gkpetery
Posts: 118
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 3:35 pm

United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:58 am

I just took a flight on UA#886 from SFO to LAX. It was an hour delayed, but to my surprise, it was on a p.s. (JFK-dedicated) special configuration 757 aircraft! I took the LAX-JFK in biz class a few months ago and was floored by the room inside. So, I was pretty happy when we got on this plane (even if it was for a 1 hour flight).

For people who don't know about p.s. check out:

http://www.unitedps.com

I know that they were probably re-positioning the p.s. plane, but for the UAL people in the know, do you know.

1. Is #886 SFO-LAX normally a p.s. aircraft? And what other SFO-LAX or LAX or SFO flight have p.s.?

2. Has anybody been on a long haul flight using p.s.? Like LAX-BOS or LAX- MIA or LAX - ORD? Did you get the p.s. treatment?

3. I was bumped from econ to biz class on my SFO-LAX flight, but does United sell the first class cabin on these non JFK routes? Or is everybody (premiers) bumped up a class of service?

4. There are multiple flights from SFO-JFK and back, why didn't they just send our plane back to JFK?

5. Is p.s. making any money? Are people just upgrading or really buying the biz and first cabins?
 
StarGoldLHR
Posts: 1346
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:02 am

It will be an occasional positioning flight.

I once took a UA 747 between LAX and SFO !
So far in 2008 45 flights and Gold already. JFK, IAD, LGA, SIN, HKG, NRT, AKL, PPT, LAX still to book ! Home Airport LCY
 
CHI787ORD
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:09 am

Quoting StarGoldLHR (Reply 1):
I once took a UA 747 between LAX and SFO !

I took a 747 between ORD and IAD myself.
 
ordpark
Posts: 577
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 3:20 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:07 am

They are never scheduled that way...as you noted, this was an e-sub...they are dedicated to JFK/LAX/SFO, but once in an blue moon, they sneak onto some other route,,
 
gkpetery
Posts: 118
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:17 am

I love the 747 and taken it between TPE and HKG numerous times on EVA and China Airlines on a 1 hour flights, but I just love the UA p.s. 757. It feels like an exclusive club plane. Really cool. I'd book my SFO-LAX flight just to get a ride!

I hope the p.s. flights are making money to make sure they are still flying. The other extreme of United from Ted to p.s.
 
N1120A
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Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:32 am

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):
2. Has anybody been on a long haul flight using p.s.? Like LAX-BOS or LAX- MIA or LAX - ORD? Did you get the p.s. treatment?

United doesn't fly LAX-MIA.

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):
1. Is #886 SFO-LAX normally a p.s. aircraft? And what other SFO-LAX or LAX or SFO flight have p.s.?

No it isn't. You just got lucky

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):
3. I was bumped from econ to biz class on my SFO-LAX flight, but does United sell the first class cabin on these non JFK routes? Or is everybody (premiers) bumped up a class of service?

I am sure they will sell it if someone wants to buy it but it is likely that the full fare first customers move up into p.s. first, with economy plus passengers being shoved into business.

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):
5. Is p.s. making any money? Are people just upgrading or really buying the biz and first cabins?

From all indications, it has done quite well for United, even better than they thought, and has won them back a lot of the high yield traffic they lost to American in 2000

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):

4. There are multiple flights from SFO-JFK and back, why didn't they just send our plane back to JFK?

It is quite possible an aircraft was ending up late at LAX or had gone tech and the spare was rotated down from SFO.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
roseflyer
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:33 am

The 757 PS is not a good substitute for SFO-LAX since it is one of the lowest capacity planes in the fleet since it carries about the same number of passengers as the 737-500.

Planes do get swapped due to operations all the time. Just two days ago, I flew a 747 between LAX and ORD since they upgraded the plane at the last minute. Business Class on the upper deck was very nice on a 3.5 hour flight.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
Mir
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:35 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 5):
but it is likely that the full fare first customers move up into p.s. first, with economy plus passengers being shoved into business.

You make it sound like the E+ passengers are being given the short end of the deal.  Smile

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
ikramerica
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:43 am

With the limited p.s. fleet that doesn't normally get rotated out to other routes, where does UA keep the spares? I would assume at SFO, so if an LAX p.s. flight had to be taken out of service, they need to replace it.

That also means that sometime soon, there will be a substitution of the 757 from LAX to SFO to get it back home.

Usually, they fly the 733 on that flight. The p.s. holds fewer pax. I assume all the J and Y were filled with Y pax.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
Bicoastal
Posts: 2446
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:58 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 8):
where does UA keep the spares? I would assume at SFO, so if an LAX p.s. flight had to be taken out of service, they need to replace it.

United, and I would say most airlines, do not have the luxury of keeping spare airplanes sitting around. If it cancels, they treat it as any other cancelled flight. First, you look for alternatives on other United flights. Second, you look for flights on other airlines.
Airliners.net has many forums. It has spell check and search functions. Use them before posting!
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:58 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 7):
You make it sound like the E+ passengers are being given the short end of the deal.

Actually, I should have been even more clear. They would push the full fares and elites up to J, since the back is all Y+

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 8):
With the limited p.s. fleet that doesn't normally get rotated out to other routes, where does UA keep the spares? I would assume at SFO, so if an LAX p.s. flight had to be taken out of service, they need to replace it.

They keep them at both SFO and LAX, as both have MX bases.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
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LAXintl
Posts: 20837
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RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:26 pm

Quoting Gkpetery (Thread starter):
Is p.s. making any money?

According to UA, the product has performend "beyond expectations" to the suprise of many. I believe you might hear about the potential growth of p.s. very soon.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 8):
With the limited p.s. fleet that doesn't normally get rotated out to other routes, where does UA keep the spares?

Current schedule requires 11-12 aircraft (depending on day of week). There are 13 p.s. configures planes at the moment.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Pilot3033
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed May 24, 2006 4:39 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:39 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 5):

From all indications, it has done quite well for United, even better than they thought, and has won them back a lot of the high yield traffic they lost to American in 2000

You can also blame Americans really crappy baggage handling at JFK. I don't know what's up there, but the last two times I've checked luggage through there, it's taken 2 hours and 1.25 hours respectively. The first time I'm not sure what was up (no ones bags were coming down). I went along believing it was a freak occurrence, but a few frequently fliers explained that it was becoming the norm. The second time they apparently put our bags in a container containing connecting bags, said it was LAX's fault. Either way, it was not nice.

All that aside, I've flown both UA p.s. First, and AA's F class product, and prefer AA. If the bags were not such a problem, I am sure more J/Y class would stay with them (most F and some J class pax just have carry-ons, thus not a problem)

Both are very very nice though.
-Matt
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13876
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:40 pm

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 9):
United, and I would say most airlines, do not have the luxury of keeping spare airplanes sitting around.

You'd be wrong. While they don't literally just sit around, for a specialized service like p.s., UA can't afford not to have the ability to sub in another p.s. jet on short notice. The planes don't carry a lot of pax, they have good loads, and you can't just accommodate the pax elsewhere that easily, especially since if you don't send that jet to JFK, it's not coming back across the country either.

All planes need to go through routine maintenance and cycle in and out of the schedule. For this type of service they can't just sub in a standard A319 or 757.

Quoting N1120A (Reply 10):
They keep them at both SFO and LAX, as both have MX bases.

I knew they had MX bases at both places, but I couldn't imagine they had enough to "park" one in both places. I would bet that they will do work in both places depending on the schedule, so the "spare" might be in either city at any time.

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 11):
Current schedule requires 11-12 aircraft (depending on day of week). There are 13 p.s. configures planes at the moment.

Thanks. That makes sense. 13 planes to cover demand for 11.5 sounds right and a good utilization of the sub-fleet.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:40 pm

Quoting Pilot3033 (Reply 12):
You can also blame Americans really crappy baggage handling at JFK.

Well, dealing with the T7 baggage claim at LAX isn't much fun either.

Quoting Pilot3033 (Reply 12):
All that aside, I've flown both UA p.s. First, and AA's F class product, and prefer AA.

How in the world is that possible? AA uses a generations old product while UA's F is international business.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Pilot3033
Posts: 107
Joined: Wed May 24, 2006 4:39 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:08 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 14):

How in the world is that possible? AA uses a generations old product while UA's F is international business.

I don't know really, I just prefer the widebody. I prefer AA's terminals at both LAX and JFK, the F/A's I've dealt with have been much nicer on AA, and there was just something about the p.s. service that I didn't like. Felt too impersonal. But if you are a big exec, I guess you would prefer that huh?
Ch 9. is also a plus, but I can live without it.
And I guess a bit of brand loyalty plays into the assessment as well. AA's usually treated me really well (except of course, for the bags at JFK).

Ay, but to each his own eh?
-Matt
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:40 pm

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
I would bet that they will do work in both places depending on the schedule, so the "spare" might be in either city at any time.

That actually makes lots of sense. I have seen p.s. 757s sitting over at the MX pads at LAX taking a rest on numerous occaisions.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2183
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:45 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 14):
How in the world is that possible? AA uses a generations old product while UA's F is international business.

 checkmark 
 
LXLucien
Posts: 314
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2005 2:51 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:05 am

Hi

I flew the p.s. service in premium Eco from LAX to JFK, an 4h 40min flight due to the string headwinds in August.

Sorry but for me as an european guy it was just a laugh!
There was nothing special... if you wanted a third glas of water (I was always told to drink aprox. 1.5l on a longhaul, and that's what I normally do) you must go to the galley and take it there. Food.. haha you're at the wrong place! one Biscuit on this flight to the coke, but that was everything. Sure you could buy a pricey sandwich or so!

Here in Switzerland, everyone is crying if you give them just a sandwich on an 1h flight!

premium service, i just can say, the LX or LH shorthaul Eco is better then this! And on a 4h flight with LX or LH you get at least one warm meal and every 30min something to drink!

For me it was the last time to spend some money on the UA p.s.!

Kind Regards,
Lucien
Quote "Syriana": "Beirut, it's like Paris in the Mid-East"
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:14 am

Quoting LXLucien (Reply 18):
if you wanted a third glas of water

Just ask for 2 at a time

Quoting LXLucien (Reply 18):
Sure you could buy a pricey sandwich or so!

Actually, that just started. UA just went BOB in Y on p.s., they had been serving full meals plus snacks for free.

Quoting LXLucien (Reply 18):
Here in Switzerland, everyone is crying if you give them just a sandwich on an 1h flight!

It wasn't long ago that LX was charging people for water, so you can't say much.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
jfk777
Posts: 6048
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:37 am

IF UA wants to upgrade its international image it would offer this service on all 777 and 744 flights, no more coach. Coach +, Business and First.
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13876
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:43 am

The 757 p.s. is not true Y+. Y+ has 38" pitch on other aircraft, Y has 31 or 32". On the p.s., Y+ is only 34".

As a comparison, B6 offers 34" pitch on 1/2 their cabins...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
LXLucien
Posts: 314
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2005 2:51 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:54 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 19):
It wasn't long ago that LX was charging people for water, so you can't say much.

Hi

yes that's why I say they go crazy if they see that they have to pay for food...
LX changed it pretty fast again and now it's pretty the best food you can get on shorthaul in Europe IMO!
Quote "Syriana": "Beirut, it's like Paris in the Mid-East"
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:55 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 21):
The 757 p.s. is not true Y+. Y+ has 38" pitch on other aircraft

Actually 38" is not true. Y+ is marketed as "up to 5 extra inches of legroom" which means up to a 36" pitch in Y+ (unless, of course, you are in the exit row). The 34" Y+ pitch on p.s. is actually just one inch short of that on most of United's aircraft.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
supa7E7
Posts: 1360
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 2:05 am

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:05 am

Maybe there is PS demand for LAX-SFO!!!

Lots of rich, important people in those cities. Just a thought (esp if aircraft are sitting in California more than 5 hrs during the day).
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
3201
Posts: 813
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2004 4:16 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:12 am

To see how often a PS aircraft is subbed on a non-PS flight, you can go to http://www.bts.gov and download, say, and entire month's flights into LAX or SFO or JFK as an Excel file. Then you can sort by tail number, and look at the 13 PS aircraft: N502UA, N505UA, N508UA, N510UA, N512UA, N517UA, N518UA, N525UA, N532UA, N554UA, N555UA, N557UA, N560UA.

For the entire month of August 2006, those aircraft only operated one flight into LAX that wasn't from JFK -- flight 633 SFO-LAX on 8/18 by N517UA.
7 hours aint long-haul
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: United P.S. SFO To LAX!

Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:32 am

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 24):
Maybe there is PS demand for LAX-SFO!!!

Lots of rich, important people in those cities. Just a thought (esp if aircraft are sitting in California more than 5 hrs during the day).

Not particularly. No one needs a flat bed for a flight that is in the air less than 1 hour.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss

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