JetBlueAUS
Topic Author
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Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:52 am

US Airways is definitely coping well with its merger with America West, but not everything is going their way...

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/b...urce=rss&channel=inquirer_business
Not all of us can be heroes, some of us can only stand on the sidewalk and clap as they go by.
 
QFSYD744
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:16 am

There are a number of questions that I have in regards to the US Airways/America West merger. If anyone is able to help that would be greatly, very grealty appreciated.

1/ Headquarters have been moved to Tempe, in Phoenix, a non long haul US Airways/America West gateway. Why was that?

2/ There are absolutely no US Airways long haul equipment rotating into/from Las Vegas or Phoenix, Why is that? Will Las Vegas remain a hub?

3/ America West/US Airways seniority, who retains and who looses?

4/ The new branding/colours seems to be less than pleasant and almost childlike. Why such odd colours?

5/ Uniforms are not the same from one airline to the other. Why is that? Cabin interiors vary greatly from one airline to the next. Are there plans to commonize the interiors?

6/ Is Pittsburgh going to remain a focus city along with La Guardia and National?

7/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 737-300/757-200 program?

8/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 767-200 program?

9/ Doug Parker, has he bitten off more than he can chew?

10/ How viable is the merger long term against the likes of Southwest, Delta, American, and United Airlines?

Any information would greatly help. It was funny about 14 years ago we in Australia were being told that by 1996 America West would have the 747-400 and would be flying to Sydney. That never happened. Just wondering what would come of this marriage between US Airways/America West?
I Still Call Australia Home
 
ATWZW170
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:22 am

Have you seen the operation in PHL - lazy ass local workers - and please don't sit and tell me that everyone has taken pay cuts and because of that people don't do more than what they are paid for. We all have, it sucks. No one is making the money they were - but fact of the matter is that if you look at those who work in PHL - and I mean everywhere in the airport, from Burger King to the city cleaners, they are all lazy local workers.

Let the lashings begin.
Success is getting what you want...happiness is liking what you get
 
QFSYD744
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:24 am

Quoting ATWZW170 (Reply 2):
PHL - and I mean everywhere in the airport, from Burger King to the city cleaners, they are all lazy local workers

If the employee morale is so bad in Philadelphia, and the headquarters have been moved to PHX, why maintain Philadelphia. Is Philadelphia O/D rich? Or is Philadelphia contract rich for TATL?
I Still Call Australia Home
 
steeler83
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:33 am

Man, if this news was any older, I would have read about it in the Book of Exodus!!!
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
warreng24
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:38 am

Just read the article.

Is there any particular reason they can't fire the people who don't show up to their shifts? Or the ones that duck out?

If I don't show up to work, I'd be fired.

I mean, I'm sure that there have to be other people who are willing and able to take the jobs from the fired workers?
 
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jaybird
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 8:45 am

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
1/ Headquarters have been moved to Tempe, in Phoenix, a non long haul US Airways/America West gateway. Why was that?

that's because HP purchased US and is running the combined airline from the HP headquarters in PHX .. they're using the name US because they felt it was better known ..

the equipment issues have much to do with the fact that they are still operating with 2 certificates .. and until they are combined into 1 certificate there are certain things that have to stay the way they are now .. that applies with seniority too - that's still being worked on .. and uniforms .. and long term equipment needs ..

not sure what you mean about the new branding .. it's white, red and blue .. that's childlike? course there are the Heritage colors which, for those of us who remember AL, PI and PS (plus LC/MO) fondly - they're really neat! and yes, i wish there was a black/gold mohawk heritage plane too!

has Doug Parker bitten off more than he can chew? way too early for that .. but, i seriously doubt it .. mergers are never easy things .. and there are always bumps in the road, but lots of people are pullin' for him and the 'new' airline ..  Smile
 
N670UW
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:07 am

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 3):
If the employee morale is so bad in Philadelphia, and the headquarters have been moved to PHX, why maintain Philadelphia. Is Philadelphia O/D rich? Or is Philadelphia contract rich for TATL?

Because PHL produces more revenue for US Airways than any other hub... Charlotte, Phoenix, Las Vegas, any of them...
 
N701AA
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:35 am

Can anyone comment on the integration of both airlines' computer reservation systems? An agent told me that if you travel on an US marketed itinerary that involves segments that are operated by both US and HP ( HP LAX-PHX US PHX-PHL), the agents have to login into both computer systems to be able to check you in. Is that true?

I went through an airport (LAS) that had common use check in kiosks. The kiosks in the lobby had hand written labels that read "If you are flying on US Air flight, check in using the button for the airline that operates the flight, US or HP." I wonder, how is a passenger supposed to know who operates the flight?

It seems to me there is still a lot of work to do to integrate both airlines.
 
JetBlueAUS
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:40 am

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
6/ Is Pittsburgh going to remain a focus city along with La Guardia and National?

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I can't see PIT becoming a hub again for US.
Not all of us can be heroes, some of us can only stand on the sidewalk and clap as they go by.
 
commavia
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:15 am

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
1/ Headquarters have been moved to Tempe, in Phoenix, a non long haul US Airways/America West gateway. Why was that?

The company kept the USAirways name. But it kept the America West management and administration. And that was in Tempe.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
2/ There are absolutely no US Airways long haul equipment rotating into/from Las Vegas or Phoenix, Why is that? Will Las Vegas remain a hub?

Because neither Las Vegas or Phoenix gets longhaul flights. Perhaps USAirways could link either hub with Asia once they get A350s, but either market would be a difficult one for flying to Asia because they're so close to the far, far larger O&D centers of Los Angeles and the San Francisco Bay Area.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
3/ America West/US Airways seniority, who retains and who looses?

That's being fought out right now between the company and the work groups.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
4/ The new branding/colours seems to be less than pleasant and almost childlike. Why such odd colours?

The merged USAirways wanted to retain the basic USAirways branding scheme, but integrated the gray wavy lines of the America West livery. In addition, they retained the America West basic white color scheme versus the USAirways basic blue body coloring because the combined company's fleet is going to spending a lot of time rotating through Phoenix and Las Vegas, two of the newly merger company's largest hubs, both of which are incredibly hot for half the year. Having a dark-blue piece of metal bake in the sun for 55 minutes on a turn would burn a lot of money on air conditioning.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
5/ Uniforms are not the same from one airline to the other. Why is that? Cabin interiors vary greatly from one airline to the next. Are there plans to commonize the interiors?

Uniforms and cabin interiors take time to unify. Cabin interiors likely won't get standardized until the planes go in for heavy overhauls, which could take several years to complete for the entire aircraft fleet.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
6/ Is Pittsburgh going to remain a focus city along with La Guardia and National?

It's probably going to stay put where it is now that USAirways has curtailed service there so dramatically. However, anything could change, especially depending on how much more capacity Southwest puts into the market.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
7/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 737-300/757-200 program?

In the medium-term, both are probably staying put. Long-term, the 737s are probably going to be replaced with Airbus A320 family aircraft. The 757s, however, probably aren't going anywhere anytime soon. They're just too capable a plane to get rid of.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
8/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 767-200 program?

They're going to be hard to replace. USAirways is flying larger A330s to larger European markets, and has a fleet of A350s coming (who knows when). However, both are way too large to replace the 767s. USAirways could never fill an A330 or A350 on PHL-Venice, for example.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
9/ Doug Parker, has he bitten off more than he can chew?

That's certainly up for intensive debate right now within the airline and the industry. Only time will tell.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
10/ How viable is the merger long term against the likes of Southwest, Delta, American, and United Airlines?

Also highly debatable based on your perspective and, quite honestly, your biases.
 
QFSYD744
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:21 am

Thanks to everyone for the information on US Airways/America West, it is always great to be able to share information amongst people who really care and have a passion for the industry.


Cheers!
I Still Call Australia Home
 
ca2ohHP
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:58 am

Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
3/ America West/US Airways seniority, who retains and who looses?

That's being fought out right now between the company and the work groups.

Actually for the passenger service group, a final transition agreement is in place and once there is a common reservation system (approximately March 2007), the seniority lists will be combined. Actually only the mechanics are the only work group with uncertain contractual issues.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
6/ Is Pittsburgh going to remain a focus city along with La Guardia and National?

Yes. Technically LGA and DCA are both shuttle cities, not focus cities.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
4/ The new branding/colours seems to be less than pleasant and almost childlike. Why such odd colours?

US Airways employees designed the new paint scheme, zero cost to the company...childlike would be a matter of one's own opinion.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
7/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 737-300/757-200 program?

They're going to be around awhile. At least until next generation narrow bodies based off 787 composite technology is developed. US is looking at a possible interim solution, but nothing except for a handful of Airbuses and E190's has been decided on.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
8/ What is the long term replacement plan for the 767-200 program?

New interiors will begin to arrive next year. Again, nothing longterm formally planned.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
9/ Doug Parker, has he bitten off more than he can chew?

DP is actively looking for other possible merger opportunities, so I think he can handle "what he has bitten off."

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
10/ How viable is the merger long term against the likes of Southwest, Delta, American, and United Airlines?

As good as anyone else's chances are.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
Any information would greatly help. It was funny about 14 years ago we in Australia were being told that by 1996 America West would have the 747-400 and would be flying to Sydney. That never happened.

Are you thinking of 1989 when America West initiated Nagoya flights? If that's the case, the timing of Pacific flights were terrible. The Gulf War had just broken out, and America West was left with these 747-200's running empty flights to Japan. In 1996, America West had just emerged from bankruptcy.
 
CentPIT
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:20 am

Quoting JetBlueAUS (Reply 9):
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I can't see PIT becoming a hub again for US.

I agree, but there is a chance that US may add a few frequencies/routes here and drop a few there. 168 daily flights isn't to bad!
Pittsburgh International: US Airways---160 daily departures! (52 destinations)
 
Cactus739
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:47 am

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
4/ The new branding/colours seems to be less than pleasant and almost childlike. Why such odd colours?

Since Red, White, and Blue are the colors of the United States flag, makes sense for US Airways to use them I'd think....

 coffee 
You can't fix stupid.... - Ron White
 
galapagapop
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:51 am

PHL is just a mess flown in on US about a dozen times now (sadly majority had on leg going to a dang CRJ!). Heck I even remember sitting for a flight in F on a CRJ in July, theres a worker sitting in the aft bin legs out sleeping (at least he remembered that step, remember the FL dummy who got stuck in there), upon pushback the adjacent gate was just dealing with an incoming flight, I watch as a cart zips up towards the main terminal leaving 3 bags in the dust. They were only moved by our wing walkers as they were close to where we'd be backing up. I dunno the inner working of PHL, but best thing to raise moral is not send BS gifts and raffles and cash incentives, show empathy. I say fire the late guy and take his place that day. Make it clear you can replace others and also show your willing to do what they do. Dave at B6 does it sometimes when he's in a jam why can't these guys.

Cheers!
 
HPLASOps
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:05 pm

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
America West/US Airways seniority, who retains and who looses?

This is taking the longest to settle to ensure there is very little difference in "winning" and "loosing." I imagine it will result in a 1 year HP=2 years US, or something similar to that.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
Uniforms are not the same from one airline to the other. Why is that? Cabin interiors vary greatly from one airline to the next. Are there plans to commonize the interiors?

That's a long-term project that is low on the totem pole of priorities right now. We need to build up the cash and fleet availability to take a/c out of service to redo the interiors, both of which the airline is a little short on. It is important to get the exterior livery painted, as that is what the public remembers the most about a plane.

About the ariticle in the OP.....the article mentions Tony Grantham many times, the new station manager at PHL. He had been station manager here at LAS for almost 2 years. I got to meet and speak with him many times and Tony is a no-nonsense, stand up guy. Tony will have a lot on his plate trying to correct the baggage problems in PHL, but he is probably the best guy we have to make things better.
"Just because I know how to get off a freeway doesn't mean I know how to get back on!" - Retard Joe
 
F9Animal
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:31 pm

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
2/ There are absolutely no US Airways long haul equipment rotating into/from Las Vegas or Phoenix, Why is that? Will Las Vegas remain a hub?

There are still many places to sign, and papers to finish before the merger is complete. I think we will see shifting of routes, and enhancements to LAS and PHX. It is too early and too soon to start tearing things apart.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
5/ Uniforms are not the same from one airline to the other. Why is that? Cabin interiors vary greatly from one airline to the next. Are there plans to commonize the interiors?

I know they are working on the uniform issue. This is certainly not an easy process. The costs alone will be very high. The interiors are probably on the back burner at the moment. There is alot of money being spent on other things at the moment, and spending has to be tight.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
9/ Doug Parker, has he bitten off more than he can chew?

No. He is and has built a team to assist with this. This certainly is no easy task, but it was necessary. HP saw an opportunity, and Doug took the gamble. Will it be successful? I sure hope so. The old US was nothing but potential. The airline has lots of opportunity to make big money. Combining the two operations seemed like a great idea. They already posted a profit. Not bad for an airline that just merged, and the other half just came out of bankruptcy.

Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):

10/ How viable is the merger long term against the likes of Southwest, Delta, American, and United Airlines?

Consolidation is the big word talked about these days by the CEO's of this industry. I am sure DL, AA, UA, WN, and all the others are watching this play out. Nobody expected US and HP to become success overnight. When NW took on Republic, it took a bit of time to fine tune the operations. NW became very successful after the takeover (and now today is a different story).
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
steeler83
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:31 pm

Quoting JetBlueAUS (Reply 9):

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I can't see PIT becoming a hub again for US.

Me neither, unless Parker would like to corrupt the entire airline and make a debacle of it!  mischievous 

I see it, at the absolute most, 180-or-so flights, including PIT-FRA or LGW resumed, but even that is a stretch at this point.

Quoting Commavia (Reply 10):
Quoting QFSYD744 (Reply 1):
6/ Is Pittsburgh going to remain a focus city along with La Guardia and National?

It's probably going to stay put where it is now that USAirways has curtailed service there so dramatically. However, anything could change, especially depending on how much more capacity Southwest puts into the market.

ehhh... it doesn't look like WN will be adding any capacity, regarding they do not intend to add any new cities. Then again, would PIT be a good start-up city to fly to? I highly doubt it. Although... they were going to focus on building up existing cities. Perhaps a PIT-BWI or PVD on the horizon?  scratchchin 

Quoting CentPIT (Reply 13):
I agree, but there is a chance that US may add a few frequencies/routes here and drop a few there. 168 daily flights isn't to bad!

Nah, not at all. It would be sweet to see another carrier come to town with the intent to build up a sizeable station, or to have an existing carrier establish one... even cargo... To Moon TWP/ACAA... Get a clue.

Quoting Galapagapop (Reply 15):
I watch as a cart zips up towards the main terminal leaving 3 bags in the dust. They were only moved by our wing walkers as they were close to where we'd be backing up.

Okay, now back on topic from that little PIT-tangent...

Having been in the customer services business for so long, I'd be the guy running my ass after the cart, dragging any bags that would fall off, and this is what I'd be yelling...

"You moron! You consider yourself among US' best rampers?!" [continuous expletives] lost bags... The passengers will have your head for lunch on a silver platter! STOP!! GET BACK HERE!! [bones cracking] AAAaagh, by back!"

Kinda like Ted Dansen as John Becker. You might even be able to hear me from inside the terminal at that!  laughing 
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
vega
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:22 pm

The Philadelphia Inquirer did this survey in hopes of lighting a fire under Parker and his Executives. The problem is with the airline - not the city, but it's the city that is getting a bad reputation. I will certainly submit that the airport design itself can't help, but that's another workable matter. It's interesting that when USAir was on the verge of liquidation, the airport authorities were at least outwardly unfazed and in fact essentially said that if US leaves, there are plenty who will pick up the slack. Now I really don't know what the attitude would be. The thing that escapes me is why Parker doesn't pick up his Executive committee and move to PHL for some period to fix all the problems. I can't fathom an organization which attempts to manage a potentially profit eroding situation like this from 2000 miles away. If PHL is as important to US as Parker indicates, he should get out there and personally manage it into shape! Too bad I'm not on the BOD.  devil 
We are but a moment in this vast Universe and when gone we will never have existed.
 
unitednrt
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 3:03 pm

The station manager at Philadelphia has the same attitude most eager station managers have, which is essentially, "I'm gonna change how this place works". Usually it takes a long time for workers to get used to you and for your goals as a station manager of a large base to pull through. I've experienced it three times and the first station, I had the same idea this guy does and needless to say, it was a damn mess most of the time.

From the article, seems like a normal "present day" station to me, just with larger baggage mishandling stats.
"...That's a lovely name. My name's Milton; Milton Ettenheim, but my friends call me Bubbles."
 
silentbob
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 3:24 pm

What they fail to mention is rampers watching the Eagles game and not actually working, problems with people punching the time clock and then going missing for the day and past issues with people punching the clock for their buddy who was still at home. Many of the employees there don't care about the company or the passengers that pay their salaries. That said, there are some very good and capable people there. They need to be rewarded.

I'm surprised they don't just load up a couple express aircraft at some of the smaller outstations with high unemployment numbers and put them to work on the ground in Philly. It isn't that expensive to ferry in a load from IPT or BGM.
 
cityguy
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 6:09 pm

This was a great article-and is very true. I had written a letter of complaint on July 17th to Parker who ignored me. I had also cc'd in his senior management who also ignored me. I sent it three times and finally I heard from Mr. Grantham who has promsied he will speak with me-and to date this has not occured.

This airline is in dire need of new and progressive management-and not a CEO who hides from the paying public. I am a Chairmans Preferred member and will be taking my business and my corporate business elsewhere in 2007.

So sad..they could have had it all.
 
sunking737
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 6:32 pm

All the new hires are getting new uniforms as we go through the system. When I was in PHX in Sept. for finger printing, company ID badge, & Etc I was fitted with my uniforms and so were others. We were told by the ladies at the company store that we will be getting the new uniforms. Others will get them in time as replacements are issued.

When you have say 35,000 employees it take time to outfit everyone. Also with over 300 A/C it takes time to paint. At lest they did not slap stickers on the planes like so many have done before. You would be seeing HP planes with tacky US Airways on them. But they did put a decal next to the door that says d/b/a US Airways, or something like that.
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
jfk777
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:16 pm

US should start Euripean service from PHX in 2008 or 2009. With the A350 situation going no where fast they should get all the A330-200 they can and think about the A350 as something ten years from now.
 
TUSflyer
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:16 pm

I have flown over 99,000 miles on HP since July 22. This airline has been nothing but wonderful to me. That includes every gate agent, phone rep, to flight crew. It always amazes me how the "21-25" year old group on A.net get off on these tangents when they may fly twice a year with mom and dad.
 
Lumberton
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 9:29 pm

Quoting JetBlueAUS (Reply 9):

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I can't see PIT becoming a hub again for US

A pity. Even though labor is often very militant there in Western Pa., good quality work gets done there. People complain sure; but they work!

Quoting Silentbob (Reply 21):
What they fail to mention is rampers watching the Eagles game and not actually working, problems with people punching the time clock and then going missing for the day and past issues with people punching the clock for their buddy who was still at home. Many of the employees there don't care about the company or the passengers that pay their salaries.

Why doesn't US just contract out the lot of them rather than allowing this situation to fester? Let them walk out and then replace them. If their performance is dragging the airline down, get the support of the rest of the union and go after them. (I know, easier said than done....)

Perhaps it would be better to fly into and out of Harrisburg,than PHL? About the same drive I have to IAH.  Wink
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
varig767
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:16 pm

From the article:

"The airline's rate was 7.6 lost or damaged bags per 1,000 passengers, versus an industry rate of 6.1."

So the airline has 0,076% damaged bags and the industry 0,061% ??

If stated in this way, no one would care! And, yes; 7,6 is indeed 25% higher than 6,1, but both rates are quite normal.

kind regards, Martijn
 
HPRamper
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:31 pm

I felt this was an excellent article. No bashing, just facts.

Quoting Galapagapop (Reply 15):
I say fire the late guy and take his place that day.

If it were only that easy, PHL would be working much better today. The problem is twofold - it is very difficult to just "fire" union employees, the process of appeals etc is very lengthy and costly and of course the IAM would turn things around and make it sound like the airline was firing-happy. Second, it's so hard to pick up new employees there that as the article said, the managers are afraid the workers won't be replaced. I personally don't know why it's such a problem there, PHX is much the same but with 120 degree heat and the staffing hasn't been nearly as bad as in PHL.
 
bobnwa
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:37 pm

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 17):
When NW took on Republic, it took a bit of time to fine tune the operations. NW became very successful after the takeover (and now today is a different story).

Have you looked at the DOT figures for the past six months or so for ontime, completion factor, baggage, and customer complaints. Northwest is at the top. Seems to me they are running a pretty good operation.
 
doug_or
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RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:42 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 28):
Second, it's so hard to pick up new employees there that as the article said, the managers are afraid the workers won't be replaced

Exactly, and this is why outsourceing won't work. An outside company with even lower pay and benefits will have even more trouble recruiting. The facilities in PHL suck, but it is above all else a personel problem.

Quoting Varig767 (Reply 27):
If stated in this way, no one would care! And, yes; 7,6 is indeed 25% higher than 6,1, but both rates are quite normal.

I think US would be doing much better than the industry average if it weren't for PHL.

Quoting Silentbob (Reply 21):
It isn't that expensive to ferry in a load from IPT or BGM.

Yes it is. I'm not saying its a bad idea, but sending a Dash (the smallest aircraft US operates out of PHL) on a roundtrip to either would use about 4000 lbs of fuel (1 roundtrip to pick 'em up and 1 to drop them off). Add to this flight crew and maintance costs, in addition to the lost revenue of not having a plane in service, and it would be very expensive. If there were enough good outstation workers in PHL to change the dominant attitude, though, it might be worth it.
When in doubt, one B pump off
 
MCOflyer
Posts: 7071
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:51 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:51 pm

You have to remember everyone at US Airways east who is a pilot is pretty senior. The guys at HP are junior. So i'm thinking a HP Captain on the 320 has 10yrs seniority while the US captain has 15-20.

Quoting HPLASOps (Reply 16):
This is taking the longest to settle to ensure there is very little difference in "winning" and "loosing." I imagine it will result in a 1 year HP=2 years US, or something similar to that.

Agreed 100%.

US is a great airline and I have hopes for them.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
DTWAGENT
Posts: 753
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:16 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 10:59 pm

Ok Now I just read that Airbus is thinking about tanking the A350 program. If they do that, then what aircraft would US go with for long haul service? Would it be the A330-200 and 300's?

chuck
 
Lumberton
Posts: 4176
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 7:34 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:16 pm

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 32):
. If they do that, then what aircraft would US go with for long haul service? Would it be the A330-200 and 300's?

US Airways Alternative To The A350? (by Vega Oct 6 2006 in Civil Aviation)
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4472
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:20 pm

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 32):
Ok Now I just read that Airbus is thinking about tanking the A350 program. If they do that, then what aircraft would US go with for long haul service? Would it be the A330-200 and 300's?

chuck

When did Airbus announce that they were thinking of tanking the A350 program.
 
QFSYD744
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:37 pm

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 34):
When did Airbus announce that they were thinking of tanking the A350 program.

Here is a link to the FORBES article:

http://www.forbes.com/2006/10/05/air...n_1005airbus.html?partner=yahootix

Hope this helps..
I Still Call Australia Home
 
QFSYD744
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:42 pm

A few questions for the masses. If the A350 programme is halted what is the next course of action for US Airways long-haul route planning? In addition arent the 767-200 frames in the US Airways fleet a little more than worn and tired at this point?
I Still Call Australia Home
 
pdxtriple7
Posts: 641
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 6:27 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:43 pm

Now I know why it took me 30 minutes to get my bag on Friday. Not to mention PHL is a mess when the wind is blowing in a different direction. No rain, only 15 mph wind caused my first flight to be cancelled and then my next one to be delayed 2.5 hours. All in all it took me 13 hours to get from RDU-PHL with only a 46 minute flight.
 
QFSYD744
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:50 pm

Quoting PDXtriple7 (Reply 37):
Now I know why it took me 30 minutes to get my bag on Friday. Not to mention PHL is a mess when the wind is blowing in a different direction. No rain, only 15 mph wind caused my first flight to be cancelled and then my next one to be delayed 2.5 hours. All in all it took me 13 hours to get from RDU-PHL with only a 46 minute flight.



Quoting Doug_Or (Reply 30):
Yes it is. I'm not saying its a bad idea, but sending a Dash (the smallest aircraft US operates out of PHL) on a roundtrip to either would use about 4000 lbs of fuel (1 roundtrip to pick 'em up and 1 to drop them off). Add to this flight crew and maintance costs, in addition to the lost revenue of not having a plane in service, and it would be very expensive. If there were enough good outstation workers in PHL to change the dominant attitude, though, it might be worth it



Quoting Doug_Or (Reply 30):
I think US would be doing much better than the industry average if it weren't for PHL



Quoting Doug_Or (Reply 30):
Exactly, and this is why outsourceing won't work. An outside company with even lower pay and benefits will have even more trouble recruiting. The facilities in PHL suck, but it is above all else a personel problem.



Quoting HPRamper (Reply 28):
The problem is twofold - it is very difficult to just "fire" union employees, the process of appeals etc is very lengthy and costly and of course the IAM would turn things around and make it sound like the airline was firing-happy. Second, it's so hard to pick up new employees there that as the article said, the managers are afraid the workers won't be replaced.



Quoting Varig767 (Reply 27):
"The airline's rate was 7.6 lost or damaged bags per 1,000 passengers, versus an industry rate of 6.1."



Quoting Cityguy (Reply 22):
This airline is in dire need of new and progressive management-and not a CEO who hides from the paying public. I am a Chairmans Preferred member and will be taking my business and my corporate business elsewhere in 2007.



Quoting Silentbob (Reply 21):
What they fail to mention is rampers watching the Eagles game and not actually working, problems with people punching the time clock and then going missing for the day and past issues with people punching the clock for their buddy who was still at home



Quoting Vega (Reply 19):
It's interesting that when USAir was on the verge of liquidation, the airport authorities were at least outwardly unfazed and in fact essentially said that if US leaves, there are plenty who will pick up the slack.



Quoting Galapagapop (Reply 15):
PHL is just a mess flown in on US about a dozen times now (sadly majority had on leg going to a dang CRJ!). Heck I even remember sitting for a flight in F on a CRJ in July, theres a worker sitting in the aft bin legs out sleeping (at least he remembered that step, remember the FL dummy who got stuck in there), upon pushback the adjacent gate was just dealing with an incoming flight, I watch as a cart zips up towards the main terminal leaving 3 bags in the dust.

From tales like the above, it is a wonder that US Airways is still in the air!
I Still Call Australia Home
 
Lumberton
Posts: 4176
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 7:34 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:53 pm

Quoting PDXtriple7 (Reply 37):
Now I know why it took me 30 minutes to get my bag on Friday.

That does it! Next trip to PHL, I'm going via Harrisburg!  Smile
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
saab2000
Posts: 1216
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2001 6:19 pm

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:14 am

The ATC delays in PHL and the personel problems are two different things. PHL has the unfortunate reality of being very close to the New York airspace. Anytime there is an easterly or southerly wind of more than about 8 knots they have to change runway configurations. Most of the departure waypoints to the NE are spaced anyway and this only makes it worse, with big airport congestion.

Another problem is that US Airways insists on too much frequency on some routes. There is little doubt in my mind that they could reduce some frequency and have fewer flights on some routes without affecting competitiveness. But that may be part of their plan with the EMB-190.

Finally, I would think that since many passengers are only connecting through PHL and not going to or originating in PHL they would be wise to have many of those connections go through PIT. It is a vastly more pleasant airport to connect through and way underutilised. It is a like a ghost town at certain times during the day.

Some of US Airways route structure is clearly a gold mine. But they are way too dependent upon PHL and would be advised to not let PHL drag them down.
smrtrthnu
 
cityguy
Posts: 72
Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2005 3:12 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:22 am

Quoting Galapagapop (Reply 15):
PHL is just a mess flown in on US about a dozen times now (sadly majority had on leg going to a dang CRJ!). Heck I even remember sitting for a flight in F on a CRJ in July, theres a worker sitting in the aft bin legs out sleeping (at least he remembered that step, remember the FL dummy who got stuck in there), upon pushback the adjacent gate was just dealing with an incoming flight, I watch as a cart zips up towards the main terminal leaving 3 bags in the dust. They were only moved by our wing walkers as they were close to where we'd be backing up. I dunno the inner working of PHL, but best thing to raise moral is not send BS gifts and raffles and cash incentives, show empathy. I say fire the late guy and take his place that day. Make it clear you can replace others and also show your willing to do what they do. Dave at B6 does it sometimes when he's in a jam why can't these guys.

Good point-but Parker does not care to deal with this. To busy counting his money.

Cheers!
 
QFSYD744
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:28 am

If US Airways is having so many problems with what seems like overcrowding at Philadelphia, why dont they combine 2 or 3 Dash 8 flights into one ERJ, or why dont they combine 2 or 3 ERJ flights into one 319? The problem at Philadelphia, seems like one that Asian and Europeans have learned from.

Sometimes frequency is not best. Instead of 12 flights a day from A to B on a ERJ, you can combine them into 4 or 5 on a 319. Just taking a look they have a 1056pm 320 and a 1045pm 757 from Las Vegas to Philadelphia. Cant they augment the departure times or rotate a widebody on the route?
I Still Call Australia Home
 
flydreamliner
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:05 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:34 am

US doesn't have that many widebodies..... and the ones they have are needed for transatlantic flights. Your point about using the larger jets is well taken, but again, they are doing that as best they can to. US flights a good number of transcons. PHL's issue is much bigger than too much frequency.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
 
QFSYD744
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:38 am

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 43):
PHL's issue is much bigger than too much frequency.

From the sounds of it lack of employee morale, and motivation are key factors.
I Still Call Australia Home
 
saab2000
Posts: 1216
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2001 6:19 pm

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:48 am

Right now they do have a mainline aircraft shortage.

US Airways' PHL problems are multi-faceted. Employee problems are a part of it, but oddly enough in every other US Airways station, including big hubs like CLT they can get it done. The labor and labor leaders need to show some accountability here, which they do not do. I am pro-labor in most circumstances, but in PHL you see them being their own worst enemy.

But not all of it is personel. The airport truly is unfortunate to be where they are geographically. Being so close to New York is tough. I am not involved with ATC so I cannot offer any answers there.

Too much frequency is part of the problem though. Do they really need two 50-seaters departing for ROC or PVD or MHT within 90-120 minutes of each other?
smrtrthnu
 
F9Animal
Posts: 3654
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:13 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:58 am

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 29):
Have you looked at the DOT figures for the past six months or so for ontime, completion factor, baggage, and customer complaints. Northwest is at the top. Seems to me they are running a pretty good operation.

I was actually talking about financial performance. I was also referring to the merger, and how well NWA came out of it. No doubt NW is getting better, and I hope they emerge from BK soon!
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
MCOflyer
Posts: 7071
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:51 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:01 am

As I fly into ELM often, I wonder why they have Dash 8 300 service instead of 100 as the 300 get filled to 25-27 seats. I can unstand the early morning CRJ flts as they are often filled up but QFSYD744 has a point, why not combine flts.

QFSYD744,

Welcome to my RU list. Your 4-5 last post have earned it.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
swatpamike
Posts: 469
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 12:14 pm

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:14 am

Hello all

"Timid managers, weak discipline" this is a problem in MCO also. But not just at US.

Cheers

swatpamike
 
BigOrange
Posts: 2291
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 2:20 am

RE: Why US Airways Is Big At Losing...

Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:26 am

Quoting ATWZW170 (Reply 2):
I mean everywhere in the airport, from Burger King

Burger King in Terminal E is very good proof of that!

Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 5):
Is there any particular reason they can't fire the people who don't show up to their shifts? Or the ones that duck out?

Yes it's called UNIONS! The whole workforce would walk off the job in an instant.

Quoting N701AA (Reply 8):
I wonder, how is a passenger supposed to know who operates the flight?

They're supposed to read their itinerary that they receive when purchasing a ticket.