didn't know that. Can you update me on that?
Thanks.

That was on order made 6/7 years ago, when IB and AA controlled the Airline.
They cancelled the order.On AR's website they show 744, 735 and A313 as "new" replacements for the 742 and 737-200.No mention of the A346.


USADreamliner
 
Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 12:50 am

Quoting PM (Reply 27):
It is, incidentally, possible to take an interest in airliner sales and deliveries without necessarily taking sides, waving flags or celebrating / grieving at individual sales. But that the A340NG programme may stutter to a close before it sells even half as many as the (already unspectacular) sales total of the original A340 is a legitimate topic of interest on a site like this.

Then I will say, without waving any flag, that people at Airbus noticed the sales figures as well and, since this is not a softball game, will look at ways to change things. Nobody should think the last A340 has been sold yet.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 29):
people at Airbus noticed the sales figures as well and, since this is not a softball game, will look at ways to change things. Nobody should think the last A340 has been sold yet.

True, we will see more A340 sales in the future. But nobody should think enhanced versions will change the game. The A340 will always remain very heavy compared to its B777 counterparts, and it will always remain a four-hauler. And why should interested airlines wait some more years when a proven top product is already available?


PH
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Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:37 am

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 34):
True, we will see more A340 sales in the future. But nobody should think enhanced versions will change the game. The A340 will always remain very heavy compared to its B777 counterparts, and it will always remain a four-hauler. And why should interested airlines wait some more years when a proven top product is already available?

I didn't mean the enhanced version.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:39 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 31):
I didn't mean the enhanced version.

What do you mean then? A completely new airframe? Stretching the A350?


PH
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Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:23 am

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 32):
What do you mean then? A completely new airframe? Stretching the A350?

No, just the current models (without the -200, of course.)
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:34 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 33):
No, just the current models (without the -200, of course.)

And how should the current models attract a number of new customers or significantly more sales than recently? You said Airbus would "look to change things" - how?


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:43 am

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 34):
And how should the current models attract a number of new customers or significantly more sales than recently? You said Airbus would "look to change things" - how?

The things you simply do in business in order to sell better. Lower the price, offer additonal benefits (like paying the fuel difference to the 777) or sell it in packages together with A320s or A380s. Don't forget that every 777 sale also means that you'll have to wait longer for one. In some time you might get a new A340 faster than a new 777.

Besides, afaik Airbus has one line that produces A330s and A340s. Also the A350, unless they change that one. This means a lot of flexibility, there is no need to rush to panic sales as long as that line is busy.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
Hamlet69
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:04 am

Quoting RICARDOAB (Reply 22):
Anyone know who the VIP customer is?

National Air Services.



To answer the question, the current A340 backlog as of March 31st is as follows:

-200
0 - no longer on offer


-300
3 - Air Mauritius
3 - Finnair
2 - LAN* (there is considerable debate/doubt as to whether LAN will take these)

8 - Total


-500
4 - Etihad Airways
1 - Thai Airways Int'l

5 - Total


-600
6 - Aerolineas Argentinas* (believed to be cancelled)
3 - Air Canada* (officially cancelled by airline, not taken off Airbus books)
18 - Emirates* (officially delayed, possibly converted to proposed 'E')
4 - Etihad Airways
1 - Iberia
3 - I.L.F.C. (2 to be delivered to EK, current status unknown)
7 - Lufthansa
4 - Qatar Airways
1 - Thai Airways Int'l
10 - Virgin Atlantic
1 - Private (National Air Services)
1 - Undisclosed

59 - Total


Regards,

Hamlet69


*Edit - Thanks Crewrest!!

[Edited 2006-04-12 20:15:22]
Honor the warriors, not the war.
 
crewrest
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:09 am

Hamlet there's a few Virgin 600s in there too.
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:21 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 35):
The things you simply do in business in order to sell better. Lower the price, offer additonal benefits (like paying the fuel difference to the 777) or sell it in packages together with A320s or A380s.

"Simply"? Airbus has most likely tried to push A340s sales with that policy for a longer time. Though, the B777 has been sold better than ever - with several A340 customers even switching (Air Canada, Cathay Pacific, Emirates). And how many carriers would be interested in an A340/A380 package? Not really many...

Quoting Thorben (Reply 35):
Don't forget that every 777 sale also means that you'll have to wait longer for one. In some time you might get a new A340 faster than a new 777.

Not necessarily with such a busy A330/A340 line.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 35):
This means a lot of flexibility, there is no need to rush to panic sales as long as that line is busy.

The line is busy because Airbus has sold many A330s. And even if the A350 wins some more important orders and keeps the line busy in the future, Airbus still doesn't have an answer to the B777-300ER and B777-200LR. Airbus may lose even more market share in that segment very soon, just think about possible B777 orders by BA, QF and SQ. I don't see how the current A340 or future versions (some five years from now) can stop that trend.


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:36 am

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
"Simply"? Airbus has most likely tried to push A340s sales with that policy for a longer time.

Proof? With three years backlog?

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
Though, the B777 has been sold better than ever - with several A340 customers even switching (Air Canada, Cathay Pacific, Emirates).

Yes, EK switched from A340 to 777F.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
And how many carriers would be interested in an A340/A380 package? Not really many...

If they're interested in the A380, then one may offer them some A340s with it.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
Not necessarily with such a busy A330/A340 line.

The line only needs to be kept busy until the A350 arrives.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
The line is busy because Airbus has sold many A330s. And even if the A350 wins some more important orders and keeps the line busy in the future, Airbus still doesn't have an answer to the B777-300ER and B777-200LR. Airbus may lose even more market share in that segment very soon, just think about possible B777 orders by BA, QF and SQ. I don't see how the current A340 or future versions (some five years from now) can stop that trend.

I think Airbus is more concerned about profit (iow to keep their production line busy) then in silencing the B boys on a.net.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
Hamlet69
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:55 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 35):
Besides, afaik Airbus has one line that produces A330s and A340s.

They do. However, the fact that the current 777 backlog is greater than the A330/340 backlog combined probably is a little worrisome to Airbus.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 35):
Also the A350, unless they change that one.

Has this been confirmed yet? I've heard both scenarios - one that Airbus will build the A350 on the same line. The other that the current A300/310 facilities will be extensively modernized to house the A350 (Airbus is, afterall, touting that the A350 is 90% new).

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 38):
Airbus has most likely tried to push A340s sales with that policy for a longer time.

It's certainly true that the A340 has always had a lower price tag than the 777. And they've certainly tried to package the aircraft with other models (with varying degrees of success). However, the cash-back for fuel proposal is just that - a proposal. So far, there is no evidence that Airbus has actually put this into practice. After all, it could possibly have a severe domino-effect that could potentially cost Airbus millions.

What Airbus has done to help A340 sales, besides the above, is guarantee residual value, with the manufacturer covering the difference.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
Yes, EK switched from A340 to 777F.

Huh?  confused  After operating the A340-500 for two years, they order exact same number of 777-200LR's, it's direct competitor. Meanwhile, after operating the 777-300ER for a year, they indefinitely delay the delivery of the A340-600HGW, once again it's direct competitor. Even the most die-hard of Airbus cheerleaders must recognize a problem with this line.

The 777-200F was ordered for EK's cargo ops. So I really don't see your point. . .

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
If they're interested in the A380, then one may offer them some A340s with it.

I'm sure they've tried. However, AFAIK, only 2 carriers have ordered the A340 in conjunction with the A380 - Etihad and Qatar.


Regards,

Hamlet69
Honor the warriors, not the war.
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 3:59 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
Proof? With three years backlog?

There have been major order battles over the last months - do you seriously think that Airbus - well aware of having an inferior product - has not tried hard to sell the A340?

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
Yes, EK switched from A340 to 777F.

Your attempt to be funny can't nebulize the fact that EK placed a huge B777 order (including the B77W), delayed the A346 and told Airbus to improve its product. But it's unlikely Airbus will be able to beat the B77W's performance (as Boeing won't rest in the next years), so EK will probably convert the order to another type or cancel.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
If they're interested in the A380, then one may offer them some A340s with it.

And which possible A380 customers would be interested in the A340-500/600?

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
The line only needs to be kept busy until the A350 arrives.

An aircraft which doesn't compete with the B777-300ER.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
I think Airbus is more concerned about profit (iow to keep their production line busy) then in silencing the B boys on a.net.

Offering attractive A340/A380 packages won't help to make big profits. And the A350 won't turn into a cash cow easily regarding its strong competition.


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
boeing767-300
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:09 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 39):
Yes, EK switched from A340 to 777F

No Thorben I think you will find that Emirates switched to 77W (26 ordered Paris 2003) after initially claiming that the 77W could not handle the hot conditions at Dubai with a full load etc. History now tells us that the A346 under delivered and the 77W over delivered on promises. The net result of that is EK now have 54 77W on order and still no A346 and wishing to defer them. If that is not switching from A340 to 777 I don't know what is.

This topic seems to be hard for the A camp to accept. I can only put it down to Airbus rushing out the A346 too quick. We had a A346 initially with lower MTOW (CX) and heavier wings and then the IGW model and newer lighter wings and then talk of and enhanced model (A346E). Meanwhile the 77W has cleaned out the A346 and the lesson for everybody to learn is better to Under promise and over deliver than over promise and under deliver

The Trent 500/A346 is a disappointment the result of which is Airlines are looking with a little skepticism towards Airbus claims.
 
Thorben
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:18 pm

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 40):
They do. However, the fact that the current 777 backlog is greater than the A330/340 backlog combined probably is a little worrisome to Airbus.

Is it really bigger? Do you have numbers? Besides, with a backlog of around three years, would there be any sense in panic sales just to have a larger backlog than Boeing?

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 40):
Has this been confirmed yet? I've heard both scenarios - one that Airbus will build the A350 on the same line. The other that the current A300/310 facilities will be extensively modernized to house the A350 (Airbus is, afterall, touting that the A350 is 90% new).

That is interesting. Does anybody know?

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 40):
Huh? After operating the A340-500 for two years, they order exact same number of 777-200LR's, it's direct competitor.

According to an interview with their CEO, none of the A345s will leave, the 772LRs will be used on even longer routes. (SFO, EZE, GIG?)

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 40):
The 777-200F was ordered for EK's cargo ops. So I really don't see your point. . .

The point is that there is no direct Airbus competitor who was beaten.

Quoting Hamlet69 (Reply 40):
I'm sure they've tried. However, AFAIK, only 2 carriers have ordered the A340 in conjunction with the A380 - Etihad and Qatar.

TG? VS? LH?

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
There have been major order battles over the last months - do you seriously think that Airbus - well aware of having an inferior product - has not tried hard to sell the A340?

I think they rather have profit-making A330s in their line than low-price A340s just in order to sell A340s. They're after profit, not market-share.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
Your attempt to be funny can't nebulize the fact that EK placed a huge B777 order (including the B77W), delayed the A346 and told Airbus to improve its product. But it's unlikely Airbus will be able to beat the B77W's performance (as Boeing won't rest in the next years), so EK will probably convert the order to another type or cancel.

Maybe twenty A380s?

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
And which possible A380 customers would be interested in the A340-500/600?

All who don't have the 777NG.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
An aircraft which doesn't compete with the B777-300ER.

Again, prestige or market-share are not the purpose of the business.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
Offering attractive A340/A380 packages won't help to make big profits.

Interesting insight you have there.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 41):
And the A350 won't turn into a cash cow easily regarding its strong competition.

The whole business is not "easy". What's your point?

Quoting Boeing767-300 (Reply 42):
the lesson for everybody to learn is better to Under promise and over deliver than over promise and under deliver

Honestly, you're re-inventing the wheel here.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
Hamlet69
Posts: 2468
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 2:45 am

RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:53 pm

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
Do you have numbers?

A330 = 172
A340 = 72

777 = 271

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
According to an interview with their CEO, none of the A345s will leave

I never said they were, and that wasn't the point I was making. The point was that, after 2 years of service, instead of ordering more of the same aircraft they already had in their fleet, they chose the direct competitor.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
The point is that there is no direct Airbus competitor who was beaten.

So you are highlighting the 772F to claim that Airbus wasn't beaten in this order, at the same time completely ignoring the 772LR and 773ER order?

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
TG? VS? LH?

None of whom ordered their A340's and A380's at the same time. Therefore, these were not package deals in the sense that you were trying to argue. Commonality? Yes.


Regards,

Hamlet69
Honor the warriors, not the war.
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: How Many A340-600 Currently On Order?

Fri Apr 14, 2006 4:59 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
The point is that there is no direct Airbus competitor who was beaten.

Sure - if you just focus at the few freighters and totally ignore the pax versions.  Yeah sure

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
TG? VS? LH?

See above.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
I think they rather have profit-making A330s in their line than low-price A340s just in order to sell A340s. They're after profit, not market-share.

So you actually suggest Airbus has to sell low-priced A340s if they want to sell any? That is a contradiction to what you have said earlier all the time...

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
Maybe twenty A380s?

If they give away the A380 for the price of the A340, maybe.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
All who don't have the 777NG.

There aren't many A380 candidates which don't have B777s in their fleets...

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
Again, prestige or market-share are not the purpose of the business.

But winning market share in the large widebody segment can be very profitable ...and Boeing doesn't have any problems in selling its most expensive jets.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
Interesting insight you have there.

Both A340 and A380 haven't sold in high numbers recently - how can they achieve big profits with both models then?

Quoting Thorben (Reply 43):
The whole business is not "easy". What's your point?

My point is that the A350 won't necessarily turn into a cash cow - we all know which model has been - clearly - preferred in that segment.


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!