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1337Delta764
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Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:12 am

United was previously considered a wildcard in choosing either the 787 or the A350. However, United has made bids to become a 787 GoldCare provider, which increases their chances of the 787. United is now in good financial condition, and a 787 order could be imminent.

AA has stated that they will not order new aircraft until their financial conditions improve somewhat. However, AA, unlike Delta, is not in bankruptcy. Delta is not expected to come out of bankruptcy until at least May 2007, and a 787 order is not likely until July of the same year. AA, however, due to the fact that they are not in bankruptcy, could order the 787 earlier than Delta.

What are your thoughts?

[Edited 2006-10-30 17:17:08]
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Stitch
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RE: 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:14 am

First I'd recommend a topic change, as one could assume UA and AA have just ordered 787s.  Smile

I'm positive it's going to happen for AA and pretty confident it will happen for UA.
 
NYC777
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:23 am

It'll happen the question is when. Production slots are filling up fast and if EK orders 100 of them then that'll mean that AA and UA would have to wait a very long time.

Now add the possibility of the A350 not entering service until 2013-2015 then you add even more pressure for airlines to order the 787. I would even postulate to say that even US may order them is the A350 turns out to be a debacle a la A380.

I'm sure Boeing is keeping them apprised of the situation.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
eatmybologna
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:23 am

I have a hunch that UA might go for the A350 considering it'll have cockpit commonality with the current Airbus planes already in their fleet.


E-M-B
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Stitch
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:27 am

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 3):
I have a hunch that UA might go for the A350 considering it'll have cockpit commonality with the current Airbus planes already in their fleet.

Except UA's entire widebody fleet is Boeing. And the A350-800 will be an even bigger jump in capacity from their 767-300s then the 787-8 would be. The A350-900 would be a 1:1 replacement for the 772ER fleet, but the 787-10 would give them a bit more room then either and would build on the 787-8. The 787-9 would also give UA some flexability on the routes that switch between the 772 and 763 depending on seasonal loads by being able to better "meet the average". And the 787-3 could conceivably replace their 763ER and 772A Hawaii fleets.
 
MCOflyer
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:48 am

I have inside sources that say UA and AA are ordering the 787. If DL was in good financial condition, they'd order a boatload of 787's.

MCOflyer
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N328KF
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:51 am

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):
I have inside sources that say UA and AA are ordering the 787. If DL was in good financial condition, they'd order a boatload of 787's.

Inside sources? I can see that being necessary with UA, but with AA, only the most ardent deniers believe that there is any chance of AA not getting the 787. It's perfect for them, and they have an allegiance to Boeing.
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UAL777UK
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:51 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 4):
Except UA's entire widebody fleet is Boeing. And the A350-800 will be an even bigger jump in capacity from their 767-300s then the 787-8 would be. The A350-900 would be a 1:1 replacement for the 772ER fleet, but the 787-10 would give them a bit more room then either and would build on the 787-8. The 787-9 would also give UA some flexability on the routes that switch between the 772 and 763 depending on seasonal loads by being able to better "meet the average". And the 787-3 could conceivably replace their 763ER and 772A Hawaii fleets.

 checkmark 

I have said before and say again, UA will order the 787 at some stage, the sooner the better and also the 747-8i. I cannot see those boys around the corner at Boeing seeing a major order from UA, the Chicago home town airline going to Airbus!
 
ordpark
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:24 am

"inside sources"???? what does that mean?
 
NYC777
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:41 am

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):
I have inside sources that say UA and AA are ordering the 787. If DL was in good financial condition, they'd order a boatload of 787's.

And have your inside sources said when each of these carriers will be making an announcement?
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
eatmybologna
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:49 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 4):
Except UA's entire widebody fleet is Boeing.

O.K., but I thought UA have A330s in their fleet? If they do, I would suspect that the A350 cockpit will be derived somewhat from the A330 line, no?

By the way, happy A-net birthday 1337Delta764  spin 
Isn't knowledge more than just the acquisition of information? Shouldn't the acquired information be correct?
 
rwsea
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:55 am

If they did get them, would they have PTV's?
 
MEACEDAR
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:59 am

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
If they did get them, would they have PTV's?

Oh...yea. I'm pretty sure.
 
B777ER
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:03 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
First I'd recommend a topic change, as one could assume UA and AA have just ordered 787s

Not really, did you not see the word "possible" in the title. Thats the problem around here, to many people read into things way to much.

Quoting Ordpark (Reply 8):
"inside sources"???? what does that mean?

"what does that mean"....are you joking? you must be joking and if not, wow........
 
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ERJ170
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:16 am

I have seen the future.. and my predictions are as follows:

AA will have an announced 787 order by end of year 2007 with at least 20 + 50 options..

DL will have an announced 787 order by end of year 2007 with at least 20 + 20 options..

UA will have an announced 787 order by end of year 2007 with at least 20 + 20 options..

YX will have an announced 737 order by end of year 2007 with at least 20 +20 options..

SY will have an announced 737 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 5-10 ordered..

SY will have an announced E75 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 10 ordered..

And now my crystal ball has fogged over.. dispute at your convenience.. Hositoshi 2000...
Aiming High and going far..
 
beech19
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:31 am

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):
I have inside sources that say UA and AA are ordering the 787. If DL was in good financial condition, they'd order a boatload of 787's.

I love comments like this... all it does it gets everyones hopes up and in reality it means squat.

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
If they did get them, would they have PTV's?

Any airline that orders new modern 8000nm range widebody and doesn't put PTV's in them need to be slapped up side the head. Just my $.02

Quoting B777ER (Reply 13):
Not really, did you not see the word "possible" in the title. Thats the problem around here, to many people read into things way to much.

 checkmark  wow... yeah...

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 14):
I have seen the future.. and my predictions are as follows:

Interesting...
Is this just an scenario from your hypothetical crystal ball or do you have anything that might lead you to those numbers?
KPAE via KBVY
 
UAL777UK
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:38 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 15):
I love comments like this... all it does it gets everyones hopes up and in reality it means squat.

 checkmark 
 
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Stitch
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:26 am

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 10):
O.K., but I thought UA have A330s in their fleet? If they do, I would suspect that the A350 cockpit will be derived somewhat from the A330 line, no?

UA flies the 767-300ER, the 777-200, the 777-200ER and the 747-400.

Quoting B777ER (Reply 13):
Did you not see the word "possible" in the title. Thats the problem around here, to many people read into things way to much.

The original title was "787s for UA and AA". The word "possible" was not present. 1337Delta764 was polite enough to add it a few minutes after I had posted my reply based on the edit time. Big grin

[Edited 2006-10-30 20:43:19]
 
FA4UA
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:34 am

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):

Ya, but my inside sources are saying it will be a few years before an aircraft order is seriously considered. Right now we're focused on prooving to the investment community that we can manage what great assets we have before running out and spending hundreds of millions more.

Former FA4UA
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ERJ170
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:41 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 15):
Is this just an scenario from your hypothetical crystal ball or do you have anything that might lead you to those numbers?

It's all hypothetical.. I work no where near the airline industry.. sorry
Aiming High and going far..
 
aircanada014
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 8:00 am

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 10):
O.K., but I thought UA have A330s in their fleet? If they do, I would suspect that the A350 cockpit will be derived somewhat from the A330 line, no?

United doesn't have A330s
 
bobnwa
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 8:15 am

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):
I have inside sources that say UA and AA are ordering the 787. If DL was in good financial condition, they'd order a boatload of 787's.

MCOflyer

That is amazing that you have such knowledgeable inside sources. I envy you.
 
UA772IAD
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 8:49 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 15):
Any airline that orders new modern 8000nm range widebody and doesn't put PTV's in them need to be slapped up side the head. Just my $.02

Ever heard of Lufthansa?
 
ChiGB1973
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:13 am

I think both carriers would like more of a back log before they order. They both have great planes and plenty of them. Granted, some interior work will be done here and there, but both need some time, no, lots of time, before committing to slots and then even more time before they get into the training facet of the new plane.

I look forward to the day AA orders the 787 and UA orders the 748 and 787.

M
 
AADC10
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:39 am

Just because United Services is bidding to become a 787 Gold Care provider does not necessarily mean UA is going to buy the 787. United Services does maintenance on the fleets of many airlines, including those of several overseas carriers while they are parked in the U.S.

United Services even has to bid to perform UA maintenance. UA and AA maintenance operate almost as independent companies.
 
jsquared
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:47 am

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 14):
SY will have an announced 737 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 5-10 ordered..

SY will have an announced E75 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 10 ordered..

Not to get too far off topic, but what makes you think this? I think SY is doing well, but that's quite the expansion from their current fleet of 7 738s! (not counting the leases from Transavia)
 
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ERJ170
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:48 am

No real basis.. just seems like something that would happen.. their management stated they were looking to expand.. so they would have to get more aircraft to do that.. just seemed... logical.. but I could be wrong.. don't get me started..  Smile
Aiming High and going far..
 
flyguy595
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:33 am

Quoting JSquared (Reply 25):
Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 14):
SY will have an announced 737 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 5-10 ordered..

SY will have an announced E75 lease by end of year 2007 with at least 10 ordered..

Not to get too far off topic, but what makes you think this? I think SY is doing well, but that's quite the expansion from their current fleet of 7 738s! (not counting the leases from Transavia)

He has an inside source on his crystal ball.


I believe that UA will order the 787 call it wishfull thinking and a gut feeling. I always think that it would have been nice for the 787 to launch with UA like the 777 did. Oh well.

The 748 will be awesome to see in the UA scheme!!!
 
shane
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:40 am

Quoting UA772IAD (Reply 22):
Ever heard of Lufthansa?

They need to be slapped upside their collective Teutonic head! One more SFO-MUC on that A340-600 in coach with no PTVs and I'm going to go nuts.
 
bobnwa
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:08 am

Quoting Shane (Reply 28):
They need to be slapped upside their collective Teutonic head! One more SFO-MUC on that A340-600 in coach with no PTVs and I'm going to go nuts.

I suggest you try a good book like most of the traveling public over 30.
 
deltajet757
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:24 pm

Whether or not AA or UA order 787's I'd like to see more US carriers ordering 787's and same with the 748.

-DeltaJet757
FLY DELTA JETS
 
commavia
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:37 pm

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 24):
UA and AA maintenance operate almost as independent companies.

In United's case, yes, but not in the case of American. American's Maintenance and Engineering division is a completely integral division within American Airlines, and is not seperate -- in any legal, financial or operational sense -- from the parent company. United Services, on the other hand, is the maintenance, training, and aviation handling services division of United, wholly-owned by UAL Corporation, and is a seperate legal entity from United.
 
legacytravel
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:00 pm

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 5):
have inside sources that say UA

My sisters best friends second cousin on her step moms side of the family flew UA one time and heard a f/a say that they were gonna order a 100 of them so it must be true.
MCO that last paragraph is not meant to belittle you. We have so much of that on here I would love a bit more meat on that morsel of information you gave us. Tell us what position of authority in UA is your source??
while I believe that UA will order 787 I also would not be surprised to see them be the domestic launch customer for the 748.
Mark in MKE
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DL4EVR
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:43 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 15):
Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
If they did get them, would they have PTV's?

Any airline that orders new modern 8000nm range widebody and doesn't put PTV's in them need to be slapped up side the head. Just my $.02

Beech19...you're missing the joke here, lol.
We Love To Fly And It Shows.
 
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antoniemey
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:02 am

Quoting Ordpark (Reply 8):
"inside sources"???? what does that mean?

It means either he knows someone high up in the company, or he's pulling crap out of his hind end.

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 29):
I suggest you try a good book like most of the traveling public over 30.

SFO-MUC would be 2 or 3 good books... each way.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
 
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jetjack74
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:06 am

Quoting Flyguy595 (Reply 27):
He has an inside source on his crystal ball.

I think he should be an inside source inside his crystal ball
Made from jets!
 
bmacleod
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:20 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
However, United has made bids to become a 787 GoldCare provider, which increases their chances of the 787.

What is a GoldCare provider?  confused 
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
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Stitch
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:23 am

Quoting Bmacleod (Reply 36):
What is a GoldCare provider?

Boeing is offering a complete "nosecone to tailcone" maintenance package for 787 operators who do not wish to create their own in-house 787 maintenance operations. For a fee, Boeing will handle all maintenance and repairs for the plane, anywhere in the world. They call this service "Gold Care".

Boeing is currently certifying companies to provide this service in each geographical area. UA is one of the companies competing to be the one that provides that service in North America.
 
beech19
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:16 am

Quoting Shane (Reply 28):
They need to be slapped upside their collective Teutonic head! One more SFO-MUC on that A340-600 in coach with no PTVs and I'm going to go nuts.

My point exactly...

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 29):
I suggest you try a good book like most of the traveling public over 30.

Read? What about those people who don't enjoy reading? Seriously... not everyone can pick up a book and be entertained. Some of us find it extremely boring. If i had no options except to sit bored out of my mind or read on a 10, 12, 15+ hour flight crammed into a sardine seat i might jump out of the plane! (no... "well you aren't over 30" comments)

Quoting DL4EVR (Reply 33):
Beech19...you're missing the joke here, lol.

I guess so... how about you fill me in instead of just laughing. That might actually be helpful...
KPAE via KBVY
 
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antoniemey
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:48 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 38):
Read? What about those people who don't enjoy reading? Seriously... not everyone can pick up a book and be entertained.

I pity those people. Reading is one of life's simplest pleasures.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
 
walter747
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:10 am

i think UA will choose the 748i and AA will choose the 787.
Hussel, Hussel, Husel, Grind, Grind, Grind
 
beech19
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:51 am

Quoting Antoniemey (Reply 39):
Reading is one of life's simplest pleasures.

Unless that is... you don't find pleasure in it.  Wink

Why would you pity someone because they find a particular activity boring just because you enjoy it? Its their opinion...
KPAE via KBVY
 
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fxramper
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:07 am

I'm hearing 100 frames confirmed for AA plus options and another North American carrier, to be named, that would warrant Boeing opening a second 787 line 07 Jan.

Will post when I have more information.
 yes 
 
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Stitch
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:17 am

Quoting FXramper (Reply 42):
I'm hearing 100 frames confirmed for AA plus options and another North American carrier, to be named, that would warrant Boeing opening a second 787 line 07 Jan.

I don't think AA and UA or DL could afford 100+ frames fast enough to force Boeing to open a second line in two months.  Wink

And even if they could, I can't see Boeing risking it all going horribly wrong by pushing the envelope beyond the bleeding edge.

Mind you, I and others could be wrong. Perhaps Boeing and their suppliers really are totally on the ball and ready to double production before first assemble, to say nothing of first flight. *shrug*
 
bobnwa
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 8:54 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 41):
Unless that is... you don't find pleasure in it.

Why would you pity someone because they find a particular activity boring just because you enjoy it? Its their opinion...

How old are you again?
 
DL4EVR
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:24 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 38):
Quoting DL4EVR (Reply 33):
Beech19...you're missing the joke here, lol.

I guess so... how about you fill me in instead of just laughing. That might actually be helpful...

Hm...I take it you've never read any of 1337Delta's posts before....99% of them involve PTVs. Hence, the joke.
We Love To Fly And It Shows.
 
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antoniemey
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:16 am

Quoting Beech19 (Reply 41):
Why would you pity someone because they find a particular activity boring just because you enjoy it? Its their opinion...

And it's their loss, hence why I pity them.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
 
beech19
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:41 am

Quoting DL4EVR (Reply 45):
Hm...I take it you've never read any of 1337Delta's posts before....99% of them involve PTVs. Hence, the joke.

Thanks for the clarification. I'll keep that in mind.  Wink

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 11):
If they did get them, would they have PTV's?

HA HA HA!! (now that i get the joke...)  duck  j/k
KPAE via KBVY
 
MEACEDAR
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:46 am

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 10):
UA have A330s

UA doesn't have any A330s in their fleet. I think you are mistaking UA with US.
 
NYC777
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RE: Possible 787s For AA And UA

Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:49 am

Quoting FXramper (Reply 42):
I'm hearing 100 frames confirmed for AA plus options and another North American carrier, to be named, that would warrant Boeing opening a second 787 line 07 Jan.

Will post when I have more information.

Does your source know when an annoucement will be made and when deliveries will start?
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.