jamesjimlb
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What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:07 am

airbus just finished the A380 and is now planning the A350 what will be next? will they take a break or will the continue comming up with new ideas?

(if no info known write what they should do)

jamesjimlb
The sky is no longer the limit, but the mere minimum
 
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shamrock350
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:11 am

A320E? Could be something great, that is if there are no delays!

[Edited 2006-09-24 20:13:08]
 
TheSonntag
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:17 am

The A320 needs a replacement, just like the 737NG, once new engines are available. Both were very successful designs, but they will need to be replaced in 10 years from now.

Other than that, I think we will not see completely new desings in the next 15 years.
 
mauriceb
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:25 am

Quote:
Other than that, I think we will not see completely new desings in the next 15 years.

Correct, both have just finished (or almost) there marketing plans for the next 10-15 years, except for the Short haul market. Although i think we might see a bigger version of the A380, but not in the near future , since i think Airbus first has to sort out the problems with the current A380 versions

Airbus:

A350
A380
A340-500/600HGW (although both not really new)

Boeing:
787-3/8/9/(10?)
777-200LR/300ER
747-8I


A380
 
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Stitch
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:27 am

Quoting JamesJimlb (Thread starter):
airbus just finished the A380 and is now planning the A350 what will be next? will they take a break or will the continue comming up with new ideas?

They will develop and launch the A320E as an interim "refresh" until the A320RS is ready in the mid-to-late 2010s.
 
jamesjimlb
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:27 am

airbus should take a chance and try to make a jet like the md80/90 or try a regional jet.
The sky is no longer the limit, but the mere minimum
 
Scorpio
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:31 am

Quoting JamesJimlb (Reply 5):
airbus should take a chance and try to make a jet like the md80/90

They've already done that. It's called the A320.

ANyway, the A320RS will probably be the next big project.
 
jamesjimlb
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:34 am

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 6):
They've already done that. It's called the A320.

that is the 737 of airbus, i'm talking about a smaller jet.
The sky is no longer the limit, but the mere minimum
 
JakTrax
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:36 am

Why would they make an MD-80/90-type jet? they already have one in the shape of the A320/321. Also, there would be little point in competing with the likes of Embraer and Bombardier in the regional stakes, as they seem to have it all wrapped up. Besides, judging by the success (or lack of) of Airbus' 'nearly' regional jet, the A318, it certainly wouldn't be a wise idea to go even smaller. Boeing have had a similar disaster with their 737-600.

The regional jet market is perhaps more fierce than the larger airliner market - Dornier are an unfortunate testimony to that.

Karl
 
curlyheadboy
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:38 am

I'm not an expert, but i guess it will depend a lot on the succes of the A380, Airbus has invested so much in it, that its downfall on any future project is likely to be huge....
If God had wanted men to fly he would have given them more money...
 
jamesjimlb
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:42 am

if not the regional jet biz they will probably make the A320 replacement
The sky is no longer the limit, but the mere minimum
 
Scorpio
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 3:52 am

Quoting JamesJimlb (Reply 7):
that is the 737 of airbus, i'm talking about a smaller jet

When did the MD-80/90 become smaller than the A320/737? A320 was designed as a direct competitor to the MD-80 (and 737), while the MD-90 was McDD's response to the A320.
 
Jpax
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:37 am

Quoting JamesJimlb (Thread starter):
airbus just finished the A380

Airbus is not quite finished with the A380. They are still working out wiring among other things, and then who knows what may (or may not) come after that. After it gets delivered to the airlines, they will definitely have their own technicalities they want sorted out, especially if it doesn't reach performance guarantees.

So while it may look like Airbus has finished the A380, they still have quite a bit of tweaking to do to have their customers satisfied.
 
hb88
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:11 am

Quoting JamesJimlb (Reply 7):
Quoting Scorpio (Reply 6):
"They've already done that. It's called the A320."

that is the 737 of airbus, i'm talking about a smaller jet.

The "737 of Airbus" is a pretty broad statement! Are you sure you don't mean the A318 or A319? To me they seem more along the lines of a smaller regional jet. In any case, ATR, also owned by EADS so I guess a sister company of Airbus produces the excellent ATR regional turboprop which has been filling a regional-jet-like space for a while. So I would speculate that there wouldn't be much business impetus to specifically develop a line similar to the ERJ etc.

In any case, I think you can safely say that Airbus will be pretty busy with the 350XWB, 380/380 stretch, NSR, A400M and the 330 freighter for a while.
 
EDDB
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:55 am

I think we all agree that the A32x will be the next type in need of a successor, so no surprise there... But what will be interesting is: Which new technology will become available at that time?

IMO Airbus will be the first to build a commercial airplane with an adaptive wing, the time might be right for that!
 
BigSky123
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:33 am

Quoting EDDB (Reply 14):
IMO Airbus will be the first to build a commercial airplane with an adaptive wing, the time might be right for that!

Could you elaborate please? Are you talking F-14 Tomcat type of adaptive wing on an airliner?!
 
474218
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:02 am

IMO the first thing Airbus must do is finish the projects they have started and restore their customers confidence. With Airbus's last two projects; the still born A350 and the much delayed A380 fresh on their mind, what airline (except for a EU state run airline) would dare to be a launch customer on a new Airbus project?
 
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Stitch
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:04 am

Quoting BigSky123 (Reply 15):
Could you elaborate please? Are you talking F-14 Tomcat type of adaptive wing on an airliner?!

The Tomcat has a variable geometry wing.

Mission Adaptable Wings - MAWS - are conceptual wings that change their shape as needed to meet mission requirements. So at take-off and landing, they would change to allow higher angles of attack to prevent stalling. At cruise, they would change to provide the most efficient profile. And such.
 
EDDB
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:39 pm

Quoting BigSky123 (Reply 15):
Could you elaborate please? Are you talking F-14 Tomcat type of adaptive wing on an airliner?!

Not quite! An adaptive wing has the target to change certain usually fixed parameters of the wing during flight, like airfoil, chord or aspect ratio! It would also make slats and flaps obsolete! This shall be done by use of flexible materials or actuators! Since nowadays wings are a compromise and not suited perfectly for every part of the flight envelope, the adaptive wing changes its form constantly to offer the best aerodynamic charateristics for every phase of flight! Experts estimate that adaptive wings have the potential to save up to 35% of fuel! I'm not quite sure if we will see this technology with the next generation of airliners after EIS of 787/350, but if not then we will see it later on! Maybe together with a blended-wing-body-kind of jetliner... Who knows? But I'm pretty sure that you won't get much more out of a conventional design with a tube, fixed wings and 2 engines fitted beneath it!
 
columba
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 6:08 pm

Quoting JamesJimlb (Thread starter):
will they take a break

It is never good to take a rest in a such a high technology industry.
Not only Boeing could come up with a 737 replacement based on 787 technology but China, Japan and Embraer could come up with a regional jet that is close to the 737/A320 size that could steal market share on the lower segment of Airbus products.
Airbus also has the A400M that has to be finished soon and is facing delays.
I guess that the next big thing for Airbus is the A320E and they will also start to work on a real replacement for it so that they are not facing a bad surprise when Boeing comes up with their new 737 sized aircraft.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
Motorhussy
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:09 pm

Something in the area of a replacement for:

- A300/310 with long and short range versions
- A320 family replacements with a consideration for a short range smaller jet; perhaps a family of two?


But only once they've got their SH*# together with the A380 and A350.

IMHO

Regards
MH
come visit the south pacific
 
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OzarkD9S
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:20 pm

They are seriously studying an aircraft powered by brainwaves. WN will be the launch customer.

:D
Next up: STL-OAK-RNO-LAS-ICT-STL
 
Motorhussy
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:32 pm

Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 21):
They are seriously studying an aircraft powered by brainwaves. WN will be the launch customer.

But there is a belief that Boeing are intercepting their wave instruction through lab tests on subjects at Guantanamo.
come visit the south pacific
 
Scorpio
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:34 pm

Quoting 474218 (Reply 16):
With Airbus's last two projects; the still born A350 and the much delayed A380 fresh on their mind, what airline (except for a EU state run airline) would dare to be a launch customer on a new Airbus project?

Oh I don't know, Singapore Airlines?
 
BigSky123
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:39 pm

Thank you for the explanation Stitch and EDDB! Sounds very interesting! How would they keep the weight of these wings down with all the machinery underneath?
 
Motorhussy
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:43 pm

Quoting Scorpio (Reply 23):
Quoting 474218 (Reply 16):
With Airbus's last two projects; the still born A350 and the much delayed A380 fresh on their mind, what airline (except for a EU state run airline) would dare to be a launch customer on a new Airbus project?

Oh I don't know, Singapore Airlines?

And maybe QR.
come visit the south pacific
 
EDDB
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 7:49 pm

Quoting BigSky123 (Reply 24):
Thank you for the explanation Stitch and EDDB! Sounds very interesting! How would they keep the weight of these wings down with all the machinery underneath?

Look at all the machinery that is used nowadays for slats, flaps, spoilers, etc. I think it won't be more machinery, but I don't know for sure of course! But I do know that you can also make things move by using layers of different materials which behave differently to any current applied, and I remember reading about using it on adaptive wings somewhere... But anyhow, I'm not a scientiest, just a user!  Wink
 
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autothrust
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:28 pm

I dont think Airbus will announce a new program in the next 2 years. We shouldn't forget how much programs are running and how busy Airbus is at the moment. A part of resources which would be free are now reinforcing the A380 program to minimize delays.

List of currents programs :
-A330F
-A400M (also delays)
-A350XBW(800,900,1000)
-A380F
-maybe after EIS A389 & A389F

IMO there is just no need for replacement of the A320(wich is selling great) until Boeing brings the Y1. Sometimes it's better to wait and let move the others make first step and then try to leapfrog it.
“Faliure is not an option.”
 
flysherwood
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:09 am

Since when is the A380 project finished? They haven't even delivered their first airplane. The A350 is still on the drawing board? The better question for this is, will Airbus survive the current mess that they are in?

Cash flow is king in business and Airbus must be very worried about their cash flow position over the next few years. Remember that the single aisle planes do not provide very much gross profit fort operating margins. The giant white elephant known as the A380 is going to sap all of the cash that Airbus can get its hands on.
 
beech19
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RE: What Will Come Next For Airbus?

Tue Sep 26, 2006 3:34 am

Quoting JakTrax (Reply 8):
Boeing have had a similar disaster with their 737-600.

I can't speak for the A318... but i think calling the 736 a disaster is a little extreme.
Am i the only one who is tired of hearing this?

Just like the 764 it wasn't designed to be the "big seller." It had a niche and the small amount of money it took to create it was worth whatever small share it would grab in the low passenger arena. It took minimal engineering to create the 736 (as the 73G was the "base model") and it has sold its small share, easily breaking even(i'm sure SOMEONE will correct me if i'm wrong here) with 70 sold and 68 delivered.

Yes it may be heavy for its size and a gas guzzler but there is at least a few airlines are quite happy with them or else they wouldn't be taking delivery of them.
SAS has a fleet of 28, Tunis Air has 7, and Westjet has taken delivery of 12 of their 14.

The average list price of a 737-600 is $51mil.
Lets do the math:
70 x $51,000,000 = $3,570,000,000

Even if ALL of the orders were sold at a 50% discount (highly unlikely):
70 x $25,500,000 = $1,785,000,000

Its just a hunch of mine but i'm guessing it didn't cost even CLOSE to $1.7bil to design and implement and build the 736 design. That being said i'm sure Boeing made a very nice profit on all of the 736 orders (as small as they may have been).
THAT doesn't sound like a disaster to me.

Sorry for my rant... back to the main topic.

We all know what is next for Boeing... Y1 (737RS) and then the Y3.
Who knows what next for Airbus as they have there hands quite full already with the A380, proposed(for the 5th time) A350, the "not going as smoothly as expected" A400, and the upcoming A320E and A320RS.

IMHO - Boeing has the upper hand during the next generation of aircraft. Only time will tell what turns up with the 737RS/A320RS and the future Y3/"whatever airbus comes up with" but it will surely be exciting to watch.  Smile
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