zvezda
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:24 pm

http://www.thepeninsulaqatar.com/Dis...ile=Business_News2006071292331.xml

Fair use quote:
"The A380 has been hit by production delays with other major airlines like Singapore and Emirates seriously reconsidering their plans to acquire the aircraft."
 
HBJZA
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:27 pm

That would be the worst that could happen to Airbus Industrie ! Hope EK and SQ keep their orders......

Finger crossed for Airbus
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:33 pm

With all due respect, with regards to the specific issue of Singapore Airlines Limited and that other airline, I don't think the newspaper knows too much.

And anyway, there are quotes from top level executives that neither airline is considering cancelling.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
Scorpio
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:35 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Thread starter):
"The A380 has been hit by production delays with other major airlines like Singapore and Emirates seriously reconsidering their plans to acquire the aircraft."

I'm going to guess they pulled this one out of their backsides. Emirates has said that they need the A380, have said in so many words that they will not cancel them, and have even recently hinted at ordering more of them. And SQ cancelling? They've already invested too much into that aircraft, they're not going to cancel them.
 
astuteman
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:40 pm

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 3):
And SQ cancelling? They've already invested too much into that aircraft, they're not going to cancel them.

And are about to partner the route-proving flight-test programme. Cancellation now sounds a bit unlikely.

Regards
 
slz396
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:40 pm

Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 2):
there are quotes from top level executives that neither airline is considering cancelling.

I thought to have read that too, Singapore_Air.

I know it has been a wet dream for A380 bashers, but EK and SQ remain totally committed to the plane.
 
PlaneHunter
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:42 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Thread starter):
"The A380 has been hit by production delays with other major airlines like Singapore and Emirates seriously reconsidering their plans to acquire the aircraft."

The question is whether this is a self-constructed and interpreted summary of the situation by the writer or refers to actual first-hand statements by top executives. And the latter option doesn't appear to be very likely...


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
zvezda
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:45 pm

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 3):
I'm going to guess they pulled this one out of their backsides.

That's a possibility, but it's not a good business strategy for a newspaper. I don't think this is the Weekly World News.

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 3):
Emirates has said that they need the A380, have said in so many words that they will not cancel them, and have even recently hinted at ordering more of them.

That's one of the reasons why I put a question mark in the title. However, EK would routinely reevaluate their situation, not run on autopilot.

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 3):
And SQ cancelling? They've already invested too much into that aircraft, they're not going to cancel them.

Given SQ's history of dumping planes after investing far more (including putting them into service), it is entirely plausible that SQ might cancel their WhaleJet orders now. If the rumours of the contract details are true, then SQ would lose their deposit on the first WhaleJet (probably around $50M) and perhaps another $50M spent on marketing. They would have to lease some JumboJets to provide interim lift until the SuperJumbo EIS in 2010.
 
PlaneHunter
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:50 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 7):
That's a possibility, but it's not a good business strategy for a newspaper.

Probably it's simply the interpretation of the individual writer - the "business strategy" of a newspaper does not always apply to every single article and every single paragraph.


PH

[Edited 2006-07-12 15:55:08]
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
boeingbus
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:59 pm

This is only to pressure Airbus further about getting a better deal. Maybe a buy 1 get 1 free offer???

These are all empty threats that circulate around so Airbus cowers a bit and gives them what the airlines want.
Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
 
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zeke
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:03 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 7):
Given SQ's history of dumping planes after investing far more (including putting them into service), it is entirely plausible that SQ might cancel their WhaleJet orders now. If the rumours of the contract details are true, then SQ would lose their deposit on the first WhaleJet (probably around $50M) and perhaps another $50M spent on marketing. They would have to lease some JumboJets to provide interim lift until the SuperJumbo EIS in 2010.

At the same time loosing face with its Chinese customers, this will be perceived as a failure of SQ management by its customers. The customers will not accept blaming Airbus, the will ask why SQ did not project manage its fleet better.

Singapore airport and SQ still have the "first to fly A380" splashed around everywhere.

Also the significant investment of Changi airport delayed A380 ready terminal 3 which is not finished yet, the delay of the A380 in service will take the heat off the terminal not being open.

SQC in my view will be a 748F customer, however in mainline I think the 773ER will be the choice machine for the next 5 years.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
Danny
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EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:06 pm

Give ourselfs a brake Zvezda. Both SQ and EK confirmed after last delay announcement that they remain commited to the plane. EK actually talked about converting order for A346 into more A380s.
 
OHLHD
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RE: EK And SQ Considering WhaleJet Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:11 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Thread starter):
http://www.thepeninsulaqatar.com/Dis...ile=Business_News2006071292331.xml

Fair use quote:
"The A380 has been hit by production delays with other major airlines like Singapore and Emirates seriously reconsidering their plans to acquire the aircraft."

The Peninsula among others is one of the worst newspapers I have ever read but also some of the best entertaining ones. Since I am about to go to Doha soon I will get some to entertain myself a bit. Big grin


I think they won´t cancel the planes unless yet another delay is announced.
let´s cross fingers and hope that it was the last interuption before the first delivery!
 
DAYflyer
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:19 pm

I seriously doubt they are going to cancel an entire major acqusition program like this. The entry in service plans are well thought out in advance of an order. Throwing the delays into this is what pissed off EK and SQ, but the fact remains that they still plan on having the type in service and they are going to extract every pint of blood possible from Airbus.
One Nation Under God
 
airfrnt
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:19 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Thread starter):
"The A380 has been hit by production delays with other major airlines like Singapore and Emirates seriously reconsidering their plans to acquire the aircraft."

EK - No way. The A380 order put EK on the map.
SQ - Possible. SQ has a history of dumping aircraft early in the adoption cycle. If as speculated the planes continue to be significantly delayed, or overweight, what SQ carefully. SQ put the A-340 on the map with a huge late cancellation of a MD-11 order.

I still think the biggest chances for cancellation are MAS and VS.
 
Danny
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:21 pm

MAS is the only real possibility. However that is not due to any issues on Airbus side but due to dramatic financial situation of the airline.
 
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zeke
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:22 pm

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 14):
I still think the biggest chances for cancellation are MAS and VS.

With MAS dumping 50 aircraft from its fleet, I see that as very possible.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
PhilSquares
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:30 pm

With respect to SQ, I think the real question is if they will convert their options to firm orders?

As far as the 77W replacing the 744, here I think the issue is what Boeing does with the 748I. If they do stretch it further as some potential customers are asking, I think it will have a very good chance of entering the SQ fleet. Especially, if there are further problems with the 380.
Fly fast, live slow
 
olympicbis
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:36 pm

Quoting Slz396 (Reply 5):
I know it has been a wet dream for A380 bashers

I am wondering if there has ever been so much bashing about any aircraft as for the A380!!! Is it due to its size, or for whatever other reason, I do not know. but as far as I am concerned, I think it just becomes ridiculous, wherever it comes from, individuals, press or professional gossip makers...
 
AirSpare
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:46 pm

Can a newspaper troll?

Maybe it's a political game inside of EK, planted in the press. Who knows, a message to A? Get it right or you'll be paying us to take the planes.
Get someone else for your hero worship fetish
 
airfrnt
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:52 pm

Quoting Danny (Reply 15):
MAS is the only real possibility. However that is not due to any issues on Airbus side but due to dramatic financial situation of the airline.

It's just a good excuse. As for the rest, we shall see what occurs.
 
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metalinyoni
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:59 pm

SQ and Ek would have ordered the 380 based on a business plan and not simply because the aircraft is availible. Canceling the orders will not achieve anything unless they have significantly changed their business plans for the next ten years or so. The airlines have specific growth plans that are being hampered due to the delay. Canceling the orders will ensure that their growth plans are not only delayed but never met. Questions would be asked of the senior managment of a company if they were to drastically change their business plan all of a sudden without any significant changes in the business environment such as 9/11 type event.
300, 310, 319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 342, 343, 345, 346, 380, 707, 727, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 742, 743, 744, 752, 753,
 
deltadc9
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:01 am

It would be completely irresponsible for all airlines to not consider cancelling every time a major problem arises. It is called due diligence, and the entire board should be fired if they did not follow through on one of their primary job requirements.

Whether or not any problem or set of problems warrants cancellation is another issue altogether, but they must perform due diligence for the stockholders.

At this point I would say that the 380 is getting close to being ripe for cancellations, but I think it will take at least one more major delay or problem for their reexaminations to result in a recommendation to cancel.
Dont take life too seriously because you will never get out of it alive - Bugs Bunny
 
airfrnt
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:07 am

Quoting MetalInyoni (Reply 21):
SQ and Ek would have ordered the 380 based on a business plan and not simply because the aircraft is availible. Canceling the orders will not achieve anything unless they have significantly changed their business plans for the next ten years or so. The airlines have specific growth plans that are being hampered due to the delay. Canceling the orders will ensure that their growth plans are not only delayed but never met. Questions would be asked of the senior managment of a company if they were to drastically change their business plan all of a sudden without any significant changes in the business environment such as 9/11 type event.

Substitute A380 with MD-11 above, and read it back to me.
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:11 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 23):
Substitute A380 with MD-11 above, and read it back to me.

The only difference is that there's no 1:1 replacement for the A380 as there was for the MD-11.


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
keesje
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:21 am

non sense & he knows it

would be interesting to see though what happens if one of the early customer gets rid of a substantial number of A380s

I think unforseen opportunism by some major international carrier(s) would be a possibility.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
pavlin
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:32 am

Airbus made "loss" with selling the A380 to SIA. It would be somewhat better if they can make order on hold. The EK order is far more valuable. If they cancel the order, the RR will be have most orders.
 
astuteman
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:12 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 14):
- Possible. SQ has a history of dumping aircraft early in the adoption cycle. If as speculated the planes continue to be significantly delayed, or overweight, what SQ carefully

Interesting - on another thread you speculated that "hundreds of millions of investment" was the "ball-and-chain" tying airlines to unwanted A380's they would otherwise cancel.

Quoting Zeke (Reply 10):
Also the significant investment of Changi airport

I assume SQ qualify for "hundreds of millions of investment" ..............

I shall sit back in my armchair  coffee  and watch with interest for the next instalment of.....

" List of "Plausible" reasons for NOT cancelling the A380 other than it's a good aircraft, (good enough to be sold at a profit)...."....  Smile

Regards
 
vinniewinnie
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:00 am

Sounds like every article that comes up on the net and which has something bad to say on Airbus is posted as a new threat on this forum! Why not create a single threat with all of them put together?

Surely they will wait till they get their first A380 to judge on all aspects of it! Does not make much sense to lose millions and millions of dollars just because a plane has delays! Better wait to see how it performs no?

To me that is common sense!  Smile
 
swissy
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:47 am

Quoting MetalInyoni (Reply 21):
SQ and Ek would have ordered the 380 based on a business plan and not simply because the aircraft is availible. Canceling the orders will not achieve anything unless they have significantly changed their business plans for the next ten years or so. The airlines have specific growth plans that are being hampered due to the delay. Canceling the orders will ensure that their growth plans are not only delayed but never met. Questions would be asked of the senior managment of a company if they were to drastically change their business plan all of a sudden without any significant changes in the business environment such as 9/11 type event



Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 24):
The only difference is that there's no 1:1 replacement for the A380 as there was for the MD-11.

See these statements and it will answer 99% why SQ or EK will not cancel the orders, delays and issues are common..... the 380 will fly just like the 787 will no buts and ifs..........

Cheers,  bigthumbsup   bigthumbsup   bigthumbsup 
 
glidepath73
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:54 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 7):
WhaleJet

???

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 7):
They would have to lease some JumboJets to provide interim lift until the SuperJumbo EIS in 2010.

???

Excuse me Zvezda, but your names make here not really sense.
Nobody but you and a few others here on A.Net call the A380 "Whalejet".

But the whole world, including aviation press, calls this remarkable aircraft "Superjumbo", which is true.
(Not only because of its two decks)

I think you refer here with "Superjumbo" to the 748 which is rather confusing. The Superjumbo (A380) EIS is 2006.

Back to the topic:

I think it would be just stupid to dump the A380 out of EK an SQ fleet plans. The air traffic grows in some parts of the world really fast, this a/c is just the best what EK and SQ can do to react with the demand on this routes.

Regards,
Patrick
Aviation! That rocks...
 
airfrnt
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:03 am

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 27):
Interesting - on another thread you speculated that "hundreds of millions of investment" was the "ball-and-chain" tying airlines to unwanted A380's they would otherwise cancel.

Once again a misquote. I was throwing a little kink into your generalization that because no one had canceled, the Business Week article a few years ago must be wrong.

EK has other reasons, most notably prestige and a absolutly insane business plane for wanting the A380. SQ has extremly high adoption costs for the A380. There are a lot of reasons to stick with it.

I just don't think the plane will ever be anything more then a niche player, and will always been in a position of struggling to make deadlines, break even, or make a profit.
 
kaneporta1
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:11 am

Why would SQ cancel their order? With the current production delay, they will be the only airline flying the thing for a while, and all the ads in pretty much every major airport they fly to, are proof that they've based their image on the A380.
Cancel it? I don't think so. Convert options to orders soon? Much more likely.
I'd rather die peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather, not terrified and screaming, like his passengers
 
slz396
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:15 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 31):
I just don't think the plane will ever be anything more then a niche player, and will always been in a position of struggling to make deadlines, break even, or make a profit.

Boeing just increased their market forcast for VLA to 990 over the next 20 years and Airbus even predicts a need for 1200 VLAs.
Judging by the extremely slow pace the 748i is gaining momentum, the conclusion must be either both manufacturers have it completely wrong with their market outlook, or the A380 will take the biggest part of what is a 1000+ market, meaning it will be a money cow for airbus once the first 200 to 250 copies have been sold and delivered.
 
astuteman
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:50 pm

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:18 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 31):
Quoting Astuteman (Reply 27):
Interesting - on another thread you speculated that "hundreds of millions of investment" was the "ball-and-chain" tying airlines to unwanted A380's they would otherwise cancel.

Once again a misquote.

For equitability, this was what you actually posted.

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 74):
Airbus made impressive bone cutting discounts to the A380 and got them to bite. They then invested hundreds of millions into prep work for the A380 and can't write off that investment now.

Apologies if my comment was a misquote....

Regards
 
PlaneHunter
Posts: 6512
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 3:17 am

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:26 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 31):
EK has other reasons, most notably prestige and a absolutly insane business plane for wanting the A380.

All the massive growth has worked well so far, though many people had predicted the end already years ago. And though EK's business plan (as well as numerous other business plans in Dubai) may look strange for many people, these people are far from making insane decisions. Sometimes it seems people have absolutely no clue about what's going on in Dubai.


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
787engineer
Posts: 545
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:29 am

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 14):

EK - No way. The A380 order put EK on the map.
SQ - Possible. SQ has a history of dumping aircraft early in the adoption cycle. If as speculated the planes continue to be significantly delayed, or overweight, what SQ carefully. SQ put the A-340 on the map with a huge late cancellation of a MD-11 order.

I still think the biggest chances for cancellation are MAS and VS.

I doubt there's any chance SQ or EK cancelling. If anything it'll be such a big blow in the PR arena that Airbus would just about do anything behind closed doors to have SQ keep the order since they're expected to recieve the very first A380. The big question will be after they enter service, will any of these airlines like the plane enough to covert their options.

Quoting Olympicbis (Reply 18):
I am wondering if there has ever been so much bashing about any aircraft as for the A380!!! Is it due to its size, or for whatever other reason, I do not know. but as far as I am concerned, I think it just becomes ridiculous, wherever it comes from, individuals, press or professional gossip makers...

You call this bashing?? You need to get out some. Zvezda posted an article that's speculates about EK and SQ cancelling their orders. I think the general concensus here is that they won't. Everyone has their opinion, and this IS a published article so it's worth discussing. Now if Zvezda started claiming that the A380 was the least safe jetliner ever built (baseless claim) or calling it disparaging names (WhaleJet does not count!) then I would consider it bashing. This is hardly bashing.

Quoting Glidepath73 (Reply 30):
Excuse me Zvezda, but your names make here not really sense.
Nobody but you and a few others here on A.Net call the A380 "Whalejet".

But the whole world, including aviation press, calls this remarkable aircraft "Superjumbo", which is true.
(Not only because of its two decks)

Not only on A.net, here take a look:
http://www.a380portal.com/ << "Home of the WhaleJet"
http://www.whalejet.net/
http://www.aviationplanning.com/Predictions2006.htm << refers to A380 as Whalejet

Now a similar search online will show that both the A380 and 748 have been dubbed the "SuperJumbo". Of course there are more A380 "SuperJumbo" references since it's been around five years longer than the 748, but news articles call both "SuperJumbos"
 
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yowza
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:37 am

Follow the crumbs and you'll find the loaf:

The Chairman of "The Peninsula" is Sheikh Thani bin Abdullah Al Thani. He is also an aviation enthusiast and is also the Chairman of Qatar Islamic Bank (QIB).

As many of you know 50% of QR is owned by the state and 50% by private interests from GCC countries (read Qatari elite), it should then not come as any surprise that QIB is one of these stakeholders.

Just as final confirmation this guy's son is a pilot (did his training out of Stansted, I forget the school) and he has had experience at QR.

The picture should pretty much paint itself for you at this point.

My my, how I miss how business is done in the GCC.

YOWza
 
katekebo
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:57 am

Realistically speaking, it is quite possible that EK and SQ may cancel SOME of their A380 orders (and EK more likely than SQ). EK order is so huge that there is a real possibility that if they will miss their growth objectives, they may cancel or at least postpone the delivery of some of the A380. EK won't take the planes if they can only fly them half-full. The success of A380 in EK colors is very dependant on EK insane business growth plans.

It will also depend if the A380 turns into a real money-maker for the airlines, based on how much flexibility it offers (in terms of payload vs. range, passengers vs. cargo payload). There aren't many routes that can be filled with 500+ passenger year round, so being able to trade passenger capacity for cargo, or turning in profit at less-than-ideal loads will be a key decision point for the airlines. SQ and EK have the advantage that they will be the first to gain operating experience with the A380, this will give them some time to decide.
 
jacobin777
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:23 am

Quoting Slz396 (Reply 33):
Boeing just increased their market forcast for VLA to 990 over the next 20 years and Airbus even predicts a need for 1200 VLAs

it was for > 400 seats..which could mean a lot....there is a difference right now between Airbus and Boeing's numbers...which is fine...that's the beauty of all this...lets see who's right in 5-10 years... Smile
"Up the Irons!"
 
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Stitch
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:28 am

While either company may not end up taking their entire order, I can't see them (or AF, or LH, or QF) cancelling their entire order. While we don't know the specifics of the A388's performance, if it was truly disastrous we'd have an inkling. And considering how generous Airbus was in the ordering terms, if the performance was significantly sub-par they'd have cancelled them already. Heck, the fact that airlines like SQ and EK are upset they have to wait for the A388 should make it clear they want the planes.
 
ikramerica
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:28 am

Quoting Glidepath73 (Reply 30):
Nobody but you and a few others here on A.Net call the A380 "Whalejet".

Only pro-Airbus A.net people believe this garbage.

Here is a list of links including A380 enthusiasts, the industry press, flight school educators, etc., all using the term or quoting others using it. Do your own search, you'll find it everywhere, though not in every article or reference.

If you want to blame anyone, blame Boyd. Which is one of your hobbies anyway, right?

http://www.whalejet.net/
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/159226_boeairbus04.html
http://www.a380portal.com/
http://www.ec.erau.edu/cce/faculty/advcir04_003.html
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1341428/posts
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
hz747300
Posts: 1908
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:38 pm

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:39 am

Quoting Singapore_Air (Reply 2):
With all due respect, with regards to the specific issue of Singapore Airlines Limited and that other airline, I don't think the newspaper knows too much.

Agreed - it would not make sense for either airline to cancel their orders.
Keep on truckin'...
 
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zeke
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Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:06 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 41):
Only pro-Airbus A.net people believe this garbage.

Nothing that I have read in this thread or others like have have convinced me this is nothing but an underhanded insult designed and used to provoke users.

If one was to take your statement as fact, that makes the likes of ABC, BBC, CNN, National Geographic, Aerospace Technology, Usa Today, Times, Telegraph, Reuters, Spiegel, Bloomberg, Flight International etc etc who refer to it as the A380 or Superjumbo included in the "pro-Airbus A.net people believe this garbage".

Even the Seattle Post-Intelligencer has changed, it now calls it the A380 or Superjumbo.

Unlike the handful of sites listed above, the news agencies I have listed above have a daily circulation of tens if not hundreds of millions of people.

To me this is the view that it is more of a minority of the users on here who want to see the product fail use it as a underhanded insult. Consistent negative posts by yourself and others who use the term against the A380 and other users who want to see the product succeed is well know, very tiresome and boring.

Difference is I respect your views, and I like see anything in aviation succeed. You seem to only like to see anything "made in USA" succeed.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
WingedMigrator
Posts: 1769
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:45 am

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:29 am

Quoting 787engineer (Reply 36):
Now a similar search online will show that both the A380 and 748 have been dubbed the "SuperJumbo". Of course there are more A380 "SuperJumbo" references since it's been around five years longer than the 748, but news articles call both "SuperJumbos"



Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 41):
Do your own search, you'll find it everywhere, though not in every article or reference.

Absolute hogwash.

Fire up Google and try the following search strings:

"airbus a380 superjumbo -boeing -747" : 135,000 hits
"boeing 747 superjumbo -airbus -a380" : 187 hits

This shows that in common usage, the term "superjumbo" is associated to the A380 by a margin of several hundred to one over the 747.

"airbus a380 superjumbo" : 271,000 hits
"airbus a380 whalejet" : 488 hits

This shows that in common usage, the A380 is called "superjumbo" rather than "whalejet" by a margin of several hundred to one.

Only on a.net and the close-knit US aviation cabal does this sort of terminology have any currency. But hey, be my guest and deny, deny, deny... make up your own reality if it makes you feel better!

Quoting Zeke (Reply 43):
Nothing that I have read in this thread or others like have have convinced me this is nothing but an underhanded insult designed and used to provoke users.

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United Airline
Posts: 8769
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:30 am

Quoting Zeke (Reply 16):
With MAS dumping 50 aircraft from its fleet, I see that as very possible

This has not been confirmed yet.

Quoting PhilSquares (Reply 17):
As far as the 77W replacing the 744, here I think the issue is what Boeing does with the 748I. If they do stretch it further as some potential customers are asking, I think it will have a very good chance of entering the SQ fleet.

The B 777 will not replace the B 747 in the aviation market.

I don't think SQ will cancel the A 380 order. But I think they will place a large order for the B 747-8.
 
antskip
Posts: 829
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:53 am

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:05 pm

Quoting MetalInyoni (Reply 21):
Q and Ek would have ordered the 380 based on a business plan and not simply because the aircraft is availible. Canceling the orders will not achieve anything unless they have significantly changed their business plans for the next ten years or so.

Yep. They know what they are doing, and the A380 is not something that can be substituted. Those who directly compete with EK and SQ will find out in good time.

Quoting AirFrnt (Reply 31):
EK has other reasons...insane business plan for wanting the A380



Quoting Katekebo (Reply 38):
EK insane business growth plans.

Using the claim of insanity as an argument against EK (and, to a lesser extent, SQ) is an admittance of not appreciating how different their business plan is to the old paradigm of an international airline.
 
glacote
Posts: 357
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2005 1:44 am

RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:02 pm

Hmm...
1) Top-level executives had publicly stated that they did not even considered cancellations - at a time where other customers (ILFC) did at least to get some compensation.
2) This online newspaper is not prima facie as credible as the usual ones quoted on A.net (FI, SeattlePi, etc.). At least such a widl claim may lead to google news a little bit deeper.
3) You have a well-entrenched track record of A380 bashing. This should be an incitation to double-check your claims.
4) The mud-throwing attempt to stick the "whalejet" offensive nickname to the plane did not fly passed A.net (and Randy's quote of it). You may consider this strategy a failure and terminate it before ridicule starts tainting your (usually interesting) posts.

I guess the breaking news (from a reputable source) that the latest iteration of the B787 is more than twice more overweight than the A380 ever was - despite weight being its (mistakenly) much touted breakthrough - must have spawn some uncontrolled desire for smoke walls...

You should have tried with the wake vortex issue. The scoop being that Lelaie eventually admits that the A388 has (and will keep) a significantly higher wake than the B747. Apologies for my having been wrong on this one. Let's start a thread - I let you do.
 
APwannabe
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:07 pm

This might, however a marketing strategy on giving pressure to Airbus to have a furhter price cut or better deal or other benefits in the future as being an angry and annoyed customer but still placing order on the A38x.

and personally I believe that they won't cancel any orders they have already made. may be a good time to tell airbus that there is still another strong competitor around called Boeing with its 748?
Keep Rollin
 
astuteman
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RE: EK And SQ Considering A380 Cancellations?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:44 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 40):
And considering how generous Airbus was in the ordering terms, if the performance was significantly sub-par they'd have cancelled them already. Heck, the fact that airlines like SQ and EK are upset they have to wait for the A388 should make it clear they want the planes.

You would think this would be so, wouldn't you Stitch? If the cancelation terms were SO generous (as BusinessWeek claimed), the lack of cancellations after two successive 6 month delays speaks volumes

Regards