duke
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Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Tue Jul 25, 2006 8:46 pm

N7470, the first Boeing 747, was built with the original configuration of three upper deck windows on each side.

Now look at these pictures:


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Photo © Gerard Helmer


In 1982, the plane has the full 10 upper deck windows, at least on the side taken in this photograph.


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Photo © Joe G. Walker


But here in 1995, it is once again with three windows on that side!


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Photo © Ryan J. Pearl


This more recent picture from 2004 confirms the three windows on the other side.

So what did they do to this plane? Did they install the ten windows on just one side or on both, and why did they plug them? Or did they rebuild it in the original skin configuration? I can't seem to see any plugs in the large version of the photo above.
 
Skymonster
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Tue Jul 25, 2006 9:21 pm

They painted the extra windows on the side to make it appear like it had extra upper deck windows. Check the top photo. The real windows are covered over (like the lower deck windows) whereas the black paint is left as it is. From some angles, if you look closely at #1 in BFI today, you can still just about make out where the extra "windows" were painted on.

Andy
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duke
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Tue Jul 25, 2006 10:19 pm

I see. These confusions abound in plane spotting...
 
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falstaff
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting Skymonster (Reply 1):
They painted the extra windows on the side to make it appear like it had extra upper deck windows.

Why would they paint on windows? That seems kind of silly to go through the hastle of painting. It reminds me of people who stick dual exhuast on their car, but really on have a single or have hood scoops going to nothing.
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dtwclipper
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 1:43 am

Quoting Falstaff (Reply 3):
Why would they paint on windows?

I suspect as a marketing technique.

It's also worth noting, that Capitol, LY and BN, for example, painted the windows of their DC-4's with a square outline, so that people would think they were the more modern DC-6.

Look closely at this Capitol DC-4 and not the square outlines on the oval windows!

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Photo © Mel Lawrence




Same thing on Trans Carib!

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Photo © Mel Lawrence

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egnr
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 2:05 am

Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 4):
Quoting Falstaff (Reply 3):
Why would they paint on windows?

I suspect as a marketing technique.

It may have been to highlight the option for 10 windows...

In a similar vein, A340-600 F-WWCA (owned by Airbus) has a painted on overwing exit. This aircraft was constructed without the exit, and can therefore not go into passenger service. But when Airbus revised their house livery, they painted on the overwing exit to make it look like all other A346s.


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Photo © Kristof Jonckheere
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Photo © Belpix - AirTeamImages

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rikkus67
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 2:29 am

Quote:
Why would they paint on windows?

...or paint fake windows?

In the case of windows, this is how the term "cheat-line" came into being.

It is a litteral term, cheating the eye to see something else. In the case of the prototype 747 upperdeck windows, perhaps we can call it the "cheat-glass"?
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kl5147
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 4:43 am

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 6):
...or paint fake windows?

It still happens today. Look at this Qantas 747. See there are 7 windows painted grey/black, left of door #2. Compare it to the 4 blinded/plugged (white) windows on the upper deck.

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Photo © Jason Milligan

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vv701
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 9:59 am

Nevertheless all initial production of the 741 and 742 had three-window upper cabins that were fitted out with a first class bar on the upper deck as standard.

From around line number 95 Boeing offered the alternative of a ten-window upper deck fitted out to the customer's specification. I believe the first two Sabena aircraft (OO-SGA/B) were the first so delivered.

The option of 3- or 10- window upper deck aircraft was offered until around line number 240 by which time I think about 160 aircraft with the 3-window upper deck had been produced.

By then many airlines were converting their 3-window versiuons to the 10-window version. These included BA who inherited around a dozen 3-window versions from BOAC and converted them all in the late 70s and very early 80s. So all of the windows in these photos are real, not painted:

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Photo © AirNikon
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Photo © Fergal Goodman

 
citationjet
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:20 pm

Raytheon's Premier business jet does the same thing today. The Premier only has three actual passenger windows per side. Anything more than 3 are not real windows, they are paint or decals. Raytheon did this because they thought that it made the plane "look better".
Note in the photos below the 3 and 5 window photos are of the same aircraft. Evidently 2 more windows were "added".

3 window Premier:
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Photo © Ilya Morozov


4 window Premier:
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Photo © Tamon Takeoka - AirTeamImages


5 window Premier:
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Photo © Dmitriy Pichugin

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RetRes
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:14 am

TWA 800 N93119 in a picture on this site taken one month before the tragedy shows three upper deck windows on the right side. On National Geographic 'Seconds from Distater' they show the TWA flight 800 747 being reassembled and it has nine upper deck windows on the right side. Can someone explain this. I can't find any reference to this and it seems there would have been some questions.
 
citationjet
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RE: Upper Deck Windows On The First 747

Sat Jul 29, 2006 9:33 am

When TWA ordered its 747-131s, most were built with the three-window upper deck. The last few, however, were built when Boeing switched to the standard ten-window upper deck. To maintain uniform appearance of their Jumbos, TWA had Boeing modify these ships to the old three-window configuration by plugging seven of the ten windows (a reversal from most airlines, such as KLM, BA, and United, which switched from three to ten). N98109, the aircraft involved in the tragic Flight 800 crash, was one of the latter: pictures of the salvaged remains show ten openings in the upper deck.

Actual windows and plugged window openings made in the structure are two different things.

http://www.airliners.net/discussions...ation/read.main/230752/6/#ID230752

I did a search on "TWA 800 window" in Archived Civil forum to find the old thread.

.
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