N43W79
Topic Author
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2006 6:19 am

Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:30 am

Will U.S. carriers invest in new first class cabins or will they be phased out? Will 2 class aircraft be the way forward like NZ and AC?
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:55 am

I assume that you are talking about international First Class and not the domestic product.

Take a look at the US carriers with longhaul routes:

DL - no F class offered.
CO - no F class offered.
NW - no F class offered.
US - F class no longer offered, although the A333s have one row of F seats which are sold as J and can be reserved for an extra fee.


That leaves AA and UA.....AA only offers F on its 777s and the 777s fly premium routes where there is F class demand (such as services to Tokyo and London). UA has F class on all of its longhaul airliners; UA is expected to announce upgrades and changes to its cabin product in the nearterm future...so its possibile we could see some changes.

Short answer to your question, most US carriers have already discontinued offering F class and instead offer an "improved" business class product....and by improved I mean a higher standard that previously offered by the subject US airlines and not a comparison with European or Asian carriers. International F (or P as you call it) is rare and, more and more, will be limited to certain routes where there is an actual demand for the product....if an airline cannot reguarly sell the small number of seats in the F cabin for full fares on a regular basis, the space occupied can be put to much more productive and profitable use.
 
N43W79
Topic Author
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2006 6:19 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 12:18 pm

I guess part of my thinking is that with fewer carriers offering a first class product and service, I could see some carriers reversing the trend meet the niche market. If most Asia-Pacific, Middle Eastern, and some European carriers carry first, then at least a couple NA carriers could profit from a front cabin.
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13763
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:48 pm

I see it as more likely that carriers like CO and DL will offer an upgraded J on their 787s where you get a product like the NZ/VS cabin, though in a different configuration. I'd expect that product to migrate to the 777 as well, with 767 and 757 retaining the current J product.

AA and UA will continue to offer F on their premium routes (London, Paris, Japan, etc.) due to many business and industry contracts and high demand.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
nzrich
Posts: 1095
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:51 pm

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:05 pm

Quoting N43W79 (Thread starter):
Will U.S. carriers invest in new first class cabins or will they be phased out? Will 2 class aircraft be the way forward like NZ and AC?

Well NZ does have 3 classes pacific class (economy) Pacific Premium Economy and Business Premier..
It no longer sells first class on its own flights..

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 1):
assume that you are talking about international First Class and not the domestic product.

It always makes me wonder why domestic airlines in america call there premium cabin First Class when its really a Business Class cabin...I know first sounds better but lets be honest it really is Business Class and in some cases on flights under 3 hrs its Economy plus a nice seat a drink and thats it !!! Thats hardly first class or business class..
"Pride of the pacific"
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:16 pm

Quoting Nzrich (Reply 4):

It always makes me wonder why domestic airlines in america call there premium cabin First Class when its really a Business Class cabin...I know first sounds better but lets be honest it really is Business Class and in some cases on flights under 3 hrs its Economy plus a nice seat a drink and thats it !!! Thats hardly first class or business class..

Marketing, nothing more.....the seats in the front cabin on US airlines have always been known as First Class so why change it? Calling it something else will only make it less valuable reducing the fare premium (for those who actually pay for F) or the implied value of the upgrade that every Frequent Flyer is looking for.

Pax accept and understand that Domestic F has little to do with the business class products (never mind the F class products) offered on international flights.......US domestic F does offer more space (4 abreast/no middle seats/38"pitch minimum) which is what the pax really wants and one of the few things that Domestic F has going for it over the business class products offered by European carriers on short flights or a Premium Economy product (which is much more a longhaul thing).
 
B6767200
Posts: 69
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 10:02 pm

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sun Jul 09, 2006 9:18 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 1):
That leaves AA and UA.....AA only offers F on its 777s and the 777s fly premium routes where there is F class demand (such as services to Tokyo and London)

I belive AA still offer's 3 class service on its JFK/LAX/SFO routes, while UA offers a Premium Service 757 on these routes.
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sun Jul 09, 2006 9:19 am

Quoting B6767200 (Reply 6):

I belive AA still offer's 3 class service on its JFK/LAX/SFO routes, while UA offers a Premium Service 757 on these routes.

Correct.....I got caught up with international services.
 
BDL2DCA
Posts: 309
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:46 am

RE: Will US Carriers Introduce New P Class Cabins?

Sun Jul 09, 2006 9:53 am

Quoting B6767200 (Reply 6):
while UA offers a Premium Service 757 on these routes.

UA p.s. is three class. First, Business and Economy Plus.
146,319,320,321,333,343,722,732,733,734,735,73G,738,744,752,762,763,772,ARJ,BE1,CRJ,D9S,D10,DH8,ERJ,E70,F100,S80