irishpower
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Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:31 pm

Often when I go out to SFO I see UA 744's being moved from the international terminal over to their maintenance base for a few hours :then they are taxied back to the terminal for flights later that day or in the evening---who gets to taxi the planes? Are they pilots or specially trained ground personel? I see it at airports all the time and have always wondered who is at the controls.
 
Newark777
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:32 pm

IIRC, some maintenance personnel are certified to taxi the plane around if they have to.

Harry
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malaysia
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:35 pm

Either Ramp Agents or Mechanics

During Ramp Tower communication, it can either be a signed off Ramp Agent in the cockpit who is brake riding, or a Mechanic.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
tsaord
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:07 pm

I've wondered about that myself when it came to AA 777's and 67's coming from T5 back to T3 for their eveining European departures.
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FlyDeltaJets
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:57 pm

At DL they are training the ramp agents to brake ride for towing, but it's MX who does taxing to other portions of the airport.
The only valid opinions are those based in facts
 
N587NK
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 3:05 pm

With us if the A/C is being taxi-ed it MX personel, if its being towed its a ramp crew tugging the aircraft with MX riding the brakes
 
superhub
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 3:09 pm

I am glad you brought this subject up. I have always wondered myself and I have always thought that the airline had some spare pilot to do the taxi from MX to ramp.

And I have learnt something new today.
 
irishpower
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 4:04 pm

So do these ground staff get special training to be able to taxi a 744 around an airport? I'm not talking about towing with a tug but rather taxiing under the planes own power?
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 5:46 pm

Out Here Mx/Engineering handles Taxiing & Towing Ops for Maintenance work.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
nonfirm
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 6:18 pm

Maintenance personal that are run and taxi qualified can perform this witch is the case with UA in SFO.I believe the ramp guys push the flight out for the revenue flight but the maintenance crew tows the airplane back and forth from the terminal to the maintenance base when required.  airplane 
 
flyinTLow
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 7:17 pm

A/C are not taxied to MX or to other gates. The expenses for starting up an engine and then riding back and forth are far greater than ordering a towing truck and towing it across the airport.
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malaysia
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:06 pm

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 7):
So do these ground staff get special training to be able to taxi a 744 around an airport? I'm not talking about towing with a tug but rather taxiing under the planes own power?

MX are trained to also taxi the plane on its own power if they feel its needed. but ramp would never be allowed to do that, but the only power the ramp agents can do is start and shut down the APU for internal power during taxi and operate the beacon lights.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
Flyer732
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:20 pm

Quoting FlyinTLow (Reply 10):
A/C are not taxied to MX or to other gates. The expenses for starting up an engine and then riding back and forth are far greater than ordering a towing truck and towing it across the airport.

Tell that to my mechanics who just taxiied my plane from the gate to its over night parking spot on the other side of the airport.

In a busy airport, tugs can take too long. Taxiing is quicker.
 
HPAEAA
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:24 pm

Quoting Tsaord (Reply 3):
I've wondered about that myself when it came to AA 777's and 67's coming from T5 back to T3 for their evening European departures.

Those are all Maintenance Personal... Pilots get off over at IT5
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dtwclipper
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:25 pm

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 11):
MX are trained to also taxi the plane on its own power if

Didn't anyone see "Airport"? Everyone knows that Joe Patroni was licenced to taxi! It's one of the high points of the film!
:D Big grin
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N353SK
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 12:24 am

Quoting FlyinTLow (Reply 10):
A/C are not taxied to MX or to other gates. The expenses for starting up an engine and then riding back and forth are far greater than ordering a towing truck and towing it across the airport.

Smaller aircraft are taxied by MX all the time. It does seem that larger A/C are usually towed.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 2:21 am

Quoting N353SK (Reply 15):
Smaller aircraft are taxied by MX all the time. It does seem that larger A/C are usually towed.

Considering the Traffic at most Airports.Taxiing permisson is sought faster than Towing to ATC.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
planespotting
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 2:25 am

Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 14):
Didn't anyone see "Airport"? Everyone knows that Joe Patroni was licenced to taxi! It's one of the high points of the film!

haha, yeah I was just thinking that.

"Now Mr. Patroni is qualified to taxi, he'll handle it."
Do you like movies about gladiators?
 
corey07850
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 7:19 am

Quoting Superhub (Reply 6):
I am glad you brought this subject up. I have always wondered myself and I have always thought that the airline had some spare pilot to do the taxi from MX to ramp.

For random taxiing, maintenance will do it... However if the maintenance work requires something like a high speed RTO test or any kind of high speed run on a runway, a spare pilot will be the one in the cockpit for this
 
ua777222
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:26 am

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't most aircraft certified to taxi on only one engine?

Thanks,

Matt
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
HPAEAA
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:41 am

Quoting Corey07850 (Reply 18):
For random taxiing, maintenance will do it... However if the maintenance work requires something like a high speed RTO test or any kind of high speed run on a runway, a spare pilot will be the one in the cockpit for this

Not neccissarily, Some carriers allow the MX personel to do this on their own... Eagle Mechanics and contractors used to be qualified for this, no need to bother the pilots... HP it was the same... MX could do high speed runups if needed....
Why do I fly???
 
raventom
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:49 am

I bet the engineers get very tempted to take them for a little bit more than a taxi!
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corey07850
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 8:57 am

Quoting HPAEAA (Reply 20):

Not neccissarily, Some carriers allow the MX personel to do this on their own... Eagle Mechanics and contractors used to be qualified for this, no need to bother the pilots... HP it was the same... MX could do high speed runups if needed....

It probably has to do more with the pilots or mx contracts than anything else...
 
irishpower
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 9:24 am

What are MX personel?
 
Clipper002
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 9:25 am

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't most aircraft certified to taxi on only one engine?

Thanks,

Matt

Matt,
What does this have to do with who taxi's the a/c?

Rgds,
Ed
Ed
 
777STL
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 9:48 am

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 19):
Correct me if I am wrong but aren't most aircraft certified to taxi on only one engine?

Thanks,

Matt

There's no "certification" to taxi on one engine.
PHX based
 
fr8mech
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 9:55 am

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 23):
What are MX personel?

MX is a common abbreviation for maintenance.

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 19):
Correct me if I am wrong but aren't most aircraft certified to taxi on only one engine?

There is no certification, per se. There are procedures that each operator may put together. My operator's procedure is that if the engine has a hydraulic pump attached to it, the engine is run for taxi by maintenance personnel.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
 
ua777222
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 10:08 am

Quoting Clipper002 (Reply 24):

Matt,
What does this have to do with who taxi's the a/c?

It would be in relation to the issue that airlines don't taxi aircraft with the engines rather a tug. I apologize for the use of the word certification. I guess I should have asked;

Aren't there certain one-engine taxi procedures in place for airlines?

Thanks,

Matt
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
flyabunch
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 10:09 am

Yesterday, I was waiting to take a TED flight in Denver. I was starting to think our inbound was late and all of a sudden a plane appeared but didn't have to unload. When I looked at out the window at the jetway steps, a MX worker was leaving after spotting the plane at the gate. And, he definitely brought it in on its own engines. The pilots for our flight were waiting on the jetway to take over when he got there.

Mike
 
BigJimFX
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 10:19 am

Quoting Raventom (Reply 21):
I bet the engineers get very tempted to take them for a little bit more than a taxi!

Yeah... When ATC tells the MX driver that there is "Traffic on a 3 mile final, without delay, cross 18L, cross 18R, and taxi to parking." The mechanics tend to "goose" the engines a bit, and travel a little faster than normal taxi speed. I have also seen a 757 MX come across a bridge so fast, it looks like its about to try to jump a row of cars!

But who can blame the mechanics for trying to having a little fun?

You can also tell the difference between a pilot and a mechanic on the radio because (and I don't mean anything bad by this) they tend not to be as radio "savaay" as a pilot is.
I'd like to thank me for flying Me Airways...
 
jeb94
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 11:54 am

All mechanics that are run & taxi qualified are trained for each specific type of aircraft they taxi. They have to know what all of the indications should be and the steering quirks of the aircraft. The DC9 steers a little differently than the MD80 for example. A lot different from a 747! They also have to know what to do in the event of an emergency. A crew taxiing a 747 must be trained to taxi a 747. Mechanics are also trained on the different signs and lights on the airfield.
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 11:56 am

Quoting FlyinTLow (Reply 10):
A/C are not taxied to MX or to other gates. The expenses for starting up an engine and then riding back and forth are far greater than ordering a towing truck and towing it across the airport.

Tell that to OO who several times a night taxies their aircraft from the Concourse at COS to their MX facility...across the airport.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
GQfluffy
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 1:29 pm

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 23):
What are MX personel?



Quoting Fr8mech (Reply 26):
MX is a common abbreviation for maintenance.

Yup. Just like WX is an abbreviation for weather...
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 1:48 pm

Quoting Raventom (Reply 21):
I bet the engineers get very tempted to take them for a little bit more than a taxi!

Temptation is only a thought for a Professional.Action is Totally Different  Smile
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
uadc8contrail
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Sun Jun 11, 2006 2:00 pm

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 27):
Aren't there certain one-engine taxi procedures in place for airlines?

UA777222,
with todays fuel prices i have seen quite a few 1 engine taxi outs to the runways...saves fuel and 1 can do the job...

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 11):
are trained to also taxi the plane on its own power if they feel its needed. but ramp would never be allowed to do that, but the only power the ramp agents can do is start and shut down the APU for internal power during taxi and operate the beacon lights.

what are you talking about????we turn off the apu at night after the cleaners are done...and fire the apu up in the moring 45 mins before departure prior to the crews arrival...but we dont touch the beacon lights...dont know any airline that has that procedure in place as for the beacon lights....also since we dont have mx here we are "brake ride"trained on everything up to a 777...
bus driver.......move that bus:)
 
twal1011727
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 2:15 am

Quoting FlyDeltaJets (Reply 4):
At DL they are training the ramp agents to brake ride for towing,

At some of DL stations, they have already trained rampees to brake ride.They also have to be trained in ATC comm and APU ops(unless its towed poweroff.)
DL and AA both have tow checklists to make sure no problems are encountered or are greatly reduced.

Time can dictate if the A/C is towed or under its own power. Mainly it depends on airline policy.
Also...pushtrucks use ahelluva lot less fuel than a taxing airliner.

KD MLB
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 2:45 am

Quoting TWAL1011727 (Reply 35):
They also have to be trained in ATC comm and APU ops(unless its towed poweroff.)

Does not Usage of ATC Communication Equipment need an Aeromobile Station Licence.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
ua777222
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 3:01 am

Quoting Uadc8contrail (Reply 34):
with todays fuel prices i have seen quite a few 1 engine taxi outs to the runways...saves fuel and 1 can do the job...

My point exactly.

Thank you UADC.

Matt
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
twal1011727
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 5:38 am

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 36):
Does not Usage of ATC Communication Equipment need an Aeromobile Station Licence.
regds
MEL

The A/C needs a radio station license but you don't need a radio permit to use it. At least a U.S. citizen in the U.S. doesn't..Not sure about other countries of the world.

KD MLB
 
ABQopsHP
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 6:02 am

I was trained to breakride the 737/A320 at HP, and was qualified to breakride the A310 for the Luftwaffe at ELP (HP has the ground contract there). I was also shown how to start the engines on the 737, by a mech, and yes it was tempting. I liked the comment about temptation and professionalism.
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irishpower
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 7:12 am

What is the difference between a brake ride and taxiing the plane under it's own power without assistance ?
 
BigJimFX
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:21 pm

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 40):
What is the difference between a brake ride and taxiing the plane under it's own power without assistance ?

A brake ride is a guy that sits in the plane while the aircraft is being towed. He basically makes sure the airplane doesn't come off of the tow-truck and make a break for it. This also includes some kind of an escort from the airport where I work.

Taxiing the plane under it's own power doesn't include a tug, or an escort and all of it is done by MX personnel.
I'd like to thank me for flying Me Airways...
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Who Is Taxiing The Plane?

Mon Jun 12, 2006 7:31 pm

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 40):



What is the difference between a brake ride and taxiing the plane under it's own power without assistance

Brake Rider is someone who needs to Apply Brakes during an Emergency.
Taxiing is Moving the Aircraft on its own power.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)