Svenskpilot
Topic Author
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EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:10 am

Noticed that EasyJet's A319s have four overwing exits and was wondering why this is. What is different about their A319s than any other carrier?


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Rheinbote
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:16 am

Quoting Svenskpilot (Thread starter):
What is different about their A319s than any other carrier?

They have a 150 seat cabin configuration.

[Edited 2006-05-26 02:25:52]
 
Cadet57
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:16 am

Quoting Svenskpilot (Thread starter):
Noticed that EasyJet's A319s have four overwing exits and was wondering why this is. What is different about their A319s than any other carrier?

They have four overwings due to the ammount of seats inside. Thats the only way they could certify the aircraft for the seats they wanted.
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
Svenskpilot
Topic Author
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:19 am

Why not go with the A320 then if you're going to cram 150 people into a plane that's 12 feet shorter?
 
BDKLEZ
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:22 am

Quoting Svenskpilot (Thread starter):
Noticed that EasyJet's A319s have four overwing exits and was wondering why this is. What is different about their A319s than any other carrier?

The centre section of the fuselage is actually that of the A320 which already accomodates the double overwing exists. These aircraft are in a 156Y passenger configuration and as such will require two extra emergency exists. The maximum passenger load on an A319 with the standard overwing exists is 149Y.

There costs involved in using the A320 centre section are completely negligable.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
HBJZA
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 2:28 pm

Quoting Rheinbote (Reply 1):
They have a 150 seat cabin configuration.

They actually have a 156 seats cabin ! And they had to add a F/A for the extra 7 seats compared to the 149 seats of the 737 !
 
studentflyer
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 3:50 pm

Quoting Svenskpilot (Reply 3):
Why not go with the A320 then if you're going to cram 150 people into a plane that's 12 feet shorter?

To tell you the scary truth, if they have the A320, they'll cram even more people..

Quoting HBJZA (Reply 5):
They actually have a 156 seats cabin ! And they had to add a F/A for the extra 7 seats compared to the 149 seats of the 737 !

Hmm.. that made me think.. is the airline going to profit more by adding the additional F/A for the 7-seat increase? I mean, obviously the more seats, the lower the CASM, but is it justifiable to have to pay an extra F/A?

Sorry if that sounded a little bit silly
 
scouseflyer
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 3:55 pm

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 6):
To tell you the scary truth, if they have the A320, they'll cram even more people..

I was wondering that too - how many people would they get into a 320 or a 321 at the same density?
 
antonovman
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 3:56 pm

i thought they had or were going to go back to 149y so as not to have an additional F/A
 
studentflyer
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 4:03 pm

Quoting Scouseflyer (Reply 7):
I was wondering that too - how many people would they get into a 320 or a 321 at the same density?

If I wasn't mistaken, an A320 can take 180Y, and A321 220Y.

I'd say any LCC would cram in as much as possible..

just my  twocents 
 
scouseflyer
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 4:15 pm

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 9):
A321 220Y

MMMMMM nice!
 
RichardPrice
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 4:28 pm

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 6):
Hmm.. that made me think.. is the airline going to profit more by adding the additional F/A for the 7-seat increase? I mean, obviously the more seats, the lower the CASM, but is it justifiable to have to pay an extra F/A?

Over a certain passenger count, fares become 100% profit - Ive heard different figures for different airlines and aircraft, but according to sources on a.net usually it loiters around 50% capacity. Adding an extra 7 people at £30 a time for a 3 hour flight, while paying the F/As £10GBP an hour, equates to £150 profit rather than £230 profit (on a return flight where all 7 passengers are returning).

Its more than worth it in Easyjets eyes.
 
studentflyer
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 4:37 pm

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 11):
Its more than worth it in Easyjets eyes.

Sorry, my bad. I forgot that LCC cabin crews are paid by the hour. I suppose that's the way LCCs make profit.. Thanks for clearing it up  Wink
 
Joost
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 6:04 pm

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 9):
If I wasn't mistaken, an A320 can take 180Y, and A321 220Y.

I'd say any LCC would cram in as much as possible..

Wizzair and Vueling have those A320s with a 180Y config.
Ryanair has a 189Y config in their 738s.

156Y in easy's A319s is not more cramped than their 149Ys 37Gs.
 
vv701
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 6:59 pm

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 11):
Over a certain passenger count, fares become 100% profit - Ive heard different figures for different airlines and aircraft, but according to sources on a.net usually it loiters around 50% capacity.

This depends on the price paid by the first 78 passengers (that are required to achieve a 50 per cent load factor). Then there are incremental costs for carrying each additional passenger including airport handling charges and the extra fuel burnt because of the additional weight created by the incremental passenger. So there is no point where an incremental fare is 100 per cent profit although the percentage profitability from an additional passenger is very high once all non-variable costs are covered.
 
ZRH
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:46 pm

Quoting Svenskpilot (Reply 3):
Why not go with the A320 then if you're going to cram 150 people into a plane that's 12 feet shorter?

That's an easy answer: €€€ $$$. There more passengers you put in a plane the more you earn.
 
Joost
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 9:51 pm

First a small detail, the F/A is not required for the 7 extra pax, but for 6. The typical 73G seats 149 pax, but a typical 319 seats 150 pax, that's the limit for 3 F/A's. The 319s were originally planned with 150 seats, look for example at this press release, dated 14 Oct 2002: https://www.easyjet.com/EN/News/20021014_01.html

Quote:
Airbus A319 will be configured with 150 seats, with the possibility of increasing to 156, compared to 149 on the Boeing 737-700

But there is another reason why they have 4 F/A's and that is because of extra revenue generated by on-board sales. When they had 3 F/A's on their 149-seat Boeings, it often occurred that on short flights, not all passengers could be well served. So, the 4th F/A is also there to boost on-board sales.

(however, I have never experienced people buying many things on board)
 
HBJZA
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Fri May 26, 2006 11:43 pm

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 12):
Sorry, my bad. I forgot that LCC cabin crews are paid by the hour. I suppose that's the way LCCs make profit.. Thanks for clearing it up

Not true, at least when I used to work for U2. The F/A get a basic salary and then are paid on flights. For example there is an amount for one flight (lets say 10 for easier calculation). Then each flight has it's ratio according to its length : small 0.8 - medium 1.0 - long 1.2. So if one flie GVA-NCE, he gets 8, then LTN-ATH, he gets 12 and so on. Hope it's clear enough.

That's actually how they gain money because if they would pay by hour, as soon as the flight is delayed, they would have to pay more. With this system, they only pay for flight actually flown and not for the delay !!!
 
TuRbUleNc3
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 12:36 am

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 9):
'd say any LCC would cram in as much as possible..

Agreed, Jet2's 757's could take 228 people, now they are going in 1 by 1 for a reconfig to add seats to seat 235 same as Thomsonfly and probably other charters, hello sardine!
 
Rheinbote
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 2:47 am

Quoting Joost (Reply 13):
156Y in easy's A319s is not more cramped than their 149Ys 37Gs.

IIRC they use 29'' pitch. I wouldn't fit in there.
 
GCDEG
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 3:36 am

Quoting StudentFlyer (Reply 12):
I forgot that LCC cabin crews are paid by the hour. I suppose that's the way LCCs make profit

As HBJZA said above this isn't the case with every LCC. There are two different ways of paying flight pay. One is sector pay and the other is per hour pay. Sector pay means that the crew get a standard amount per flight and with per hour pay means basically what it says. The crew are paid every hour until they check back in at their base again. There are pros and cons to each one but every airline has either one or the other. With my company it's per hour pay but with EZY it's sector pay.

Nick
The best thing invented - Winglets!
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 8:22 am

They cram everyone in the A319s because well, they are operating under Southwest's business plan. Operate small, efficient airplanes with as many seats as possible.
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
B6JFKH81
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 8:25 am

Quoting HBJZA (Reply 5):
They actually have a 156 seats cabin !

That is amazing. We fly all 320's and our configuration is 156. What is the seat pitch on EasyJet?
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
 
ManchesterMAN
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 8:30 am

Quoting Antonovman (Reply 8):
i thought they had or were going to go back to 149y so as not to have an additional F/A

This is what I heard too. Anyone know any more about this?
Flown: A300,A319,A320,A321,A330,A340.A380,717,727,737,747,757,767,777,DC9,DC10,MD11,MD80,F100,F50,ERJ,E190,CRJ,BAe146,Da
 
Almeriabound
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 8:30 am

I don't know what the seat pitch is, but easyJet's A319s are extremely comfortable. I use them regularly flying LEI to either LGW or STN and there is no problem with either the seats or the pitch. The space available seems more than adequate for the two and a half hour flights, and compares as well as Iberia or British Airways aircraft.

Saludos from LEI
Mike Barker in Almeria
 
ade99
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 8:32 am

Easyjet have been considering removing/decreasing the number seats down to 150 so they on need three cabin crew, however the decision making has gone rather quiet.

The problem being, on their LGW routes that are busy they often will operate at 100% and the 156 seats means max money. The logistics for them to arrange crew for flights with less 150 would be horrendous especially as they operate a two/four/six sector day for their crew which mainly results in them coming home every night.
 
bmiexpat
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 1:12 pm

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 11):
Adding an extra 7 people at £30 a time for a 3 hour flight, while paying the F/As £10GBP an hour, equates to £150 profit rather than £230 profit (on a return flight where all 7 passengers are returning).

However, I can imagine that those extra 7 seats are sold at top whack fares rather than the average, so on a full flight those extra seats would mean mega bucks for easyjet.
 
rootsair
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 6:21 pm

This is funny..
Its the nth time this topic comes up
Such as :

Why Lufthansa no PTV's?

When are NW retiring their DC9's and DC 10's?

Why no more eyebrows on 737NG's?

Dirty AF planes
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
superhub
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sat May 27, 2006 6:40 pm

Quoting Svenskpilot (Thread starter):
Noticed that EasyJet's A319s have four overwing exits and was wondering why this is. What is different about their A319s than any other carrier?

Is this a joke?

Quoting RootsAir (Reply 27):
Why Lufthansa no PTV's?

When are NW retiring their DC9's and DC 10's?

Why no more eyebrows on 737NG's?

Dirty AF planes

There should be a FAQ section where people can consult before posting a question like the EZ A319s and questions like yours above. It should be made mandatory for new members to read before they can write their first post.

And when someone wants to post a new thread asking those questions, the "reminder" section at the end (after you press the "post the message" button first time, but before you press "confirm post") should always give a link to the relevant question in the FAQ section.

[Edited 2006-05-27 11:46:20]
 
vv701
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 1:29 am

Quoting Almeriabound (Reply 24):
I don't know what the seat pitch is, but easyJet's A319s are extremely comfortable. I use them regularly flying LEI to either LGW or STN and there is no problem with either the seats or the pitch. The space available seems more than adequate for the two and a half hour flights, and compares as well as Iberia or British Airways aircraft.

I must bow to your experience although I am very surprised. The maximum number of seats on a BA 319 is 126. EZ have 24 per cent more at 156. Indeed BA have fewer seats on their 320s (maximum 150) that are 12 feet longer. I would have thought that these sort of differences would be very noticeable and make the leg room on the two very different cabin configurations not comparable at all.
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 1:37 am

View Large View Medium
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Photo © Dickson Ching - HKAEC



They are using the new age seats that are thinner than most economy seats. They are able to maintain reasonable seat pitch this way. They are very comfortable despite their looks.

FOUND IT!

Additional seat requirement
Our minimum seat dimensions are as follows:

Pitch (distance between back of seat and back of seat in front): 29" (approx. 72.5cm)
Width (distance between armrests): 171/2 " (approx. 44cm)
If you are unable to fit into a single seat with the above dimensions for any reason (such as special medical requirements e.g. a broken leg) you will be required to purchase additional seating

[Edited 2006-05-27 18:48:26]
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 1:53 am

Quoting Almeriabound (Reply 24):
I don't know what the seat pitch is, but easyJet's A319s are extremely comfortable. I use them regularly flying LEI to either LGW or STN and there is no problem with either the seats or the pitch. The space available seems more than adequate for the two and a half hour flights,

How short are you!?!?! 29" pitch and being 6'1" I'd have my knees in my throat. Big grin
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
miami1
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 3:04 am

Quoting Skyexramper (Reply 21):
they are operating under Southwest's business plan. Operate small, efficient airplanes with as many seats as possible.

Southwest have 33-34" seat pitch - much MORE ROOM than most majors.

And 137 on their 73Gs and 733s is far from maximum for that aircraft type. Southwest also have smaller galleys to accomodate the extra seat pitch in the cabin.
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 5:11 am

Quoting Miami1 (Reply 32):

Go to their site and read about their procedures and how they operate. Although they have taken it one step further than SWA by cramming as many people into the airplane as they can, because they can. People in the states would have nothing to do with that.

[Edited 2006-05-27 22:14:26]
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
RJ100
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 5:31 am

Quoting Bmiexpat (Reply 26):
However, I can imagine that those extra 7 seats are sold at top whack fares rather than the average, so on a full flight those extra seats would mean mega bucks for easyjet.

Yes, for instance tomorrow:

Naples-Basel 299.99 Euros (2 seats left)
Nice-Basel 254.99 Euros (5 seats left)
Basel-Nice 254.99 Euros (2 seats left)
Rome CIA-Basel 253.49 Euros (5 seats left)
Alicante-Basel 303.49 Euros (4 seats left)
Barcelona-Basel 303.49 Euros (1 seat left)
Madrid-Basel 301.49 Euros (5 seats left)

Tomorrow, for instance, all 3 flights London-Basel are fully booked. Also, all flights London-Geneva are fully booked. The six additional seats in the A-319 generate approx. 1800 Euros on a single flight!

Regards,
RJ100
none
 
gilesdavies
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 7:04 am

Quoting Miami1 (Reply 32):
Southwest have 33-34" seat pitch - much MORE ROOM than most majors.

And 137 on their 73Gs and 733s is far from maximum for that aircraft type. Southwest also have smaller galleys to accomodate the extra seat pitch in the cabin.

Welcome to the world of LCC in Europe and the UK! - Theres no Jet Blue carriers operating this side of the pond and unlikely to be any here any time soon!

28-30 inches is pretty much the standard seat ptich on all low cost carriers and charter airlines flying in Europe and come to think about it I think most legacy carriers operating in Europe are only about 30 inches in Y. (Im sure there is the exception with one or two carriers and someone will surely tell me about that!)

Even longhaul flights with European carriers rarely exceeds 31inches of seat pitch in Y, I know this is the case with Virgin and BA.

[Edited 2006-05-28 00:05:53]
 
RedChili
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 7:38 am

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 11):
Over a certain passenger count, fares become 100% profit - Ive heard different figures for different airlines and aircraft, but according to sources on a.net usually it loiters around 50% capacity. Adding an extra 7 people at £30 a time for a 3 hour flight, while paying the F/As £10GBP an hour, equates to £150 profit rather than £230 profit (on a return flight where all 7 passengers are returning).

This assumes that those final six seats are sold on each flight. If, on a certain flight, they can't sell those six seats, then they're paying the extra F/A for "nothing."

(By taking out one row of six seats and reducing the number from 156 to 150, you could reduce the number of F/As from four to three.)

Quoting RJ100 (Reply 34):
Quoting Bmiexpat (Reply 26):
However, I can imagine that those extra 7 seats are sold at top whack fares rather than the average, so on a full flight those extra seats would mean mega bucks for easyjet.

Yes, for instance tomorrow:

Naples-Basel 299.99 Euros (2 seats left)

But if they would reduce capacity with six seats, they could charge top fares for the previous six tickets (seats 145-150). In order to fill up these six extra seats, they have to offer six extra low-cost tickets. So those six extra seats don't mean mega bucks for the airline.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 35):
Welcome to the world of LCC in Europe and the UK! - Theres no Jet Blue carriers operating this side of the pond and unlikely to be any here any time soon!

Unfortunately, Europe has turned into a pitiful continent aviation wise. Makes me want to apply for a political asylum in the Far East, where you have CX, SQ, TG, MH and other similar carriers! Even North American, with JetBlue and Southwest, would be better than Europe nowadays.
Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
 
vv701
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 7:59 am

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 35):
28-30 inches is pretty much the standard seat ptich on all low cost carriers and charter airlines flying in Europe and come to think about it I think most legacy carriers operating in Europe are only about 30 inches in Y.

EuroTraveller on BA is 31 inches with 34 inches in the 'front' cabin for Club Europe. On many flights some of the Club Europe seats (2 - 3 configuration in each row) are converted to a 3 - 3 configuration for use by EuroTraveller passengers but the pitch remains at 34 inches. So if travelling EuroTraveller you need to try to be allocated a seat as far forward as possible. Which rows depends on the exact aircraft as I believe, for example, that while BA's older 320's have 22 rows of 34 inch pitch seats their much newer 320 232s have, I think, only 19 rows.
 
RJ100
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RE: EasyJet A319, Why 4 Overwing Exits?

Sun May 28, 2006 8:26 am

Quoting RedChili (Reply 36):
This assumes that those final six seats are sold on each flight. If, on a certain flight, they can't sell those six seats, then they're paying the extra F/A for "nothing."

(By taking out one row of six seats and reducing the number from 156 to 150, you could reduce the number of F/As from four to three.)

This is true. But obviously they sell the 6 seats enough times during a year. EZY is a well run company...I guess they were thinking about that too...

Quoting RedChili (Reply 36):
But if they would reduce capacity with six seats, they could charge top fares for the previous six tickets (seats 145-150). In order to fill up these six extra seats, they have to offer six extra low-cost tickets. So those six extra seats don't mean mega bucks for the airline.

They could of course. But why to do so if you can charge top fares on let's say the last 30 or more seats? Let's take the example of the London to Geneva and London to Basel flights tomorrow where demand exceeds offer by far (all flights completely sold out). It's not that they just sell the last six seats for a good price. They sold a big bunch of expensive seats.

Interesting discussion though!

Regards,
RJ100
none