highpeaklad
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Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:25 am

I've just noticed that Delta are changing to a 767-200 for their MAN-ATL flights for the summer (DL64/65) . Do they have many 767-200's left and are they used on other long haul routes?

Chris
Don't try to keep up with the Joneses - bring them down to your level !
 
gkirk
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:28 am

I thought all their 762s had now left the fleet?
Although Amadeus does show:
Delta Air Lines
DL 65
Manchester Int'l (MAN), Manchester, United Kingdom
Terminal 2 11:55

William B Hartsfield (ATL), Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Terminal S 16:05
Non-stop
762 9h10min Daily
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
highpeaklad
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:32 am

You're quick off the mark!

I was looking at www.delta.com at prices for July and saw this and thought it was a mistake, but checked the seats available and the seat map definately said 767-200 , and the layout is shorter than the 767-300 so I presume its right.

Chris

P.S. How was Blackpool?
Don't try to keep up with the Joneses - bring them down to your level !
 
ramerinianair
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:39 am

There is an internal notation for DL's 767s
767 is the 763ER
763 is the domestic 763 not ER
762 are the ex-gulf air 763ERs
SR
W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:41 am

Are the ex Gulf-Air 3P6s and the ex Continental(NTU) -324 configured the same?
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
highpeaklad
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:54 am

Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 3):
762 are the ex-gulf air 763ERs

Looking again at the seat plan this does seem the most likely explanation as there is an exit door shown at the back of the business class section. It is confusing though as the seats available map has a heading marked 767-200, although when you check against the seat plan section, it doesn't actually correspond with any of the diagrams shown there.


Chris
Don't try to keep up with the Joneses - bring them down to your level !
 
scott0305
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:18 am

Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 3):
762 are the ex-gulf air 763ERs

Most rediculous thing I ever heard. Are they TRYING to confuse people?
 
A342
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:30 am

Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 3):
There is an internal notation for DL's 767s
767 is the 763ER
763 is the domestic 763 not ER
762 are the ex-gulf air 763ERs

So what is the 767-200 and the 767-400ER ?
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
jbmitt
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:32 am

The 767-200 is no longer flown by Delta. Go read the topic about the Spirit of DELTA retiring. She was the last one.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:43 am

Quoting A342 (Reply 7):
So what is the 767-200

Gone.

Quoting A342 (Reply 7):
and the 767-400ER ?

764, obviously.
 
A342
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:52 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 9):

OK, so what used to be the 767-200 ? And I asked about the 767-400ER because I, like Scott0305, couldn't believe that belive that DL calls its aircraft in such a confusing, maybe even stupid way.
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:55 am

Quoting A342 (Reply 10):
OK, so what used to be the 767-200 ?

767, simple as that.

Quoting A342 (Reply 10):
And I asked about the 767-400ER because I, like Scott0305, couldn't believe that belive that DL calls its aircraft in such a confusing, maybe even stupid way.

You mean like CO calls their BizE-configured 757-200s 756s?
Might appear stupid, but it certainly makes it easier for a customer to tell what plane to expect. BizE yes or no, how many rows, that was often just a guess when 763 was the code for all of those flights. With 763, 762 and 767 it is clearer now.
 
LHR777
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:01 am

Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 3):
767 is the 763ER



Quoting A342 (Reply 10):
OK, so what used to be the 767-200 ?



Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 11):
767, simple as that.

Ok, so which is it to be? 767 = 763ER or 767-200? Of course, I'm aware the 767-200 is no more at DL. But whilst it was there, what was it's 'internal' designator?
 
A342
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:05 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 11):
Quoting A342 (Reply 10):
OK, so what used to be the 767-200 ?

767, simple as that.



Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 3):
767 is the 763ER

???

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 11):
You mean like CO calls their BizE-configured 757-200s 756s?
Might appear stupid, but it certainly makes it easier for a customer to tell what plane to expect. BizE yes or no, how many rows, that was often just a guess when 763 was the code for all of those flights. With 763, 762 and 767 it is clearer now.

Maybe for a frequent traveller with the particular airline, but for everyone else it's confusing.

Why not make it simple and call it 752BizE ?
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:13 am

Let's make it veeeery easy to understand:
The 767-200 is gone from DL's fleet, so the 3-letter codes "762" and "767" are officially free.
Now, DL had the problem that travellers were often unsure as to what kind of "763" they were on. Would the get a domestic 767-300? Would they get one of DL's own 767-300ERs? Or perhaps one of the differently configured 767-300ERs formerly operated by Gulf Air?
Realising this, DL came to the conclusion that the best way to assure pax of what plane they would be on was to have different 3-letter codes for the different models. So the new lettering was introduced:
The 767-300 got to stay as the "763", as it is the baseline model of the family.
The ex-GF 767-300ERs got the code "762", and DL's own 767-300ERs have been assigned the code "767".
 
777gk
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:21 am

Couple things,

Our internal designations are not very confusing, here are relevant 757 codes:

757: Domestic 757-200 configuration (24/159, on the way out)
75B: BusinessFirst 757-200 (16/156, no winglets)
75L: 757-300
75E: BusinessFirst 757-200 (16/156, soon to be 16/159, winglets)

There is no '756', correct me if I'm wrong, but that may be a Northwest designation.

BusinessElite is a Delta product, BusinessFirst is the correct Continental terminology, but nobody else really gives a shit, so neither do I.
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:26 am

I wonder, will Delta come up with a new code for the five 767-400ERs that will be configured with BusinessElite?
The Pink Delta 767-400ER - The most beautiful aircraft in the sky
 
DeltaWings
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 4:30 am

They confuse you like Alitalia. They have "764" for a differently configured 767-300
Homer: Marge, it takes two to lie. One to lie and one to listen.
 
Evan767
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 5:05 am

Quoting Scott0305 (Reply 6):
Most rediculous thing I ever heard. Are they TRYING to confuse people?

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

Why are they doing this? Why can't they just say, 763ER (ex-Gulf Air) or 763ER or 763 domestic. This is crazy......
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
ramerinianair
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 5:17 am

Most people don't look in the schedules. DL.com posts the flights as 767-300 anyway. A lot of people don't know an A330 from a 767 so it's no big deal. For the people who do notice, they should know the difference. Not confusing at all.
SR
W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
 
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litz
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 6:07 am

Ok, even better, go look up the flight status for DL 65 on delta.com ...

Quote:
Flight Status
Flight 65
Departing City (Airport) Manchester (Manchester)
Departure Gate G1 (MAN)
Carrier Delta
Equipment Type Boeing 767-200
Arriving City (Airport) Atlanta (Hartsfield Atlanta Intl)
Arriving Gate E31 (ATL)
Flight Distance (miles) 4086

If that doesn't start confusing people, I don't know what else could do better ...

 Smile

(Maybe one of you DL folks can let the website folks know about this?)

- litz
 
OOer
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 6:19 am

Flight DL65 operating from MAN to ATL is a Boeing 767-300ER...it is not the usual one....it seats 30/170 instead of 36/163. Thats why it says 762, because it is a 767-300ER configured differently!
 
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litz
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 6:25 am

Sure it's a 767-300 ... and if you look at the seating chart, it's a 767-300.

However, the confusion is, as I pasted above, dl.com is listing the airplane type specifically as a "767-200".

They just need to update the website html for the equipment type to reflect the change from a 767-200 to 767-300 for the "762" and "767" equipment codes.

- litz
 
positiverate
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 6:31 am

While not related to this specific instance, when DL operated 762's out of the FRA hub in the mid 90's, did they operate scheduled service across the Atlantic with them? Or were they purely intra-Europe?
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 6:55 am

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 18):
Why are they doing this? Why can't they just say, 763ER (ex-Gulf Air) or 763ER or 763 domestic. This is crazy......

Because flight schedules require 3-letter codes, nothing more, nothing less.

Quoting Positiverate (Reply 23):
While not related to this specific instance, when DL operated 762's out of the FRA hub in the mid 90's, did they operate scheduled service across the Atlantic with them? Or were they purely intra-Europe?

Just intra-Europe, considering the non-ER 767-200 doesn't have transatlantic range, particularly not from FRA.
 
deltagator
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 7:08 am

Quoting Scott0305 (Reply 6):
Most rediculous thing I ever heard. Are they TRYING to confuse people?

No, most people don't know what they are flying on. Only geeks like us and frequent travellers would see a difference.

Quoting A342 (Reply 10):
And I asked about the 767-400ER because I, like Scott0305, couldn't believe that belive that DL calls its aircraft in such a confusing, maybe even stupid way.

All the 764s in the fleet are ER models IIRC so no need to call them anything else than 764.

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 11):
You mean like CO calls their BizE-configured 757-200s 756s?

Internal designation for pilot bids only I would think. The BizFirst 757 is called a 752 on their website. Now I see I stand corrected about the 756 internal thing but I do know the 752 is the BF configured 757 as I flew on one just a month or so ago.

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 18):
Why are they doing this? Why can't they just say, 763ER (ex-Gulf Air) or 763ER or 763 domestic. This is crazy......

Again, most people won't know the difference! Only geeks like us.

Quoting RamerinianAir (Reply 19):
For the people who do notice, they should know the difference.

Amen brother!
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
scott0305
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 7:23 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 25):
Quoting Scott0305 (Reply 6):
Most rediculous thing I ever heard. Are they TRYING to confuse people?

No, most people don't know what they are flying on. Only geeks like us and frequent travellers would see a difference.

All I'm saying is why can't they use a different 3 letter code and not one that is an industry standard for a different aircraft?

I agree that most people have no clue about this stuff but geeks like us can still be confused by this silliness.
 
deltagator
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 7:33 am

That's the airlines for you I suppose. I would hazard a guess that there is only a field for 3 numbers in the reservation system for plane code. I have no idea what stuff DL uses but it is most likely home grown and been used for some time when hard drive space was much more limited hence the 3 digit field. That's just a wild guess though. Perhaps someone on here works for Delta IT and can starighten us out.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
milesrich
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 11:05 am

Delta's 767-232's were never ETOPS qualified, and were operated in Domestic Service only, never trans Atlantic.
 
DeltaMIA
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 11:18 am

Quoting Milesrich (Reply 28):
Delta's 767-232's were never ETOPS qualified, and were operated in Domestic Service only, never trans Atlantic.

They were operated intra-Europe in the early-mid 1990's. DL needed additional capacity out of the FRA hub and sent a few over.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
teixeim
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 11:40 am

SO, what's the difference with the 767-300ERs DL acquired from Gulf Air?
 
FlyDeltaJets
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 1:02 pm

The Gulf Air 767's have three full sized exit doors, and they have 1600 series ship numbers and they have a little less seats.
The only valid opinions are those based in facts
 
NorthstarBoy
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 2:21 pm

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 31):
The Gulf Air 767's have three full sized exit doors, and they have 1600 series ship numbers and they have a little less seats.

they also carry 1500 ship numbers, my one 767-3P6 was ship 1506

as for the confusion issue, the system is to blame. the system is programmed to understand that a 767 is a 767-200 and a 763 is a 767-300, so when the website goes into pars and pulls up the flight information the user is requesting, it translates 767 as 767-200 because that's how the system defines 767. you'll also notice that on some websites the A330-200, A340-200, A340-500 and 600 are stated as "Airbus Jet" because the system hasn't been programmed to recognize 342, 332, 345 and 346 and thus assign them specific definitions, whereare 330 and 340 are recognized as the A330-300 and A340-300 and thus do have defiinitions in the system. try going into apollo and typing in "help 345" or "help 346" and see what you get.
Yes, I'd like to see airbus go under so Boeing can have their customers!
 
dl1011
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:39 pm

"The Gulf Air 767's have three full sized exit doors, and they have 1600 series ship numbers and they have a little less seats."

The Gulf Air 767's are the 1500 series a/c except 1521 which was an Asiana a/c. The Gulf Air a/c have non-FADEC CF6 powerplants and I can't remember what 1521 has on the pylons. I'm thinking a FADEC CF6 but I'm not sure.

The 1600 series a/c are not Gulf Air. They are CF6-80C2 FADEC powered.

The 767 fleet is VERY confusing. Think about it,
1) 767-200's with CF6-80A engines.
2) 767-300's, non ETOP's and ETOP's with CF6-80A, CF6-C2 non-FADEC, CF6-C2 FADEC and PW4000.
3) 767-400's with a different CF6-C2 FADEC engine.

Add in all the different door and overwing hatch configs plus steel brakes for some and carbon brakes for others and it's a flipping nightmare!

Oop's, almost forgot. Add in 2 or 3 different paint jobs.
 
lhrmaccoll
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Tue May 02, 2006 3:56 pm

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 27):
I would hazard a guess that there is only a field for 3 numbers in the reservation system for plane code

Yup.
 
RobertS975
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Wed May 03, 2006 3:30 am

For whatever reason, I do not believe that the ex-Gulf Air 767s have overhead air vents... you don't miss them till you don't have them!
 
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litz
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Wed May 03, 2006 4:15 am

The ex-ATA (I think) 757s are like that ... I don't do well on airplanes without that air blowing on me; it wasn't all that fun for a PHX-ATL run w/out it.

When I first pulled up the seating chart for the "new" 762, and saw the exit door 2L, it really threw me for a loop. It almost looks like a 757 that's grown a 2nd aisle. Or a 764 that someone squished to make it shorter ... (mind you, the 764 is actually one of these made longer but you get my drift)

 Smile

- litz
 
bond007
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Wed May 03, 2006 4:50 am

Quoting Scott0305 (Reply 26):
All I'm saying is why can't they use a different 3 letter code and not one that is an industry standard for a different aircraft?

That's the point exactly  Smile

Call it 75A, 75X whatever.


Jimbo
I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
 
DeltaGuy
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Wed May 03, 2006 9:24 am

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 31):
The Gulf Air 767's have three full sized exit doors, and they have 1600 series ship numbers and they have a little less seats.

And no air conditioning vents overhead. Very much hated by us hot-natured folks.

Well, since everyone is confused as to aircraft codes, why don't we just take it a step further and get off the 767 for a minute.

738 is the internal designation for the 737-800, but 73Q is the designation for the 738 Shuttle config.

757 is the internal designation for the 757-200, but 75K is the designation for the Song configuration.

733 was the internal desitignation for te 737-300, but 73G was the designation for the Germania glass cockpit 733s.

Just added that to throw in a little more confusion into the mix.
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
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litz
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Wed May 03, 2006 4:45 pm

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 38):
73G was the designation for the Germania glass cockpit 733s.

And, of course, 73G to most of the rest of the world is a 737-700 ...

(this stuff is like trying to interpret Greek spoken with a southeast US accent, written using a Swahili alphabet)

- litz
 
DeltaGuy
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RE: Delta 767-200 Transatlantic

Thu May 04, 2006 7:22 am

Quoting Litz (Reply 39):
And, of course, 73G to most of the rest of the world is a 737-700 ...

(this stuff is like trying to interpret Greek spoken with a southeast US accent, written using a Swahili alphabet)

LOL Won't argue with you there. And to think, this all started with someone asking if DL still flew 762's across the Pond. LOL
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan