FrontierMan
Topic Author
Posts: 384
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 6:19 am

Predatory Practices.

Sun Jun 11, 2000 9:38 am

This is an extremely sensitive subject. I believe that you will see more DOJ cases is large airlines merge. Bigger airlines and more assets make it easier to compete in predatory practices. Small Start-up airlines are forced with an unfair fight because larger airlines price their services below cost. Those prices make it a low-profit or no-profit situation for the smaller airline. Although if we look back at airline history, we see some low-fare airlines pricing their services below cost, we still see major airlines slashing fares and unleashing hoards of capacity just to compete with a start-up airline. Sometimes they bring in lower-paid staff(aka "United Shuttle"). Airlines are getting very creative with predatory practices.
I believe that American got nailed with a settlement for Vanguard for predatory practicing in the DFW area. I know United is getting sued from Frontier for their predatory practices. I think Spirit is suing Northwest also. Well, does anyone know of any other cases that are arising from predatory practices, and if so what are your opinions on Predatory Practices?
 
Seattle Ops
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 1999 7:35 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Sun Jun 11, 2000 2:35 pm

Does Sam Addoms teach all F9 employee how to whine?
 
FrontierMan
Topic Author
Posts: 384
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 6:19 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Sun Jun 11, 2000 10:06 pm

Hey that was pretty funny. Monopoly court is not whining. Just ask American how much a laughing matter Monopoly court really is.
 
BH346
Posts: 3164
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2000 5:50 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 12:33 am

AA has its own site about AA and Predatory Practices. I guess the site's meaning is to say that they were just competing. http://www.aadoj.com
It talks a lot about Vanguard in the part called "Kansas Information" I am from Wichita, and AA got Vanguard out of here a while ago. You can find out more about it there.
BH346
Northwest Airlines - Some People Just Know How to Fly
 
Seattle Ops
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 1999 7:35 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 12:40 am

Frontier: "WE LOVE TO WHINE, AND IT SHOWS"
 
DSMav8r
Posts: 575
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 2:32 pm

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 2:07 am

It has nothing to do with whining. I have seen 3 airlines in a span of 2 years get run out of DSM. Vanguard, AirTran and AccessAir. The predator in DSM is not AA, but UA. Competition is one thing, but slashing prices to the point that UA is *losing* $$ on the route is another.

Don't get me wrong, its nice flying one-way to ORD on a 757 for $74. But once the "intruder" gets ran out, the price jumps to $600 on a 737-200 one-way, hmmm.........
To most people, the sky is the limit. To those who love aviation, the sky is home
 
Samurai 777
Posts: 2000
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 2:56 pm

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 3:27 am

No wonder WestJet wanted to fly to YHM (Hamilton, ON) instead of YYZ! Because if it didn't, Air Canada would've really attacked it! Smart move for WestJet.
 
tritanic
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 8:12 pm

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 5:13 am

Well no offense, and I know starting up a new airline is near impossible, as well as not profitable. Trust me when I say AirTran some months have been known to sell off parts just to make rent. I will say this I would never ever think about opening up a small grocery store, or a hardware store right next to a WALMART!!!!!
 
FrontierMan
Topic Author
Posts: 384
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 6:19 am

Seattle Ops

Mon Jun 12, 2000 5:16 am

I'll tell you who's really going to be whining, It's going to be the consumer when they have to pay 600 dollar fares to go somewhere.
 
tritanic
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 8:12 pm

RE: Seattle Ops

Mon Jun 12, 2000 5:30 am

Ok FrontierMan, let's get serious. Is it fare for a new airline to cruise into an airport and introduce fares that are absolutely UNPROFITABLE!!! When your dollar per seat mile is costing you up to two times what the passenger is paying you are not using sensible business sense!!! Just take a look at AirTran, the fares have risen every year in operation. They allocate fewer discount fare seats than ever. They put in a First Class on there flights!!!! They are not a discount airline they want to be one of the bigboys!!!!! So is it fare for an airline to come in as a "discount" airline, and the real intentions are to actually make a profit!!!!, like the big boys!!! Let's not sugar coat this, operating an airline is far, far, from cheap, and those 600.00 seats you are talking about are a gamble on behalf of the airline. They sell them usually for the same day business guy, but you can bet it's definitely a gamble!!!
 
Seattle Ops
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 1999 7:35 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 11:50 am

Frontier: "Something whining in the sky"
 
FrontierMan
Topic Author
Posts: 384
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 6:19 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 10:03 pm

Boy Seattle OPs you are really displaying some maturity. Dominant airlines slash their fares below cost at the competing airline's destinations, and then raise prices where there is no competition. Forcing other customers to pay sky high prices. So call it whining if you will. When you run into a 400 dollar fare to fly from Shenendoah Valley to Dulles. I don't want to hear you complain, because you'll know why it's happening.
 
AAR90
Posts: 3140
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2000 11:51 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Mon Jun 12, 2000 11:25 pm

Frontierman, suggest you take a few beginning economics classes in college followed by a couple of beginning law courses. You'll find supply and demand set the prices and _matching_ a competitor's price is, by definintion, not a "predatory" practice no matter what your costs to produce the product. If you believe otherwise, you are saying SEARS can not sell the same product for the same price as WALMART. Sorry but capitalism and free markets don't work that way.

FYI, I own/operate a $1.5 million/year business and all of my products pricing is set by my numerous competitors. I'd prefer the prices to be higher, but the marketplace sets the price. Some I lose money on, but I have to sell at that price to keep my customers.

Reality is sometimes tough.

*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
 
Seattle Ops
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 1999 7:35 am

RE: Predatory Practices.

Tue Jun 13, 2000 1:16 am

I was out in my ops truck checking some lights, very carefully clear of incoming flights.Out in the rain with my earmuffs on tight,the sound of those jets can cause quite a fright!The roar of the engines on a seven twenty seven, a Dash eight's props feathering then reving and reving.Then all of a sudden a noise had me puzzled, what was this strange airplane that had me befuddled?It could best be described as a sickening WHINE, so I looked and I looked could it be DC-9?Then I finally discovered who had made such a wail, for it had a bald eagle, right on its tail!

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