atomother
Posts: 389
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 8:47 am

ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:25 am

Rumor going around seems to have a good chance of being legit.

59 a/c to fly routes for AA out of LAX and then the other 10 to be used in a 135 charter type thing.

Anyone in the business (or over 21 years old) heard about this?
 
DLKAPA
Posts: 7962
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:37 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:28 am

That'd be pretty cool, I guess they'd be flying under the American Connection banner then?

Tim you flyin for Expressjet now?
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:33 am

Quoting Atomother (Thread starter):
59 a/c to fly routes for AA out of LAX and then the other 10 to be used in a 135 charter type thing.

That would be a huge streach. I'm not sure how they'd mix the 121 - 135 fleet. Too many different regulations, manuals, training, Ops differences...etc, etc. etc.

I've only seen it a few times but I've heard of ExpressJet Europe being formed. I could see the planes going over there.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
DLKAPA
Posts: 7962
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:37 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
That would be a huge streach. I'm not sure how they'd mix the 121 - 135 fleet. Too many different regulations, manuals, training, Ops differences...etc, etc. etc.

Why couldn't they just be 121 charter?
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:38 am

That would be a HUGE boost in capacity for AA out of LAX... are we sure that their ready to deploy that kind of capacity???? I'd honestly even doubt if they have that many a/c deployed on the westcoast period.... However I'd love to see ExpressJet show Eagle how to run a regional airline... they need some lessons!
Why do I fly???
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 8:47 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 3):
Why couldn't they just be 121 charter?

Because Part 121 is for scheduled airlines. The regulations and guide lines the airlines fly under are very different.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
atomother
Posts: 389
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 8:47 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:02 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 1):
Tim you flyin for Expressjet now?

Negative... You live in the Sudan now?

ExpressJet would be nice. Not sure about the commute though, might go for it if I move to DC though. Might get a regular 9-5 job too. We shall see...
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:14 am

While I would not question AA switching things around for AE in LAX, absorbing a 59 aircraft operation would be out of the question.

59 aircraft operating 4-5 daily departures would equal 250-300 departures, something not AA, nor any other LAX airline could absorb with current facilities.

Matter of fact, AA will in the next two years loose its remote AE terminal and further down the road its entire maintenance base at LAX due to approved expansion work, so if anything I could see AA pull back AE ops at the airport, not expand them.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
jetdeltamsy
Posts: 2688
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2000 11:51 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:22 am

Entirely possible.

Eagle is expensive for AA. AA could farm out much of what Eagle flies for much lower rates than they are currently paying. Eagle currently flies on contract about 235 jets for AA. ExpressJet's 67 (?) jets that will become available at the end of their contract with CO could resplace upto..what...30% of Eagle's flying?

And the notion that AA would somehow lose control over quality should they farm out the flying is nonsense. AA is a very strong and well managed company. They wouldn't enter into any flying agreement that would be without minimum standards of performance required of the new feeder carrier. And besides, ExpressJet is an extremely well run feeder airline in its own right. They have excellent equipment (if you like ERJ's) and very well trained employees.

I think it might be a great fit for AA in its search to lower costs wherever possible.

AA is looking to cut costs $1 billion in the next 12 months. That won't come without some dramatic and out of the box thinking. I think anything is on the table right now.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:34 am

Wouldn't American's Scope Clause play a part in all this...?? They are limited to the number of seats that Eagle and Connection can fly.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
nwab787techops
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 7:57 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:35 am

If AA was going to put American Connection in LAX, it would be Trans States or Chautauqua. I know talk at CHQ that AMR was going to dump CHQ as American Connection airline and make it AE.

I don't know what express jet going to do with the A/C. 50 seat lift is cheap now and express jet's OPS are not. So, If it was me I would have gave them back to CO.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:44 am

Its only fair to point out that Arpey did just say in the Q1 confrence call that he was in favor of keeping eagle and their flying in house, he brought up a simple point that by farming out flying you have to pay another companies profiet... with eagle, the profiets stay inhouse with AMR... I do agree that MQ could learn a thing or two about how not to cancel flights and run an ontime operation, I don't think that that would be enough cause to add an extra 59 jets to the operation....
Why do I fly???
 
DLKAPA
Posts: 7962
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:37 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:46 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 5):
Because Part 121 is for scheduled airlines. The regulations and guide lines the airlines fly under are very different.

Tell that to ATA.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:50 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 12):
Tell that to ATA.

What does ATA have to do with American Eagle or American Connection...?
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:53 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 13):
What does ATA have to do with American Eagle or American Connection...?

I believe they were refering to the American Transport Association... not ATA Airlines
Why do I fly???
 
stirling
Posts: 3897
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:00 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:56 am

I just can't imagine what 60 RJs in LAX would be like!

First off, where would they schedule them to? Anywhere UA schedules X?
And then some?

I think there is more to this story that has yet to hit the fan, as it were.

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 7):

Just not gonna happen - LAX absorbing another 200-300 daily ops!....unless they turn Sepulveda into the new 18/36....and make the Radisson the new remote commuter terminal.
Delete this User
 
optionscle
Posts: 428
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:08 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:57 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
AA is looking to cut costs $1 billion in the next 12 months

Well one thing's for sure, they're NOT going to do that with ExpressJet. That's the reason that CO is partially dropping them, they're just too damn expensive!!! Continental told ExpressJet that their costs were too high and XJT refused to make the same cost cuts that every other airline - mainline and regional, alike - have had to make. XJT is a very safe and high quality regional carrier, there's no debating that, but there costs are too high with jet fuel at the price that it is. Only time will tell if ExpressJet can be successful without CO, but at this point in time, I don't see this being the right choice for AA.
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 10:08 am

When compared with flying MD80s, XJ's airplane trip costs are very favorable to AA's. I would hate to see AA pull a bunch more capacity from their system but the fact that they are parking MD80s during the peak summer season says they want alot less capacity in their system.

As for LAX, the remote parking observation is interesting but I'm sure if AA puts in more RJ flying, it won't be to the same destinations they serve now... RJs will be used to substantially increase AA's size in LAX. LAX is alot like BOS... no real dominant carrier and no one really pulling away from the pack. This could be AA's opportunity to do that.... move some 777s from elsewhere in their system (not sure how) and beef up the Pacific and make LAX much more of a hub operation.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 10:19 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 17):
I would hate to see AA pull a bunch more capacity from their system but the fact that they are parking MD80s during the peak summer season says they want alot less capacity in their system.

I think that it can't be refuted Less Capacity = higher fares, which Arpey went on record saying today that Fares must increase in order for airlines to return to profitablitly

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 17):
This could be AA's opportunity to do that.... move some 777s from elsewhere in their system (not sure how) and beef up the Pacific and make LAX much more of a hub operation.

Exaclty, were are they going to come from? at any rate, I think AA has shown were their pacific/Asian stratagy is being setup, ORD and DFW... between the two they've launched several new routes in the past year... in addition If you were going to beefup your service to those regions wouldn't you be looking for 1 stop service? if you launch new service to Asia from LAX you would need larger a/c to connect most of the US from LAX... thus the MD80's would be better.... UA seams to use their service there as overflow for ORD and SFO... looking more of O&D traffic...
Why do I fly???
 
IAHFLYR
Posts: 3943
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 12:56 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 12:56 pm

Quoting OptionsCLE (Reply 16):
Only time will tell if ExpressJet can be successful without CO

Can anyone see the similar Atlantic Coast Airline cost issue with United a few years ago, they became Independence Air and now GONE! I sure hope this doesn't happen with ExpressJet as they make a superb and seamless transition to CO and vice versa.....it's like flying the same exact airline so lets not see LAX and Eagle be part of this picture.
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
 
ckfred
Posts: 4734
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 2:51 pm

Quoting HPAEAA (Reply 11):
I do agree that MQ could learn a thing or two about how not to cancel flights and run an ontime operation, I don't think that that would be enough cause to add an extra 59 jets to the operation....

A friend of mine flies for AA, and part of Eagle's problem is ORD. If ORD gets backed up, which happens so often, then Eagle takes the brunt of it, because the average Embrear flies more segments than an MD-80 on a daily basis.

The other problem is that because the FAA raised the passenger and carry-on bag weights for weight and balance calculations, the Embrears now bump up against max. payload weight with less-than full flights.

So, if a mainline flight is late in arriving at a hub, letting Eagle flights go may not be an option. Even if later Eagle flights have open seats, they may not be able to accomodate passengers, because of weight and balance issues. Thus, Eagle winds up holding flights.
 
ANNOYEDFA
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:16 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Fri May 26, 2006 4:01 pm

Actually there have been talks of flying for AA out of CALI not LAX specifically, and also UAL out of DAL to start nit picking some of AA'S preimum pax. They can do that since they have the XRJ and those planes have the range and easily sail through the problem with the wright agreement over the airport. Talk's of the charter operation are also on going and also ExpressJet Europe. ExpressJet has a advantage with the XRJ and also talk of excerising some of the XRJ options "might" be needed. Long thin routes are what this plane is going to be focusing on for other airlines that Continental will be losing. Most of the jets being extracted from the COEX flying are 145XRJ'S. So Continental could find themselves losing quite a few flight's and route's in the future.

As for ExpressJet being too expensive to operate that's nothing short of bull. Just because ExpressJet doesn't do their flying at a loss such as those at Mesa and CHQ it doesn't mean they are too expensive it just means Continental is now looking for anyway possible to cut costs deeper. Passenger's will notice the difference soon enough. Especially with those lovely new props flown by Colgan and Executive. As a little tid bid that new prop service by Exec sure will soil the "Clean,Safe, and realiable" service they are none of the three.
"TWA... One Mission, Yours."
 
commavia
Posts: 9781
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 12:11 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
AA is looking to cut costs $1 billion in the next 12 months

$700M of that $1B is already identified. It's really $300M more they are now looking for actively.

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 9):
Wouldn't American's Scope Clause play a part in all this

American's Scope clause with its mainline pilots allows some regional flying by outside vendors, in addition to Eagle. The Eagle pilots would be the main concern -- they would no doubt be furious about losing this flying. However, if this deal also included some flying from ExpressJet replacing Chautauqua out of STL, then Eagle would likely be forced to take possession of 15 Chautauqua RJs and could use those to backfill most of the losses in pilot jobs that a pull-down in LAX flying would entail.

Quoting Nwab787techops (Reply 10):
I know talk at CHQ that AMR was going to dump CHQ as American Connection airline and make it AE.

Possible, and I think that has been rumored by many for a while, but AMR would then have to take back much of the Chautauqua American Connection fleet of EMB-140s.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 17):
When compared with flying MD80s, XJ's airplane trip costs are very favorable to AA's

Maybe, but certainly not when compared with Eagle's SAAB 340Bs on >1 hr flights to SBA, SBP, FAT, SAN, etc. On these routes, regional jets would have absolutely horrible economics, and would be hardly competitive with United Express' SkyWest Embraers.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 17):
As for LAX, the remote parking observation is interesting but I'm sure if AA puts in more RJ flying, it won't be to the same destinations they serve now... RJs will be used to substantially increase AA's size in LAX. LAX is alot like BOS... no real dominant carrier and no one really pulling away from the pack.

I doubt that. If Eagle is going to grow at LAX, why would they add to routes they already serve with RJs? Besides, what routes does AA mainline now fly from LAX that could be increased in frequency with RJs? Not DFW, not ORD, certainly not BOS, JFK, EWR, IAD, or MIA. That leaves LAX, DEN, SAT, SFO, SJD, and I really can't see any of those besides maybe SFO going RJ. If, hypothetically, Eagle were to boost RJ flying out of LAX with ExpressJet or by any other means, it would likely be new growth in new markets. They tried this twice before -- once in 2000-2001 when they dramatically ramped up LAX flying with MD80s going to PHX, DEN, OAK, etc. 9/11 killed those. Then, around 2002-2003, they tried again with RJs flying to PHX, OAK, SMF, ABQ, etc., and that also failed. So, I would guess that any new RJ flying out of LAX for American would probably include cities like PHX, TUS, COS, SMF, OAK, etc.

Quoting Ckfred (Reply 20):
If ORD gets backed up, which happens so often, then Eagle takes the brunt of it, because the average Embrear flies more segments than an MD-80 on a daily basis.

Yep, not to mention that if ORD ATC is dealing with an OSO and has a 777 waiting to take off for LHR and an Eagle EMB waiting to take off for MKE, guess which one is getting the clearance first?

Quoting ANNOYEDFA (Reply 21):
UAL out of DAL to start nit picking some of AA'S preimum pax

That will never happen, and if it did, it would be laughable. United has a miniscule presence in Dallas compared with AA, and the market for them to fly 50-seat RJs up against AA's MD80s is a joke. It would be Delta 2002 all over again -- flying regional jets while AA has mainline flights. Yes, there is a certain competitive advantage to being able to fly nonstop out of Love and thus attract premium travel and poach "some of AA's premium pax," but that is completely outweighed by the fact that a lack of First Class, and flying on a tiny jet for 3+ hours, doesn't stack up to well when AA has more flights, with more seats, more times per day, with First Class, and when probably 2/3 of the Metroplex has an AAdvantage account.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24595
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 1:52 am

Quoting Atomother (Thread starter):

59 a/c to fly routes for AA out of LAX and then the other 10 to be used in a 135 charter type thing.

59? No way. That is not needed out of LAX. Now, I wouldn't find the rumour hard to believe if Express was to fly 59 planes for AA in general, maybe base them out of MIA, LAX, and BOS, which would allow them to build-up LGA/DFW/ORD.
a.
 
as739x
Posts: 5008
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2003 7:23 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 2:35 am

Mah4546/ Laxintl...Agreed.....thats just to much capacity here. There is no where to put that many planes at LAX. LAX couldn't handle that many more flights arriving. Also, its not economical to fly the ERJ on a majority of AAEagle routes. Some routes are so short lile LAX-SAN. Every 1/2 hr with a ERJ?

I think there is a better chance of Horizon taking over some of the local routes from LAX.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
S5FA170
Posts: 528
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:04 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 3:43 am

Quoting ANNOYEDFA (Reply 21):
Just because ExpressJet doesn't do their flying at a loss such as those at Mesa and CHQ

Excuse me, but what do you mean you don't do your flying at a loss like those of us at CHQ? I'm pretty sure we are one damn profitable airline...

-Tony
Prepare doors for departure and cross-check.
 
SABE
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:19 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 3:53 am

I hope the rumor is true and AA brings back the former Reno Air TUS-LAX service. Sure would be nice to do TUS-LAX-HNL with AA all the way. Nowadays I'm forced to do TUS-DFW-HNL just to avoid WN and their cattle-like procedures on TUS-LAX, plus the headaches of going through security at LAX.
TUS-DFW-EZE... can't wait to visit home again!
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 3:58 am

Quoting Commavia (Reply 22):
I doubt that. If Eagle is going to grow at LAX, why would they add to routes they already serve with RJs? Besides, what routes does AA mainline now fly from LAX that could be increased in frequency with RJs? Not DFW, not ORD, certainly not BOS, JFK, EWR, IAD, or MIA. That leaves LAX, DEN, SAT, SFO, SJD, and I really can't see any of those besides maybe SFO going RJ. If, hypothetically, Eagle were to boost RJ flying out of LAX with ExpressJet or by any other means, it would likely be new growth in new markets. They tried this twice before -- once in 2000-2001 when they dramatically ramped up LAX flying with MD80s going to PHX, DEN, OAK, etc. 9/11 killed those. Then, around 2002-2003, they tried again with RJs flying to PHX, OAK, SMF, ABQ, etc., and that also failed. So, I would guess that any new RJ flying out of LAX for American would probably include cities like PHX, TUS, COS, SMF, OAK, etc.

The point is that if AA started flying more RJs from LAX it would be to open NEW routes from LAX, not replace what they have.

I also would be very surprised if AA made DFW a key part of its Asian growth strategy. DFW is too far southeast and many of the same destinations can be served from ORD. Plus, LAX is still largely unserved to Asia by US carriers and has a much, much larger local market than Texas.
 
Humberside
Posts: 3223
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:44 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 6:56 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
I've only seen it a few times but I've heard of ExpressJet Europe being formed. I could see the planes going over there.

Plans are fairly well advanced I think. However it will be a small operation at least to begin with. The airline is presently based in Cork

ExpressJet have also been looking at Asia
Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
 
atlaaron
Posts: 973
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:30 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 7:54 am

Quoting IAHFLYR (Reply 19):
Can anyone see the similar Atlantic Coast Airline cost issue with United a few years ago, they became Independence Air and now GONE! I sure hope this doesn't happen with ExpressJet as they make a superb and seamless transition to CO and vice versa.....it's like flying the same exact airline so lets not see LAX and Eagle be part of this picture.

No way, I think everyone in the industry learned their lesson from Flyi. A fleet of regionals as a stand alone carrier, does not work.
 
Pilot3033
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed May 24, 2006 4:39 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 7:56 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 27):
The point is that if AA started flying more RJs from LAX it would be to open NEW routes from LAX, not replace what they have.

Like...? I can't think of any route that is not either already served, or would not make money from LAX.
-Matt
 
WesternA318
Posts: 4477
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:55 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 9:29 am

Quoting Stirling (Reply 15):
and make the Radisson the new remote commuter terminal.

How bout making the Sheraton the new CO Pres Club?
Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 11:44 am

Quoting Pilot3033 (Reply 30):
Like...? I can't think of any route that is not either already served, or would not make money from LAX.

so... I'm guessing you don't work in AA's network analysis dept. There are dozens of cities within 1000 miles of LAX that could make money and are not flown; even more if CR7s are used w/ their longer range.

LAX is not a true hub for any carrier. AA has as good of a chance of any carrier of making it one.
 
optionscle
Posts: 428
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:08 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 1:04 pm

Quoting ANNOYEDFA (Reply 21):
They can do that since they have the XRJ and those planes have the range and easily sail through the problem with the wright agreement over the airport.

Can someone else confirm this for us please? I would really doubt that CO is releasing any of the XRJ's, my guess would be a mix of the SRJ's and LRJ's. The XR's are too in demand, I think it would be a foolish move to give up the more economical and longer-range aircraft. I haven't actually heard anything about this but that would just be my guess.

Quoting ANNOYEDFA (Reply 21):
Just because ExpressJet doesn't do their flying at a loss such as those at Mesa and CHQ it doesn't mean they are too expensive it just means Continental is now looking for anyway possible to cut costs deeper.

I don't really know what you're trying to say here, but I think you're questioning whether XJT is too expensive. The clear and simple answer is that yes, they are too expensive.

Express my once have been the darling of CO, but with soaring fuel costs, they just can't keep opperating the way that they have been. I believe that pre-9/11 CO/RU was briefly an all jet fleet. Now, with rising fuel prices and consistently high XJT costs, we have seen Continental look to other carriers (C5, 3C, 9L, 3M etc.) who can do the job for less. Believe me, for simplification's sake, it would have been much easier to work with just one regional carrier, but CO felt compelled to do otherwise.

If RU wants to remain successful in the US regional market, they will have to lower their costs to compete not only with the turboprop carriers, but also with jet opperators like RP and YV who can simply do the job for less!
 
ANNOYEDFA
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:16 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 4:46 pm

So you think........ you'll see.......
"TWA... One Mission, Yours."
 
FCYTravis
Posts: 1172
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:21 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sat May 27, 2006 5:13 pm

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 32):
LAX is not a true hub for any carrier. AA has as good of a chance of any carrier of making it one.

LAX will never be a true domestic hub for anyone because it's in a horrible place to connect traffic, tucked off in the extreme southwestern corner of the country. The only plausible way to make it a strong connecting hub would be to focus trans-Pacific traffic through there, but any effort to do that would run smack-dab into UA's strong and better-located transpac hub at SFO.

Because of its anti-hub location, LAX will forever be like BOS - a big-city airport with no single big hub carrier.
USAir A321 service now departing for SFO with fuel stops in CAK, COS and RNO. Enjoy your flight.
 
modesto2
Posts: 2671
Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2000 3:44 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 6:37 am

Quoting OptionsCLE (Reply 33):
I would really doubt that CO is releasing any of the XRJ's, my guess would be a mix of the SRJ's and LRJ's. The XR's are too in demand, I think it would be a foolish move to give up the more economical and longer-range aircraft. I haven't actually heard anything about this but that would just be my guess.

Actually, the majority of the 69 airplanes are the XRJ's. Who knows what CO was thinking when they released the aircraft but XJT is happy!
 
KAUSpilot
Posts: 1659
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:15 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 10:35 am

I would not be surprised to see some of the 69 airplanes stay with Continental after all the huffing and puffing is done, with Expressjet assuming the leases on these airplanes. It would be a win/win. CAL offloads some costs and XJT keeps some of the planes in service. I also expect to see XJT diversify their product by seeking other codeshares with a small number of those aircraft. From what I understand, the terms of any capcity purchase agreement XJT engages in with more than 10 aircraft outside of CAL must also be offered to Continental (in other words, they can't give a better deal to other carriers without offering the same thing to CAL, if they plan on using more than 10 aircraft). Again this second hand information, as I don't have direct access to the CPA between CAL and XJT.

Also, charter ops would not "be a huge streach." XJT's current opspecs already cover charter/ on demand operations, as probably do the opsecs of every other 121 airline. XJT already does charters. I can't name a 121 airline off the top of my head that doesn't do charters from time to time.

I expect to see a few of the 69 airplanes converted into executive configurations and utilized in a manner befitting that type of setup. The airframe has already proven capable in that role.
 
FLY777UAL
Posts: 4830
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 11:05 am

Quoting ANNOYEDFA (Reply 21):
Actually there have been talks of flying for AA out of CALI

It's California.

Signed,

Everyone from the state
 
WesternA318
Posts: 4477
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:55 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 11:56 am

Quoting OptionsCLE (Reply 33):
I would really doubt that CO is releasing any of the XRJ's, my guess would be a mix of the SRJ's and LRJ's. The XR's are too in demand, I think it would be a foolish move to give up the more economical and longer-range aircraft.

Exactly. CO nor ExpressJet are getting rid of the Xrj's. I am assumming the majority will be SRJ'S, but thats just my opinion.
Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
 
ANNOYEDFA
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:16 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 11:57 am

Ummmmm, get a life... Signed ME and Cali.
"TWA... One Mission, Yours."
 
stirling
Posts: 3897
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:00 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:12 pm

The only people who use "Cali", are those who don't live here, but want to sound they're "hip".
We call it California. And sometimes Kalee-fornia. But never Cali.
Only LL Cool J calls it Cali.
Delete this User
 
optionscle
Posts: 428
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:08 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:18 pm

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 39):
Exactly. CO nor ExpressJet are getting rid of the Xrj's. I am assumming the majority will be SRJ'S, but thats just my opinion.

Well according to a couple of people on this thread, the rejected leases are mostly on XRJ's. Interesting...
 
FATFlyer
Posts: 4446
Joined: Fri May 18, 2001 4:12 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:27 pm

Quoting FLY777UAL (Reply 38):
It's California.

Signed,

Everyone from the state



Quoting Stirling (Reply 41):
The only people who use "Cali", are those who don't live here, but want to sound they're "hip".
We call it California. And sometimes Kalee-fornia. But never Cali.
Only LL Cool J calls it Cali.

I hate it too, just shows someone isn't from here or is trying to be cool. Until people elsewhere start saying they are from "the york" or "flori" or "o" I think it just shows disrespect.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
BigGSFO
Posts: 2214
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:27 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:28 pm

Quoting Stirling (Reply 41):
The only people who use "Cali", are those who don't live here, but want to sound they're "hip".
We call it California. And sometimes Kalee-fornia. But never Cali.
Only LL Cool J calls it Cali.

Agreed.  Smile
 
Garri767
Posts: 2207
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 2:00 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:49 pm

IF XJT starts AAEX flights at LAX will this lead to cutting back flights at their other airports they currently serve? i dont the time to read this entire thread so could someone tell me and ill check back later?

[Edited 2006-05-28 05:53:47]
Two wrongs may not make a right, but three lefts do!
 
KAUSpilot
Posts: 1659
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:15 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 12:51 pm

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 39):
Exactly. CO nor ExpressJet are getting rid of the Xrj's. I am assumming the majority will be SRJ'S, but thats just my opinion.

Expressjet already knows which aircraft they are retaining.

It will be 44 145XR's and 25 145LR's. Why did CAL specify these particular aircraft to be released? I don't know. It almost seems like CAL was doing XJET a favor in giving them a very marketable fleet with the 69 aircraft they withdrew.

I reiterate, the 69 airplanes CAL are deferring to XJET are 44 XR's and 25 LR's. This represents almost half of the CAL XR fleet, and will present some problems for their route system unless they're able to replace that flying with 737's or acquire more XR's. All of the old ER/EP's and 135's will remain in service in the CAL system.

Nothing is set in stone here, but if those planes leave the CAL system, and it appears that they will, it will be 44 XR's and 25 LR's.
 
ANNOYEDFA
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:16 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 1:37 pm

Thanks!!! KAUSPILOT...... This was released when they released the with drawl... Prepare for the cut backs on flights....
"TWA... One Mission, Yours."
 
KAUSpilot
Posts: 1659
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 2:15 pm

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Sun May 28, 2006 2:22 pm

I am fairly confident that this turn of events will not adversely effect XJET anymore more than it already has. Management seems confident that they will find profitable opportunities for these aircraft, be it here or overseas, and has even hinted at new aircraft orders if any of these opportunities pan out. XJET is continuing to hire F/A's, Pilot's and Mechanics into the end of this year. They would obviously not be doing that if they were going to lose 25% of their fleet. I expect to at least half of those 69 airplanes to remain in the country, being staffed by XJET employees in one way or another.

XJET will almost certainly see a cutback in flights in the CAL system, the big question mark is still how big those cuts will be and if they will make it up with these other business ventures.

I'm sure you RJET fanatics will come on here and tell me how wrong I am, but I thnk XJET is being run by competent management team. They obviously felt that agreeing to the terms that CAL was offering in extending the capacity purchase agreement wasn't in the best interest of the company.
 
ANNOYEDFA
Posts: 441
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 9:16 am

RE: ExpressJet To Fly For AA Out Of LAX?

Mon May 29, 2006 2:23 am

The only Airline losing out is CAL. I wonder who and what is going to fly all the 3-4 hour flights the current XR'S operate.
"TWA... One Mission, Yours."