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United787
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Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:06 am

Does anyone know anything about the plane in this video? It looks like a either a DC-9 or F-100. Was this a failed test flight? Was anyone hurt?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C74ZXW2NlSY&search=airplanes
 
LMP737
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:13 am

The the aircraft in question is an MD-80 during flight testing of that model.
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MCOflyer
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:17 am

cool video. At least it broke off on the ground, not in the air.

MCOflyer
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BradWray
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:21 am

When using the rudder, obviousley causing drag on one side why wouldnt the tail of fallen off then instead of just falling off from a hard landing?

Thanks, Bradley!
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OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:24 am

Quoting United787 (Thread starter):
Was this a failed test flight?

Do you think?

Quoting United787 (Thread starter):
Was anyone hurt?

Not that I'm aware of.

If I recall the story correctly it was an FAA pilot in the left seat and a McD pilot in the right, and they came down a too high a "sink rate". Happened at EDW, IIRC...

Although the aircraft was repaired, I don't think it ever saw revenue service with an airline, and stayed with McD and was their demo aircraft for the unducted fan (UDF) engine... Scrapped in Sherman, Texas some years ago...

[Edited 2006-06-14 00:44:58]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
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United787
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:25 am

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
Although the aircraft was repaired,

That is scary, did you see the flex that was put on that aircraft after the tail fell off?
 
texfly101
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 7:42 am

It happened during flight test and resulted in structural mods to the fuselage.
 
N353SK
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:05 am

were they specifically testing it for a hard landing or was this an accident?
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:08 am

Quoting United787 (Reply 5):
That is scary, did you see the flex that was put on that aircraft after the tail fell off?

Shortly after this happened, I ended up at Air Florida, as did a former McD person, and we shared a crashpad near MIA with some other guys. He told us all about the incident, and that it had been videotaped. (When the video clip hit the net a couple of years ago, I'd been waiting to see it for 20+ years). He said after the pilots got it stopped, they were quite surprised to look back and see daylight out the back end....
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:10 am

Quoting N353SK (Reply 7):
were they specifically testing it for a hard landing or was this an accident?

IIRC, they were testing it for a landing based on a certain sink rate, and the sink rate increased over what they were planning on and was enough to shear the tail off...
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burnsie28
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:15 am

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
Although the aircraft was repaired, I don't think it ever saw revenue service with an airlin

From what I know that aircraft is in service with American Airlines now.

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
If I recall the story correctly it was an FAA pilot in the left seat and a McD pilot in the right, and they came down a too high a "sink rate". Happened at EDW, IIRC...

No, they did it on purpose, they were suppose to come in hard, it was a actual test, with the results they didn't want needless to say.
 
trekster
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:40 am

IIRC There were a few injuries among the crew.

Cant recall what though,
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LMP737
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:46 am

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 10):
From what I know that aircraft is in service with American Airlines now.

No it is not.
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OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:48 am

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 10):
From what I know that aircraft is in service with American Airlines now.

Don't think so..


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http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19800502-0&lang=en
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
citationjet
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:57 am

Here is the NTSB report of the incident. This should answer all your questions.

http://amelia.db.erau.edu/reports/ntsb/aar/AAR82-02.pdf

.
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jetdeltamsy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:00 am

This has been posted many times before..which is fine. It's always fun to watch.

This was a test model aircraft. The hard landing was intentional. The tail falling off was not intentional. The accident understandably caused a major redesign of the tail support structure.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:13 am

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 10):
No, they did it on purpose, they were suppose to come in hard, it was a actual test, with the results they didn't want needless to say.

Check out pages 2-3 of the NTSB report that someone was kind enough to link...

They had a sink rate of 700-800fpm as a target, and one of the flight test engineers mentioned it as 1,000fpm just before they hit...
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tbnist03
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:21 am

Geez...I cringed the first time I watched that. That's a pretty sweet video though.


Thanks
-Mike
 
isitsafenow
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:38 am

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 13):
Don't think so.

You're right. It was written off.
Frame 48001, W.O. 6-19-80
At that time it was labeled a DC-9-80.

safe

[Edited 2006-06-14 02:40:05]
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OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:44 am

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 18):

You're right. It was written off.
Frame 48001, W.O. 6-19-80

No, I said (to the other poster) that it wasn't flying for AA...

The aircraft was not written off after the EDW accident---was repaired, and used as a demo aircraft for GE's UDF engine....


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ian Kirby



Search the photo database for "N980DC" and you'll see several other pictures....

[Edited 2006-06-14 02:48:05]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
isitsafenow
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:55 am

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 19):
OPNLguy

I know it was you said it was NOT American.
You are on to something...W O was not in the book.
I did note that N980DC was frame 48000...a different bird.

The manufactures book said damaged beyond repair.


"N1002G...Douglas ..damaged beyond repair, Yuma, AZ 6-19-80"
safe

[Edited 2006-06-14 02:58:04]
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OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:04 am

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 20):

"N1002G...Douglas ..damaged beyond repair, Yuma, AZ 6-19-80"

That's a different MD-80, the one the crane fell on in YUM.

http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19800619-0&lang=en

The summer of 1980 wasn't kind to MD-80 prototypes...  Wink

[Edited 2006-06-14 03:06:15]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
isitsafenow
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:09 am

OHHHHHHHH yeah..now I remember that story.......thanks for rattling the memory.
 blockhead  safe
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OPNLguy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:13 am

No prob. More than a few people have confused the two, since they happened so close to one another, and the EDW one had flown in from YUM for the tests...
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
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vzlet
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:40 pm

I'm impressed that the plane is responsive enough to halt that high a rate of descent in less than 50 feet (as detailed in the NTSB report CitationJet mentioned):

"The analysis of the go-around capability showed that if the go-around had been started at 50 feet it would have been completed successfully. During the engineering analysis, as the aircraft descended through 50 feet, the go-around was initiated with a 13.8' TEU elevator deflection followed 0.5 seconds later by the application of go-around thrust. With the elevators held at the position noted above, the aircraft rotated to a 11.8' noseup pitch attitude. The data showed that the aircraft would have descended 43 feet during the maneuver and cleared the runway by 7 feet.

During the DC-9-80 landing performance tests, a test pilot had made an actual go-around from 50 feet because of an excessive rate of descent (912 fpm) at that height. The aircraft was in the 40' flap landing configuration, its landing weight was 124,030 pounds, Vref was 128 KIAS, and the engine EPR's were 1.28 when the pilot began the go-around. At 50 feet, the pilot applied up-elevator and the elevators were deflected to 10 TEU. About 0.5 seconds after the elevator input, the thrust was increased to the go-around thrust, and the aircraft was rotated to a 8' noseup pitch attitude. Comparison of these data with the data derived in the go-around analysis above showed that the test aircraft's engines' thrust was slightly higher at the beginning of the maneuver. The elevator deflection on the test aircraft was the same as that used for the analysis; however, its noseup pitch attitude was 3.8' lower. During the actual go-around, the test aircraft descended 45 feet and it cleared the runway by about 5 feet. The data derived from the actual maneuver in conjunction with the data derived from the engineering analysis indicated that a successful go-around could have been made on the accident approach if the pilot had begun the maneuver at 50 feet."
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skywatch
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:16 am

Why was the nose gear sparking? Were the struts flexing so much that they made contact with something they weren't supposed to? It almost appears as if the nose gear collapsed, but I don't think it did. Did the NTSB report have anything about that?

---Skywatch
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A320ajm
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Thu Jun 15, 2006 2:08 am

The plane seemed to be alright after it had landed even after it had lost the tail e.g. it did not crash or set on fire.
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isitsafenow
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Thu Jun 15, 2006 2:24 am

There also was a buckle on top of the fuselege just behind the pax loading door. Those photos were published in Aviation Week a few days after the incident.
safe
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United787
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Thu Jun 15, 2006 7:02 am

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 27):
Those photos were published in Aviation Week a few days after the incident.

I would love to see those.


I am surprised the tail fell off, afterall I have had numerous landings worse than that on my flight stimulator and seemed to recover just fine
 crazy 
 
texfly101
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:29 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 28):
I am surprised the tail fell off, afterall I have had numerous landings worse than that on my flight stimulator and seemed to recover just fine

lololol...oh how true. That's the best thing about flight sims. Being able to do things that you know what the outcome is before doing them and then trying to execute them and then laughing at the smoking hole the ground you just made.
 
tbnist03
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:46 am

Quoting Texfly101 (Reply 29):
Being able to do things that you know what the outcome is before doing them and then trying to execute them and then laughing at the smoking hole the ground you just made.

Yeah, the ground around KGRR in my edition of FS9 is littered with craters...good times though...
-Mike
 
briboy
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RE: Video Of Hard Landing And Tail Falling Off

Sun Jun 18, 2006 12:24 pm

Quoting Skywatch (Reply 25):
Why was the nose gear sparking? Were the struts flexing so much that they made contact with something they weren't supposed to? It almost appears as if the nose gear collapsed, but I don't think it did. Did the NTSB report have anything about that?

From the report:

"The aircraft landed very hard, and as a result, the nose fell through and the nose wheel tires blew out."

/Brian
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