BigGSFO
Topic Author
Posts: 2213
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:27 am

USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 8:33 am

Saber rattling?
http://www.usatoday.com/money/biztra...09-northwest-possible-strike_x.htm

Apologies if this is buried in another thread....
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2001 4:57 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 8:44 am

Sounds like the typical managment response to the typical union response to the typical managment threats. NWA has put itself in this position.... negotiate in good faith, and quit crying....
 
MCOflyer
Posts: 7068
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 8:49 am

Good luck to NW.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:10 am

Seems like every time this is brought up, NW's unions seem to blink first, and, perhaps, realize that not having a job at all is not in their best interest.

Is it sabre-rattling? Absolutely. Could it really happen? Absolutely. You can't lose 20% of your business overnight and survive for very long.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
okie73
Posts: 303
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 11:09 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:18 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
realize that not having a job at all is not in their best interest.

the problem this time around is that you have a labor group who is making so litttle they can very easily go out and replace the vast majority of thier income even if they have to work as a waitress in a resturaunt. The union will not cave this time.
 
hiflyer
Posts: 1270
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:22 am

AFA has blinked everytime on every contract proposal in the last few years. They invented CHAOS because they could not get the membership to walk as a group so they resulted to 'deniable' guerrilla tactics of spot job actions.
 
steeler83
Posts: 7391
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:49 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
Seems like every time this is brought up, NW's unions seem to blink first, and, perhaps, realize that not having a job at all is not in their best interest.

This to me is rediculous. Take the darned pay cut, stay at work, work for your company, build up moral, blah blah blah. Would I be upset if someone said I'd be paid less than what I have now? Of course, but it would make a difference in the company's sole existance...

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
Is it sabre-rattling? Absolutely.

 checkmark 

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
Could it really happen? Absolutely.

 checkmark  I think I might be able to list companies this happened to. Not necessarily airlines, but other companies that went on strike only to wind up out of business...

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
You can't lose 20% of your business overnight and survive for very long.

Euuuhh... In this day and age, you'd liquidate the next day I'd bet... Watch...

NW FAs will all strike on the 15th, and in the USA Today, the headline will read "Northwest Shuts Operations, Is No More..." or something to that extent...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
Tango-Bravo
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:55 am

Whatever happened to the scab FAs NW spent million$ to train not so very long ago?
 
Alitalia744
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:01 am

have to side with the F/As on this one and if it brings NWA down, so be it.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
BigGSFO
Topic Author
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:10 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 8):
have to side with the F/As on this one and if it brings NWA down, so be it.

And I do not think their Pacific division is as valuable as it once was. The China authorities and Narita slots have value, but there is not much else to be gained that one can't get on their own.
 
isitsafenow
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:14 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 8):
have to side with the F/As on this one and if it brings NWA down, so be it.

So NW is gone by the end of the month....the FA say
yaaaaaaaaaaaaa...now they apply for work with Skywest and Mesa....
Now who won?????
Think it out first, will ya kid?
safe
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
Fleet Service
Posts: 473
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:20 am

Pure saber rattling, you can look back at all of the airlines that were engaged in concession negotiations and all of the labor groups made strike threats, with the Delta pilots going as far as having a 'Practice Strike'.Ultimately, every last one of them accepted concessions and moved forward.

The only exception is the maintenance technicians at NW, who struck and were replaced in short order.

Airline labor is a toothless tiger these days.
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:21 am

YAWN - the F/As won't put NWA out of business.... NW will put itself out of business. You people need to understand:

LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3777
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:22 am

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 10):
o NW is gone by the end of the month....the FA say
yaaaaaaaaaaaaa...now they apply for work with Skywest and Mesa....
Now who won?????
Think it out first, will ya kid?
safe

1) I'm not a kid, just not as old as you.
2) I did think it out, there is more to life than serving people on an airplane, and if these people feel they can do better elsewhere, they should. Whether they quit en-masse, or strike, the same end result happens.
3) NWA needs to figure out how to operate their business outside of just constantly f'ing the employees over
4) I have friends/family that work for NWA and know what they're facing. And no, they're not flight attendants so they have nothing to gain by a strike and only things to lose.

5) f'off.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
Fleet Service
Posts: 473
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:26 am

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

Then why does labor accept concession after concession?

Everyone talks tough, but when push comes to shove the decision to actually strike and shut a carrier down is a call no one is willing to actually make.
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
TWFirst
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:33 am

Quoting Travatl (Reply 1):
negotiate in good faith, and quit crying....

They did.... TWICE. And they didn't even have to negotiate a second time. The rank and file voted two different TAs down, contrary to the recommendations of TWO different union management teams. Maybe the FAs should go for a THIRD union to represent them and see if they come up with anything better?

Now, how exactly is NW management "doing this to itself"??
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
steeler83
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:35 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 13):
Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 10):
o NW is gone by the end of the month....the FA say
yaaaaaaaaaaaaa...now they apply for work with Skywest and Mesa....
Now who won?????
Think it out first, will ya kid?
safe

1) I'm not a kid, just not as old as you.
2) I did think it out, there is more to life than serving people on an airplane, and if these people feel they can do better elsewhere, they should. Whether they quit en-masse, or strike, the same end result happens.
3) NWA needs to figure out how to operate their business outside of just constantly f'ing the employees over
4) I have friends/family that work for NWA and know what they're facing. And no, they're not flight attendants so they have nothing to gain by a strike and only things to lose.

5) f'off.

Is this necessary???

Going back to that statement though about the "then they apply for skywest and mesa..." That would be a riot if that hypothetical scenario occurs. Aren't there a bunch of negative comments circling their way around here regarding mesa? They walk off the job at NWA, losses really accumulate, NWA can't/won't rebound, therefore causing ch7 filing, and NWA is history. Then, those "airline crashers" go work for mesa... Sorry, that whole thought just intrigues me. I doubt it will all pan out as such, but it's still funny nonetheless...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
qantas787
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:40 am

I think it is time to say good bye to NW. It really is an old decrepit carcass of an airline. Go on strike FA's and give anyone who is involved an opportunity to kill it off and pick the bones. Only good will become of it.
G'day
 
isitsafenow
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:40 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 13):

Ya sound like one.. I just got off two NW DC you-know-whats about 90 minutes ago and the FA's don't want to strike anymore they you wish to learn facts.
So remove head from buttocks and talk to them! You just might get educated!

I used to work for em and have a few buddies around the system and others in the pipeline and I dont mean in the cockpit. So of the folks I worked with got promoted through the years and some carry some weight.........and knowledge.
Therefore I feel my gang will bulldoze yours with insight and knowledge any day anytime.

The whole idea is to compete and survive. With the lenient pay and bonus and benefit packages they had four years ago, they were dead in five years....then came the oil prices and fuel became the biggie. The only place to go after renegotiating all
contracts and planes and services was the help.
Its a good thing you dont run an airline....or a company......you'd never make it...................kid
safe
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:41 am

You named it Fleet Service.

Labor has watched airline after airline demand concessions. When the environment was one that it seemed every airline was on the brink... few were willing to take the chance of a full out strike. Now in an environment where money is ready to be made again, and NWA is STILL demanding not only competitive concessions, but bone-cutting repeals of wages, and work rules (including some that are gonna put a LOT of union members on the street), then there's a lot of pressure on the NW flight attendants to finally put an end to this never ending "taking" from mgmt teams. And this isn't a full blown strike, this is simply a PR game being threatened.
 
Fleet Service
Posts: 473
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:47 am

One profitable quarter does not a turn around make.Fuel is still a wild card and it looks to be going nowhere but up for the short term.Couple that with the seasonal demand drop off of the fall and we shall see how all of the airlines fare.
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
KLMA330
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:59 am

Flying NW to Miami on August 31st returning Sept 12th.

AA has a sale on expedia for 400 bucks. Should I buy it, just in case? or will I fly? what do you guys think? I"m a bit nervous...
 
ckfred
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:01 am

AFA made a huge deal about doing CHAOS strikes at UA, because of the pension termination. The AFA/UA website had a new code word every week, which gave the impression that each code word corresponded to a set of flights or cities that were to be struck.

Yet, not one flight was ever cancelled due to CHAOS.

It seems to me that if AFA doesn't do a CHAOS strike against NW, then in negotiations in the future with any airline, management won't take the threat of a CHAOS strike seriously.

AFA has boxed itself into a position of either having to agree to a contract that is very close to management's negotiating position or risking a shut down and possible liquidation of NW.
 
N174UA
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:01 pm

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 13):
1) I'm not a kid, just not as old as you.

Ok, you're not a kid, fine.

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 13):
5) f'off.

But here you act like one. If you want respect on here, give it back. It's a two way street.

I don't think there will be a strike. Too many times in the past few years we've seen this sort of thing, only for some last minute deal to be made, and the f-ed up airline lives on.
 
ASFlyer
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:17 pm

Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 6):
This to me is rediculous. Take the darned pay cut, stay at work, work for your company, build up moral, blah blah blah. Would I be upset if someone said I'd be paid less than what I have now? Of course, but it would make a difference in the company's sole existance...

Isn't it the job of management to build up morale, work for the company and take pay cuts necessary to keep the airline in business?

As someone else mentioned, these F/A's have nothing to lose. People do crazy things when they have nothing to lose. It would be very easy to get another entry level job that pays as much as it does at NW. The lifestyle changes would be an adjustment, and for that reason NW F/A's would like to keep their jobs. It would not be the end of their worlds if they had to go out and find another low paying job.
 
ASFlyer
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Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:20 pm

Quoting Isitsafenow (Reply 10):
So NW is gone by the end of the month....the FA say
yaaaaaaaaaaaaa...now they apply for work with Skywest and Mesa....
Now who won?????
Think it out first, will ya kid?

Or they apply with UA or CO or AS or B6 or WN, or any of the myriad of regional carriers that are hiring. It would be a life change, but they wouldn't lose much in the way of $$$ or bennies.

This message should probably be the one that NW's management should be hearing.
 
Falcon84
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:23 pm

Quoting Okie73 (Reply 4):
the problem this time around is that you have a labor group who is making so litttle they can very easily go out and replace the vast majority of thier income even if they have to work as a waitress in a resturaunt.

Then maybe that's what they should do, and let those who want to make NW a better airline do just that. This suicide pact crap is just that-crap.

Not everyone wants to leave the company. Maybe these yahoos who say "it's our way or death to the company" need to leave.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
ASFlyer
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Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:25 pm

Quoting Fleet Service (Reply 11):
Pure saber rattling, you can look back at all of the airlines that were engaged in concession negotiations and all of the labor groups made strike threats, with the Delta pilots going as far as having a 'Practice Strike'.Ultimately, every last one of them accepted concessions and moved forward.

The only exception is the maintenance technicians at NW, who struck and were replaced in short order.

Airline labor is a toothless tiger these days.

None of the F/A's are opposed to taking cuts or giving back. It's the extent to which management expects them to give back. As in negotiations at other airlines, management will likely realize that a strike would be detrimental to their well being and reach an agreement that both sides can live with. Just as at other carriers, the rank and file will likely ratify a TA that is more equitable. Strike threats haven't failed at other airlines, they have allowed the workers to reach agreements they can live with. Were it not for strike threats, management would like have taken far more.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 875
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:26 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
YAWN - the F/As won't put NWA out of business.... NW will put itself out of business. You people need to understand:

LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....

Hm.. where do I start... or should labor unions be blamed for the airlines mismanagement? I mean, its not like everytime they try to compensate the the CEO's and management that the labor unions throw a fit..... lets face it, if you want a quality experienced manager your going to have to pay!!! which quite frankly is a lot more than a pilot or flight attendent makes... quit griping ever time the managers get a raise!
Why do I fly???
 
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TVNWZ
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:30 pm

Quoting Okie73 (Reply 4):
union will not cave this time.

In my mind the union has already caved. With a new union in place only one in four flight attendants voted AGAINST the last tenative agreement. 3 of 4 either voted FOR it or DID NOT VOTE.

25% of the union wants a strike. Let's say HALF will go along. That means 12% will go...at the most. If I were NW, I would be doing exactly what they are doing...

Nobody is walking.
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1253
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:34 pm

Quoting TVNWZ (Reply 29):
In my mind the union has already caved. With a new union in place only one in four flight attendants voted AGAINST the last tenative agreement. 3 of 4 either voted FOR it or DID NOT VOTE.

25% of the union wants a strike. Let's say HALF will go along. That means 12% will go...at the most. If I were NW, I would be doing exactly what they are doing...

Nobody is walking.

F/A's very narrowly turned down TA2. They overwhelmingly turned down TA1. They also had a pretty strong strike vote for TA1. Now that they've turned down TA2, the company has imposed TA1 on them, the same TA they strongly voted against and voted to strike for. So, your numbers don't mean much when you look at it like that.
 
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TVNWZ
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:46 pm

Quoting ASFlyer (Reply 30):
So, your numbers don't mean much when you look at it like that.

Yes they do. In collective bargaining the latest vote is the one that counts in the power play of union politics. Union #2 could only generate a 50% turn out, less than Union #1. This does not project power to bargain any agreement favorable to them. Of course they implemented the first contract proposal. The F/As played Union Roulette and lost.
 
mspguy
Posts: 183
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 11:49 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:18 pm

Quoting ASFlyer (Reply 24):
As someone else mentioned, these F/A's have nothing to lose. People do crazy things when they have nothing to lose. It would be very easy to get another entry level job that pays as much as it does at NW. The lifestyle changes would be an adjustment, and for that reason NW F/A's would like to keep their jobs. It would not be the end of their worlds if they had to go out and find another low paying job.

If it's not a big deal to them, they should just quit. Let the company have staff who wants to work. I didn't like the way my former company was treating me after 9 years of work. What did I do? I quit and found a better paying job, instead of trying to stay and complain!!!! Bottom line, the unhappy F/A's need to leave and let the rest have their jobs!!!
If it ain't broke, DON'T touch it!!!!
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1253
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:19 pm

Quoting TVNWZ (Reply 31):
Yes they do. In collective bargaining the latest vote is the one that counts in the power play of union politics. Union #2 could only generate a 50% turn out, less than Union #1. This does not project power to bargain any agreement favorable to them. Of course they implemented the first contract proposal. The F/As played Union Roulette and lost.

The post I was referring to was the post where you said only 25% of the F/A's were willing to walk based on the vote for TA2. You said nothing about the message management got from that. If management is dumb enough to disregard the fact that they have forced a contract that was overwhelmingly voted down on a group that overwhelmingly voted to strike on same then they deserve what they get. If you are counting on the fact that only 25% of the people that voted against that TA then you are sadly mistaken. That may be true, but take a look at the numbers where regards TA1. The F/A's were okaywith TA2, NOT TA1.
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1253
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:22 pm

Quoting MSPGUY (Reply 32):
If it's not a big deal to them, they should just quit. Let the company have staff who wants to work. I didn't like the way my former company was treating me after 9 years of work. What did I do? I quit and found a better paying job, instead of trying to stay and complain!!!! Bottom line, the unhappy F/A's need to leave and let the rest have their jobs!!!

If all of the unhappy F/A's left the result would be the same. There aren't that many left that think their jobs are worth keeping under the current conditions. Many are afraid of the fear of the unknown that leaving presents - most don't love their jobs anymore.
 
JAFA
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:41 pm

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 3):
You can't lose 20% of your business overnight and survive for very long.

Try losing not 20% but 40% of your pay and benefits and see if you can survive on that.
 
AADC10
Posts: 1506
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2004 7:40 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:35 pm

The airline does not decide if it is going to liquidate, it is the creditors and the creditors loath going to Ch.7 and losing their money. A prolonged strike that is honored by all of the unions might do it, but it is just saber rattling.

The unions at Eastern went on strike knowing that it would kill the airline only because they knew that Lorenzo would kill it anyway.
 
ZKNBX
Posts: 440
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2006 5:24 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:51 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....

Well said. NW has been pretty screwed up with the events of the past 10 years; poor strategic planning and financial management has contributed most to the airline's present woes. It's really no wonder employees are ready to walk out! It may be too late to save the whole operation.. nonetheless they have enough assets and network slots to ensure - even with collapse of this sick giant - that a good chunk of the employees have future job opportunities... as other operators move in to pick up the pieces.
 
DALelite
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:39 pm

Good Luck, NWA

DALelite
They loved to fly and it showed..
 
brdcessna
Posts: 55
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:39 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
YAWN - the F/As won't put NWA out of business.... NW will put itself out of business. You people need to understand:

LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....

I agree sooo much I was an ese for NW. Well the did our contracts, then replaced us within a few weeks

Quoting ZKNBX (Reply 37):
Well said. NW has been pretty screwed up with the events of the past 10 years; poor strategic planning and financial management has contributed most to the airline's present woes. It's really no wonder employees are ready to walk out! It may be too late to save the whole operation.. nonetheless they have enough assets and network slots to ensure - even with collapse of this sick giant - that a good chunk of the employees have future job opportunities... as other operators move in to pick up the pieces.

Well said. I think I heard somewhere that the NW big wigs just took some raises. HMmmmm nothing new.
 
Dtw757
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 8:47 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....

This is the United States....Not a single person has a gun held to their head and is being forced to work at their job. If you don't like what the company has to offer you, you move on. You go and find another job. You start your own company. It is a free country. If people think they can make as much or more in another job, go get one.
721,2,732,3,4,5,G,8,9,741,2,3,4,752,3,762,3,4,772,3,788,D93,5,M80,D10,M11,L10,100,AB6,319,20,21,332,3,346,388,146,CR2,7,
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:07 pm

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 8):
have to side with the F/As on this one and if it brings NWA down, so be it.

Several months ago, DL was being threatened by a pilot strike. At that time, there was outrage directed at the pilots from several Anet posters, saying how could they be so greedy to walk out and cause thousands of other employees to lose their jobs.

So where is that outrage now?

Quoting DTW757 (Reply 40):
This is the United States....Not a single person has a gun held to their head and is being forced to work at their job. If you don't like what the company has to offer you, you move on. You go and find another job. You start your own company. It is a free country. If people think they can make as much or more in another job, go get one.

 checkmark 
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4460
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RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:30 pm

Quoting JAFA (Reply 35):
Try losing not 20% but 40% of your pay and benefits and see if you can survive on that.

The F/A's are being asked to take the same cuts as the rest of the employee groups at NWA including management. Yes the cuts hurt, but the F/A's are not being singled out.
 
goaliemn
Posts: 320
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:46 pm

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:07 pm

Quoting ASFlyer (Reply 30):
Now that they've turned down TA2, the company has imposed TA1 on them, the same TA they strongly voted against and voted to strike for.

The judge approved TA1 for imposition. NW didn't have the option of imposing TA2.

Quoting JAFA (Reply 35):
Try losing not 20% but 40% of your pay and benefits and see if you can survive on that.

I've had that happen to me.. I quit and went elsewhere.

Quoting Brdcessna (Reply 39):
I think I heard somewhere that the NW big wigs just took some raises.

Nope. Everyone is taking cuts. The board of directors all took 20%+ cuts last year. All salaried employees took 2 rounds of paycuts/benefit cuts/vacation cuts/holiday cuts. I know many people at NW who took these cuts. Some left, some stayed.
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3777
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 8:22 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:17 pm

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 41):
Several months ago, DL was being threatened by a pilot strike. At that time, there was outrage directed at the pilots from several Anet posters, saying how could they be so greedy to walk out and cause thousands of other employees to lose their jobs.

So where is that outrage now?

I wasn't happy then as much as I'm not happy about the NWA situation, and while a pilot strike would have crippled DL, management needed a clear signal that you can't just take from employees.

If they (the pilots) striked back then, I woulda been pissed, but always did understand their side of the argument in a similar fashion to the F/As. There is only so much you can kill a salary before someone realizes - you know what, I can do better.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
787kq
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 6:52 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:25 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 12):
YAWN - the F/As won't put NWA out of business.... NW will put itself out of business. You people need to understand:

LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY IS TIRED OF BEING THE BANDAID FOR THEIR AIRLINES' MISMANAGEMENT AND FATCAT GOLDEN PARACHUTES.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.....

With the clear exception of Southwest, many US airlines (and other companies) have management that pays themselves first, including those golden parachutes. But the fact of the matter is that labor is a big cost and many others would gladly fill the positions for flight attendants. The bottom line is that all companies should be profitable to justify their existence. Airlines haven't generally justified their existence but this is due to the ability of pilots, who are not easily replaced, to wring all out of the airlines. Given the high amount of capital used in an airline, the airlines have no choice but to give in. The cycle won't stop until the contracts are more closely tied to profitability and I mean $80,000 salaries with $300,000 bonuses during good times and nothing during bad. Good luck to all
 
rj777
Posts: 1548
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 1:47 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:42 pm

"It's the End Of Northwest as we know it!It's the End Of Northwest as we know it! And I feel fine!"
 
RAPCON
Posts: 651
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 7:20 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:04 pm

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 2):
Good luck to NW.

Best of luck in liquidation NW. We hardly knew ya!

WN will love to pick up a alot of those routes!!!
MODS CAN'T STOP ME....THEY CAN ONLY HOPE TO CONTAIN ME!!!
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4460
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:18 pm

Quoting RAPCON (Reply 47):
WN will love to pick up a alot of those routes!!!

If it's domestic routes, WN can start flying them right now if they wanted.
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 12:48 am

RE: USA Today: Strike Could Liquidate NW

Fri Aug 11, 2006 1:05 am

Guys, I used to be an F/A for FL. CHAOS was threatened at one point with one of our negotiations as well. The company sign our contract on the 11th hour. Unions are a necessary evil and it's unfortunate that the companies think we are expendable and easily replaceable. At one point, FL was training gate agents in a remedial "crash course" (please excuse the pun). That amounted to one week of training and they were "certified" to be a flight attendant. Many f/a's refused to fly with them, me included. That was just plain irresponsible of FL to put improperly trained crews onboard. While I realize that the FAA had to approve that training program, that doesn't make it any less dangerous.

I didn't agree with the company and their tactics. But I disagreed with AFA more in their leafletting practice. Enough passengers sway from our company for too long and we just shot ourselves in the foot anyway. In my experience, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. But it's a game of chicken ultimately. Who will flinch first. In or case, the company flinched. We had enough people staged in enough stations to throw things off just enough. Back then, all it really took was one plane to be late and it threw off the whole schedule across the system.

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