grantcv
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A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:35 am

I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?
 
787engineer
Posts: 545
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:05 am

In short, when the engines are ready. Most likely Airbus won't start a new major project until they finish the base model A350-800 or A370 which will be around early 2012.
 
EMBQA
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:08 am

Quoting Grantcv (Thread starter):
I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?

Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
zvezda
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:03 am

The earliest plausible dates are, IMO, 2008 for launch, 2012 for first flight, and 2013 for EIS. Probably a few years later.

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 1):
In short, when the engines are ready.

 checkmark 
 
ebbuk
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 2:08 am

Quoting Grantcv (Thread starter):
I was wondering when the A320's replacement will be launched?

give it a rest dear boy, Airbus this airbus that.
 
grantcv
Posts: 410
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:28 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:20 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 4):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well

Well, there have been 3 generations of 737 - the first was in service for 18 years before it was superceded, the second 14 years. The current generation is a far cry from the original - it was almost all new. The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.
 
zvezda
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Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:48 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:31 am

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

The Airbus NSR and B737RS will probably EIS within 18 months of each other. As 787engineer pointed out, it all depends on the availability of engines.
 
kaneporta1
Posts: 710
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2005 12:22 am

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 5:31 am

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

Well, they put new winglets on recently...
I'd rather die peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather, not terrified and screaming, like his passengers
 
bomber996
Posts: 412
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:21 am

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:28 am

Quoting Kaneporta1 (Reply 7):
Well, they put new winglets on recently...

You could say that about the 757 and 737NG. I think what he means by update is new engines, ala 787, and new fuselage components.

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Two biggest lies in aviation... "I'm from the FAA and I'm here to help you." & "Traffic in sight."
 
787engineer
Posts: 545
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:50 am

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 5):
The current A320 is now pushing 18 years. At the very least, it is due for an update.

Airplanes aren't "due" for updates after approximately a certain number of years. They will be updated when the technology advances enough that the update will provide a favorable ROI. If Airbus produced a NG A320 everytime there's a small improvement it'd be a waste of money. If it doesn't hurt sales why not wait until technology provides a 5, 10, or 15% improvement?
 
grantcv
Posts: 410
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:28 am

So in the 20 years since the A320 was launched there has been no significant technological advancement to improve the A320 significantly? (putting winglets aside).
 
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Stitch
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:32 am

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 10):
So in the 20 years since the A320 was launched there has been no significant technological advancement to improve the A320 significantly? (putting winglets aside).

That appears to be the case. Airbus picked an excellent time to launch their product, capitalizing on the improvements available at the time to maximize the time the plane would be effective.

Boeing, coming later with the 737NG, was able to capitalize on those same improvements, which is why we have not seen any major updates to that family, as well.
 
joffie
Posts: 814
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:45 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:30 am

Speaking of the A320, the new ones are coming with LCD PFD's. Back 10 years ago, they were all CRT. There's an update Big grin
 
DfwRevolution
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Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:37 am

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 9):
Airplanes aren't "due" for updates after approximately a certain number of years.

18 years for a narrowbody is a lot. Prior to the A320 and 737NG, short-haul aircraft were overturning on 12-14 year cycles.

At this point, the A320 is at 18 years and there is no forseable end before the platform hits 24-26 years old. That's quite unprecedented
 
grantcv
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:01 pm

It seems that the new widebodies (B787, B748, A3?0) are offering a 20% improvement in operating costs over the 1980's designs they replace. And none too soon given the price of fuel. So I am wondering, does the price of jet fuel impact narrowbodies more or less than the widebodies? Or, in other words, are the fuel costs for a narrowboday a smaller or larger percentage of the operating costs versus a widebody. Surely both Airbus and Boeing should be scrambling right now to find a way to produce a cost-effective narrowbody for the future. Or will the price of jet fuel drop down to 2000 levels again?
 
zvezda
Posts: 8891
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:48 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:46 pm

Quoting Grantcv (Reply 14):
does the price of jet fuel impact narrowbodies more or less than the widebodies? Or, in other words, are the fuel costs for a narrowboday a smaller or larger percentage of the operating costs versus a widebody.

Fuel is a larger component of operating costs for narrow-bodies than for wide-bodies.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 4:01 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.

The technology shift will dictate it. You're probably looking at a bleedless system, composite or Li airframe, composite wing, and a wider airframe. So much has changed in the last 10 years. Dornier was onto something with the 728 family in terms of aerodynamics... Just look at it vs. how the 787 is shaking out physically.

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Oykie
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Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 9:21 am

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:29 pm

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
18 years for a narrowbody is a lot. Prior to the A320 and 737NG, short-haul aircraft were overturning on 12-14 year cycles.

At this point, the A320 is at 18 years and there is no foreseeable end before the platform hits 24-26 years old. That's quite unprecedented

I wonder why that is? Is it because both the 737 and A320 continuous to sell well, and since neither Boeing or Airbus has pushed for an update the engine manufacturers has been putting their products development on hold in the thrust class for the A320/737?
Dream no small dream; it lacks magic. Dream large, then go make that dream real - Donald Douglas
 
kappel
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Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 6:48 pm

RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:42 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
Why do we need to replace it...?? Just look at the Boeing 737. It's push 40+ years old and still selling well.

As pointed out, the 737-100 only resembles the 737NG in fuselage width. Almost everything is new, avionics, wings, engines, the NG also has some composites (the fin IIRC and other components).

Quoting OyKIE (Reply 17):
I wonder why that is? Is it because both the 737 and A320 continuous to sell well, and since neither Boeing or Airbus has pushed for an update the engine manufacturers has been putting their products development on hold in the thrust class for the A320/737?

I believe the engines did receive several updates, just no major ones like now with the GEnx and Trent 1000 and their derivatives. No doubt engines with that technology will be under the new 737 and a320.
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HPAEAA
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RE: A320 Replacement

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:53 pm

With the latest redesign on the the A350, I think I remeber hearing that Airbus is fully commited between the A380 and A350, and by fully commited meaing they have no more money that they can divert to R&D over the next couple years until orders begin to pickup... I'll see if I can find the article...
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