greaser
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Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:12 am

from Randy's Blog:
Randy Baseler Blog

Basically Randy's 'Big Airplanes' entry talks about the difficulty of building airplanes, and answers some questions regarding that all too famous 787 fuse as well as his (and Boeing's) insight into the recent a380 delay.

"You may have read media reports about a recent challenge with one of the composite fuselage barrels we've built during the development phase of 787 Dreamliner. We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality...."

"This ninth finished barrel was found to be unacceptable, due to some excessive porosity, or trapped gas or air in the fuselage material.Our study of the root cause clearly points to differences between tools and processes used on this barrel compared to the eight others."



"Now, you may also have read about some problems with Airbus' production and delivery schedule for the A380. They've hit a tough patch. But Airbus has a long history of achievements. They'll work through it and will continue to be a formidable competitor."

Edited for content.

[Edited 2006-06-24 00:21:49]
Now you're really flying
 
Lumberton
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:18 am

Very classy blog, IMO.
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
aerobalance
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:27 am

Here I was thinking that planes just grew on trees.......
"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
 
PolymerPlane
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:27 am

I agree. No Airbus bashing at all, not like Leahy

Cheers,
PP
One day there will be 100% polymer plane
 
Lumberton
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:32 am

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 3):
not like Leahy

Has Mr. Leahy ever taken the "high road" when Boeing had problems? (Hint: this is a rhetorical question)
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
Ruscoe
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:47 am

It just shows that Boeing is light years ahead of airbus in the area of public relations.

It is also easy to be reasonable when you are on top.

It might also mean that Boeing wants to keep Airbus as its major competitor rather than learn to deal with another.

It might also mean Boeing is setting the scene in case it runs into problems with the 787. This is my choice.

Ruscoe
 
LawnDart
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:51 am

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 3):
I agree. No Airbus bashing at all, not like Leahy

Leahy bashes Airbus?!?
 
aeropiggot
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:57 am

Randy is classy individual, Leahy is not period! remember Leahy use to sell cars before he got his job at airbus. Big grin
A scientist discovers that which exists, an engineer creates that which never was.
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:00 am

Please find a quote from Leahy bashing Boeing about production problems.

Thanks.
Never trust the obvious
 
Lumberton
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:10 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 8):
Please find a quote from Leahy bashing Boeing about production problems.

Production problems! You don't get off that easy! The question is: when did Leahy ever take the "high road" and refrain from criticizing his competitor when it was having problems. IMO, Randy's latest blog shows a lot of class.
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
PolymerPlane
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:11 am

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 6):

Leahy bashes Airbus?!?

Read more carefully  Wink

Quoting Aither (Reply 8):
Please find a quote from Leahy bashing Boeing about production problems.

Please find a quote from Randy bashing Airbus about anything !

Cheers,
PP
One day there will be 100% polymer plane
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:21 am

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 9):
Production problems! You don't get off that easy! The question is: when did Leahy ever take the "high road" and refrain from criticizing his competitor when it was having problems. IMO, Randy's latest blog shows a lot of class.

Some entries were not as discussed on this forum. He was sometime way out of the line when comparing manufacturers products. Not very classy.

Many times Airbus had the opportunity to criticize Boeing as well and did not take the opportunity. Both manufacturer are quite "classy" overall.

Bashing Airbus is like bashing France, it's all about ignorance.

[Edited 2006-06-24 01:23:37]
Never trust the obvious
 
Lumberton
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:25 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 11):
Bashing Airbus is like bashing France, it's all about ignorance.

Huh?  confused  We're talking about Randy B's latest blog. Other posters and I compared it to the utterly different tact taken by Mr. Leahy. How did we get to the point of a strike against Airbus is a rebuke of France? Big leap IMO....
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:27 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 11):
Bashing Airbus is like bashing France, it's all about ignorance.

Because there's never been an apt criticism of the French...  Yeah sure

Quoting Aither (Reply 8):
Please find a quote from Leahy bashing Boeing about production problems.

There are numerous, including the gem in 2003 in which Leahy said it was physically impossible for Boeing to construct the 7E7 from CFRP
 
saturn5
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:30 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 11):
Many times Airbus had the opportunity to criticize Boeing as well and did not take the opportunity.

I guess you have no clue about the history of statements that Mr. Leahy (who works for Airbus) made - someone once collected and posted all of them on this forum. Yes, Mr.Leahy took delight in bushing Boeing, no Airbus is not "classy", not until people like Leahy will work there. Of course Mr. Leahy could have changed his ways - we shall see.
 
aeropiggot
Posts: 224
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:34 am

Quote:
Bashing Airbus is like bashing France, it's all about ignorance

I thought France was Airbus???

http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...rowing+political+scandal+over.html
A scientist discovers that which exists, an engineer creates that which never was.
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:41 am

Quoting Saturn5 (Reply 14):
guess you have no clue about the history of statements that Mr. Leahy (who works for Airbus) made - someone once collected and posted all of them on this forum. Yes, Mr.Leahy took delight in bushing Boeing, no Airbus is not "classy", not until people like Leahy will work there. Of course Mr. Leahy could have changed his ways - we shall see

Leahy is a salesman defending the Airbus products and playing down competition's products.

Saying the 787 technology is causing some issues is fair and far different than eventually laughing at the other production problems.
Never trust the obvious
 
Lumberton
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:45 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 16):
Saying the 787 technology is causing some issues is fair and far different than eventually laughing at the other production problems.

I just re-read Randy's latest blog and no where is he laughing at Airbus' production problems.
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
787engineer
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:50 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 16):
Saying the 787 technology is causing some issues is fair and far different than eventually laughing at the other production problems.

Who's laughing at who's production problems? Boeing certainly isn't laughing at the issues with the A380. Leahy on the other hand have made some statements that I consider. . . well you can judge for yourself. . .

Leahy once called the 787's use of composites for the fuselage "rushed and ridiculous"  Yeah sure.

This was no gem either: Airbus's response is the �4 billion ($5.3 billion) A350 programme, which was unveiled in December and "put a hole in Boeing's Christmas stocking", says Airbus chief commercial officer John Leahy.

"The 'dream machine' or whatever it's called? I couldn't have hoped for a better name, being their competitor. It's a PR man's dream, but an engineer's nightmare ... It's purely a PR man's dream. I think the travelling public knows that, too, which is probably why they voted [for the name 'Dreamliner']. In fact, it seems most of the people at Airbus who voted picked the 'Dreamliner'. Some of the traditionalists
voted for 'Stratoclimber', which would have been a better name."

'Leahy says he's so convinced the Dreamliner will never fly that he's started taking wagers.'

"If [Boeing] bring out something that costs $8bn in 2008, they're not going to be around for the 2012-15 cycle."

"Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only two seats."

"Unless [Boeing] have discovered some new law of physics or some new manufacturing process that nobody in the world has ever heard of -- and we know they have not -- then they either will be sub-optimal, in which case they will make an airplane and it will cost them a fortune to do it, or they will come back toward the best engineering and manufacturing standards and build a plane with less than 30 percent
composites."

"You can increase the hype, but you can't change the physics. The cabin will look like the A330, and the economics of the [7E7] will be similar as well.

"[The Boeing claim that 200 7E7 orders by end-04 is possible is] typical hype. I've never seen an airplane where the market hype from the PR department is less in contact with the reality of the marketplace ... Those numbers are purely a figment of the imagination of Boeing's public relations department there in Seattle."

Some real classy statements there  Yeah sure
 
zoom1018
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:50 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 8):

I just find something quite interesting here:
http://www.leeham.net/filelib/ScottsColumn041806.pdf
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:53 am

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 17):
I just re-read Randy's latest blog and no where is he laughing at Airbus' production problems.

Never said he was.
Never trust the obvious
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 9:01 am

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 18):
Who's laughing at who's production problems?

So what ? he's playing down the 787 program just like Boeing is playing down the A380 program. Many are still not convinced by the composite fuselage etc.

As i said it's far different than saying something like : "great you have failed in your testings!".

It's just incredible how suddenly Boeing is perceived like the cool company while Airbus would be full of incompetent uncivilised barbarians.
You'll see, soon there will be articles about the "Boeing family" having great values, going to church every sunday, with 5 nice kids and a blonde wife.

This is really getting ridiculous.
Never trust the obvious
 
PolymerPlane
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 9:03 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 16):
Leahy is a salesman defending the Airbus products and playing down competition's products.

Leahy defends Airbus's products like a vacuum cleaner salesman bad mouthing his competitors.
Playing down is one thing, but bad mouthing is another. Playing down is showing number, compare and contrast, etc. Bad mouthing is for example calling 787 chinese copy of A330.

Cheers,
PP
One day there will be 100% polymer plane
 
Aither
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 9:09 am

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 22):
Bad mouthing is for example calling 787 chinese copy of A330.

Bad mouthing is also calling the A380 a symbol of European arrogance.
Never trust the obvious
 
PolymerPlane
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 9:19 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 23):
Bad mouthing is also calling the A380 a symbol of European arrogance.


I have never heard Randy made this statement. Care to provide any proof of your allegation?

However, a "short list" of Leahy bad mouthing 787

http://www.ifdg.net/forum/index.php?act=Attach&type=post&id=1499

Cheers,
PP
One day there will be 100% polymer plane
 
jacobin777
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 9:29 am

Quoting Ruscoe (Reply 5):

It is also easy to be reasonable when you are on top.

with Airbus management, its called "hubris" and that's what most people hate about Airbus management, not that fact they make killer planes and they have loads of talent...

Leahy feels the need to put down the competition at every chance he gets...like his "777 killer", "chinese A330" comments...or Forgeards ": "We don't need to react to the presentation of this plane." comment....

during the "official" launch of the A350, Leahy and Forgeard where having some love fest bashing the competition...made me want to puke  yuck 

when the A380 first flight took off, I read numerous places of Boeing mangement congratulating Airbus...
"Up the Irons!"
 
saturn5
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:20 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 23):
Bad mouthing is also calling the A380 a symbol of European arrogance.

And who said so, I guarantee you it was not anybody from Boeing. Just to remind you - we are talking about what Boeing/Airbus executives say about their counterparts, not what newspapers print.
 
User avatar
Revelation
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:25 am

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 22):
Leahy defends Airbus's products like a vacuum cleaner salesman bad mouthing his competitors.
Playing down is one thing, but bad mouthing is another. Playing down is showing number, compare and contrast, etc. Bad mouthing is for example calling 787 chinese copy of A330.

Not to disrupt a good Leahy bashing session, but the "Chinese copy" comment comes from none other than the EADS Co-CEO and current man of the moment, Noel Forgeard.

Ref:

http://www.flug-revue.rotor.com/FRheft/FRHeft06/FRH0607/FR0607a.htm
Inspiration, move me brightly!
 
zoom1018
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:34 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 25):
during the "official" launch of the A350, Leahy and Forgeard where having some love fest bashing the competition...made me want to puke

That is so true!!!

Has Boeing ever stated these towards Airbus?

"I've never seen an airplane where the market hype from the PR department is less in contact with the reality of the marketplace."


"Those numbers are purely a figment of the imagination of Boeing's public relations department there in Seattle"

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/182692_airbus19.html
 
ebbuk
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:42 am

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 4):
Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 3):
not like Leahy

Has Mr. Leahy ever taken the "high road" when Boeing had problems? (Hint: this is a rhetorical question)

Yes he is American isn't he? Time you had him back me thinks. Nice fellow, a bit mouthy that's all.

No actually the Europeans should keep him. It's been satisfying to know that Airbus's success is due, in some part to the efforts of Americans, amongst whom is the head of sales.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):

There are numerous, including the gem in 2003 in which Leahy said it was physically impossible for Boeing to construct the 7E7 from CFRP

Well Randy says they've built 9 so far without much success, but early days, plenty of time to get the glue mix right.
 
PolymerPlane
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:52 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
Yes he is American isn't he? Time you had him back me thinks. Nice fellow, a bit mouthy that's all.

No actually the Europeans should keep him. It's been satisfying to know that Airbus's success is due, in some part to the efforts of Americans, amongst whom is the head of sales.

What? Are you trying to make this into a Europe Vs. US? Maybe we should start bashing Forgeard...  

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
Well Randy says they've built 9 so far without much success, but early days, plenty of time to get the glue mix right.

Are you high on something? I wonder: you come from England, but has a much much lower reading comprehension than me, a non native speaker? Wow... From what I read 8 were successful, and one failed, which they replaced by two successful ones.

Does anybody else read what I read?  

Cheers,
PP

[Edited 2006-06-24 03:53:56]
One day there will be 100% polymer plane
 
saturn5
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:58 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
Yes he is American isn't he?

I thought he was English. But I would never hire him in the US or wherever - perhaps he could do well as a used car salesman.  Silly
 
norcal
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:01 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 23):

Bad mouthing is also calling the A380 a symbol of European arrogance.

Is this what you were referring too?  Yeah sure

"Without question the A380 is a great engineering and industrial achievement. We congratulate Airbus on reaching this significant milestone. The people who designed it and put it together should be proud."

or how about this

"Bien joué. Well done.

Anyone in aviation can tell you that first flights rank way up there on the list of exciting, memorable, and emotional highlights in our industry. You might even add "spine-tingling" to those descriptions.

So, it's got to be a great feeling for the Airbus team, now that the A380 has completed its first test flight early this morning (Seattle time). "Hats off" to them.

I'm sure everyone involved is feeling very proud today. And they should be.

Of course, we have our differences with Airbus on the future of ultra-large airplanes and whether this is really the way passengers want to fly. But that's a topic for further discussion some other day.

Today is the A380's day, and I send my congratulations."



That really sounds like, "The A380 is a symbol of European arrogance."  Yeah sure
All of these are straight from Randy's Blog
http://boeing.com/randy/
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:01 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
Well Randy says they've built 9 so far without much success, but early days, plenty of time to get the glue mix right.

Way to be totally wrong:

"You may have read media reports about a recent challenge with one of the composite fuselage barrels we've built during the development phase of the 787 Dreamliner. We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality. And then, as part of our continued efforts to optimize our processes, we tried out a ninth barrel on an experimental tool and with different materials.

This ninth finished barrel was found to be unacceptable, due to some excessive porosity, or trapped gas or air in the fuselage material. Our study of the root cause clearly points to differences between tools and processes used on this barrel compared to the eight others.

So we learn as we go along. And in fact we're moving forward in the certification process for the 787 by producing two additional barrels with the previously proven production method. And the program is progressing on schedule. But this is all part of building a new airplane."


Emphasis added...

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
It's been satisfying to know that Airbus's success is due, in some part to the efforts of Americans, amongst whom is the head of sales.

So you find undignified nationalism satisfying? How mature...

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 25):
with Airbus management, its called "hubris" and that's what most people hate about Airbus management

 checkmark 
 
NYC777
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:08 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 29):
Well Randy says they've built 9 so far without much success, but early days, plenty of time to get the glue mix right.

Got it all wrong dude!!! They built 8 test section SUCCESSFULLY (and no where were they going to try and join them). The ninth failed because of an experimental process. They are producing two more new barrels to stay on schedule and to continue the certification process.

If your going to say Randy said this and Randy said that at least be accurate.

And I want to add that Randy is much classy guys compared to what's-his-name in Toulouse. I bet we'll hear nothing but scorn and derision from Leahy and Co when the 787 goes for it's 1st flight. This in total contrast to the congratulation sent from Boeing when the A380 had it's first flight.

[Edited 2006-06-24 04:11:07]

[Edited 2006-06-24 04:14:47]
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
ebbuk
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 11:28 am

Quoting PolymerPlane (Reply 30):
What? Are you trying to make this into a Europe Vs. US? Maybe we should start bashing Forgeard...

No I think Forgeard has done enough bashing of his own. However, just in case you do start it, I will readily join in.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 33):
So you find undignified nationalism satisfying? How mature...

what I like is that as a plane manufacturer, airbus is more global than boeing. It has an American at senior level. How enlightened

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 33):
We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality. And then, as part of our continued efforts to optimize our processes, we tried out a ninth barrel on an experimental tool and with different materials.



Quoting NYC777 (Reply 34):

If your going to say Randy said this and Randy said that at least be accurate.

Woah! woah! woah! before you all start spitting American venom at me, all I was saying is that those barrels are not fit for flight, as Randy said, and highlighted by DfwRevolution (thanks my friend) "We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality", the ninth one was a dud. But we all know Randy has time on his side, the best brains on the job, and a dollop of free japanese money. It's a no-brainer, the plane will be a success.
 
AerospaceFan
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:10 pm

Randy is a class act. What a great blog entry! I am very happy for Boeing that it has taken this high road.
What's fair is fair.
 
jacobin777
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:19 pm

Quoting Zoom1018 (Reply 28):
Has Boeing ever stated these towards Airbus?

I can't recall Boeing bashing Airbus like that....
"Up the Irons!"
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:00 pm

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 33):
So you find undignified nationalism satisfying? How mature...

Well at least he managed to get through a thread without using the word "Balls" in some sort of analogy. He seems to have found a way to use it in a lot of threads lately. I was beginning to think I was on the wrong forum.

-Dave
-Dave
 
Bohlman
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:05 pm

I think the bottom line is that Randy is avoiding the clear mistakes that Leahy made by over extending his opinion. Boeing sees the current situation at Airbus, but more importantly, it saw how quickly the situation at Airbus has changed. Randy/Boeing know that they could have the exact thing happen with their 787 program, and that such a change, while maybe not being as drastic as Airbus, could certainly be painful for Boeing. I think that Randy taking the high road is as much him being classy as it is him being cautious.

I doubt that Leahy was predicting the current situation at Airbus when he made his comments about the 787, and one would certainly think that if he had, he would not have made those comments (duh?). Boeing has clearly learned their lesson since the "200 firm by year end", and are clearly learning a similar lesson from Forgeard/Leahy missteps and mistakes.

Congratulations to Boeing for not only their current success, but also their caution.
I'm not pro-Boeing or pro-Airbus, I'm pro-crew all the way.
 
mham001
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:35 pm

Quoting Aither (Reply 21):
It's just incredible how suddenly Boeing is perceived like the cool company while Airbus would be full of incompetent uncivilised barbarians.

I don't know why you all focus on Leahy, although I guess he is Randys counterpart, but Forgeard has led the way in classless behavior....I recall one press conference where he actually cursed about Boeing.

[Edited 2006-06-24 06:37:01]
 
AerospaceFan
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:43 pm

Forgeard has -- what's an antonym for "endeared himself to"? -- alienated -- me as an observer of the industry with what appeared to me to be his rather self-indulgent past comments about Boeing, and that's part of why I wouldn't shed a tear if he gets the boot soon over Airbus' current troubles.

My belief that Forgeard should, at the very least, "take one for the team" and that his involvement in Airbus' difficulties of late looks a bit compromising are primary reasons I think Forgeard should leave. But my sentiments against him are motivated as well by that past behavior of his which displayed what seemed to me to be open contempt for Boeing. What is it that they say? "As you reap, so shall you sow."

[Edited 2006-06-24 06:46:22]
What's fair is fair.
 
brendows
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 7:57 pm

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 35):
all I was saying is that those barrels are not fit for flight, as Randy said, and highlighted by DfwRevolution (thanks my friend) "We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality", the ninth one was a dud.

Boeing never had intention to make these barrels fit for flight, they were only supposed to be test barrels.
 
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autothrust
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:08 pm

LOL  biggrin  some guys take it to personal what leahy says.
Anyway i dont like his attitude and saying that BS about Boeing.

But you guys shouldn't blame airbus for that because most of the 50 000 ppl working there would never say such BS instead they respect a lot Boeing and give a big merit for the 787.

Leahy is just a salesman who act to aggressive and making credibility of Airbus down same for Foregeard and they hope Airlines will believe them.

But Humbert never had bashed Boeing or would say such ignorant things. So please dont throw all in same pot.  talktothehand 

Said this on this forum the a380 indeed its bashed as a European pride object and that's just ignorant.

BTW i agree Airbus should learn from Boeing in terms of Public relation.
“Faliure is not an option.”
 
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:19 pm

Quoting Aither (Reply 11):
Bashing Airbus is like bashing France, it's all about ignorance.

Just to clarify the position for the contributor from France, Airbus is not French. This is something that many US + French a.netters do not seem to know.  Smile
 
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USAF336TFS
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:19 pm

Class act, Randy is... Randy and his bosses at Boeing have clearly taken the high road with respect to the A380 issues. And they know two things very well...

1) New aircraft development will always produce unexpected challenges.
Pushing the envelopes of technology always does.

2) Airbus is a formidable competitor and Boeing isn't about to rest their laurels just because Toulouse has hit a few snags. Perhaps a lesson for those a few years ago calling Boeing a dying dinosaur and those today dancing on Airbus' grave.

MEMO TO J. LEAHY: Next time Boeing has a hiccup, try taking the high road. This way you won't have to sharpen your toenails when you have a foot in your mouth.
It'll also dissuade people from thinking that all of us Americans are arrogant.

[Edited 2006-06-24 15:53:03]
336th Tactical Fighter Squadron, 4th Fighter Wing, Seymour Johnson AFB
 
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sun Jun 25, 2006 1:21 am

Quoting Aither (Reply 11):
Bashing Airbus is like bashing France

Yes, both are equally enjoyable ways of passing the time.
 
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sun Jun 25, 2006 1:32 am

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 35):
what I like is that as a plane manufacturer, airbus is more global than boeing. It has an American at senior level. How enlightened

By your logic, Boeing should tell RR to take a hike. Luckily they're a bit more intelligent than this. btw, beyond suppliers there are lots of non-Americans working for Boeing here and abroad. I really don't understand your hatred for Boeing and the US - it's pretty damn pathetic. If you could try to step back and be maybe contructive and objective maybe you wouldn't come across as such a loser. Frankly, you come across as the exact Euro equivalent of the ugly American. Either way it's not a pretty sight.

Quoting EbbUK (Reply 35):
Woah! woah! woah! before you all start spitting American venom at me, all I was saying is that those barrels are not fit for flight, as Randy said, and highlighted by DfwRevolution (thanks my friend) "We built eight test fuselage barrels successfully, and with improving quality"

If anybody here is doing a spitting cobra imitation it's you. It is not standard practice to use the first production prototypes of anything as flight hardware; if you think that this makes these barrels a "failure" then you are blind. The likely fate of these barrels is to be tested extensively, first with non-destructive methods and finally with destructive methods to fully understand the results of what was accomplished. The full purpose of this exercise is to find problems so that they can be fixed. SOP but you think it's a combo of FUBAR and SNAFU.

[sarcasm] This just in from EbbUK, B787 cabin mockup is not flightworthy! It's also overweight! What will Randy say now? [/sarcasm]
Where are all of my respected members going?
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sun Jun 25, 2006 5:38 am

Quoting AutoThrust (Reply 43):
But you guys shouldn't blame airbus for that because most of the 50 000 ppl working there would never say such BS instead they respect a lot Boeing and give a big merit for the 787.

Well, if Airbus is gonna hire the guy, then I guess Airbus should take the criticism or reward of his actions. Airbus is not a victim here - they are in control of their own destiny.

I understand your point about the employees vs Leahy but as head of Sales, he IS Airbus.

-Dave
-Dave
 
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RE: Randy B. Comments On 787 Fuse, A380 Hiccups

Sun Jun 25, 2006 6:06 am

I can't remember any large commercial airplane manufacturer bashing another until the current management at Airbus have tried changing the rules (past 10 years or so). From blaming crashes on their customers, trying to instill fear in the public that fly on twins over water, to calling their competitors airplanes unsafe.

Cheers

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