jumbojet
Posts: 988
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:26 am

I was very surprised when I called Delta and spoke to a reservations specialist when they told me they were able to book me JFK to Valencia, Spain. Being that delta nor through their codeshare agreements with other airlines serve Valencia I thought I would have to take DL to either CDG or MAD and then I would be on my own from there. Nope!! DL reservations specialist booked me on DL FLIGHT #126 JFK to MAD and the shocker came when he told me my connecting flight would be on Iberia MAD to VLC I dont believe I receive any mileage credit for this segment but it's a relatively short flight and I'm happy that the trip is booked as one itinerary. What I wanted to know, being that this destination does not show up on delta's destination's map, is it common for something like this to happen with Delta and other airlines? Needless to say, I was quite happy with Delta and there efforts to get me to my destination.
 
DeltaSFO
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Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2000 11:22 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:28 am

Virtually all major airlines have ticketing agreements with each other. This is not surprising at all, given that Delta has no codeshare partner in Spain.
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
BA
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:33 am

United booked me on MEA when I wanted to go to Beirut this summer.

They booked me all the way from Denver to Beirut on a combined United/MEA ticket.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:36 am

The pertinent fare rule for DL JFK-VLC:

Transfers:
UNLIMITED TRANSFERS PERMITTED
ONLINE ON THE PUBLISHING CARRIER.
AND - 2 TRANSFERS PERMITTED - 1 IN EACH DIRECTION
INTERLINE BETWEEN THE PUBLISHING CARRIER AND
ANOTHER CARRIER
OUTSIDE THE UNITED STATES.
International Homo of Mystery
 
dutchjet
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:38 am

Dont place so much emphasis on code shares and alliance partners - the network/legacy airlines worked together with booking and ticketing before these marketing ideas came to be and continue to do so. You wanted to go to Valencia, DL will get you there.....with its own flight to MAD and then on the most natural choice, IB, for the Spanish domestic leg. Interlining is very practical for pax and DL/IB will split the revenue from your fare via the clearing house.

Note that most LCCs do not interline - with the "newer generation" carriers, you must check to see what agreements they have in place. In this case, its advantage DL.
 
jumbojet
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Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:45 am

simply put, I was surprised I was able to do this flight through delta being that VLC doenst show up as a destination served.

Actually, when attempting to book JFK to VLC on DL's website you get this message "VLC is an invalid city code or cannot be booked through this web site. Please check the spelling of VLC or use the appropriate city code."

I was only able to book it when speaking to a res. specialist. anyway, why would this be?
 
deltagator
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Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:47 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
I dont believe I receive any mileage credit for this segment

You believe correctly. No mileage credit to Valencia for you. Perhaps if you have a OneWorld members' FF# they can credit it to that though.

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
What I wanted to know, being that this destination does not show up on delta's destination's map, is it common for something like this to happen with Delta and other airlines?

One of the advantages of the legacy carriers. My trip to Oz last week was purchased by the client through QANTAS and they were able to get me from ATL to LAX and back for the domestic portion of the trip. It even showed on my DL intineraries though I couldn't select seats or get mileage.

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
Needless to say, I was quite happy with Delta and there efforts to get me to my destination.

Glad you have enjoyed them so far. Prepare to be flamed for saying something good about Delta though.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
DALelite
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:48 am

two months ago DL booked me from PHL - TPA on US Airways.
no credit on miles though.

DALelite
They loved to fly and it showed..
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:13 am

AirEuropa in Spain has applied to be an associate member with Skyteam along with several other European airlines as well as Middle East Airlines/Air Liban. This may facilitate some connections (such as through check-in) but all of the major world's airlines can ticket you to thousands of destinations using any airline with whom they have a ticketing agreement. The benefits of an alliance include one-stop check-in, mileage credit, and lounge reciprocity.

FOUR CARRIERS TO JOIN SKYTEAM ASSOCIATE PROGRAM
Governing Board Announces First Associate Airline Candidates



AMSTERDAM, June 9, 2005 - At a press briefing following its semiannual meeting in Amsterdam today, the SkyTeam Governing Board announced the finalization of the alliance's Associate Program and named the first carriers selected to begin the joining process: Air Europa of Spain; Copa Airlines of Panama; Kenya Airways of Kenya; and Tarom of Romania. All four carriers have already begun the process of meeting the necessary operational and service standards to attain Associate status, with completion expected in 2006. The airlines will sign a SkyTeam Associate Adherence Agreement (SAAA) this summer.

"As we approach our fifth anniversary, it is fitting that we prepare to welcome the first four Associate Airlines," said Leo van Wijk, CEO and president of KLM Royal Dutch Airlines. "The Associate Program is a new tool of SkyTeam's growth strategy and will broaden the alliance's presence to several strategic regions while providing more travelers with access to our expanding network."

With access to the alliance's expanding network, the Associate Program extends SkyTeam's benefits to more passengers. As part of their involvement with SkyTeam, Associate Airlines will adhere to several key alliance programs, including:
Frequent Flyer Reciprocity: Associate Airlines will adopt the frequent flyer program of one of the Member airlines. This step will help expedite the integration process enabling passengers to get frequent flyer benefits sooner.
Lounge Access: Associate Airlines will establish bilateral agreements for passenger lounge access. By doing this, all SkyTeam Elite Plus Members, as well as international first or business class passengers holding a SkyTeam Member or SkyTeam Associate Airlines international ticket will have complimentary access to SkyTeam lounges on day of travel.
Codeshare Agreements: Associate Airlines will enter agreements for codesharing with certain SkyTeam Members. This will allow Member Airlines to serve additional destinations.
"We have worked to make sure the Associate Program will benefit everyone involved - current Members, Associates and, most importantly, our alliance customers," said Larry Kellner, chairman and CEO of Continental Airlines. "Once the integration is complete, travelers flying with a SkyTeam Member or SkyTeam Associate Airline will be able to experience the combined resources of 13 airlines across the globe as part of the consistent, high quality service that is SkyTeam's hallmark."

As part of the joining process, each candidate has been assigned a current Member to act as its Sponsor and aid in the joining and integration processes. The Sponsor will represent the interests of the Associate Airline in all decision-making situations, as well as facilitate the relationship between the Associate and the other SkyTeam Member airlines.

The Associate - Sponsor airlines are :

Air Europa - Air France
Copa Airlines - Continental Airlines
Kenya Airways - KLM Royal Dutch Airlines
Tarom - Alitalia
Each Associate Airline candidate
 
jumbojet
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:19 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 6):
Glad you have enjoyed them so far. Prepare to be flamed for saying something good about Delta though.

I have nothing but great things to say about delta air lines. I know not everyone is going to like them and they are far from the perfect airline but every time I had to call or deal with a delta representative I've always gotten someone who seemed to care and was courteous.

Any way, I am excited to be flying delta air lines again over seas, this will be my 3rd european flight with delta this year and all have been fantastic. I hope to get the refurbished biz cabin this time around, and I'm even more excited to fly on Iberia for the 1st time.
 
DALelite
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 6:51 am

do you happen to know if it is IB or Air Nostrum= Iberia regional?
DALelite
They loved to fly and it showed..
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:19 am

Quoting DALelite (Reply 10):
do you happen to know if it is IB or Air Nostrum= Iberia regional?

It'll be Iberia, MAD-VLC is done by Iberia.
No Vueling No Party
 
jumbojet
Posts: 988
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:32 am

Quoting DALelite (Reply 10):
do you happen to know if it is IB or Air Nostrum= Iberia regional?
DALelite

MAD to VLC is on IB A320 while the return, VLC to MAD is Air Nostrum RJ

The only pitfall in combining my IB flight with DL is that paper tickets have to be issued. Its going to feel like I stepped into a time portal and went back 10 years! I cant remember the last time I had to deal with paper tickets, ughh
 
B4REAL
Posts: 2557
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:36 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
I dont believe I receive any mileage credit

Correct

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 5):
I was only able to book it when speaking to a res. specialist. anyway, why would this be?

DL (and all the legacies) can book you just about anywhere even on other carriers, through interlining and other mechanisms. And when your itinerary is set up that way on the top level systems, your luggage can transfer automatically if applicable as well. Generally speaking, with the exception of the SkyTeam partners and flights that will carry a DL code (like the American Eagle flights in California), these can't be booked on the DL website.
B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
 
BA
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2000 11:06 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:46 am

Quoting B4real (Reply 13):
And when your itinerary is set up that way on the top level systems, your luggage can transfer automatically if applicable as well.

In my experience on interline tickets from the US airlines, your luggage will be checked in all the way to your final destination, but they won't won't be able to issue you your boarding pass for the other airline(s) on the itinerary.

This was my experience on United/MEA to Beirut this summer.

In the past, I've done United/KLM itineraries, but I forgot whether United was able to give me my KLM boarding passes or not. Probably not.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
jumbojet
Posts: 988
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:52 am

Quoting BA (Reply 14):
but they won't won't be able to issue you your boarding pass for the other airline(s) on the itinerary.

This is probably the reason DL is issuing me paper tickets. When I arrive at MAD I will have to go to an IB ticket counter. I still dont see why DL couldnt issue me an E ticket for the DL segment, no big deal though. As for the luggage issue, that would be great if I simply had to check it at JFK and pick it up at VLC
 
BA
Posts: 10133
Joined: Fri May 19, 2000 11:06 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:17 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
This is probably the reason DL is issuing me paper tickets.

Exactly. I fly UA regularly domestically and for the past few years, it's always been e-tickets.

However, when I booked this United/MEA itinerary, they mailed me paper tickets. Infact, the check-in lady at Denver was a bit surprised to see paper tickets and didn't exactly know what to do with them, she had to call her supervisor.

I am assuming that when you book an itinerary with two airlines who are each on a different booking system, e-tickets are just not possible.

MEA has not implemented e-ticketing yet (they are working on it), so United had to send me paper tickets either way.

Iberia I know has implemented e-ticketing, but their booking system probably does not hook up with Delta's booking system which is why you Delta had to issue you paper tickets.

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
When I arrive at MAD I will have to go to an IB ticket counter.

There should be a flight connections center which includes transit check-in counters for passengers connecting from other flights.

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
I still dont see why DL couldnt issue me an E ticket for the DL segment, no big deal though.

I don't think this is possible. Since it is one itinerary, it either has to be all paper tickets or all e-tickets.

I flew DEN-IAD-LHR-BEY in May with the DEN-IAD-LHR flights operated by United and the LHR-BEY flight operated by MEA. Even though the United operated flights could have been issued via e-ticketing, they issued them as paper tickets for me since the itinerary included a segment operated by another airline, MEA.

Same goes for your Delta/Iberia experience.

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
As for the luggage issue, that would be great if I simply had to check it at JFK and pick it up at VLC

Yes, they should be able to check in your luggage all the way to VLC. You won't have to worry about it anymore, but be sure to hold on to your checked-in luggage tags which DL will give you in JFK. When you check in for your Iberia flight in MAD, they will ask to see them so they can track them. This is what I had to do when I checked in for MEA in LHR.

Simply put, the reason Delta booked you on an Iberia flight is because they want your business and this is the only way they could accomodate you since they don't serve VLC themselves or through a codeshare agreement with other airlines.

Enjoy your trip! I'd love to visit Spain one day.
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
jumbojet
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:58 am

Quoting BA (Reply 16):
the check-in lady at Denver was a bit surprised to see paper tickets

I dont remember the last time I myself used paper tickets. The main reason I am happy I was able to do this on one itinerary is now if my DL flight arrives late into MAD and I miss my connection there should be no problem with IB putting me on another flight to VLC. With having two different itineraries and missing the IB flight because of a late arrival, I am pretty sure I'd be responsible for paying any fees for having a new ticket reissued for a later flight.
 
malaysia
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:47 am

AA.com booked me on US from DCA-NAS before as the lowest fare compared to AA metal
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
AeroWesty
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Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:09 pm

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
As for the luggage issue, that would be great if I simply had to check it at JFK and pick it up at VLC

You might want to verify that since you'll be heading to a domestic destination in Spain. You'll have to pass through customs and immigration at Madrid, but they'll most likely have an onward baggage check outside customs. (I've never done that type of connection at Madrid, so I can't say exactly how it'll work there.)
International Homo of Mystery
 
LGAtoIND
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:11 pm

Why couldn't DL have booked you from JFK-CDG-VLC, with CDG-VLC on AF? Does AF not serve VLC?
 
jetdeltamsy
Posts: 2688
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:01 pm

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
What I wanted to know, being that this destination does not show up on delta's destination's map, is it common for something like this to happen with Delta and other airlines?

Well of course. Interline agreements allow us to transport people to thousands of destinations we or our Skymiles partners do not serve. In many cases, joint fares exist allowing the passenger to pay a through fare instead of a point-to-point fare.

This has been common practice since the beginning of time, LONG before the idea of a Skymiles, Star or any other alliance had ever been conceived.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
ArtieFufkin
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:17 pm

This really says alot about the state of Delta and I would imagine other US carriers.

There once was a time when most airline reservation agents knew how to book other airlines interline and also separately if need be. Now it's a rare occurrence to run across somebody with experience to do this.
 
B4REAL
Posts: 2557
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RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:37 pm

Quoting BA (Reply 16):
I don't think this is possible. Since it is one itinerary, it either has to be all paper tickets or all e-tickets.

If one itinerary yes. They can disjoin them and split - meaning JFK-MAD DL only, e-ticket. MAD-JFK separate res, paper ticket. BUT - one 'trip' as us passengers would call it can have luggage routed all the way, and have two itineraries with different ticket status. For example, I went GRR-DFW-MEX on AA and then MEX-SLP on VW and luggage went all the way through. AA segments were e-ticket, VW was paper.

Quoting ArtieFufkin (Reply 22):
This really says alot about the state of Delta and I would imagine other US carriers.

There once was a time when most airline reservation agents knew how to book other airlines interline and also separately if need be. Now it's a rare occurrence to run across somebody with experience to do this.

What are you really saying here? That ticketing has become advanced, and easier for the passenger?

No it is not rare. People are just lazy and don't want to call the right people to whom to book such a trip. They just want to click it on the Internet. Don't feel your flow so much here.
B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
 
kulatict
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 9:20 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:55 pm

not suprising at all... last year, i called singapore airlines for the non-stop flight, instead of UA, they booked me on AA from ICT to EWR & LAX to ICT to connect the SQ flights... during check in, AA could even get me the boarding pass for SQ's flight
 
ArtieFufkin
Posts: 671
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 2:26 pm

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:59 pm

Call Delta and tell them you need to go to Odessa Ukraine for example. This destination will not show up on their website, unless it's a code share.



1) You may get an agent that says they don't fly there and try and end the call.
2) Or you will get an agent that knows about a single code share flight that is not available and will not look any further than that.
3) Or you may "rarely" get a reservation agent that knows how to get to Odessa via Kiev, via Vienna, etc. Knows how to book the other airline and what inventory to request.

Also be sure and tell them Odessa Ukraine is in E-u-r-o-p-e, otherwise they will need to look that up too (5 minutes) if you are wanting to use miles.

[Edited 2006-07-07 07:02:50]
 
trekster
Posts: 4319
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:47 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:51 pm

I had fun booking a itin that included US, CO and DL as well as BA of course.

These times were good for the pax.
Where does the time go???
 
IBERIA747
Posts: 1648
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:43 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:27 pm

I don't want to scare you, but you better have enough time for your transfer or you'll be in trouble.

Delta flights arrive at Terminal 1 and all Iberia flights depart from Terminals 4 and 4S which are about 5km/3miles away. There's a free shuttle service (AENA's green buses) which runs on the landside between terminals 1, 2, 3 and terminal 4. There's another free shuttle that runs on the airside for connecting passengers.

I don't know how good is the signage at T1 to get to this shuttle if you're going to transfer on the airside, so I can't help you there. However, I can say the the signage for those connecting passengers that have to go from T4 to T1/2/3 is quite good. I arrived at T4S last week on an IB long haul flight and upon arriving at T4 from T4S I clearly saw the signs indicating where the shuttle bus stop is. This was the shuttle for those connecting pax that won't go out to the landside. You won't miss it.

I don't think the transfer will be "traumatic", but given the BIG distance between terminals (and the size of the terminals) it's much better if you have plenty of time in order to avoid unnecesary risks.

It would be much better of you were flying Spanair to VLC. They depart from Terminals 2 and 3 which are located on the same terminal complex where T1 is, although it takes a looooong walk if you go from T1 to T3.

I hope you enjoy your trip.

[Edited 2006-07-07 16:32:58]
¡¡VIVA ESPAÑA!!
 
VgnAtl747
Posts: 1333
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 3:59 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:27 pm

If you're on a DL coded codeshare flight, then you "should" earn Delta mileage. If your itn actually has an IB coded flight, then you are correct, no mileage.
Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
 
jumbojet
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Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:56 pm

Quoting IBERIA747 (Reply 27):
I don't want to scare you, but you better have enough time for your transfer or you'll be in trouble.

I have 2 1/2 hours between flights, hopefully that should be enough time even with minimal delays and if not, IB has plenty of flights throughout the day to VLC

Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 28):
If you're on a DL coded codeshare flight, then you "should" earn Delta mileage

DL res specialist said no and he appeared to seem to know what he was talking about.

Quoting LGAtoIND (Reply 20):
Why couldn't DL have booked you from JFK-CDG-VLC, with CDG-VLC on AF? Does AF not serve VLC?

Thats what I thought would happen but much to my surprise and liking DL sent me to MAD. If you had your choice, wouldnt you avoid having to connect in CDG? Air France only has two flights a day to VLC, the 1st one I would have missed and the last one would have required a 10 hour layover. Thats probably why.
 
ANother
Posts: 1833
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 2:47 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:00 am

Quoting ArtieFufkin (Reply 22):
Well of course. Interline agreements allow us to transport people to thousands of destinations we or our Skymiles partners do not serve. In many cases, joint fares exist allowing the passenger to pay a through fare instead of a point-to-point fare.

Not for much longer though. Your government is going to do away with the cooperative arrangements that allowed this. From now on on-line or intra-alliance only.

And they think they are increasing competition and reducing prices. Fools, they know not what they do.

See: http://www.dot.gov/affairs/dot7506.htm
 
IBERIA747
Posts: 1648
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:43 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:02 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 29):
I have 2 1/2 hours between flights

That should be enough then.

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 29):
IB has plenty of flights throughout the day to VLC

Well that's true. Maybe I exaggerated a little bit.
¡¡VIVA ESPAÑA!!
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:05 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 30):
Not for much longer though. Your government is going to do away with the cooperative arrangements that allowed this. From now on on-line or intra-alliance only.

How would this restrict the IATA clearinghouse from passing on the beyond city add-on to an international ticket between any two carriers?
International Homo of Mystery
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:17 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 29):
Quoting LGAtoIND (Reply 20):
Why couldn't DL have booked you from JFK-CDG-VLC, with CDG-VLC on AF? Does AF not serve VLC?

DL does not have its code of AF's flights CDG-VLC. I don't know why but they don't. In that case, then the sale reverts to a standard interline fare which any international reservation agent at a major airline should be capable of doing. For instance, UA no longer serves SCL but publishes fares between Washington DC and Chile that stipulate using UA to Brazil or Argentina and then any airline to SCL.

Regarding electronic ticketing agreements, I believe all of the US network airlines have ET agreements with each other. Each airline also has ET agreements with its alliance partners. Many airlines have ET agreements with the largest airlines in the international regions where they are strong. Some airlines have said they will cancel ticketing agreements with airlines that do not develop ET capabilities meaning some airlines are moving quickly to no longer issuing paper tickets.
 
RAPCON
Posts: 651
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:20 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:15 am

I hope that they got rid of the smoking sections on IB!!

BTW, if you land at MAD/LEMD from the south, sit on the stbd side, and on final waive to all my buds at LETO twr!
MODS CAN'T STOP ME....THEY CAN ONLY HOPE TO CONTAIN ME!!!
 
JGPH1A
Posts: 15080
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 4:36 pm

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:29 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 5):
simply put, I was surprised I was able to do this flight through delta being that VLC doenst show up as a destination served.

Actually, when attempting to book JFK to VLC on DL's website you get this message "VLC is an invalid city code or cannot be booked through this web site. Please check the spelling of VLC or use the appropriate city code."

I was only able to book it when speaking to a res. specialist. anyway, why would this be?

Because the website is set up to sell DL and Skyteam services only. The good ol' Deltamatic Res system is not restricted to DL and Skyteam only, they can book any airline for whom they load schedules pretty much.

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 15):
This is probably the reason DL is issuing me paper tickets. When I arrive at MAD I will have to go to an IB ticket counter. I still dont see why DL couldnt issue me an E ticket for the DL segment, no big deal though. As for the luggage issue, that would be great if I simply had to check it at JFK and pick it up at VLC



Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 17):
With having two different itineraries and missing the IB flight because of a late arrival, I am pretty sure I'd be responsible for paying any fees for having a new ticket reissued for a later flight.

DL should just issue a paper ticket for the whole trip, if the itinerary is booked and priced together. You really shouldn't have to collect a ticket at MAD. Paper tickets really aren't that bad you know, you make it sound like they're carved on marble tablets or something.
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
ANother
Posts: 1833
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 2:47 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:32 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 32):
How would this restrict the IATA clearinghouse from passing on the beyond city add-on to an international ticket between any two carriers?

Well in theory it doesn't, but at the moment (and using the tread starters journey) IB and DL have agreed through IATA on the fare for the interline journey.

They have agreed the end to end price (and not the price each get for their sectors) which applies via ANY reasonbly direct routing. i.e. the price is also available for NYC - YMQ - PAR - VLC or other similar routing.

Without the ability to agree on the end-to-end price the airlines will not participate in these interline journeys any more.

The DOT says that them agreeing on the price for their joint product is a bad thing raising competition issues. However the prices they are agreeing on are only the prices for the joint product. i.e. They don't agree on the IB on-line fare JFK - MAD - VLC only on the interline fare.

As noted above - this system has been in place forever (actually since 1946 following Bermuda I). No apparent reason given by DOT for wanting to destroy the multilateral interline system - other than the idea that competitors shouldn't be discussing prices. This is idealistic and will simply reduce consumers choice IMHO while delivering few, if any benefits.
 
jetdeltamsy
Posts: 2688
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2000 11:51 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:59 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 30):
Not for much longer though. Your government is going to do away with the cooperative arrangements that allowed this.

It says..."The Department tentatively found that airlines can establish interline fares without IATA conferences and that international alliances have made it even easier for passengers to make trips using more than one carrier without IATA’s involvement"

I don't take that to mean the practice is being abolished. I take it to mean that IATA no longer needs to be in the process.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
Aisak
Posts: 549
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 10:56 pm

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:12 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 33):
DL does not have its code of AF's flights CDG-VLC. I don't know why but they don't.

2 reasons.
First and foremost because they are not AF's flights. They are operated by UX and AF puts its code on them. AFAIK DL and UX don't have any kind of agreement (Code-share, FFP, Check-in....)
The other one is practical... the times don't suit DL network. The early departure ex-CDG is at 10.05 and only 2 flights from ATL are able to connect with this flight (arrivals at 6.20 and 8.15) and for other flights, the layover would be too large to wait for the 19.35 flight
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:43 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 37):
I don't take that to mean the practice is being abolished. I take it to mean that IATA no longer needs to be in the process.

I read it the same way too. I'd be interested to hear more about it.
International Homo of Mystery
 
DTWAGENT
Posts: 753
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:16 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:31 am

I hope you are not flying between July 10 -16, 2006. I just got a notice from IB stating their pilots are going on stike on these dates. The only thing they are going to keep flying is the Long-haul flights. Everything else may or maynot be flying.

Good Luck

Chuck
 
ANother
Posts: 1833
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 2:47 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:48 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 39):
Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 37):I don't take that to mean the practice is being abolished. I take it to mean that IATA no longer needs to be in the process.
I read it the same way too. I'd be interested to hear more about it.

The issue is that the consumer today has three options - multilateral interline through IATA, alliance interline and on-line.

Again using the treadstartes example - he was looking to fly Delta to Europe and was expecting to have to buy another ticket to get to his destination. I'm not certain why he didn't approach IB or AF or BA (etc) that provides on-line service, but a travel agent would have checked these. His alliance option was there too, but with a long layover at CDG, but he chose the multilateral interline option - because, one assumes, that was the best service choice for him.

So, if the DOT get there way, the passenger would lose his preferred option - and would have to substitute it with two tickets, two contracts using the same airlines possibly at a higher price. He loses involuntary reroute in the case of irregular operations, has to pick up luggage and recheck in.

DOT thinks that IATA no longer needs to be involved - but this will reduce choice for the customer - whose best options are not always on-line or alliance.

I don't recommend you read the DOT's document (its 63 pages) but they can't point to any consumer harm from the IATA process, only argue that on-line / alliance products are better and nobody uses IATA fares. If you do read the order - don't believe everything they say about the EU and ACCC investigations. The ignored evidence that suggested that both of these used flawed data.
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:01 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 41):
DOT thinks that IATA no longer needs to be involved - but this will reduce choice for the customer - whose best options are not always on-line or alliance.

If that's the case, then why is this limited to US-Europe and US-Australia, and not US-Asia, US-South America, US-Africa, etc.?
International Homo of Mystery
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:36 am

The whole IATA-DOT issue is probably another thread but I’ll go on record as saying that I don’t think it’s necessary for non-allied carriers to cooperate on pricing nor do I think that imposing their restrictions will eliminate the ability for carriers to engage in bilateral interline travel. There are minimum prorates that carriers put in place all the time to ensure they don’t carry trash traffic because of another carrier’s fare. For example, AA and AS can’t cooperate on fares but AA publishes a fare from ATL to YKM, even though neither AA or AS can carry you all the way through.

Airlines still act far too much like an oligopoly; the case against BA re: surcharges when compared with the IATA process is not substantially different. If competition is to be free and fair, then carriers must cooperate without sitting down and agreeing on fares.

I noticed the times for CDG-VLC weren’t optimal for transatlantic connections but didn’t notice that AF is already codesharing on someone elses’ flight. Thanks for clarifying.
 
panamair
Posts: 3759
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 2:24 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:06 am

Quoting Aisak (Reply 38):
The other one is practical... the times don't suit DL network. The early departure ex-CDG is at 10.05 and only 2 flights from ATL are able to connect with this flight (arrivals at 6.20 and 8.15) and for other flights, the layover would be too large to wait for the 19.35 flight

Well actually the 10:05 CDG-VLC is more than suitable for almost all of DL's TATL connections from ATL, JFK, and CVG. In fact, many of DL's intra-Europe codeshares on AF leave around the 0945 - 1030 timeframe. The real reason, as you said, is that the flight is UX and not AF-operated.
 
Aisak
Posts: 549
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 10:56 pm

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:57 am

Quoting Panamair (Reply 44):
Well actually the 10:05 CDG-VLC is more than suitable for almost all of DL's TATL connections from ATL, JFK, and CVG.

These

Flight Frm Departs To Arrives Typ Meal Freq Begins Until OperatedBy

DL 118 JFK 7:05pm CDG 9:00am 767 D MTWTFSS 01JUN06 03AUG06
DL 119 MAA 2:45am CDG 10:00am 767 B MTWTFSS 01JUN06 05AUG06
DL 21 BOM 1:50am CDG 7:55am 767 B MTWTFSS 01JUN06 07AUG06
DL 22 ATL 5:40pm CDG 8:15am 777 D MTWTFSS 08JUN06 31AUG06
DL 28 ATL 3:35pm CDG 6:20am 767 D MTWTFSS 01JUL06 27OCT06
DL 44 CVG 7:15pm CDG 9:20am 777 D MTWTFS. 06JUL06 26AUG06
DL 52 ATL 6:50pm CDG 9:45am 767 D MTWTFSS 08JUN06 05AUG06


Like i said above 1x ATL and the only CVG can't make it. The JFK flight only has 70 mins to connect, so i'm not sure if you can go thru inmigration and security or transit bus from 2E to 2D... i'm sure it can be done in normal circumstances. But if i'm not mistaken 2E is out of service so i guess it's all done via remotes -> more time
I didn't know DL had 5th freedoms ex-CDG, but has you see only BOM can get in time for the VLC flight.

There are better ways to get to VLC than DL via CDG
 
jumbojet
Posts: 988
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 6:42 am

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 40):
I hope you are not flying between July 10 -16, 2006. I

I read that to and fortunately my flights aren't until October

Quoting ANother (Reply 41):
His alliance option was there too, but with a long layover at CDG, but he chose the multilateral interline option - because, one assumes, that was the best service choice for him.

The alliance in question is the Air France flights, however as another user pointed out the flights are actually on UX metal and I dont think I would get the sky miles credit for a flight like that.

Quoting Aisak (Reply 45):
There are better ways to get to VLC than DL via CDG

True, like DL to MAD then MAD to VLC thus avoiding CDG all together.
 
jouy31
Posts: 305
Joined: Mon May 05, 2003 4:59 pm

RE: Delta Booked Me On An Iberia Air Flight!

Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:33 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 19):
You'll have to pass through customs and immigration at Madrid, but they'll most likely have an onward baggage check outside customs. (I've never done that type of connection at Madrid, so I can't say exactly how it'll work there.)

Unless I am mistaken, when connecting to a domestic flight in an EU country (or to any destination in another EU country, for that matter), you do not need to pick up your hold baggage and re-check it after going through customs. Your hold baggage should clear customs at your final EU destination, where customs inspectors can determine, based on the lack of two green stripes on your baggage tags, that you are arriving from outside the EU. The only thing that could happen in MAD with respect to customs is a cursory check of your carry-ons.

Picking up your hold baggage, going through customs and rechecking your baggage at the first port of entry is a US process.

You do need to clear immigration in MAD as you are entering the Schengen area.

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