jumbojet
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Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:54 am

I am planning a flight to JNB via DL for December and want to fly biz elite. Now, I know seat mappers aren't entirely accurate, but in checking out seat availability for around december 15th, there are no biz class seats available as well as no coach seats available. Is this flight doing that well already? Again, I know that seat mappers arent the tell all of availability but I've never seen anything like this. I used the following web site to check.

http://www.benedelman.org/travel/dls...=prg&classP=J&Submit=View+Seat+Map
 
ah414211
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:05 pm

Flight 34 on the 15th of December is sold out in Business Elite. There are several seats available in coach though.
Business Elite is also nearly sold out on the 16th, but there are many seats available on the 17th.

I hope that helps.........
 
Go3Team
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:20 pm

Looks like DL34 is operated by a 763. Where do they plan on stopping?
Yay Pudding!
 
misbeehavin
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:28 pm

Quoting Go3Team (Reply 2):
Looks like DL34 is operated by a 763. Where do they plan on stopping?

Same place they were always gonna stop - even when it was supposed to be a 777: Dakar, Senegal.
 
AA767400
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:31 pm

I thought at first they were going to use a 777 on their ATL-DKR-JNB route? I guess the up coming JFK-BOM needs the aircraft.
"The low fares airline."
 
misbeehavin
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:35 pm

Quoting AA767400 (Reply 4):
I thought at first they were going to use a 777 on their ATL-DKR-JNB route? I guess the up coming JFK-BOM needs the aircraft.

Yep. TLV & BOM get the 777. DKR, JNB and ACC get the ol' 763s. And JFK-LGW will also be 763, I think.
 
panamair
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Sun Aug 20, 2006 6:07 pm

Quoting Jumbojet (Thread starter):
I am planning a flight to JNB via DL for December and want to fly biz elite. Now, I know seat mappers aren't entirely accurate, but in checking out seat availability for around december 15th, there are no biz class seats available as well as no coach seats available. Is this flight doing that well already?

Well, a few reasons:
- Dec 15/16 weekend is the start of the heavy Christmas holiday travel season
- When a new route opens up, there are quite a few Mileage Award seats available; many of those snapped up in the earlier stages of the announcement were Business Award/upgrade seats
- DL switched from the 777 to the 763ER resulting in a pretty significant reduction in BE seat availability (from 52 to 35 per flight). Combined with the award seats situation described above, it shouldn't be a surprise that the Business cabin is already fully booked on peak travel days
 
AV8AJET
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:06 am

When DL re-configures some of the B764ER fleet into "international configuration" with the BizElite cabin, could we see the possibility of a switch from the 763ER to the 764ER? I would think the premium cabin will hopefully be larger than 35 J class on the 763 and I would think that it could carry a little more cargo to/from Africa. Just my thoughts.
"To fly or not to fly there is no question!"
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:42 am

An upgrade could happen, but it would of course depend on how the route performs. Once the network folks believe the route has "earned" an equipment upgrade, it would also depend on how many 764s DL ultimately converts for international service. If they only configure enough airframes to backfill lost 777 capacity in Europe, it would be unlikely. My guess is DL34/35 will most likely retain 763ER equipment until it goes nonstop sometime in 2008.

[Edited 2006-08-20 19:52:56]
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
jumbojet
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 3:01 am

Quoting Panamair (Reply 6):
Well, a few reasons:
- Dec 15/16 weekend is the start of the heavy Christmas holiday travel season
- When a new route opens up, there are quite a few Mileage Award seats available; many of those snapped up in the earlier stages of the announcement were Business Award/upgrade seats

Anyway, glad to see ATL - JNB doing so well already.
 
B777ER
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:28 am

Quoting Misbeehavin (Reply 5):
Yep. TLV & BOM get the 777. DKR, JNB and ACC get the ol' 763s. And JFK-LGW will also be 763, I think

Good God, the travelers from South Africa that fly to ATL go from a spacious SA A346 to a old wore out cramped 763 on DL. Unreal. That is a heck of a long flight to be in Y class on that aircraft. I have said it before, DL wants to be a premium international airline, then get some better aircraft for these premier routes. Its getting to be a real joke how they are expanding all over Europe, Middle East, India and now Africa with just 8 777's. No wonder airlines like BA get the high paying premier business travelers. I for one would fly SA into IAD long before choosing DL's product on the 763. DL needs to get off the wallet and order some more T7's post-haste.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:39 am

Quoting B777ER (Reply 10):
Good God, the travelers from South Africa that fly to ATL go from a spacious SA A346 to a old wore out cramped 763 on DL.

The SA 346's weren't that spacious if you recall - thus the reason SAA is reconfiguring them in the back.

While I do agree, DL's 763s are older, they still have plenty of service life left and if they can be used to maximize DL's operational abilities, why not?

Quoting B777ER (Reply 10):
I have said it before, DL wants to be a premium international airline, then get some better aircraft for these premier routes. Its getting to be a real joke how they are expanding all over Europe, Middle East, India and now Africa with just 8 777's.

And how were they supposed to get more than 8 777s? Pilots said no, management said no, and then there is this thing called Chap 11. You make do with what you have when you can't buy new a/c.

Quoting B777ER (Reply 10):
I for one would fly SA into IAD long before choosing DL's product on the 763. DL needs to get off the wallet and order some more T7's post-haste.

There are five more T7s coming online within the next two years, 2 of which are -232LRs.

Also, everyone is already expecting an order of some sort post emergence from Chap 11.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
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Flying Belgian
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:43 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 9):
Anyway, glad to see ATL - JNB doing so well already.

Africa-USA traffic is a goldmine... It's up to the U.S carriers to dare flying to Africa.
The market is huge.

FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
Tango-Bravo
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:55 am

Quoting B777ER (Reply 10):
I have said it before, DL wants to be a premium international airline, then get some better aircraft for these premier routes. Its getting to be a real joke how they are expanding all over Europe, Middle East, India and now Africa with just 8 777's

Please explain more specifically how 767s are inherently "uncomfortable" while A340s, 777s and other true wide cabin types are to be presumed to more comfortable. Seems to me that inflight comfort levels for pax or the lack thereof, whether in Y or otherwise, has little to nothing to do with aircraft type but rather has everything to do the design of the seats installed in any given aircraft type and the manner in which seats are arranged/spaced.

[Edited 2006-08-20 22:03:10]
 
UAL777UK
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:19 am

How long is the aircraft on the ground in Senegal?
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:24 am

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 14):
How long is the aircraft on the ground in Senegal?

1:25h ATL-JNB and 1:15 JNB-ATL.
 
utapao
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:33 am

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 14):
How long is the aircraft on the ground in Senegal?

Looks like 1:15 on the ground each direction.

V*DL34/15DEC
..................DPTR....ARVL MEALS EQP ELPD ACCUM MILES
ATL....DKR....355P....530A‡1... D........767..8.35.....8.35....4343
DKR....JNB.....645A...500P........B...............8.15...18.05....4174

V*DL35/16DEC«
..................DPTR....ARVL MEALS EQP ELPD ACCUM MILES
JNB....DKR....700P.....215A‡1....D........767...9.15....9.15...4174
DKR....ATL....330A.....810A.......B................9.40..20.10...4343
Sawasdee khrab!
 
rwsea
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:37 am

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 13):
Please explain more specifically how 767s are inherently "uncomfortable" while A340s, 777s and other true wide cabin types are to be presumed to more comfortable. Seems to me that inflight comfort levels for pax or the lack thereof, whether in Y or otherwise, has little to nothing to do with aircraft type but rather has everything to do the design of the seats installed in any given aircraft type and the manner in which seats are arranged/spaced.

 checkmark 

As a Y passenger, I'd take a 763 over a 777 anyday assuming that the amenities (seats, IFE, etc.) are the same. Only a 1/7 chance of a middle seat as opposed to a 3/9 chance.
 
dutchjet
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:38 am

To be honest, nothing really beats the comfort of a 767 in coach, 2-3-2 works out rather well on a long flight......and DL is in the process of upgrading its 767s and its international product in general.

Why is everyone so negative about everything?

DL had "the balls" to open a route from the US to Africa, not since the PanAm days has any US airline taken a chance with a service to Africa (aside from the odd USAfrica experiment)......give DL credit for that. Yes, DL's 777 fleet is limited, and the 777 that orginally flew the JNB route is needed for the nonstop to India....but the 763ER will do just fine on this route for the time being. Give DL credit for taking a big risk with its JNB service.
 
UAL777UK
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:40 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 15):
1:25h ATL-JNB and 1:15 JNB-ATL.

Thats a short refuelling stop, so I assume everybody stays on the aircraft. If I was in Y, no matter what aircraft, I would want to get off and stretch those legs!
 
airplanetire
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:01 am

Don't be too hard on DL's 763s. It's true that they lack PTVs and the seats certainly look like crap, but I've flown them transatlantic once and transcontinental in the US countless times and they are actually pretty comfortable. Given a choice between DL's 777s (I've also flown those transatlantic) and 763s, I would pick the 763s. Also, service and comfort are way more important than the appearance of the aircraft for actually enjoying the flight (first impression might be bad if aircraft is ugly like DL's on the inside, but comfort isn't impacted). The majority of my eight transatlantic trips (I know a lot fewer than many of you) have been on European airlines and my two favorite, by far, were Swissair (had PTVs) and KLM (no PTVs but very comfortable) because the aircraft were comfortable and the service was great. My three transatlantic flights on BA have been way worse than any of my five on Delta because their 777s are horrendously cramped, the seats are hard, and the recline is so much that people were lying in my face the whole time. I wouldn't think twice about flying DL to South Africa.
 
upstatedave
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:19 am

Ok i read delta is planning on updating the international 767s with the leaher seats, the LED reading lights & cabin lights, refurbishing the bathrooms, etc. With this upgrade are they also going to add PTVs? Seems like Africa on a 767 with just mainline movies could get old fast. Personally i wish delta would put their PTV system from Song on there intl flights with free on demand movies instead of TV. I think that would really be competitive compaired to the systems other airlines have.
"Once you fly, you will walk with your eyes skyward. For there you will go again." Leonardo da Vinci
 
Flyer732
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:27 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 18):
DL had "the balls" to open a route from the US to Africa, not since the PanAm days has any US airline taken a chance with a service to Africa (aside from the odd USAfrica experiment)......

North American Airlines operates from JFK to ACC and LOS along with BWI to Banjul and Accra.
I think the JFK-ACC is up to daily, if not daily then very close to it.

World Airways also operates from IAH to Luanda, Angola (LAD) 3x week.
 
dutchjet
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:39 am

Quoting Flyer732 (Reply 22):
North American Airlines operates from JFK to ACC and LOS along with BWI to Banjul and Accra.
I think the JFK-ACC is up to daily, if not daily then very close to it.

Correct.....I honestly did not recall those flights....I should have said DL is the only legacy carrier that is taking a chance with flights to Africa.

Quoting Flyer732 (Reply 22):

World Airways also operates from IAH to Luanda, Angola (LAD) 3x week.

Arent these charters run specifically for the oil industry execs......I dont think its possible to just purchase a ticket on these flights (this topic was discussed here at a.net, I cannot remember the exact result.)
 
Flyer732
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:57 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 23):
Arent these charters run specifically for the oil industry execs......I dont think its possible to just purchase a ticket on these flights (this topic was discussed here at a.net, I cannot remember the exact result.)

As far as I know you cannot book it outside of the oil industry, BUT...according to some travel sites you can, but you have to be a member on the houston-express website to get to a booking page, and I'm not sure how to register.

Though I've seen a trip report, on flyertalk by someone who rode the flight and bought a ticket on it, but that was some time ago.
 
aviationwiz
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 9:56 am

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 19):
Thats a short refuelling stop, so I assume everybody stays on the aircraft. If I was in Y, no matter what aircraft, I would want to get off and stretch those legs!

As per US law, all pax continuing on to the United States (does Delta even have permission to load/offload pax or cargo in DKR?) must stay onboard, and a securty sweep of the aircraft is done.

Quoting Airplanetire (Reply 20):
I wouldn't think twice about flying Delta to South Africa.

I sure would! SA would give me way better service than DL, not to mention a PTV.
Proudly from the Home of the Red Tail.
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:04 am

Even with a 777, ATL-JNB will experience a decline in available seats YR/YR
 
worldtraveler
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:10 am

DKR is a full revenue stop. It is not a technical stop. I doubt if they plan on allowing passengers to fully disembark given the short ground time but DL has route authority already between DKR and the US and is seeking it (may have already obtained it) between DKR and JNB. South African has had 5th freedom authority between several points in west Africa and S. Africa. Part of the reason DL chose DKR is because the US-Senegal treaty permits it.

Thankfully, there are people here who recognize that the aircraft type is not as significant to the comfort of a flight as how an airline configures it. DL has been flying 8000 mile plus flights from the US to India via Europe for 15 years and has attracted very strong business class demand on the routes until recently when nonstops on AA and CO begun. Translation: the 767 is not at all considered an inferior aircraft and enjoys revenue generation on par with other widebody aircraft even on ultra-long haul (16+ hour) flights. DL is upgrading the cabins of all its int'l aircraft and is still seeking to put the same AVOD IFE on the 763s as it is putting on every seat on the 764 and 777 but right now they want Panasonic to reduce the weight of the system because DL wants to use the 763 for some flights that approach or exceed 6000 miles, longer than any current airline flies the 767.

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 11):
And how were they supposed to get more than 8 777s? Pilots said no, management said no, and then there is this thing called Chap 11. You make do with what you have when you can't buy new a/c.

Just because DL is in bankrtupcy doesn't mean they cannot spend money. Bankruptcy 8is a process whereby the debtors restructure their obligations. DL still has dozens of 777s and 738s on firm order from a pre-bankruptcy order. It is well within bankruptcy law and fiscal responsibility for DL to affirm its oustanding aircraft order. It is a bigger deal for a company to place a massive new order but DL has said all along that it intends to obtain financing and terms that allow it to continue to grow as soon as it leaves bankruptcy. In many respects, DL has learned from what other airlines did or did not do in bankruptcy and is doing things that make bankruptcy as short a process as possible and one that facilitates, not impedes, DL's long-term prospects. It does little good to get your costs down in bankruptcy and then be unable to grow to take advantage of those lower costs.

[Edited 2006-08-21 03:17:29]
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:18 am

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 26):
Even with a 777, ATL-JNB will experience a decline in available seats YR/YR

Care to explain your thinking or rationale behind this?
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
louA340
Posts: 323
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:19 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 18):
DL had "the balls" to open a route from the US to Africa, not since the PanAm days has any US airline taken a chance with a service to Africa (aside from the odd USAfrica experiment)

North American has already taken that title. They now have scheduled servives to ACC, LOS and BJL.
RyEng
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3777
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:24 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 27):
Just because DL is in bankrtupcy doesn't mean they cannot spend money. Bankruptcy 8is a process whereby the debtors restructure their obligations. DL still has dozens of 777s and 738s on firm order from a pre-bankruptcy order. It is well within bankruptcy law and fiscal responsibility for DL to affirm its oustanding aircraft order. It is a bigger deal for a company to place a massive new order but DL has said all along that it intends to obtain financing and terms that allow it to continue to grow as soon as it leaves bankruptcy. In many respects, DL has learned from what other airlines did or did not do in bankruptcy and is doing things that make bankruptcy as short a process as possible and one that facilitates, not impedes, DL's long-term prospects. It does little good to get your costs down in bankruptcy and then be unable to grow to take advantage of those lower costs.

WT, I know, don't attack me, I was responding to someone else.

Should we begin discussing the "decision" or do you wanna wait?
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
richie87
Posts: 61
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2005 2:02 pm

RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:40 am

I had not heard much about Delta's routes to South Africa as yet. I have booked a trip to South Africa in January 2007.. taking my 13 y/o nephew on a great adventure. I seriously considered SA)">DL but a departure from the US west coast ( Oregon and Washington ) did not work out too well. I have flown SAA once before, however.

I ended up booking BA from SEA to LHR then a brief layover before an overnight to CPT. We're leaving JNB to London for a day then on to SEA.
BA apparently uses B777 and then B744 to SA... has anybody flown either of those routes.. and have any comment on them? The BA departure and arrival
times in SEA are really excellent, and the $ fare was reasonable, too.

I could easily stand a B767 for the trip, though. I have been on them twice between the western US and Europe and thought they were fine... and I liked the coach section seating arrangements.

Anyway... I really do wish Delta the best of luck with these routes.. and I think it's great that a US airline is trying it out. Maybe another US east-coast to CPT or JNB non-stopper will come along again someday.... as SAA used to do outbound from the US with the 744. That was nice. Stopping at 1 am or so at Cape Verde' was not so thrilling, though....

Regards, all...
 
N600RR
Posts: 171
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:04 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 18):
Why is everyone so negative about everything?

 checkmark 
Why indeed? And it seems like it's not just here on A.net either...

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 27):
but right now they want Panasonic to reduce the weight of the system

How much does one of these systems weigh? weightlifter 

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 30):
Should we begin discussing the "decision" or do you wanna wait?

Hey! Don't play with our emotions like that...Ya big tease! biggrin 

P.S. I hope it's something like the board of directors has authorized the revocation or voiding of a certain former executive's deferred compensation/retirement package, and then use the money to buy more planes...
"And the fluffy white lines that the airplane leaves behind are drifting right in front of the waning of the moon" -Cake
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:07 am

Quoting N600RR (Reply 32):
P.S. I hope it's something like the board of directors has authorized the revocation or voiding of a certain former executive's deferred compensation/retirement package, and then use the money to buy more planes...

We should be so lucky. I wish Leo gets not a single more cent from Delta Air Lines, Inc. But that's probably not likely to happen...

I think?
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
N600RR
Posts: 171
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:42 am

Quoting N600RR (Reply 32):
and then use the money to buy more planes...

I should have said: use the money to buy more planes, pay off creditors, upgrade inflight service, employee pay, etc., etc.
"And the fluffy white lines that the airplane leaves behind are drifting right in front of the waning of the moon" -Cake
 
HnlBoi
Posts: 128
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:02 pm

Is there a crew change in DKR to work the DKR-JNB leg? and vice versa?
 
EXAAUADL
Posts: 1740
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:09 pm

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 28):
Care to explain your thinking or rationale behind this?

SA's A340-600 had 333 seats. DL's 777 has something like 270 or so.
 
B777ER
Posts: 431
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:02 pm

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 17):
I'd take a 763 over a 777 anyday assuming that the amenities (seats, IFE, etc.) are the same

As of now..you get a nice inflight magazine! Oh and a movie that everyone must watch on the main screen.

Quoting Airplanetire (Reply 20):
Don't be too hard on DL's 763s. It's true that they lack PTVs and the seats certainly look like crap

Thats the point I was trying to make but I admit, I worded it wrong.

Quoting UpstateDave (Reply 21):
are they also going to add PTVs

Not anytime soon. I have heard only that they will be adding PTV's to the 757 for their overhauled transcon product (as the 757 will be the transcon work horse)...see Song type product.

Quoting UpstateDave (Reply 21):
wish delta would put their PTV system from Song

See above.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 27):
DL is upgrading the cabins of all its int'l aircraft and is still seeking to put the same AVOD IFE on the 763s as it is putting on every seat on the 764 and 777 but right now they want Panasonic to reduce the weight of the system

Not anytime soon.
 
zsx81
Posts: 288
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2000 11:46 am

RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:38 pm

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 13):
Please explain more specifically how 767s are inherently "uncomfortable" while A340s, 777s and other true wide cabin types are to be presumed to more comfortable. Seems to me that inflight comfort levels for pax or the lack thereof, whether in Y or otherwise, has little to nothing to do with aircraft type but rather has everything to do the design of the seats installed in any given aircraft type and the manner in which seats are arranged/spaced.

Thank you Tango very good point. If you think about it 777s are configure 3-3-3 as opposed to 76s with 2-3-2. You have a more middle seats on 777! Plus DL is redoing the cabins, soon adding PTVs as well. I don't think 76s have any sort of disadvantage over the bigger aircrafts!
 
DAL767400ER
Posts: 5084
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:04 pm

Quoting Flyer732 (Reply 22):
I think the JFK-ACC is up to daily, if not daily then very close to it.

It's actually going from 2x weekly to 3x weekly, not daily.

Quoting Aviationwiz (Reply 25):
I sure would! SA would give me way better service than DL, not to mention a PTV.

Why is everybody so goddamn hell-bent on having PTVs? I guess things like books, you know, those collections of words written on paper, are just soo 20th century...

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 26):
Even with a 777, ATL-JNB will experience a decline in available seats YR/YR



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 36):
SA's A340-600 had 333 seats. DL's 777 has something like 270 or so.

Hmm, didn't know that DL wanted to take over all of SAA's own pax as well. Brilliant logic.
 
aviationwiz
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 7:20 pm

RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:33 pm

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 39):
Why is everybody so goddamn hell-bent on having PTVs? I guess things like books, you know, those collections of words written on paper, are just soo 20th century...

Because most people don't just want to sit there and read for 18 hours, especially in this day and age. People want to recline their seats and watch a movie, which can often make the time go by much faster than reading (unless it's a damn good book!)

People used to flying the US-South Africa route in Y are used to PTV's now thanks to SA, if DL doesn't offer that service as well, they will have a harder time competing with SA for economy class pax.

It also appears (from Seatguru) that DL doesn't have fully-flat J seats like SA does on their US routes (and has for at least the past 4 years.)

I really don't see any reason why I would want to fly DL to South Africa over SA, except for better feeding in the United States, which, let's face it, UA and US feed into JFK and IAD is fairly weak compared to what DL can get into ATL in time to make the flight to South Africa. On the flip side though, trying to book on DL's website for any flights in Africa once in JNB is simply not possible.

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 39):
Hmm, didn't know that DL wanted to take over all of SAA's own pax as well. Brilliant logic.

Of course they want to take over all of SAA's own pax on the route, notice the key word there is *WANT*. That means more passengers, which translates into increased revenues and profits. They simply know they won't be able to do so.
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soups
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:48 pm

Quoting Flyer732 (Reply 22):
I think the JFK-ACC is up to daily

1 weekly flight during the low seasons
2/3 during the peak periods
Next destinations, Suarabaya, beirut, paris, Accra
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:38 pm

Quoting B777ER (Reply 37):
Not anytime soon. I have heard only that they will be adding PTV's to the 757 for their overhauled transcon product (as the 757 will be the transcon work horse)...see Song type product.

Incorrect, again.

Total of 117 a/c will get the first module - inclusive of 757s, 767-300 (domestic birds) and 737-800s.

The first 757-200 w/ the new interior (ship # 6717 I believe) has left the shop and is flying revenue flights.

The first domestic 767-300 is currently having the system installed. There is another 757-200 started. They will do (from what I heard) 5 a/c per month.

Perhaps you care to retract your statement?
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B747-437B
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:43 pm

Quoting Flyer732 (Reply 22):
I think the JFK-ACC is up to daily, if not daily then very close to it.

The JFK-ACC is 2x weekly (Wed/Sat) and BWI-BJL-ACC is 1x weekly (Sun).

The summer loads have been by all anecdotal accounts very disappointing for NAA, with flights regularly leaving ACC with dozens of empty seats. On-time performance has also been woeful with delays of 8+ hours not uncommon.
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OttoPylit
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:45 pm

Quoting B777ER (Reply 10):
SA)">DL needs to get off the wallet and order some more T7's post-haste.

Don't worry. A good chunk of 777's will be arriving beginning early 2008.

Quoting B777ER (Reply 37):
Not anytime soon. I have heard only that they will be adding PTV's to the 757 for their overhauled transcon product (as the 757 will be the transcon work horse)...see Song type product.

Because the IFE product for the 767's is not decided yet. The 757's will be sticking with the current Song IFE. For the 767's, however, until the wgt ratio and brand is decided, no additional mention will be made of it.

Quoting Aviationwiz (Reply 40):
Of course they want to take over all of SAA's own pax on the route, notice the key word there is *WANT*. That means more passengers, which translates into increased revenues and profits. They simply know they won't be able to do so.

SA fed all that traffic onto code-share SA)">DL flights once it entered ATL. Any O&D traffic will continue, instead of making more of a hassle by connecting through JFK or IAD. Any additional traffic would have a choice by connecting to the(as you mentioned) weak traffic in JFK and IAD as compared to the vast SA)">DL network out of ATL. When compared with the options available, there should still be quite a hefty market there for SA)">DL. I think SA)">DL only cares to make money on the route, I doubt they are trying to capitalize on SAA's traffic. Flying throughout the US and throughout Africa are two different worlds for both airlines.



OttoPylit
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panamair
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:10 am

Quoting Aviationwiz (Reply 40):
Because most people don't just want to sit there and read for 18 hours, especially in this day and age. People want to recline their seats and watch a movie, which can often make the time go by much faster than reading (unless it's a damn good book!)

People used to flying the US-South Africa route in Y are used to PTV's now thanks to SA, if DL doesn't offer that service as well, they will have a harder time competing with SA for economy class pax.

PTVs in Y (or for that matter in J or F) are not the deal-breaker for most people when deciding on air travel. Price, schedules, convenience, FF program membership, and even seat comfort feature much more prominently than PTVs. Especially with those passengers that matter to the airlines, i.e., full fare and premium class pax. Usually those tend to be older too and are not as hooked to the Idiot Box like the MTV generation. I am lucky enough to be in international Business cabins pretty frequently and have never found more than half the cabin's passengers tuned into their PTVs; a lot of people simply don't care.
 
B777ER
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:12 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 42):
Incorrect, again.

Total of 117 a/c will get the first module - inclusive of 757s, 767-300 (domestic birds) and 737-800s.

The first 757-200 w/ the new interior (ship # 6717 I believe) has left the shop and is flying revenue flights.

The first domestic 767-300 is currently having the system installed. There is another 757-200 started. They will do (from what I heard) 5 a/c per month.

Perhaps you care to retract your statement?

No, you basically confirmed what I said! No 763 domestic or otherwise is getting PTV's for now. Just the 757. See below as well. Have a nice day.

Quoting OttoPylit (Reply 44):
Because the IFE product for the 767's is not decided yet. The 757's will be sticking with the current Song IFE. For the 767's, however, until the wgt ratio and brand is decided, no additional mention will be made of it.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:29 am

Quoting B777ER (Reply 46):
No, you basically confirmed what I said! No 763 domestic or otherwise is getting PTV's for now. Just the 757. See below as well. Have a nice day.

B777ER - your statement is still invalid see below:

1) When refering to the 767 fleet there are currently three different fleet sets: -332(domestic), -332ER/-3P6ER/-324ER (international configured -300s), and -432ERs

2) Delta Boeing 767-332 (read domestic) are getting the PTV system. There currently is 1 -332 in tech-ops getting the modification (inclusive of new interior/leather and PTVs in all classes. It is due out later this month/early September and from what I understand is going to be initially routed ATL-LAX.

3) Delta Boeing 767-432ERs (inclusive of both domestic and those to be internationally configured) are getting the PTV mods.

4) Delta Boeing 767-332ER/-3P6ER/-324ER are the only 767s currently not slated to get PTVs in the back. As they go in for reconfiguring, BizE will get the new AVOD int'l system. As for the back of the bus, they're currently working with Panasonic (the same provider of IFE for Song and the new domestic product) to get the weight down. The issue is DL plans to fly these birds on routes up to and possibly beyond 6000nm and the weight penalty for the PTV limits that ability.

5) The PTV enhancement to the fleet will touch the following aircraft by mid-late 2007/early 2008:
-Portion of the 757 (inclusive of ex-Song a/c)
-All 767-332s (domestic birds)
-Portion of the 737-832s
-767-432ERs (entire fleet)

6) We're all still awaiting clarity re: 777 a/c.

Hope this provides some clarity that will help you better understand the modifications going on at Delta. And have a nice day too.
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DeltaSFO
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:37 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 47):
We're all still awaiting clarity re: 777 a/c.

The B777s will also receive the cabin refurbishment and PTV enhancement mods within the timeframe you mentioned for the remainder of the fleet.
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Alitalia744
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RE: Whats Up With DL Fl# 34 ATL To JNB?

Tue Aug 22, 2006 2:36 am

Quoting DeltaSFO (Reply 48):
The B777s will also receive the cabin refurbishment and PTV enhancement mods within the timeframe you mentioned for the remainder of the fleet.

thanks for the info DeltaSFO - I knew they were getting the all leather interior, but wasn't sure about PTVs given the system is already installed and I believe it's Matsu-something (which I believe was absorbed into Panasonic anyway).
Some see lines, others see between the lines.

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