DCAYOW
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UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 3:57 am

During the ill-fated merger process of United and USAirways, United indicated that 29 new daily international nonstop flights would be created. I have been trying to do research to find out what these proposed flights were. The UA website doesn't have any of that information anymore (used to have a route map showing the additional new flights). I also checked airliners.net archives, but could only find the ones I have listed below...

Does anyone have the complete list they can share? Many thanks DCAYOW

I know they proposed the following:

1) BOS-NRT
2) IAD-CPH
3) DEN-LGW
4) IAD-LHR (daylight)

I am at a loss for the others...

29 new daily non-stop international flights.
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Avianca
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:03 am

Quoting DCAYOW (Thread starter):
4) IAD-LHR (daylight)

at least this flight is currently operating under UA-922 with B763.

regards
Avianca
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:33 am

I was so gung-ho on this for the year-and-a-half this behemoth was supposed to take place. They were 64 round-trip domestic routes and 29 international routes, some of which took place anyway with US or UA.

Domestic
BOS-SEA
BOS-SAN
BOS-SNA
CLT-PDX
CLT-AUS
CLT-SAT
CLT-SJC
DEN-RDU
DEN-FLL
LAX-TPA
PHL-PDX
PHL-SJC
PHL-SNA
PIT-SJC
PIT-PDX
SFO-RDU
SFO-TPA
IAD-SNA

International
BOS-NRT
BOS-FRA
CLT-AUA
CLT-BGI
CLT-SXM
DEN-LGW
IAD-CPH
IAD-STT

Those are all the ones I can think of off the top of my head. Most of the domestic flights were connecting the transcon dots on US Airways' network. Others were jumping on AA's turf. The international flights were additional frequencies and some new cities, all of which, except DEN-LGW and BOS-NRT were started by UA or US recently anyway.
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steeler83
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:33 am

What about additional european routes from PIT; UA agreed that if UA was to merge with US, they would keep their hub in PIT and add more mx there...

Although I am sure that whatever int'l route was added would not have lasted and the statement about the hub remaining in PIT is moot; US closed it in November 2004 and another hub for PIT is not in the cards any time soon, if ever...
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:40 am

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 3):
What about additional european routes from PIT; UA agreed that if UA was to merge with US, they would keep their hub in PIT and add more mx there...

Although I am sure that whatever int'l route was added would not have lasted and the statement about the hub remaining in PIT is moot; US closed it in November 2004 and another hub for PIT is not in the cards any time soon, if ever...

Ironically, there were no international nonstops to be added as a result of the merger here in PIT. UA was going to run one-stops to PEK, HKG, KIX, NRT, and SYD from PIT with 747s going through the hubs (SFO, ORD, LAX, etc). They also agreed to build a new maintenance hangar. Also, in another twist, the very routes UA pledged to add (PIT-SJC, PIT-PDX) were announced by US to start in late 2001/early 2002 and were cancelled because of 9/11 and the suspension of A321 deliveries. I remember asking a ticket agent in PIT about the SAT and PDX inaugural runs in March 2002 and he said they'd been suspended indefinitely. Scary stuff.
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ERJ170
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:47 am

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 2):
DEN-RDU



Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 2):
SFO-RDU

Can we say 2 long overdue routes?
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:52 am

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 5):
Can we say 2 long overdue routes?

And they were mainline, at that. Just shows how far the business has fallen since early 2000. If UA had purchased US, they would have liquidated by now. There is no doubt after 9/11, SARS, and the current fuel crisis that UA would not be here if they had been able to purchase US. That simple.
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steeler83
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:00 am

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 4):
Ironically, there were no international nonstops to be added as a result of the merger here in PIT. UA was going to run one-stops to PEK, HKG, KIX, NRT, and SYD from PIT with 747s going through the hubs (SFO, ORD, LAX, etc). They also agreed to build a new maintenance hangar. Also, in another twist, the very routes UA pledged to add (PIT-SJC, PIT-PDX) were announced by US to start in late 2001/early 2002 and were cancelled because of 9/11 and the suspension of A321 deliveries. I remember asking a ticket agent in PIT about the SAT and PDX inaugural runs in March 2002 and he said they'd been suspended indefinitely. Scary stuff.

So that would have been direct heavy runs though with stops at their west coast hubs. That would have been sweet if that would have happened... So basically what that would have been were 747s from PIT-SFO, and LAX? Would that also have been one to ORD despite the considerably short distance between the two markets? Do you suppose that any of those would have been changed to 777 equipment? The latter is probably a very difficult question to answer... I cannot get over how hard-hit the airline industry was after 9-11. It was already dwindling somewhat just before 9-11 from what others were saying in their posts, and then that God-awful day happened...
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:09 am

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 7):
So that would have been direct heavy runs though with stops at their west coast hubs. That would have been sweet if that would have happened... So basically what that would have been were 747s from PIT-SFO, and LAX? Would that also have been one to ORD despite the considerably short distance between the two markets? Do you suppose that any of those would have been changed to 777 equipment? The latter is probably a very difficult question to answer... I cannot get over how hard-hit the airline industry was after 9-11. It was already dwindling somewhat just before 9-11 from what others were saying in their posts, and then that God-awful day happened...

That's correct. UA ran widebodies through their hubs as tag-ons of their prime international routes. So you'd have DEN-NRT one-stop with a 777 from SFO or LAX to DEN. I don't know how often UA does this now, but when I visited ORD in 2003, they were still doing it. Sure, there was always a possiblity of an aircraft swap. You and me both, brother. I would've been a reservation sales agent for either AA or US had 9/11 not happened. I'm sure of it. I then could've transferred to gate anywhere in the world with AA or US.

Yeah, that would've been quite a sight from Concourse C with all those widebodies here. The closest we ever get to that now is when IAD or JFK is socked in with fog and everything has to divert here.
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:12 am

Some of the other routes announced along with the merger:

PHL-AMS
PHL-BRU
PHL-YVR
IAD-BDA

I have one of those route maps the thread starter mentioned. I also still have a printed copy of the press release announcing the merger from ual.com dated 5/24/2000.
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:14 am

Given that UA has disposed of several slot pairs at LHR over the last couple of years (Sold and leased), would we have seen any of US's LGW flights move to LHR? I can think that BWI and possibly PIT could have switched under Bermuda II, but that CLT would have had to stay at LGW, along with proposed DEN flight.
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:28 am

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 10):
Given that UA has disposed of several slot pairs at LHR over the last couple of years (Sold and leased), would we have seen any of US's LGW flights move to LHR? I can think that BWI and possibly PIT could have switched under Bermuda II, but that CLT would have had to stay at LGW, along with proposed DEN flight.

US didn't fly BWI-LGW in 2000. It was dropped in 1993, when USAir and BA first started codesharing flights. US gave up their US-UK flying rights to begin codeshare service with BA.
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PSA727
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 5:49 am

This denied merger by the Feds was actually a blessing in
disguise for USAirways.

After 9/11, look what happed to the remnants of TW and its
employees with American Airlines.
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rwsea
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 6:09 am

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 8):
That's correct. UA ran widebodies through their hubs as tag-ons of their prime international routes. So you'd have DEN-NRT one-stop with a 777 from SFO or LAX to DEN. I don't know how often UA does this now, but when I visited ORD in 2003, they were still doing it.

They're still doing it to an extent. The SEA-NRT flight continues to DEN on a 777.
 
vega
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 6:12 am

Quoting PSA727 (Reply 12):
This denied merger by the Feds was actually a blessing in
disguise for USAirways.

AND to PHL, which would likely have been relegated to an IAD tag-on for international access.
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Continental
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:01 pm

US in BRU!? Awesome!
 
PSA727
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:07 pm

Quoting Continental (Reply 15):
US in BRU!? Awesome

US was in BRU, from May 2001 unitl Jan 2002.
fly high, pay low...Germanwings!
 
looneytoon
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:37 pm

correct me if I am wrong, but US and UA merged?
LooneyToon
 
md90fan
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:49 pm

Quoting LooneyToon (Reply 17):
correct me if I am wrong, but US and UA merged?

No. It was blocked my friend, but they (US) have since merged with HP  Smile

Regards,
MD90fan  airplane 
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looneytoon
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:53 pm

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 18):
(US) have since merged with HP Smile

oh, that I knew. I just thougt I read wrong, and couldnt believe what I saw!

thanks
LooneyToon
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Sun Apr 23, 2006 11:11 pm

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 11):
US didn't fly BWI-LGW in 2000. It was dropped in 1993, when USAir and BA first started codesharing flights. US gave up their US-UK flying rights to begin codeshare service with BA.

Don't know why I was thinking of BWI, when I in fact meant PHL.
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:29 am

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 20):
Don't know why I was thinking of BWI, when I in fact meant PHL.

Actually, UA only sold off the slots to EWR and BOS in 2003. They went to BA in a silent bid. PHL would've been a perfect fit for LHR, if not for Bermuda II. PIT and CLT are simply too small to warrant service there by a US carrier.
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787kq
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:53 am

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 2):
International
BOS-NRT
BOS-FRA
CLT-AUA
CLT-BGI
CLT-SXM
DEN-LGW
IAD-CPH
IAD-STT

IAD to STT is not an international flight.
 
steeler83
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:19 am

Quoting 787KQ (Reply 22):
IAD to STT is not an international flight.

What airport is STT? I can't seem to be able to identify it...
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Mikey711MN
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:44 am

There was a pretty extensive website that touted the supposed benefits of the merger that included a map of new routes. I wish I could remember the URL of it, so I'd look it up on web archives and see if those images were saved.

All in all as I recall it was pretty interesting reading, if only to be undone (and rightly so) by the DOJ in the end.

-Mike
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:12 am

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 23):
What airport is STT? I can't seem to be able to identify it...

St. Thomas, US Virgin Islands.

Quoting 787KQ (Reply 22):
IAD to STT is not an international flight.

UA seemed to. It was off the map the thread poster mentioned.
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:49 am

Here are the nonstops, taken directly from the route map the intial poster mentioned.

Domestic
BWI-SEA
BOS-SAN
BOS-SJC
BOS-SEA
CLT-AUS
CLT-SAT
CLT-PDX
DEN-PBI
DEN-RDU
PHL-SJC
PHL-SNA
PHL-PDX
PIT-PDX
PIT-SJC
SFO-FLL
SFO-RDU
SFO-TPA
IAD-SNA
International
BOS-NRT
BOS-FRA
CLT-AUA
CLT-BGI
DEN-LGW
JFK-FRA
PHL-AMS
PHL-BGI
PHL-BRU
PHL-YVR
IAD-BDA
IAD-CPH
IAD-SJU
IAD-SXM

Go to archive.org, and type in United Airlines, and you will be able to pull up the route maps. Click on United-US Airways and then combined route maps. That will take you right to the page.
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steeler83
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:20 pm

What kind of equipment would have been used from PHL and PIT to SJC and PDX, A320 or 757 equipment?
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USPIT10L
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RE: UA/US Merger = 29 New Intl Flts

Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:59 pm

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 27):
What kind of equipment would have been used from PHL and PIT to SJC and PDX, A320 or 757 equipment?

There's no way of knowing. The service was never loaded into any res system. It was just speculation/hearsay. I've never seen a grander scheme fall apart so quickly. All the things UA promised to do would've put them further in the red, not to mention liquidation knowing the world events ahead.
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