HB-IWC
Topic Author
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:56 pm

As part of ongoing changes to its transatlantic network, KLM has reshuffled some of its aircraft among its core transatlantic routes. As of July 01, 2007, KLM will open a third daily frequency between its Amsterdam homebase and New York's JFK airport. Because of this extra frequency, capacity on the existing JFK flights will be reduced with the withdrawal of the B772 and the introduction of the A332 on the routes. Here is the schedule for AMS JFK for next summer:

KL641 AMS JFK 1330 1545 - daily, A332
KL642 JFK AMS 1820 0800 - daily, A332

KL643 AMS JFK 1820 2015 - daily, EQV (mix of B74E, B744 and B772)
KL644 JFK AMS 2210 1120 - daily, EQV (mix of B74E, B744 and B772)

KL645 AMS JFK 1015 1230 - daily, A332
KL646 JFK AMS 1620 0600 - daily, A332

The B772ER aircraft that was previously used on the daily KL641/642 JFK roundtrip will subsequently be shifted to the airline's daily Washington Dulles flight, marking a surprising increase in capacity on that route. As from July 1, here is what the schedule will look like:

KL651 AMS IAD 1315 1530 - daily, B772
KL652 IAD AMS 1800 0735 - daily, B772

In addition to the changes above, KLM and its transatlantic partner Northwest Airlines, are introducing another couple of changes to their respective routes, many of which were already discussed in here. Here is a short overview:


  • LAX - addition of 5 weekly roundtrips to the existing daily roundtrip. These additional flights operated with B772 according to the following schedule:

    KL603 AMS LAX 0810 1020 - 5 weekly, B772
    KL604 LAX AMS 1220 0800 - 5 weekly, B772

  • SFO - upgrade of capacity from the current MD11 to a B744 full pax version ;

  • ATL - upgrade from the current B763ER to A332 effective December 30, 2006. This flight operates 5 times weekly in winter and daily in summer ;

  • YYZ - addition of 5 weekly roundtrips to the existing daily roundtrip. These additional flights operated with B772 according to the following schedule:

    KL695 AMS YYZ 1820 2025 - 5 weekly, B772
    KL696 YYZ AMS 2225 1135 - 5 weekly, B772

  • YVR - capacity upgrade from A332 to MD11 ;


Also some changes in the Northwest operated flights:

  • DTW - addition of one extra roundtrip for a total of 5 daily flights. This additional flight operated by B752. All flights operated by NW ;

  • BOS - addition of one extra roundtrip for a total of 2 daily flights. This additional flight operated by B752. All flights operated by NW ;

  • EWR - addition of one extra roundtrip for a total of 2 daily flights. This additional flight operated by B752. The existing KLM flight KL657/658 will remain in the schedule and will be operated by a KLM A332, but the current schedule might change as it operates very closely to the new NW operated flight. KLM is currently looking for appropriate slots and gate space at EWR. The flight is most likely changing to an evening departure ;

  • BDL - new flight, operated daily by NW B752 ;
 
jacobin777
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:00 pm

I wish KL brought the 772ER to SFO...I miss those days..... Sad


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Of course, there is nothing wrong with bringing a KL 744 to SFO... biggrin 
"Up the Irons!"
 
The777Man
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:28 am

Great news!

Thanks for the info, looking forward to seeing KL 777s both at IAD and at LAX!

The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
jfk777
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:25 am

JFK should have a 744 on one flight daily, as a passenger that likes Jumbo I always take the KLM 747 from JFK.
 
Virginia
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:36 am

HB-IWC

Wow, that's a rather big increase seats on the SFo route.
What's the reason for this.

Personally do like the early morning flight to LAX, that will be a great success i think, 1st European flight arrving into LAX.


Regards Virginia
 
dutchjet
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:19 am

The adjustments make sense.....KL will now have three widebody flights per day into JFK so downsizing the aircraft on one of the existing flights is sensible. The market can only absorb so many extra seats before yeilds and load factors start becoming problematic. Good move by KLM, especially when considering that EWR is also getting an additional 752 flight from AMS (operated by partner NW). KL/NW will have 1 777/744/74E, 3 A332s and 1 752 per day between AMS and the NYC area, thats a big jump in capacity over just a few years ago.

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 3):
JFK should have a 744 on one flight daily, as a passenger that likes Jumbo I always take the KLM 747 from JFK.

KL641 is a special flight in KL/Netherlands culture, its a service where many passengers (especially Dutch) expect the newest-largest equipment from KLM.....as that flight was KL's first transtalantic connection. A couple of years ago, NW operated the JFK-AMS turn at the traditional KL641/642 times, and the Dutch public was outraged, there were quite a few newspaper articles in the Dutch press about this.

But times change, and the A332 is probably far better suited for the JFK-AMS flight, especially now that three flights per day will operate on the route.

Quoting Virginia (Reply 4):
Personally do like the early morning flight to LAX, that will be a great success i think, 1st European flight arrving into LAX.

Its going to be interesting to see if this flight works.....there are limited connection possibilities to support this flight and the new early AMS-LAX flight departs before the first European arrival bank.
 
Joost
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:29 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 5):
there are limited connection possibilities to support this flight and the new early AMS-LAX flight departs before the first European arrival bank.

And on the other hand, it is perfect for some other, important flights for the LAX market: (arrival time in current schedule, so might change but still)

KWI 5:50
DXB 5:40
NBO: 5:30
ADD: 5:50
BOM: 6:50
DEL: 5:50
BAH: 5:45
DMM: 6:20

I wouldn't be surprised if these flights are important contributors to the LAX flights; when they are connected to the early morning (together with local departures), it frees up quite some capacity to serve the European market (and some other l/h's) with the afternoon flight.
 
plunafan
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:23 am

Today 10/18 the KL657/658 was operated by 747. Anyone knows why?
 
AlitaliaMD11
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:34 am

Quoting Plunafan (Reply 7):
Today 10/18 the KL657/658 was operated by 747. Anyone knows why?

This flight is ocasionally upgraded due to loads, it's not the first time.
No Vueling No Party
 
ricardofg
Posts: 581
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:44 am

YYZ is growing and growing...i love it...just wish the GTAA would let it grow a bit more.
 
HB-IWC
Topic Author
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:16 pm

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 5):
Its going to be interesting to see if this flight works.....there are limited connection possibilities to support this flight and the new early AMS-LAX flight departs before the first European arrival bank.



Quoting Joost (Reply 6):
And on the other hand, it is perfect for some other, important flights for the LAX market: (arrival time in current schedule, so might change but still)

KWI 5:50
DXB 5:40
NBO: 5:30
ADD: 5:50
BOM: 6:50
DEL: 5:50
BAH: 5:45
DMM: 6:20

I wouldn't be surprised if these flights are important contributors to the LAX flights; when they are connected to the early morning (together with local departures), it frees up quite some capacity to serve the European market (and some other l/h's) with the afternoon flight.

The new LAX early morning departure is part of a number of new flights around that time, including new additions to BOS and EWR, both operated by NW and the existing DTW flight. KL/NW are trying to counter an increasing number of nonstops between Africa, the Middle East, and the Indian Subcontinent and the US by offering this new early morning departure wave, which offers minimum connecting times for passengers transiting in AMS from overnight longhauls.

The new flights represent quite a risky venture on behalf of KLM and Northwest as there is virtually no European feed for these departures and as such these flights will entirely depend on longhaul connections from destinations like DEL, DXB, AUH, DMM, BAH, KWI, DOH, KRT, ADD, ACC, LOS, NBO and EBB as well as on the local market.

It remains to be seen whether this experiment will actually work out as expected. I, for one, expect the new LAX connection to be quickly rescheduled to the 10am departure wave so that it can benefit from the first wave of European arrivals.
 
HB-IWC
Topic Author
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:24 pm

Quoting Plunafan (Reply 7):
Today 10/18 the KL657/658 was operated by 747. Anyone knows why?



Quoting AlitaliaMD11 (Reply 8):
This flight is ocasionally upgraded due to loads, it's not the first time.

The flight was not upgraded for high loads but because one of the A332s has been unserviceable for a couple of days now. Two days ago, KLM had to cancel an AMS KWI roundtrip operated by A332, and the airline has since taken one A332 out of the schedule and sent a B74E combi to EWR as KL657/658 yesterday. Today a B744 full pax will make the roundtrip because it is the only spare aircraft. The loads on the flights are actually rather light.
 
as739x
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:24 pm

Virginia: Summer season is high demand for San Francisco. AF also increases seats to SFO during the high season. AF/KL seem to be the only carriers though that change seasonally. I'm sure KL will downgrade back to a 772 or MD11 around Oct '07 when demand drops.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
lamedianaranja
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RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:27 am

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 11):
Today a B744 full pax will make the roundtrip because it is the only spare aircraft.

They may have been sorry later today as all of a sudden another B747 went out of service and KL809 was cancelled as a result.
Source: www.schiphol.nl
I wish that all skies were orange and blue!!
 
NYC-air
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2000 6:59 am

RE: KLM To Send B772 To IAD, A332 To JFK

Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:46 am

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the 747s lack PTVs in Y. If this is the case it makes sense to deploy more A332s and 777s (both of which have PTVs) on runs to the highly competitive, flagship NYC market. Now I know that KLM has a sizable cargo operation at JFK which necessitates the use of 744 Combis. Hopefully KLM will install PTVs in its entire long haul fleet soon, so as to provide consistent service on all aircraft.

~NYC-AIR