worldtraveler
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Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 2:56 am

Delta enters transatlantic 757 game with 10 of the ex-TW 757s equipped with Business Elite seats. DL says they could be used for Europe, S. America, or Hawaii routes.

Delta to add 10 big jets next year
Move comes amid better outlook for ailing carriers, despite fuel costs

By RUSSELL GRANTHAM
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 07/13/06
In its first addition of big jets since 9/11, Delta Air Lines plans to lease 10 extended-range jets that could fly to Hawaii or some spots in Europe.
Delta signed a letter of intent this week with International Lease Finance Corp. to lease the ten used jets for more than seven years starting in July, 2007, a spokeswoman said.

Delta hopes to sign a final rental agreement, which would require the U.S. Bankruptcy Court's approval, by Aug. 4. The carrier has been expanding its international routes as part of a recovery plan.
More at ajc.com.
 
Cadet57
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:00 am

I thought these diddnt have the legs for ETOPS routes? and thats why AA was gettin rid of them, that and cuz of the leases...
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atrude777
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:01 am

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO  Sad

Those ex TWA 757 were half the reason I flew AA.

It will be sad to see them leave STL and AA.

Delta, take good care of them!!!

Anyone know the regs that will be going to DL?

Alex
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:04 am

I guess DL was full of it with those ads badmouthing CO's Trans-Atlantic 757s, I think it's time to bring back CO's ads saying "Imitation is the sincerest way of saying were better".
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
Cadet57
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:08 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
I think it's time to bring back CO's ads saying "Imitation is the sincerest way of saying were better".

Did they really have ad's like that? Wow. But its amazing how much crap they fling at each other being skyteam partners and all....
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DeltaMIA
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:09 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
I guess DL was full of it with those ads badmouthing CO's Trans-Atlantic 757s, I think it's time to bring back CO's ads saying "Imitation is the sincerest way of saying were better".

Its marketing. Obviously you can't ever say never. I am sure there will even be a point where VS will have to buy twin engine aircraft. Despite that there is no way DL can use a 763 year round to cities like LIS, OSL, PRG, HAM, LYS and ARN. A smaller capacity aircraft provides DL with the right size aircraft to dot every I in Europe. Look at it as next summer DL will had 8-9 destinations.
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FlyPNS1
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:09 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Thread starter):
Delta enters transatlantic 757 game with 10 of the ex-TW 757s equipped with Business Elite seats.

I don't think you can assume they will have BE just yet. If these planes are put on the Hawaii routes or many Latin American routes, they wouldn't necessarily need to have BE (though it would be nice).

I could see DL using the 757's to Hawaii to free up the 764's to fly higher volume European routes. Not to mention that some Hawaiian routes (like SLC-KOA) could use a smaller planes.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:09 am

Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 2):
Delta, take good care of them!!!

Fat chance...  Wink

I think it's amazing to what extent DL is going to to copy CO's business model.

Problem is, their main hub is ATL, and 757s can't make Europe from there, so the 757s will be at JFK, where DL is growing but still has much less feed.
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worldtraveler
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:09 am

DL's ads were true this year...in the airline business, no one ever says "Never". They'll have to come up w/something else next year. I suspect some of the Ireland/UK routes will be replaced w/ 757s.
 
dutchjet
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:12 am

Interesting that DL may join the "757 accross the Atlantic CLub".....the feeling were mixed as to whether DL would use the 757 on some transatlantic or Hawaii routes as DL has a rather large 763/763ER/764ER fleet. In any case, I think that DL is making a smart move here - the 757s are very versatile aircraft that DL can utilize in various mission in its route network. Even if the 757s never fly JFK to Europe, the 757s can handle more "longer" domestic services......and these airplanes can replace some of the capacity lost to the retirement of the 762s, for example.

Leasing the 757s is the type of transaction that DL can accomplish at the present time.....the deal will probably be structured so that it does not affect Delta's finances or balance sheet too severely and the lease/acquisition of the 757s will not become a big deal in the court room as Delta hopes to fly out of bankruptcy. Its a smart move, all around, and ILFC likely made an attractive offer to DL to pick up these airplanes.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Thread starter):
Delta Air Lines plans to lease 10 extended-range jets

Cute, until recently, I guess we never thought of 757-200s as extended range airplanes......the reference almost makes the 752s sound like ULH airliners.

----

Question: I thought that AA had more than ten ex-TW 752s in their fleet, I know that a handful have gone to other operators in the past year or so.....how many ex-TW 752s remain? And do you think that these airplanes will find their way to DL as well?
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:17 am

Please don't let Delta put these aircraft on HNL routes. OGG and KOA are okay, but not HNL.
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wjcandee
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:17 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 9):
the 757s are very versatile aircraft that DL can utilize in various mission in its route network

Which is why DL is one of the largest operators of 757s in the world (if not now THE largest, it's within a couple of planes between them and AA), with north of 130 them with the new additions.
 
DeltaMIA
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:18 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
I think it's amazing to what extent DL is going to to copy CO's business model.

They want to hit smaller cities in Europe with a smaller capacity aircraft. What choice do they have? Remember DL was flying to these cities with the A310 initially before CO did. The A310 just didn't really fit over all in DL's fleet. The 757 has developed into that aircraft. What other aircraft should they have chosen? Last I checked DL is the larger airline with more destinations, more seats and more flights than CO.
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ArtieFufkin
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:24 am

WT

Where are you getting the info regarding the Business Elite seats? I didn't read that in the article.

Are these extended range versions only feasible for extended range routes?
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:26 am

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 12):
Remember DL was flying to these cities with the A310 initially before CO did.

SO CO has been flying Trans-Atlantic routes from the NY area before DL, what's the point? CO has been flying 757s across the Atlantic for 10 years, widebodies for 20 years.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
quickmover
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:28 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
Problem is, their main hub is ATL, and 757s can't make Europe from there, so the 757s will be at JFK, where DL is growing but still has much less feed.

Are you sure about that? I know that when these birds flew for TWA, they could make HNL-STL nonstop. Of course that's east bound, but I thought most of Europe was closer than that.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 14):
SO CO has been flying Trans-Atlantic routes from the NY area before DL, what's the point? CO has been flying 757s across the Atlantic for 10 years, widebodies for 20 years.

Why is it always a PISSING match with you?
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KFLLCFII
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:29 am

Hmm, 10 out of (I count 17 ex-TW AA birds on AirFleets).

Why not just go for the full lot and utilize them where needed? Seeing as how they're also PW-powered, there shouldn't be any problem with fleet integration.

But long-haul use? I think we might see some of the first PW 757s with winglets in the near future Big grin
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dutchjet
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:30 am

Quoting ArtieFufkin (Reply 13):
Are these extended range versions only feasible for extended range routes?

Its funny, from time to time, there are references to a 757-200ER model, even in aviation web-sites, although officially there is no such airplane. As far I can remember, the TW 757s are simply 757-200s that are ETOPS capable (TW did use the airplanes on some transatlantic and Hawaiian routes) but other then being rather new and rather capable versions of the 752, there is nothing unique about them. It would not be the first time that the press has confused some details concerning an airliner....my guess is that the ex-TW 752s can be used for ETOPS while DL's existing 752 fleet (except for the four ex-ATA birds?) is not.
 
quickmover
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:32 am

TWA had 27 757s at their peak. They were very nice aircraft.
 
rwsea
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:35 am

This will be a great addition to DL's fleet - these planes are also relatively new - I believe they were delivered starting in the late 1990s.

So let the guessing games begin! I'm going to start by guessing that we could see these planes on some of the following routes:

LAX-OGG
SLC-KOA
JFK-SNN
ATL-SNN
JFK-LIS
JFK-LIM
JFK-LYS

I'm sure they'll use a couple of these on thinner Hawaii routes, and the rest to Europe. Maybe a few for domestic expansion as well.
 
worldtraveler
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:36 am

The AJC called them extended range aircraft, not me.

Does anyone know the MTOW of the ex-TW 757s? I thought all 757s have the same fuel tanks which should mean they all should have the same range, aside from engine performance issues and MTOW limits, right?

These are to be leased aircraft so there is no impact on DL’s balance sheet. Creditors and the court will agree to the transaction if DL can demonstrate the planes will generate sufficient revenue to be at least marginally profitable.
 
positiverate
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:37 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 10):
Please don't let Delta put these aircraft on HNL routes. OGG and KOA are okay, but not HNL.

P.S. This is not a poll.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
Problem is, their main hub is ATL, and 757s can't make Europe from there, so the 757s will be at JFK, where DL is growing but still has much less feed.

Which makes the move a smart one. Put the 757's in JFK where the traffic is O/D, less airplane to fill. PMove the widebodies to ATL where the feed can fill a larger airplane.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 6):
I could see DL using the 757's to Hawaii to free up the 764's to fly higher volume European routes. Not to mention that some Hawaiian routes (like SLC-KOA) could use a smaller planes.

I think you're spot on with that observation.
 
LawnDart
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:38 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 21):
These are to be leased aircraft so there is no impact on DL’s balance sheet.

ILFC is leasing them to Delta for free?!? Woo hoo!!!

Sure there is an impact on Delta's balance sheet, right under the "Expenses" column...
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:39 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 16):
Why is it always a PISSING match with you?

The DL is larger and the A310 was there first comment I thought was totaly un related thus I used a similiar comparison to show the arguments weakness.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
MastaHanky
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:41 am

I would say putting one on SLC-KOA is a given.

I think a few people have mentioned starting SLC-LIH with one too.

I've wondered if they'll give a shot at some of the smaller South American destinations like ATL-BSB.
 
ArtieFufkin
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:41 am

I was just thinking there is plenty of room in Delta's system to incorporate 10 757s on longer range routes to free up 767-300s for Transatlantic service. Hawaii, West Coast, Lima, etc. use plenty of 767s obviously.

Delta might even want to replace some Latin America 737-800s with these aircraft to get those back on some domestic routes.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:42 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 24):
Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 16):
Why is it always a PISSING match with you?

The DL is larger and the A310 was there first comment I thought was totaly un related thus I used a similiar comparison to show the arguments weakness.

No, you started from the get-go. It's a constant argument over DL vs. CO that's getting old - seriously. In reality, your argument started with your first post:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 3):
I guess DL was full of it with those ads badmouthing CO's Trans-Atlantic 757s, I think it's time to bring back CO's ads saying "Imitation is the sincerest way of saying were better".
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
rwsea
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:46 am

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 23):
Sure there is an impact on Delta's balance sheet, right under the "Expenses" column...

Except for the fact that there is no "expenses" column on a balance sheet - that's on the income statement  wink .
 
dutchjet
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:46 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Thread starter):
its first addition of big jets since 9/11, Delta Air Lines plans to lease 10 extended-range jets that could fly to Hawaii or some spots in Europe

Key word is "COULD".....Delta will use the airplanes where they are most effective........that may mean routes to Hawaii or Europe, or that may mean that DL will use these additional 752s on domestic services and free up 767s to fly the longer routes, or a combination of both. The a.net crowd is probably thinking faster than DL's route planning group and marketing department at the moment.....DL saw a good opportunity in leasing these airplanes and made their move, thats what is important for now.

Whether the airplanes get Biz Elite interiors, or other such upgrades, is also probably not yet determined......DL will work out the numbers, its options, and make the choice it thinks is right.

The article says that the airplanes will be delivered to DL next year.....rather vague, I am sure that DL would like to have the 757s in operation by the Summer 2007 schedule.
 
moman
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:48 am

What happeend to the other TWA 757s.

The ex-TWA birds are nicer than AA birds. Wish they would keep 'em around. It's been 2 years since I've been put on one, and the AA 757s look old and have the boob tube TV's instead of the flip down LCDs like the TWA jets.
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:50 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 27):
No, you started from the get-go. It's a constant argument over DL vs. CO that's getting old - seriously. In reality, your argument started with your first post

How could I not point out how hypocritical DL is being by bashing the Trans-Altantic 757 product one mintue and then turning around and endorsing it, DL's decisions over the years shows a total lack of direction which is probably why they are in the shape they are in.

DL Express, SONG, I don't even remember how many times they changed their color schemes, build a new JFK facility, don't build a new JFK facility, drop LAX-Mexico City, add LAX-Mexico flights, build a new BOS terminal, reduce BOS flying, bad mouth CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product, copy CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product.

How can one not critisize such flip-flopping.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
DualQual
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:50 am

Quoting ArtieFufkin (Reply 26):
I was just thinking there is plenty of room in Delta's system to incorporate 10 757s on longer range routes to free up 767-300s for Transatlantic service. Hawaii, West Coast, Lima, etc. use plenty of 767s obviously.

All of those are good possibilities however Lima is a -400 due to the amount of cargo revenue that is generated from there. I would anticipate it remaining that way. West coast-Hawaii is a good bet. Obviously ATL-Hawaii is well beyond the range of the airplane.
There's no known cure for stupid
 
alphaomega
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:51 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
Problem is, their main hub is ATL, and 757s can't make Europe from there, so the 757s will be at JFK, where DL is growing but still has much less feed.

Where did you get that from? The RR-powered 752s can usually make it from Florida to London non-stop and with 213 pax...I'm sure DL's 752s are configured with less, and from ATL, wouldn't be a problem. I could be wrong tho...not sure how the PW's fair compared to the RR's
 
mcg
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:51 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 21):
These are to be leased aircraft so there is no impact on DL's balance sheet.

ILFC is leasing them to Delta for free?!? Woo hoo!!!

Sure there is an impact on Delta's balance sheet, right under the "Expenses" column...


"Expenses" aren't noted on any company's balance sheet, "expenses" appear on the income statement.

It's reasonable to expect that this transaction will be structured as an operating lease, thus avoiding any impact to Delta's balance sheet. Monthly rental payments will appear as expenses on Delta's income statement.
 
kyair
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:53 am

Quoting LawnDart (Reply 23):
Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 21):
These are to be leased aircraft so there is no impact on DL's balance sheet.

ILFC is leasing them to Delta for free?!? Woo hoo!!!

Sure there is an impact on Delta's balance sheet, right under the "Expenses" column...

Sorry, but you're confusing balance sheet with income statement. Since DL will not own the aircraft, it will not reflect on their balance sheet as either an asset or liability. The lease expense will appear on the income statement, just as you said under expenses.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened - Dr. Seuss
 
ikramerica
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:10 am

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 12):
Last I checked DL is the larger airline with more destinations

Check again. You are wrong. CO has the most destinations of any airline in the world.

Quoting Positiverate (Reply 22):
Put the 757's in JFK where the traffic is O/D, less airplane to fill.

True, but if you are then also talking into smaller cities, it gets tight. Or are they going to do LGW, CDG and FRA with 757s from JFK?

Quoting Alphaomega (Reply 33):
Where did you get that from? The RR-powered 752s can usually make it from Florida to London non-stop and with 213 pax...I'm sure DL's 752s are configured with less, and from ATL, wouldn't be a problem. I could be wrong tho...

You are.

Are we talking England or are we talking all of Europe.

ATL-LGW is long enough, but to places like HAM or MAD?

CO can get the 757 CLE-LGW or other parts of the UK without issue. It's onward into Europe where it becomes an issue, and it will for DL from ATL, too. CLE-CDG is barely doable, ATL-CDG is further.

ATL-CDG is 3800nm. No 757 is going to make that westbound!

Anything 3500nm (map distance) or greater is going to involve regular fuel stops, especially with the nasty ATL summer delays...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
DeltaMIA
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:14 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 24):
The DL is larger and the A310 was there first comment I thought was totaly un related thus I used a similiar comparison to show the arguments weakness.

You mean to say you were simply stating that CO flew 757's across the Atlantic and are upset that it is possible DL will. Sorry I took a bit deeper and thought you meant that it was CO and not DL, as well as their predecessor's, that knew certain markets can only be served with lower capacity aircraft. Well I am mistaken and apologize. Good job CO on finding the ONLY plane, and apparently making it their own, that can serve cities like LIS, EDI, CGN, etc. No other airline has the right to fly there now unless they do so with a different aircraft.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 14):
SO CO has been flying Trans-Atlantic routes from the NY area before DL, what's the point? CO has been flying 757s across the Atlantic for 10 years, widebodies for 20 years.

Again congrats to them. DL is going to expand Internationally. CO can't either take the heat or get out the kitchen. You can't honestly complain that DL is expanding. I honestly don't believe they are targeting CO, but they need the planes. DL wants cities like OTP, WAW, LIS, LED, PRG, HEL, ARN, etc. and in order to do it they either need new planes or a plane that will allow them to free up other aircraft. Other carriers do fly 757's overseas. And other airlines do fly Internationally from NYC.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
aanyc
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:14 am

Where in the article does it mention 757's? Could these then be something else other than the ex-TW 75's.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:15 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
DL Express, SONG

Different managements.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
I don't even remember how many times they changed their color schemes

Different managements.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
build a new JFK facility, don't build a new JFK facility,

Um, there was this tiny, unimportant incident called 9/11 that might have had something to do with that.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
drop LAX-Mexico City, add LAX-Mexico flights,

DL dropped LAX-MEX, and AM dropped ATL-MEX, so what's the problem?

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
build a new BOS terminal, reduce BOS flying,

Different managements.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
bad mouth CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product, copy CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product.

Hmm, maybe Delta should sue CO for copying them by flying 767s transatlantic.

Seriously, some of this talk is ridiculous, and turning into just another p!ssing match about whether CO or DL owns the transatlantic business. Seriously, both sides, LEAVE IT THE F*CK ALONE, DAMMIT!

Okay, so with that off my chest, now while the 757s could be used across the pond, and probably will, there are other markets that will come first, and that will likely already require most of these 757s. Those routes being existing Hawaiian routes like SLC-OGG/KOA, LAX-OGG, and new routes like SLC-LIH (a given) and perhaps LAX-KOA/LIH. Then of course, LatAm/Caribbean expansion from JFK, as has been planned since the days of Mullin, namely JFK-LIM/BOG/SJO, and perhaps weekend-only services to SXM, BGI, and perhaps a few other places. Until DL officially announces a 757 transatlantic route, all this back-and-forth b!tching is just a waste of bandwidth.
 
BlueShamu330s
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:17 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 7):
I think it's amazing to what extent DL is going to to copy CO's business model.

You know what they say about immitation and flattery.

So another member of the same alliance is taking a leaf out of another's book.... Bravo, I say.

It's a win win win situation for Delta.

I can't imagine the lease rates are going to be through the roof for these birds.

Integration into the fleet is a relative walk in the park.

Fight fire with fire.... If AA, US, CO and Privatair can do it... and it seems to be making $$$ , then why not ?!

I can see JFK - DUB,SNN,MAN, possibly one CVG - LGW definitely going the 757 way in winter.

However, I think more certain is the possibility that they will be deployed on current 763 central america / caribbean routes to release more widebodies for transatlantic service.

The one question I have though, is would Delta have problem sending 757 crews transatlantic without a major renegotiation of their terms? Just a wild thought that came to my mind, so any educated response to clear my ignorance of internal agreements would be appreciated!

Shamu
So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:18 am

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 37):
You can't honestly complain that DL is expanding.

Im complaining about DL being hypocritical when it comes to Trans-Atlantic 757 product, one minute they bad mouth it in the NY papers and now they endorse the product.
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DeltaMIA
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:23 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 36):
Check again. You are wrong. CO has the most destinations of any airline in the world.

Sorry DL has 295 destinations to CO's 292.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):
DL Express, SONG, I don't even remember how many times they changed their color schemes, build a new JFK facility, don't build a new JFK facility, drop LAX-Mexico City, add LAX-Mexico flights, build a new BOS terminal, reduce BOS flying, bad mouth CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product, copy CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product.

Show's different mindset of management. When DL's June numbers come out they will announce a profit for the month. So this management seems to have them headed the right way.
In regards to the 757. DL didn't actually say where the planes will be used other than say they could be used for Europe. You are speculating that they will be.
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dutchjet
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:24 am

Quoting Alphaomega (Reply 33):
Where did you get that from? The RR-powered 752s can usually make it from Florida to London non-stop and with 213 pax...

The 757s can make it from Florida to London with a stop in Bangor.....while its still unclear what missions the new 757s will undertake, and whether DL will actually send them to Europe, we will not be seeing 757s flying any ATL-Europe flights.....if anything, look for 752s on the JFK-UK routes.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 31):

How could I not point out how hypocritical DL is being by bashing the Trans-Altantic 757 product one mintue and then turning around and endorsing it, DL's decisions over the years shows a total lack of direction which is probably why they are in the shape they are in.

DL Express, SONG, I don't even remember how many times they changed their color schemes, build a new JFK facility, don't build a new JFK facility, drop LAX-Mexico City, add LAX-Mexico flights, build a new BOS terminal, reduce BOS flying, bad mouth CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product, copy CO's Trans-Atlantic 757 product.

How can one not critisize such flip-flopping.

Can we please not do the Delta vs Continental thing again?! Nobody wins in these discussions, believe me I know (and this is something that even WT and I can probably agree on.)

Is DL taking a page out of the CO play book by sending 757s to Europe....we dont know yet, all that the article in the newpaper said is that the 757s COULD be used on DL flights to Europe and Hawaii, as I said above, DL has not scheduled or allocated these aircraft yet, the deal was just announced today. It is very possible that DL will use the 757 on select European routes, JFK-UK makes the most sense.......just like CO does....so what? CO found a formula that works, the other airlines noticed and are going to try the same thing (US with the ex-ATA 752s, AA is already flying 757s out of BOS to MAN and Ireland, NW is rumored to be thinking about DTW-Ireland/UK with the 752) and DL will consider doing it also......the question is whether DL and other US carriers can duplicate CO's success? That remains to be seen. As much as I am a CO fan, I dont think its fair to be critical of DL for trying.

Yes, its true that DL has been "all over the place" in recent years and it got them into trouble, big trouble, they are now attempting to fix their problems and, from what we are hearing, DL may have learned from its mistakes.

With oil nearing $77/bbl today, there are bigger problems for the airlines to worry about.
 
peachair
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:25 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Thread starter):
Delta enters transatlantic 757 game with 10 of the ex-TW 757s equipped with Business Elite seats. DL says they could be used for Europe, S. America, or Hawaii routes.

I read the AJC article twice, it says nothing about what type of A/C these are, just that they are "big jets". How do you know they are ex-TWA 757's?
 
RandyWaldron
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:31 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Thread starter):
Delta enters transatlantic 757 game with 10 of the ex-TW 757s equipped with Business Elite seats. DL says they could be used for Europe, S. America, or Hawaii routes.

The article in the Atlanta Journal Constitution makes no references to the type of aircrafts Delta will be leasing from ILFC.

Delta has yet to issue a press release regarding this aircraft acquisition.

So, how can anyone [without inside information] be certain that Delta is acquiring the ex-TWA 757's? This thread is pure conjecture without facts to back up the statement WorldTraveler made at the start of this discussion.

Bucky707 has stated that DL will be acquiring the ex-TWA, now AA 757's. Thanks for the inside information, Bucky!

[Edited 2006-07-13 21:42:04]
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DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:34 am

Quoting RandyWaldron (Reply 45):
So, how can anyone [without inside information] be certain that Delta is acquiring the ex-TWA 757's? This thread is pure conjecture without facts to back up the statement WorldTraveler made at the start of this discussion.

Just using pure logic. There are not enough used 763s on the market, and neither are 772ER. And we all know that DL won't be adding a new (or old) plane type, so A330/340/MD-11/747 are out of the picture as well. So what would be left? Only 757s.
 
bucky707
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:37 am

Quoting RandyWaldron (Reply 45):
So, how can anyone [without inside information] be certain that Delta is acquiring the ex-TWA 757's? This thread is pure conjecture without facts to back up the statement WorldTraveler made at the start of this discussion.

in an online chat with employees today, it was announced that Delta would be getting ex-AA/TWA 757s.
 
TWFirst
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:43 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 39):
Um, there was this tiny, unimportant incident called 9/11 that might have had something to do with that.

Didn't stop AA.
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DAYflyer
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RE: Delta To Acquire Ex-TW 757s For Int'l Routes

Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:50 am

I was thinking that they might use two of the 757 to free up a 777 for a transatlantic route. I know they still run a 777 or 767-300 between MCO-ATL sometimes which seems like a waste if they need some capacity over the pond.
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