IFEMaster
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Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:36 am

Take a look at this picture in large format, specifically the overheac bins on the right. What's with the cloud/steam/smoke/mist in the cabin??


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Photo © Mike Moores

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flyabunch
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:44 am

This phenomenon happens quite frequently in humid climates. The outside moisture enters the plane thru the open doorway and the moisture is picked up by the air conditioning and blown around. It usually freaks out people that have not seen it. There is actually enough moisture that when you put your hand in the air stream, it will get wet.

The moisture usually dissipates after the doors are closed. If there is a real excess of moisture, sometimes it doesn't go away until after takeoff.

I used to call TPA my home airport and I saw this situation a lot in the humid summer months.

Mike
 
EMBQA
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:45 am

This was just asked a few days back... If the weather conditions are right and the humidity is high this will happen. VERY-VERY common in the summer time
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IFEMaster
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:46 am

Wow...I have never seen this before. It's totally weird.
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hiflyer
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:50 am

Don't know why but I see it far more on airbus products down in Florida than on any other....have seen an almost white out on the 320 just after deplaning...grin!
 
SAS333
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 1:52 am

Some years ago, I have seen it on a Qantas 717 in BNE. Some people start really to freak out, until the captain did an announcement.
When you see it in reality, it looks just fantastic.
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:40 am

There have been many times when the F/A on our jets would open the door and the "fog" comes pouring down the steps, kind of freaky to see. Not to mention on the hot days you can see the a/c flowing up the cockpit windows.
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JetBlueGuy2006
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:19 am

Yeah, I flew back from PHF and that happened on my FL Flight from ATL to FNT
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nomadic
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:25 am

I have seen it once in a while on various aircraft but it happened EVERY time I have flown on a Pulkovo Aviation IL-86.
Moscow & St. Petersburg can get very humid during the summer but I am beginning to think it might have more to do with the actual ventilation system.

nomadic:?)
 
sulman
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:27 am

Saw this coming back from JFK on a VS A346.
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falstaff
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:33 am

I used to have a 64 Mercury Comet that would do that when you first turned on the AC after getting in on a very hot and humid St. Louis summer day. Never seen it on a plane, that is cool! Literally.
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Outlier
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:38 am

Fly around Hawaii and you'll see fog on many occaisions.

The first time I noticed it, I asked the guy next to me:
Are we making a movie?


My mother tells a story of a SEA-HNL flight on Pan Am where
"It rained. I'm telling you it rained" Uh huh, ok ma, whatever!
Took me a few years to believe her.
 
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zeke
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:55 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 2):
This was just asked a few days back... If the weather conditions are right and the humidity is high this will happen. VERY-VERY common in the summer time

Discussed here Some Sort Of Smoke In Cabin While Acr On Ground (by A380CGN Jul 28 2006 in Tech Ops)
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SP90
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:17 am

Happens to me a lot when I turn on the a/c in my car during the hot and humid days. I see white smoke blowing out of the vents. Its almost like the vents are the engine exhaust ports and their pulling contrails.  Big grin
 
markabcan
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:25 am

Just happened to me on a Northwest Airbus 320, MSP-YYC! It was crazy inside the cabin at MSP, white vapor going everywhere. Cleared up sometime during taxi.

[Edited 2006-08-06 01:32:50]
 
Outlier
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 8:31 am

Just as a reminder: its not smoke, its vapor.
 
Lucky42
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:49 am

Quoting Zeke (Reply 12):
My mother tells a story of a SEA-HNL flight on Pan Am where
"It rained. I'm telling you it rained" Uh huh, ok ma, whatever!
Took me a few years to believe her.

Anyone who has flown on an NW DC-9 a lot and were in the last rows in the summer will probably tell you they got wet....water would collect on hot humid days and when the a/c rotated they would get a waterfall effect in the last rows coming out of the PSU's. After NW went to the new interiors in the DC-9 the fasten seat belt sign and F/A call button were all controlled in each row were controlled with a curcuit board so when this would get wet would would see the call chime and reading lights in a particular row would go on and off....
 
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zeke
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:34 pm

Lucky42

I did not say any of that.
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longhauler
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:59 pm

Take it even further .... after airborne, as the packs achieve full efficiency with engine bleed source as opposed to APU bleed source, and it starts SNOWING in the cabin.

I see it alot after departure from BGI in an A319.
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lufthansi
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:08 pm

In TAM's A330s I got ice-cubes served through the instrument panel outlets of the air conditioning. That's cool! But it only works when it's very hot at CDG and when the pack selector switches are in high position and temp. selectors to cold.
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md80fanatic
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:12 pm

That is water vapour, and it's inside the cabin at all times (even if in the desert). Assuming normal flight pressures...when this vapour is cooled by the air conditioning vent it will momentarily condense into a liquid that is visible. Once the now-liquid water warms again, past the air conditioning stream, it will re-evaporate into it's normal invisible gaseous state.
 
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zeke
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:20 pm

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 18):
Take it even further .... after airborne, as the packs achieve full efficiency with engine bleed source as opposed to APU bleed source, and it starts SNOWING in the cabin.

I see it alot after departure from BGI in an A319.

Pack flow reduces with engine bleed, on HIGH with APU/ext high press, NORM with engines.

Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 20):
That is water vapour, and it's inside the cabin at all times (even if in the desert). Assuming normal flight pressures...when this vapour is cooled by the air conditioning vent it will momentarily condense into a liquid that is visible. Once the now-liquid water warms again, past the air conditioning stream, it will re-evaporate into it's normal invisible gaseous state.

That will depend on the relative humudity and temperature split from dew point.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
IDISA
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:33 pm

This phenomenon had happened to me once on a HAV-FCO flight, while at the gate, doors closed and pushback started. Some clouds of vapor started soaring and I remember an old lady sat next to me being freaking out and asked me what was happening...
 
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longhauler
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 12:15 am

Quoting Zeke (Reply 21):
Pack flow reduces with engine bleed, on HIGH with APU/ext high press, NORM with engines.

If the selector is left in NORM, however out of Caribbean destinations, we select HI, to quickly cool the cabin.
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AlitaliaMD11
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 12:23 am

Had the same thing happen to me on an Iberia A340-600 when we arrived at JFK.
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crogalski
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 1:54 am

Quoting Flyabunch (Reply 1):
I used to call TPA my home airport and I saw this situation a lot in the humid summer months.

haha yeah, TPA is famous for that.
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KPDX
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:02 am

I saw this cool phenomenon when we were in our Frontier A319 taxing for our flight to DEN from DFW.

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United_fan
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:04 am

I saw it last week on my ASA CR7 flight to ATL . Neat to see.
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Cadet57
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:18 am

As others have said, its condensation from the outside. It has happened on both US flights I took to AUA;

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skytaxi
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:53 am

On a return flight from Mexico our plane had to stop in Monterrey (Mexico) for fuel,We sat on the tarmac for maybe an hour before the fuel truck showed up.
It must have been well over 100 degrees outside, 100+ inside the plane, but the vapors were cascading down out of every air vent/nozzle until the first twelve inches of the cabin floor looked like a Hollywood horror movie special effects job. Very surreal.
By the way when the fuel truck showed up one of the workers had a cigarette in his mouth, it took me a second or two to determine that it wasn't lit. Phew!!
 
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scbriml
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 3:24 am

I've seen this quite often, but I must say that I can only ever remember seeing it happen on Airbus planes. scratchchin 
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afay1
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 4:56 am

I too have only seen it (vapor) on Airbus planes, but have seen actual water dripping from various Soviet aircraft.
 
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zeke
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 5:33 am

Quoting LongHauler (Reply 23):
If the selector is left in NORM, however out of Caribbean destinations, we select HI, to quickly cool the cabin.

The selector has no effect on the ground at all with the APU only running, if you are doing it "to quickly cool the cabin down" (non standard) after engine start it does not change the pack flow either, as it would have been on HIGH with the APU running.

I find the snowing comments hard to believe knowing the physics behind what is happening.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
jetfan
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 5:44 am

Quoting Afay1 (Reply 31):
I too have only seen it (vapor) on Airbus planes, but have seen actual water dripping from various Soviet aircraft.

I have seen it raining on a DL 732 in MSY! FAs started to give out blankets, because at some seats it was raining onto passengers and some seats were a little bit soaked and uncomfortable to sit on.
 
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BreninTW
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 11:24 am

Quoting Afay1 (Reply 31):
but have seen actual water dripping from various Soviet aircraft

I've seen this a few times on B744's -- most obviously a full SQ flight from SIN - TPE -- the poor child sitting next to me was getting very wet. I eventually rigged a "tent" from a blanket over his seat so that he wouldn't get wet.
 
mspguy
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 12:25 pm

Quoting Brenintw (Reply 34):
I've seen this a few times on B744's -- most obviously a full SQ flight from SIN - TPE -- the poor child sitting next to me was getting very wet. I eventually rigged a "tent" from a blanket over his seat so that he wouldn't get wet

I was sitting in the last row of a NW DC10 MSP-LGW and had this happen upon desent in LGW. The F/A's were joking with me that NorthWest inculds a free shower with those seats!!
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longhauler
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 11:36 pm

Quoting Zeke (Reply 32):
The selector has no effect on the ground at all with the APU only running, if you are doing it "to quickly cool the cabin down" (non standard) after engine start it does not change the pack flow either, as it would have been on HIGH with the APU running.

I say again .... once airborne .... engine bleeds .... APU not an issue here!
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emseeeye
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RE: Clouds In The Cabin?

Mon Aug 07, 2006 11:52 pm

The Challenger CL600's (600, 601 and 604) are notorious for doing this. More than once the big wigs who owned the planes look back when driving off and see this vapor bellowing out of the cockpit. You can imagine what happened next.

A few times - in airliners and a couple of corporate aircraft - I have seen this when performing a go around on landing.

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