frntman
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US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:25 am

I have heard through various contacts at PHL that US is in the midst of hiring 39 new managers for their PHL operation.

Anyone have an idea if this is for potential expansion or to alleviate the service issues? Or a combination?
 
SANFan
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:32 am

Sounds like a classic case of, "Too many Chefs and not enough cooks."

Or else PHL is really out of control...

bb
 
charlienorth
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:34 am

Retired Marine Drill Instructors only need apply.
Work hard fly right..don't understand it
 
US AIRWAYS
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:34 am

The jobs aren't worth it. Trust me. PHL is like a revolving door when it comes to managers. It's kind of sad actually.
Go Eagles!
 
CALMSP
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:38 am

i had heard this on CNN over the weekend about htem trying to make sure their baggage disaster like years past isnt a common accurance
 
frntman
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:40 am

Quoting US AIRWAYS (Reply 3):
The jobs aren't worth it. Trust me. PHL is like a revolving door when it comes to managers. It's kind of sad actually.

Is this the case post merger? Or, is PHL always going to be plagued with this situation?
 
mah584jr
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 5:58 am

Hopefully these managers will equal to greater success at PHL
 
saab2000
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:14 am

This will NOT solves PHL's problems.

Rather they need to expect competence and accountability from the existing management. And from every worker from the top down and from the bottom up.

There may well be a lack of personel, but the problems are much deeper than something that just hiring more personel will solve. Throwing money at a problem will not solve it.

US Airways can improve PHL by doing the following.

1. Less frequency to places they have little or no competition. Use larger planes a bit less often. Congestion is a major, major problem at PHL.

2. Offer rewards for workers who do a good job and stay. Incentives work. Disencentives don't.

3. Find a solution to the labor problems. I am pro-union, but not to the point that it becomes a major mud slinging fest and bogs down the operation. Then it has gone way too far. I don't blame either side more than the other. Just fix it.

4. Work with the FAA to find a solution to the departure and arrival problems which plague PHL anytime there are more than 3 knots of wind, 2 clouds or anything else other than computer simulation ideal conditions.

5. Route more passengers who have no intention of staying in PHL through PIT and CLT. PHL is a terrible place to get stranded and it happens a lot. The problem is exacerbated when half the traffic in and out of PHL is just transit traffic. CLT and PIT both have better geographical locations. Use that to your advantage.

I am sure there are more solutions. But hiring more managers is not one of them.

So there. Big grin
smrtrthnu
 
US AIRWAYS
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 8:46 am

Quoting Frntman (Reply 5):
Is this the case post merger? Or, is PHL always going to be plagued with this situation?

Unfortunatley it will probably always be like this. I'm qualified for the job, as I was a ramp agent and now work at HQ in PHX, and it pays very well but it's not enough to deal with the crap that you're going to have to deal with. After working as an agent there I'd have to hear some really positive reports from friends I still have working there to head back and take the position.
Go Eagles!
 
UALPHLCS
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:39 am

If those 39 managers are being hired becuase of the porportional hiring of ramp and gate agents then I would say that it would help.

However, I fear that those managers are only more chiefs without any indians. Which mean US's problems in PHL will only continue.
A little less Hooah, and a little more Dooah.
 
vega
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:11 pm

Quoting Saab2000 (Reply 7):
5. Route more passengers who have no intention of staying in PHL through PIT and CLT. PHL is a terrible place to get stranded and it happens a lot. The problem is exacerbated when half the traffic in and out of PHL is just transit traffic. CLT and PIT both have better geographical locations. Use that to your advantage.

Why is PHL a "terrible" place to be stranded and why would PIT or CLT be any better ??

38% of PHL Domestic traffic is transit - not half.

CLT and PIT have better geographic locations for what?
If PIT had such a great geographic location it would be a hub/focus city for someone else and CLT is fortunate it has US Airways.

Great idea. Just shuffle a load of high revenue PHL flights and their dependent connections to CLT or PIT and wait for the bottom line to erode.
We are but a moment in this vast Universe and when gone we will never have existed.
 
vikinga346
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:26 pm

I agree with Vega, I think the situation is a bit exagerated here. I have lived in PHL for 9 years and have never had a problem. I have flown in and out of that airport more than most anyone has and only once has my luggage been lost - and that was because I had 2 layovers with 2 different airlines on an international flight. ONCE.

I have no idea why you claim CLT and PIT are better geographically.. You can't get any better geographically than PHL. Can you provide some analysis behind this claim?

If you mean to say that PHL would benefit from having some of the traffic relieved by sending them to PIT or CLE, i might agree.. But stating that CLE and PIT are better geographically, that makes no sense in terms of the problems PHL is facing.

In regards to the managers positions - I think you have to start somewhere. Even though hiring new managers might not fix the problem directly - it will help. For all we know, they are hiring very qualified people that will resolve many of the issues at PHL. With every problem, you need a starting point - and often that starting point is hiring the right people for the job. That said, they are taking the right steps. Whether this is a long term or short term solution, we shall see.

Quoting Saab2000 (Reply 7):
4. Work with the FAA to find a solution to the departure and arrival problems which plague PHL anytime there are more than 3 knots of wind, 2 clouds or anything else other than computer simulation ideal conditions.

....What? I have flown in and out of PHL is extremely bad weather - and just like any other airport - operations are slowed by bad weather. How does this affect PHL more than any other airport in the states? There are airports lots worse off than PHL - lets not make things up to enhance our arguments.
...you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you shall return
 
apodino
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:26 am

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 11):
....What? I have flown in and out of PHL is extremely bad weather - and just like any other airport - operations are slowed by bad weather. How does this affect PHL more than any other airport in the states? There are airports lots worse off than PHL - lets not make things up to enhance our arguments.

The problem is that many other airports are not as affected by bad weather as PHL. On a good day in PHL, with the west configuration the airport can handle about 52 arrivals per hour. In the east configuration, you lose one landing runway, so it goes to about 48 an hour. Thats assuming VFR conditions. And its also assuming that CRJ's and the occasional 737 can land on 17-35. If the runway becomes wet, CRJ's can no longer land on this runway and have to use one of the longer runways, and I am sure 737s are the same way. Now your acceptance rate goes to 36.

The bigger problem is the peak and valley demand. Every other hour in PHL, the demand goes above 52, which almost always means airborne holding. In the odd hours, demand goes down to about 30 arrivals. One immediate solution is to work with the airlines to change schedules so that instead of the big banks, you get maybe 40-42 in an hour. You wouldn't have as much holding, and delays would be reduced in bad weather.

As has also been mentioned, RJs are a big problem in PHL. US operates more RJ's in than PHL than Mainline (actually there are more US express planes than mainline planes on the east side). And some of the RJ routes are real stupid. Like two CRJ's an hour apart from PHL to MCI, with a plane that barely, if even, has the range for such a route. That particular route is always weight restricted, passengers are constantly denied boarding, and even with that, sometimes has to make a fuel stop along the way. They would be much better off sending one 737 on the route instead of two CRJ's with all the problems they cause. This is more a problem of the way the old US did business, and I am sure will be fixed once Parker can get the merger stuff straightened out.

About PIT being in a better location. I would have to agree with Saab. Its a little more centrally located, has a much better layout than PHL, meaning delays are minimal even in bad weather, and you don't have nearly the headaches of a PHL. Obviously, places like ELM and BGR you need the international feed into PHL to help them out. But pax connecting from bigger cities, like BOS, EWR, and such would benefit much more connecting in PIT, than in PHL. I don't mean to spark this debate again. For east west passengers, PIT is definitely a better geographic location. Just as CLT is a better, more centrally located N-S hub, with great access to a lot of southern destinations. Also, DCA is a very simple place as well, and it never has the headaches of a PHL. And no one ever talks about DCA on here.
 
vikinga346
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:38 am

Ok i'm not going to go into this because frankly this debate is downright stupid. You can't realistically sit here and argue that PIT and CLE are in a better geographic location - its nonsense. That's like saying, MIA is in a better geographic location to handle South America traffic... well, no shit!

I'm sorry if this sounds rude, but your argument makes no sense.. Its not about the location of PHL, its about the problem with traffic. Don't sit here and tell me and PIT and CLE are more "centrally located".. I know where PIT and CLE are on the map - that is irrelevant to the debate in question.

I'm done with this discussion, its pissing me off.
...you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you shall return
 
PHLBOS
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:55 am

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 11):
If you mean to say that PHL would benefit from having some of the traffic relieved by sending them to PIT or CLE, i might agree.. But stating that CLE and PIT are better geographically, that makes no sense in terms of the problems PHL is facing.

I believe you meant to say CLT in the above-paragraph not CLE

Quoting Apodino (Reply 12):
Also, DCA is a very simple place as well, and it never has the headaches of a PHL. And no one ever talks about DCA on here.

DCA (like LGA, another US focus city) is IIRC slot-restricted (it also has a perimeter rule (w/some exemptions)); which means that US (or anyone else that operates out of DCA for that matter) can't just simply add more flights (or at least obtain more gates) to increase connecting traffic through that airport. Which is probably why no one talks about DCA being used as an alternate connecting airport.

Anyway, the Philadelphia Inquirer article that was out about a couple weeks ago clearly points the finger of blame at US and not necessarily PHL itself. DOA director Charles Idell was quoted in the article saying that (as one problem) US takes a lot longer to get passengers' luggage to the baggage claim vs. other carriers (including WN) at the airport.

The hiring of these managers, I guess (key word: guess), is to address this and other similar problems.

[Edited 2006-10-31 18:58:47]
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
 
HPRamper
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:07 am

Most of you are talking about things you know nothing about. If you don't work for US in PHL (or have spent some time in-system inspecting the situation from the inside) then you really don't know what it's like. Some a.netters do, most do not.

In most cases these managers are actually needed. Someone I know very well is being hired to be the PHL safety manager. He is not a replacement - the position has been empty. Big surprise? There's been nobody to really hold safety briefings, put out anything but the most basic bulletins, conduct disciplinary activity etc. And we wonder why there are so many accidents, aircraft strikes, slide deployments in PHL as opposed to the rest of the US operation. They had stuck safety duty on some other manager who had neither the time nor motivation to take on that job in addition to his normal duties. Turnover at PHL doesn't just apply to rampers. Management has also been a revolving door for years and for there to be an example to set for younger employees the management needs to be steadier.
 
ophila
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:38 am

IF YOU HAVE HEARD ME SPEAK BEFORE THIS WILL NOT SOLVE THE PROBLEM...I WAS A MANAGER IN PHL W/ US & FLEW FOR ANOTHER CARRIER HERE AS WELL...TRAINING IS THE 1ST PROBLEM GOOD EMPLOYEES YES THEIR AE GOOD EMPLOYEES THEIR THAT HAVE BEEN THERE FOR YEARS BUT THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO WORK SMART CAUSE THEY HAVE NOT BEEN TRAINED PROPERLY....DURING AN IROP THERE IS NO CLUE ASTO WHAT TO DUE...HOW DO WE RECOVER???LIKE SAAB SAID DUE WE REDUCE FREQUENCY & UPGRADE TO LARGER EQP???THE MANAGEMENT IN PLACE DOESN'T HAVE A CLUE AND THEY TOO HAVE NO TRAINING......PHL HAS PLENTY OF GATES BETWEEN TERMS B & C.....THEY JUST DO NOT KNOW HOW TO UTILIZE THEM PROPERLY....39 MANAGERS WOW I CAME IN WITH 11 AND ONLY 2 REMAIN..
 
saab2000
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:33 am

CLT and PIT are better locations geographically because they are not restricted by the neighbor to the NE, namely New York and its airports - LGA, JFK and EWR. When departure fixes just north or west of PHL are closed it it not unusual to have taxiway lineups and taxi times of 2+ hours at PHL, for a 30 minute flight.

I work in and out of PHL all the time and yes, I do know what I am talking about. I was there today. Landed and waited 30 minutes on the ground for our gate. There were probably a dozen open gates near ours, but we waited for ours. This does not happen in PIT or CLT. Of course, that is a different issue.

Anyway, PHL is a problem for US Airways and for them to not utilize PIT and CLT better is unwise IMHO. Take that opinion for what it's worth. But I am not dumb and have been working in this industry a long time. Operationally, PHL is the worst airport I have ever worked at. Only IAD comes close.

PIT and CLT and DCA are a joy (usually), so it is not just US Airways. It is PHL, for a lot of reasons.
smrtrthnu
 
vega
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:53 am

Quoting Saab2000 (Reply 17):
Anyway, PHL is a problem for US Airways and for them to not utilize PIT and CLT better is unwise IMHO. Take that opinion for what it's worth. But I am not dumb and have been working in this industry a long time. Operationally, PHL is the worst airport I have ever worked at. Only IAD comes close.

Again, you are only considering the negative aspects of the airport from a non-economic standpoint. PHL is the highest revenue and profit producing center for US Airways. Why should they risk loosing that just to fly into a "better" airport with significantly less O&D ? We are all fully aware of the NE corridor ATC problems - so what should we do - move everything out of EWR, JFK, LGA and PHL because the FAA can't find a fix- an economic disaster would ensue. From my perspective, touting one's supposid credentials does not increase their credibilty in a public, open forum. If they have a position - state it, await a reply or move on.
We are but a moment in this vast Universe and when gone we will never have existed.
 
MrPIBB
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:01 am

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 13):
That's like saying, MIA is in a better geographic location to handle South America traffic... well, no shit!

Hmm .. I thought profanity was a violation of forum rules.

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 13):
I'm done with this discussion, its pissing me off.

Thank you. You have a coarse mouth and this forum will be better off without your childish rantings.
 
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fxramper
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:05 am

Quoting Frntman (Thread starter):

It's the worst hub for any airline in the US current?  confused   yes 
 
charlienorth
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:21 am

Hiring managers is a good idea if you train them properly,AND give them the authority to do what is needed,and to back up their decisions,I've seen too many times in this business a supervisor disciplining an employee only to have the higher level of management rescind the punishment and look like the "good guy". Too many airlines hire a manager,put them out on the floor and say "make it work".
Work hard fly right..don't understand it
 
saab2000
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:24 am

Quoting Vega (Reply 18):
From my perspective, touting one's supposid credentials does not increase their credibilty in a public, open forum. If they have a position - state it, await a reply or move on.

I do have an opinion and stated it. If you don't like it, well, I guess I just have to accept you don't like it. I have to deal with PHL every single day I fly because I am either there directly or have to deal with the ripple effects of the chaos there, either in planes arriving late, bags not arriving, passengers whining about missed connections or whatever.

I will move on because clearly you think my opinion is not valid. I think it is valid. So what? We differ. The glory of free speech.

But back to the original point, throwing money at management will accomplish nothing without accountability, from the top down and from the bottom up.
smrtrthnu
 
saab2000
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:28 am

Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 21):
Hiring managers is a good idea if you train them properly,AND give them the authority to do what is needed,and to back up their decisions,I've seen too many times in this business a supervisor disciplining an employee only to have the higher level of management rescind the punishment and look like the "good guy". Too many airlines hire a manager,put them out on the floor and say "make it work".

BINGO!!!

I will add that not only do they need decision authority, they also need then to be expected to be accountable. Finally, they need competence. Competence is not learned in a classroom getting an MBA and sucking up to management types. It is learned by throwing bags and working gates and pushing planes and managing situations which come up on a daily basis.
smrtrthnu
 
WJ
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:22 pm

This sounds like a fun job, I think i will apply.
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malaysia
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:37 pm

They are not hiring 39 managers. I do not count that many postings for a manager in PHL even with internal postings as well.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
CentPIT
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Thu Nov 02, 2006 5:57 am

Quoting VikingA346 (Reply 13):
I know where PIT and CLE are on the map - that is irrelevant to the debate in question.

I agree.


I will say, however, that unless a passenger is flying to Europe, South America, or somewhere that US does not fly to from PIT, DO NOT give that passenger the option of "just connecting" through PHL. This will cut back on some frequencies and little DH8s clogging the taxiways and runways. You do not need all of those extra connecting PAX in an airport that can't handle them.
Pittsburgh International: US Airways---160 daily departures! (52 destinations)
 
steeler83
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RE: US Hiring 39 Managers In PHL?

Thu Nov 02, 2006 8:05 am

Quoting CentPIT (Reply 26):
I will say, however, that unless a passenger is flying to Europe, South America, or somewhere that US does not fly to from PIT, DO NOT give that passenger the option of "just connecting" through PHL. This will cut back on some frequencies and little DH8s clogging the taxiways and runways. You do not need all of those extra connecting PAX in an airport that can't handle them.

Right, and might I add my own input about what some of you have stated about PIT and CLT being in better locations geographically...

They do appear to be in strategic geographic locations, although, more relevant, both appear to be laid out more properly for a large operation.

Quoting Vega (Reply 10):
If PIT had such a great geographic location it would be a hub/focus city for someone else

Ok, this is valid to a given limit... PIT is too expensive. Nobody wants to pay those landing fees and other hub/focus city expenses at those ungodly rates that the ACAA is asking for...

US had a sizeable operation there when they first began, and ultimately built that up over the years. 20 years ago (circa 1985), it was the only hub for US pretty much, offering flights up and down the coast and a few out west to PHX, LAX, SAN, and others (courtesy of an old route map I found when doing a google image search on USAir). Because operations were growing rapidly, they needed a new airport, and in 1992 they got it. Because the new facility came with a big price tag, US had to pay more to have its hub there, paying for the facility to avoid considerable tax hikes on the public. The costs wound up outweighing the benefits at PIT, US raised fares trying to boost profits but ultimately drove away the customer base, 9-11 happened which sent them into a financial nosedive, and PIT became a money hole. Still, with PIT being a new facility, the costs are keeping other carriers at bay, not the location itself.

Off topic, although someone did bring this up, CLE is a small hub for CO, but they want to grow that facility and allow it to participate in the global market, probably having to do with the costs of operations there...

I would like to see some ops come back to PIT, but not necessarily the 500+ flight mega hub that used to be here, and certainly not any international hub. Better domestic connecting traffic for East-West travel, and maybe one or two transatlantic frequencies would suit PIT fine. If US had the equipment, a freed-up 757 laying around somewhere, I think they could do a PIT-LGW flight.

Coming back to PHL, the reason why US doesn't shift its ops elsewhere, well is just that... PHL has massive O&D. It also has regional feed on top of O&D for its huge transatlantic service. Put that together, and you have a good hub operation for US.

Would I be in favor of US moving ops to PIT, I will give an emphatic YES. PIT has a much better layout, and was my hometown airport. However, US would make more money if I went through PHL as opposed to connecting through PIT - O&D/connectivity reasons etc...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.

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