Robbie86
Topic Author
Posts: 305
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 11:35 pm

What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:01 am

I Know that a HUB is the homebase of an airline, but when can you call an airport a HUB and when is it just a key airport? Where does the line go? Is ARN a HUB for SK or just a key airport?
 
steeler83
Posts: 7391
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:56 am

Quoting Robbie86 (Thread starter):
I Know that a HUB is the homebase of an airline

It's not necessarily the home base/headquarters of an airline, but that is often the case. At least one example would be US when its hq was at DCA (Alexandria, VA) when its hubs at the time were at PIT, CLT, and PHL.

Hubs are very large stations for airlines. Usually they consist of at least 200 flights (O&D and connection). They are mostly connection centers for regional feed. Connecting flights take passengers to other larger domestic markets as well as international markets. There could be as many as 100 flights to several large markets served with mainline aircraft, and have as many as triple that number of regional feed from other surrounding large markets as well as some smaller regional markets. In a nutshell, a hub is a very large market for an airline; that given airline runs a massive operation at a hub location: DFW, JFK, LAX, ATL, ORD, DEN, SFO, IAD, EWR, IAH, MSP, CVG, DTW, PHX, SLC, PHL, CLT. That is a list of the hub airports I know of. Oh, forgot one more, CLE... I believe that of all of these airports, CLE is the smallest of the hubs with roughly 220 flights.

Another thing regarding hub airports, they are mostly the international gateways to some international markets. BOS is one exception here, as is BWI (although BWI could be considered to be a "hub" for WN, but WN doesn't follow the hub-and-spoke system. Atleast it doesn't appear that way...

Something else to add here, PIT back in 2000/2001 was a massive hub for US. US Airways operated over 500 flights from PIT, with the majority of that being regional or express service to other surrounding large markets such as STL, MCI, DFW, DTW as well as local regional service to places like DuBois, Johnstown, State College, and RDU. US drastically cut PIT service down to 170-some flights, no longer qualifying PIT as a hub, as now it is mostly O&D based. PIT has lost just about all of its regional feed to support some of the mainline routes, especially to international markets like LGW, FRA, and CDG.

I hope this helps...

[Edited 2006-06-27 02:03:56]
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
Eastern1985
Posts: 203
Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 4:12 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 9:11 am

I may be wrong here, but was the hub concept less common in the 80's?

I know that by 1985 Ozark was totally hubbed, but other airlines were not. Northwest flew from several cities and did not officiallhy adopt hubs until after the RC merger. ORD was their second bussiest city until the merger.

Republic until mid 1985 concentrated on several cities before adopting their three hubs in MSP, MEM, DTW.

Same with TWA. They adopted the STL hub in 1983 or so, but continued having sizeable operations at many other airports before concentrating their flights into their hubs. Does anyone know when that was?

So could the 80's be seen as one giant "Hub" experiement?
 
roseflyer
Posts: 9606
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2004 9:34 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 10:00 am

This is one of the most argued subjets on Airliners.net since some think that some cities are hubs while others argue that they are just focus cities.

To use an outside reference, here is Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_hub

An Airline hub is an airport that an airline uses as a transfer point to get passengers to their intended destination. It is part of a hub and spoke model, where travelers moving between airports not served by direct flights change planes en route to their destination.

Some airlines may use only a single hub, while other airlines use multiple hubs. Hubs are used for both passenger flights as well as cargo flights.

Many airlines also utilize focus cities, which function much the same as hubs, but with fewer flights. Airlines may also use secondary hubs, a non-technical term for large focus cities. Examples include British Airways at Manchester International Airport and US Airways at Pittsburgh International Airport.

Some of the major airlines' most significant hubs are known as fortress hubs; such airports are typically dominated by a single airline, which can fly upwards of 70% of a fortress hub airport's traffic. Examples include Delta Air Lines' (DL) hub in Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport and American Airlines' (AA) hub in Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport. Some observers argue that the existence of such hubs can stifle competition; ProAir's battle with Northwest when it briefly flew out of Detroit City Airport is often cited as an example. Northwest was able to outcompete the short-lived discount carrier by matching its fares and offering more frequent flights.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
CIDFlyer
Posts: 1875
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:19 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 10:39 am

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 1):
In a nutshell, a hub is a very large market for an airline; that given airline runs a massive operation at a hub location: DFW, JFK, LAX, ATL, ORD, DEN, SFO, IAD, EWR, IAH, MSP, CVG, DTW, PHX, SLC, PHL, CLT. That is a list of the hub airports I know of. Oh, forgot one more, CLE... I believe that of all of these airports, CLE is the smallest of the hubs with roughly 220 flights.

Don't forget MEM (NW), STL (AA), MIA (AA) & LAS (US). MEM and STL are about roughly the same size of CLE. MIA I think is a little bit larger. It might be somewhere in the 250-300 flts/day range. I think LAS may be a bit under the 200 flts/day mark. I guess we probably should throw SEA in there too as it is an Alaska hub. Not sure how many daily flights are run from that hub though...
 
steeler83
Posts: 7391
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:03 pm

Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 4):
Don't forget MEM (NW), STL (AA), MIA (AA) & LAS (US). MEM and STL are about roughly the same size of CLE. MIA I think is a little bit larger. It might be somewhere in the 250-300 flts/day range. I think LAS may be a bit under the 200 flts/day mark. I guess we probably should throw SEA in there too as it is an Alaska hub. Not sure how many daily flights are run from that hub though...

Right. Those that I mentioned were those that I know of right off the top of my head. They were not the only US hubs out there. Does my definition make sense though, and is it rather accurate?
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
masseybrown
Posts: 4406
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:56 pm

The legal definition of hub is any US airport having more than .25% of total passenger boardings. For reference, Google: "Section 41731(a)(2) of Title 49 US Code."

But that isn't at all the common usage. How about: Any airport where a number of flights arrive and depart so as to permit embarking and debarking local passengers as well as easily exchanging continuing passengers among the flights.

I don't think a certain number of flights is essential to the definition. A lot of what are commonly called hubs in the 70's and 80's had fewer than 100 flights.
 
nosedive
Posts: 2176
Joined: Sun May 23, 2004 2:18 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:03 pm

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 1):
Hubs are very large stations for airlines. Usually they consist of at least 200 flights (O&D and connection). They are mostly connection centers for regional feed.

But that's not important right now  Wink
 
GQfluffy
Posts: 3072
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:13 pm

SEA is also a hub for AS and QX....
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29867
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:14 pm

HUB could be the Main base where other Sector flights operate to.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
stirling
Posts: 3897
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:00 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:31 pm

Portland could be considered a hub for Horizon/Alaska.

Honolulu and Anchorage too.
Delete this User
 
lapper
Posts: 1536
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 6:42 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:36 pm

The easiest way to think about what a hub is, is by imagining a bicycle wheel. You have spokes coming into one central area and then going out again from there to somewhere else. It isn't always the home city of a carrier in the US, but mainly is in other parts of the world, e.g.
AA has hubs in
MIA
DFW
ORD
JFK
LAX

UA has hubs in
ORD
DEN
LAX
SFO
IAD

DL has hubs in
CVG
ATL
SLC

etc etc.

Now the other issue of course is gateways...  Wink
 
Delta787
Posts: 306
Joined: Mon May 01, 2006 8:13 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 9:24 pm

Quoting Lapper (Reply 11):
AA has hubs in
MIA
DFW
ORD
JFK
LAX

AA doesnt call JFK or LAX hubs. It does call STL and SJU hubs.

Quoting Lapper (Reply 11):
DL has hubs in
CVG
ATL
SLC

Dont forget JFK.
Fly Delta!
 
lapper
Posts: 1536
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 6:42 am

RE: What's A HUB?

Tue Jun 27, 2006 10:57 pm

Quoting Delta787 (Reply 12):
AA doesnt call JFK or LAX hubs.

Thanks for clarifying. It's been along time since I sold flights to the US. So these would be called gateways then.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AC853, asqx, Baidu [Spider], flyDTW1992, Guillaume787, hufftheweevil, jpetekyxmd80, kimshep, LOWS, qf789, rlwynn, thekorean, vpat48, Waterbomber, Yahoo [Bot], Ytraveller, zkncj and 233 guests