leelaw
Posts: 4520
Joined: Sat May 29, 2004 4:13 pm

Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Mon May 01, 2006 6:27 pm

The electronic edition of this week's (5/2/06) Flight International is reporting that Tim Clark says Airbus faces "huge hurdles" to meets it April 2007 target to deliver the first Engine Alliance-GP7200 powered A380, of which EK is the launch operator. "I dont believe for a moment it won't be tough," said Clark. "So far, it's so good, but cabin integration is an enourmous challenge. If it is looking to go beyond that time we have asked them to be as candid as possible with us. But nothing would surprise us."

Last week EK confirmed that senior managers had visited Toulouse in April and "they confirmed we will receive our A380 in mid-April." Publicly Airbus will only commit to a "second quarter" delivery for the first EK aircraft.
Lex Ancilla Justitiae
 
Sinlock
Posts: 1631
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:55 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Mon May 01, 2006 11:27 pm

It's going to a very large task. Being that a GP-7200 powered A380 hasn't even flown yet.

The thing that I wounder is who's mainly at fault. Is it Engine Alliance or Airbus? I've read that the main issue is unseen problems getting the engines integrated. What hasn't really been covered is who's side the Tech issues are on.
Well who ever is at fault will surly have some major penalty's.
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Mon May 01, 2006 11:30 pm

what was the original time frame for testing of a GP-powered example?
 
User avatar
PM
Posts: 4820
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:05 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 12:47 am

Quoting Sinlock (Reply 1):
I've read that the main issue is unseen problems getting the engines integrated.

I'm no engineer but I can't understand why it would be harder (if it is) integrating the GP7200 than the Trent 900. Any answers?
 
airfrnt
Posts: 1993
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2004 2:05 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 1:21 am

Quoting PM (Reply 3):

I'm no engineer but I can't understand why it would be harder (if it is) integrating the GP7200 than the Trent 900. Any answers?

Engine Alliance politically is a different beast then RR. That means that integration might be more difficult both poltically.

Random question, did Airbus ever state when they intended to start the GP tests?
 
RichardPrice
Posts: 4474
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2005 5:12 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 1:25 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 4):
Random question, did Airbus ever state when they intended to start the GP tests?

The engines were hung on the airframe in February, so its got to be soon I think. While not being an aerospace engineer, I would highly doubt it would be a hard task to certify just an engine in 9 months.
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 9757
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 5):
I would highly doubt it would be a hard task to certify just an engine in 9 months.

The FAA granted the engine its certification on 29 December 2005.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
RichardPrice
Posts: 4474
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2005 5:12 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 1:46 am

Quoting Zeke (Reply 6):
The FAA granted the engine its certification on 29 December 2005.

I meant internally - time from the RR engines being hung on the airframe to first flight was around 4 months, so this could be similiar.
 
tockeyhockey
Posts: 880
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 10:57 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 4:56 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 4):
Engine Alliance politically is a different beast then RR. That means that integration might be more difficult both poltically.

what does politics have to do with engines being hung on a wing?
 
OldAeroGuy
Posts: 3185
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:50 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 5:28 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 5):
The engines were hung on the airframe in February, so its got to be soon I think. While not being an aerospace engineer, I would highly doubt it would be a hard task to certify just an engine in 9 months.

It's the airframe/engine combination that has to be certified. This will entail re-doing a number of the test conditions performed for the Trent 900 A380 certification.

However, there will be addition flowtime because the EK interior must also be certified before the airplane can be delivered. After all, individual airline interiors were given as the primary cause for the late delivery to SQ.
Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
 
RichardPrice
Posts: 4474
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2005 5:12 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 5:40 am

Quoting OldAeroGuy (Reply 9):
It's the airframe/engine combination that has to be certified. This will entail re-doing a number of the test conditions performed for the Trent 900 A380 certification.

Yes but it certainly doesnt mean the same amount of time the RR engines have been flying, and thats only just a year now.

With more than one airframe for EK currently completed, the interior and the engine certifications can be done in tandem.

Its just under a year until the deadline EK have publically stated, so I dont think we need to engage in any rumour mongering just yet.
 
leelaw
Posts: 4520
Joined: Sat May 29, 2004 4:13 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 5:59 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 10):
With more than one airframe for EK currently completed, the interior and the engine certifications can be done in tandem.

No airframe slated for delivery to EK is part of the flight-test program, MSN002, 004, 007, 009 will all be delivered to Etihad. MSN007 & 009 will be re-engined to Roll-Royce before delivery. Oddly, 007 starts off with RR, with a switch to GP this summer, and switch back to RR before delivery to Etihad.
Lex Ancilla Justitiae
 
OldAeroGuy
Posts: 3185
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:50 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 6:06 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 10):
With more than one airframe for EK currently completed, the interior and the engine certifications can be done in tandem.

Without the airframe/engine combination in the Type Certification Data Sheet, Interior certification can be difficult to achieve. It is not a given they can be done in parallel.

Engine failure conditions can induce loads in interior fittings that must be accounted for in their certification.
Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
 
A319XFW
Posts: 1519
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 5:41 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 6:06 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 10):
With more than one airframe for EK currently completed, the interior and the engine certifications can be done in tandem.

The problem is, the cabin has to be installed first - so it'll be something like fly to XFW, fit cabin and then do engine and cabin trials (if they weren't done before the ferry to XFW).
 
RichardPrice
Posts: 4474
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2005 5:12 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 6:08 am

Quoting OldAeroGuy (Reply 12):



Quoting A319XFW (Reply 13):

Ahh thats true, sorry for my lack of understanding  Smile
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 6:20 am

so I dont think we need to engage in any rumour mongering just yet.

Hardly a rumor, as it comes from the mouth of the CEO whos airline we are talking about.
 
StarGoldLHR
Posts: 1346
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 1:29 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 6:27 am

All these rumours...

it's a sign of everyones excited impatience !

Come on Airbus..
So far in 2008 45 flights and Gold already. JFK, IAD, LGA, SIN, HKG, NRT, AKL, PPT, LAX still to book ! Home Airport LCY
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13730
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: Clark: "Huge Hurdles" For Timely GP Powered A380

Tue May 02, 2006 7:08 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 15):
Hardly a rumor, as it comes from the mouth of the CEO whos airline we are talking about.

Yeah, but Clark is one of the most vocal, manipulative CEOs out there. I've never seen one guy so loud about so many things, making so many demands publicly. I know he controls a lot of lucrative orders, but it's getting kind of ridiculous.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.