amirs
Posts: 1184
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:20 am

Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:47 pm

Apparently Israir cancelled its Business class for this week on flights to NY.
The regular 763 is not available so one was leased this week from NEOS. The NEOS configuration does not have Business Class seats.

Here is how I learnt about it .... I posted this onanother thread

I got my mother a ticket JFK - TLV - JFK with Israir in business because LY was not available the date she wanted to fly. The inbound flight was uneventful. She was suppose to fly back this Saturday night. I called them yesterday to reconfirm and assign her a seat. The agent on the phone from Israir Reservation told me she was downgraded to Economy because they had to change the a/c on the route this week to a NEOS 763, and that a/c does not have business!!!!
He really didnt have any more info. After many minutes of being put on hold and i was told to contact Israir NY.
To make a long story short ... I spoke to an Israir agent in NY who told me they were just going to call me and notify that my mother has a few options. This was at 18:45 thursday evening.
1. To get her money back on that segment - $1200
2. To get the difference back, fly on her original Israir flight but in economy (or rather charter version economy) and then get a free round trip ticket in economy to TLV in the future as compensation.
3. To fly with a "European" airline with a stop in Europe in C class and also get a free roundtrip in the future. Malev, Aerosvit or CSA ONLY !!!!
Non of these option were acceptable. Since it was already last minute i would not be able to find a reasonable priced ticket in C Class to NY so the first option was not acceptable.
She was only interested in flying Business (and definetly not in Israir's economy) so the second wasnt either. I wasnt going to let her fly in one of those "european" airlines with a 3 hour layover so that option was not acceptable either. If they would have offered more reliable airlines. even Iberia or Alitalia it would have been fine. BUT Aerosvit and Malev ???!!!???
This kinda of thing would have never happened on LY. They have the frequency and timetable to offer much better options. I am sure they would have even offered to put her on BA, LX etc Business if they had no other option. Also the way we were treated (No one called us, I accidently found out when i called to assign her a seat).
Though the younger agent I spoke to on the phone in NY was nice, non of the agent had the professionalism and experience that you feel when you speak to LY's resevation system. No one really knew anything here in Israir's Israel office, and i was ent from agent to agent.
After speaking for hours with one of the managers of Israir in NY (he claimed CSA was owned by lufthansa and that both Malev and CSA have a better business class than Israir) i was finally able to convince him that it would be in their best interest to give her a better flight. She didnt even want the compensation on the roundtrip ticket in eceonomy for the future. He ended up putting her on a LY flight, but without issuing a compensation ticket. That's fine she didnt really need it - though it would have been nice after what we went through.
I am sure it would have been treated much much better on LY!!!! You cannot yet compare Israir to LY, even if they operate the same a/c on the route.
 
ly7e7
Posts: 2222
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:15 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 8:30 pm

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
I am sure it would have been treated much much better on LY!!!! You cannot yet compare Israir to LY, even if they operate the same a/c on the route.

True. Why are you so surprised then?
2 things are endless: ignorance and space
 
LY777
Posts: 2284
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:58 pm

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 8:31 pm

Thanks Amirs for all the infos you give us!!!
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
amirs
Posts: 1184
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:20 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 10:04 pm

Quoting LY7E7 (Reply 1):
True. Why are you so surprised then?

Im not surprised, just answering to some comments made on another thread, that now that LY will start to operate 762/763 on JFK route there will not be much of a difference between the two airlines.
 
JRadier
Posts: 3943
Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:36 pm

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 10:19 pm

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
BUT Aerosvit and Malev ???!!!???

From what I gather Aerosvit is not too good, but MALEV and CSA aren't the worst, I don't really see the problem.
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and ther
 
ly7e7
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Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:15 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 10:38 pm

Quoting Amirs (Reply 3):
that now that LY will start to operate 762/763 on JFK route

With new C class seats?
2 things are endless: ignorance and space
 
amirs
Posts: 1184
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:20 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 11:16 pm

Quoting JRadier (Reply 4):
I don't really see the problem.

1. They knew for about two days before they contacted us.
2. I got for my mom a ticket in Business class for an overnight nonstop flight with an Israeli airline. There airlines all made stops in Eastern Europe, were day flights with 3 Hr + layovers. I paid for the ticket only $300 less than the cheapest discounted LY Business class ticket. It wasnt that big of a bargain. I think we should have been treated better by the staff and should have gotten more option. I didnt expect BA or SQ, even IB or Alitalia would have been fine. From the start I could have bought a cheaper business class ticket for my mom with Alitalia or AF.
 
tymnbalewne
Posts: 714
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:06 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 11:26 pm

I gotta say...it sounds like Israir did everything they could do to get your mom back and offered compensation to boot.

Quoting Amirs (Reply 1):
This kinda of thing would have never happened on LY. They have the frequency and timetable to offer much better options.

Could happen, (and has!) to any airline. Next time though, if you feel that extra USD300.00 will give you peace of mind, spend it.

C.

[Edited 2006-06-25 16:27:56]

[Edited 2006-06-25 16:28:34]
Dewmanair...begins with Dew
 
amirs
Posts: 1184
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2003 7:20 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 11:51 pm

Quoting TymnBalewne (Reply 7):
I gotta say...it sounds like Israir did everything they could do to get your mom back and offered compensation to boot

The question is how she will get back. If it didnt matter how one flies and how one gets from point A to B, then we all would not be here in this forum.

Anyway, at first they did nothing, I had to call in to check seat assignment to hear about it. It took them over two days to notify us. They weren't very friendly on the phone either. They didnt even know what to say to me. The first agent said "I cannot assign her a seat because it is an all tourst a/c. I dont understand how she is in Business. We dont have business this week." It was only after 3 + of phone calls that finally the manager in NY understood the situation and called back with the LY offer. Yeah, you could say that at THE END, At the end they did everything they could to get my mom back.
 
FlyDeltaJets
Posts: 1631
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 4:24 pm

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Sun Jun 25, 2006 11:59 pm

Does Israir op every day b/c I only see the plane once or twice a week unless its on the A conc. of T4
The only valid opinions are those based in facts
 
tymnbalewne
Posts: 714
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:06 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 12:03 am

Quoting Amirs (Reply 8):
The question is how she will get back. If it didnt matter how one flies and how one gets from point A to B, then we all would not be here in this forum.

They offered you options and compensation. You didn't like them. So be it. They could've just as easily said, "it's a coach aircraft here's the fare diffence".

C.
Dewmanair...begins with Dew
 
dartland
Posts: 514
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 5:09 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 1:16 am

Quoting TymnBalewne (Reply 10):
They offered you options and compensation. You didn't like them. So be it. They could've just as easily said, "it's a coach aircraft here's the fare diffence".

Sorry, but I agree. That's the difference with flying an LCC!

Besides, I've heard great things about CSA. I bet they are probably at least as comfortable as IB and AZ.
 
UN_B732
Posts: 3529
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2001 12:57 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 1:53 am

but CSA is not owned by Lufthansa  Smile
CSA business is OK, but I haven't seen Israir seats to confirm.
VV business sucks, I'll be straight with you, while MA is pretty decent.
-Mr. X
What now?
 
JBLUA320
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2002 8:51 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:02 am

Yeah I'm going to side with a few others here and say that Israir did everything they could for you. It's a sucky situation but for an airline with limited resources, I don't see what else they could have done. Additionally, I've heard only good things about CSA and especially Malev. And they offered you biz class on both carriers.

If your mom was only willing to fly business class then, sorry, but I think it's her stubborness that really screwed up your experience with Israir. And if Israir's economy is that bad, well, sorry- but she wouldn't have been flying with Israir in the first place-- she would have had NEOS seats. If I recall correctly, Neos is part of the Thompson group-- that group of airlines usually gets pretty good reviews.

For a 9ish hour flight be it in economy or on another airline in C, I think Israir offered you the best they could. You should be thankful you even got options.

JBLU
 
sk601
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Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:46 pm

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:28 am

Quoting JBLUA320 (Reply 13):
I think Israir offered you the best they could. You should be thankful you even got options.

 checkmark  I agree. Israir had a problem in their fleet. Option 1: cancel the flight(s) until the aircraft is available again. All passengers will be affected and need to be rebooked. Option 2: get a plane from another airline to operate under your name. Maybe for the C-class pax it's not the best option, but IMO Israir offered good and generous alternatives.

Quoting Amirs (Thread starter):
If they would have offered more reliable airlines.

I don't know about Aerosvit, but CSA are Malev are certainly not bad. OK/MA service are on par, or above, with the big 3 in Europe. Especially on intra-european routes.
Reliability? Last year MA was the airline with the best on-time performance in AMS.
 
semsem
Posts: 1621
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:06 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 4:09 am

Malev is quite good and they operate the 767. Czech is also good but I don't like the A310.
It is obvious that Israir operate more like a charter airline or like Tower Air.
 
Yirmiyahu
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 2:44 am

RE: Israir Cancelled Buisness This Week To NY

Mon Jun 26, 2006 5:49 am

Quoting Amirs (Reply 6):
From the start I could have bought a cheaper business class ticket for my mom with Alitalia or AF.

From the two, I would pick AF, especially a BTriple7 flight, (although depending upon experiences with CDG, connecting could be a nightmare). Service on AF is pretty decent, nice attendants, not to mention the (kosher) food was better than expected.

Regards
Yirmiyahu
Hine Ma Tov Umenayim, Shevet Achim Gam Yachad