SapphireLHR
Topic Author
Posts: 102
Joined: Wed Mar 22, 2006 4:09 pm

BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 4:19 pm

BA are very keen to promote passengers purchasing tickets on the internet but I have just been stung through using this service. They impose a 350 day maximum advance booking buying on line, so exactly 350 days prior to my choice date of travel I checked prices on line for London Gatwick to Orlando for 8th September 2007 returning 15th September 2007. Cost was approx' £400 return, a great price. On rechecking my booking for the apartment it was noted that it was also available for the following week, so I decided to take a two week vacation. I had to wait a further 7 days to be able to comply with the 350 day rule to be able to book my return flight by which time the price had rocketed to nearly £700. I contacted BA Customer relations to ask why and was told.....I should have booked earlier...HOW? and that I should have booked on line to get a better deal.....DUH!!!!
I also noted that in the same period Club World and World Traveller Plus also rose by................£1.20 !!!
Ever been had?
 
BCAL
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 5:33 pm

Whilst the airlines deny it, I am convinced that they use cookies to increase revenues. When you check a fare on the internet, but don't book it at the time, the airline knows you might be interested and therefore the fare goes up should you return within a set time limit. I checked this theory on U2 website. Sure enough, the fare had increased on my return visit from my own PC, but strangely a cheaper fare was quoted when I made an enquiry for the same flight from a different PC.
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GSM763
Posts: 573
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 5:48 pm

It does seem to be true. Last noght when I booked a GLA-BRS-GLA flight for myself for next moth the flight on the computer we checked it first on was £40. Coming back 2 minutes later it was £60. Amazingly when we moved to this Mac and checked again the price was £40.
 
anstar
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:08 pm

BA also don't tend to release their cheapest fare buckets 330 days out.
 
carduelis
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:35 pm

BA's Reservation System, like other airlines, has a maximum 350 days forward booking limitation. Otherwise if it were 365 days plus, there would be the same day twice in the computer. The 350 days was set so that to have a continuous moving 15 days system maintenance period. The same 350 day limitation is not just for web bookings, it is worldwide, for the above reason.
Per Ardua ad Astra! ........ Honi Soit Qui Mal y Pense!
 
carduelis
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:56 pm

For further clarification - some fares are not only seasonal, they also vary on different days of the week. They will also be different if a large sporting event or if School Holidays Half Term are included in the period. Needless to say, Yield Management are experts at their job. It's your choice whether to use BA or some other carrier.

With reference to the price changing from one minute to the next, there are only a limited number of lowest fare class seats listed in the booking system at the cheapest price, and when that number has been reached, the system will take you to the next level of fare. If, for example six people make an entry at the same, or near the same, time, the cheap seats are then released from the flight inventory until the person making the enquiry releases it, usually by logging-off. Hence if you look again in five minutes time, it will re-appear as available for booking! Using a Mac or PC makes absolutley no difference at all - it's the website that holds the information, not the computer operating system - but I'm sure you must know that!
Per Ardua ad Astra! ........ Honi Soit Qui Mal y Pense!
 
theginge
Posts: 485
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 8:56 pm

I had a cost increase booking BA tickets to Barbados in the space of about 5 minutes. It didn't seem to be the fare that went up but the tax!

If the computer operating system held the fare then I am sure people would be finding ways to hack it and giving themselves £30 business class return to somewhere nice!!!
 
satx
Posts: 2771
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:26 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Tue Nov 21, 2006 9:52 pm

Quoting Theginge (Reply 6):
If the computer operating system held the fare then I am sure people would be finding ways to hack it and giving themselves £30 business class return to somewhere nice!!!

You don't seem to understand what is being alleged here. Nobody is saying your personal computer is in control in any way. Rather, it is being suggested that our sessions are being tracked by some form of uniquely identifiable marker, such as a cookie, and that the main system is using this information to supply a tailor-made price point. The current assumption appears to be entirely based on fares all being raised, but there is no reason such a system couldn't be used to dangle a lower fair in the face of someone who can't seem to make up their mind. Here in the US we have at least one carrier (WN) who has implied they have the technology to make such offers on an individual basis. There has been no specific evidence that this process is already in effect so far as I know, but if you download their "Ding" utility you will get a list of various offers from your home airport that may or may not have anything to do with your previous history of buying or not buying tickets.
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
theginge
Posts: 485
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Wed Nov 22, 2006 12:37 am

Look at the word 'If'. As the post above mine suggested it is not the computer system that holds the information but the website.

I do understand that it is cookies that might hold the information, easy way is to delete the cookies, then it won't remember you, if indeed it is cookies affecting higher fares but I think it is probably more like what Carduelis is saying.
 
carduelis
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RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Wed Nov 22, 2006 12:45 am

Quoting Theginge (Reply 8):
I think it is probably more like what Carduelis is saying.

Thanks!

Hardly, probably, what I described is, in general, the way it does work. Perhaps our colleague JGPH1A might offer his professional advice to expand . . .
Per Ardua ad Astra! ........ Honi Soit Qui Mal y Pense!
 
BAxMAN
Posts: 654
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 7:51 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:27 am

Quoting BCAL (Reply 1):
Whilst the airlines deny it, I am convinced that they use cookies to increase revenues. When you check a fare on the internet, but don't book it at the time, the airline knows you might be interested and therefore the fare goes up should you return within a set time limit. I checked this theory on U2 website. Sure enough, the fare had increased on my return visit from my own PC, but strangely a cheaper fare was quoted when I made an enquiry for the same flight from a different PC.

Well, this theory is way off target. BA.com availability is driven purely through what it is instructed by Amadeus, not by monitoring your previous visits and trying to sting you accordingly. I've no doubt the technology exists to do that, but it is something that BA.com most definitley does not do!

Quoting Theginge (Reply 6):
I had a cost increase booking BA tickets to Barbados in the space of about 5 minutes. It didn't seem to be the fare that went up but the tax!

If the computer operating system held the fare then I am sure people would be finding ways to hack it and giving themselves £30 business class return to somewhere nice!!!

The Barbadian authorities have recently introduced a new tax (a JH tax, I think). It would be the most remarkable bad luck if you witnessed its introduction in real time.

Any fool with access to a GDS could 'hack' away and book a silly fare. These things get picked up though and you would be billed accordingly.
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richardw
Posts: 3131
Joined: Tue May 08, 2001 3:17 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Wed Nov 22, 2006 11:06 pm

Quoting BAxMAN (Reply 10):
Well, this theory is way off target. BA.com availability is driven purely through what it is instructed by Amadeus, not by monitoring your previous visits and trying to sting you accordingly. I've no doubt the technology exists to do that, but it is something that BA.com most definitley does not do!

What is your source?
 
columbia107
Posts: 328
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 4:42 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 4:12 am

Quoting BAxMAN (Reply 10):
Well, this theory is way off target. BA.com availability is driven purely through what it is instructed by Amadeus, not by monitoring your previous visits and trying to sting you accordingly. I've no doubt the technology exists to do that, but it is something that BA.com most definitley does not do!

Well here are the facts.

21 November 2006 1331 hours
Purchased one ticket Gibraltar/ London/ Bermuda return for my wife GBP1664:-
21 November 2006 1335 hours
Purchased one ticket Gibraltar/ London/ Bermuda return for myself GBP1892:-

When search for availability of seats and prices I was offered the same price but regtrettably it would not allow me to buy two tickets - one for myself and another one for my wife - so I opted to buy her ticket under her Frequent flyer number and do likewise under my own frequent flyer number.

To my biggest surprise when I reverted to my frequent flyer number some 5 minutes later, the price quoted was GBP228 extra and no matter what I tried, the price would not shift.

The only good thing is that I booked World Traveller Plus seats and on three of the flights, Club seats were alloted. On checking Club seat prices they certainly exceeded GBP1892. So I guess I got a good deal.

My own conclusions are that it seems BA manipulate fares by taking control of your PC.
In God we trust
 
Shamrock_747
Posts: 1499
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 3:25 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 5:10 am

Quoting Columbia107 (Reply 12):
When search for availability of seats and prices I was offered the same price but regtrettably it would not allow me to buy two tickets - one for myself and another one for my wife

Almost certainly looks like there was just the one seat left at that price, hence you could only book one ticket at that fare.

Quoting Columbia107 (Reply 12):
My own conclusions are that it seems BA manipulate fares by taking control of your PC.

As has already been mentioned, the availability/fares on ba.com come straight from Amadeus.
 
BAxMAN
Posts: 654
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 7:51 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 7:43 am

Quoting Columbia107 (Reply 12):
My own conclusions are that it seems BA manipulate fares by taking control of your PC.

This is an absurd conclusion.

Quoting Richardw (Reply 11):
What is your source?

What an absolutely ridiculous question. The person making the allegation (which is actually quite damaging) would need to show evidence of a 'source.'

The fact is that BA.com will display exactly what Amadeus instructs it to. If you can find discrepancies between availability on Amadeus and fares on BA.com, then it will be a different ball game. However, someone complaining that a fare increased is spurious evience at best. Unless, of course, this is a conspiracy between BA and Amadeus.

Even by the typical A.net style of groundless rumour mongering, this thread is completely nonsensical.
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OMA2FAI2SAV
Posts: 215
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 8:53 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:07 am

Quoting BAxMAN (Reply 14):
What an absolutely ridiculous question. The person making the allegation (which is actually quite damaging) would need to show evidence of a 'source.'

Why? The person making the allegation said

Quoting BCAL (Reply 1):
Whilst the airlines deny it, I am convinced that they use cookies to increase revenues.

It says that THEY are CONVINCED. Not that they have proof. Everyone is allowed to have thoughts.
You on the other hand said

Quoting BAxMAN (Reply 10):
Well, this theory is way off target. BA.com availability is driven purely through what it is instructed by Amadeus, not by monitoring your previous visits and trying to sting you accordingly.

While I dont believe that cookies or anything else is used to monitor your flight searches, and I do belive that you are correct, YOU should have to provide some source info showing you are correct. Your post makes it clear that you are 100% sure of this, and thus you are asked from a source and some proof. Thats the way I see it, and I THINK (My own feelings again) that I am not alone in seeing it this way.
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pilot21
Posts: 983
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 8:28 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:31 am

I'm not accusing BA or any airline of manipulating fares, or using cookies, but I had heard that certain cheap fares aren't offered at certain times. e.g. Cheaper fares maybe found at 4am on a Tuesday morning then 1pm on a Thursday afternoon. Now that maybe because travel agents can hold the cheaper seats etc. but it was mentioned to me that certain classes of fares weren't released at certain times/days because the demand is much stronger at certain times.

Any Truth to that rumour?
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BAxMAN
Posts: 654
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 7:51 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:39 am

Quoting OMA2FAI2SAV (Reply 15):
YOU should have to provide some source info showing you are correct. Your post makes it clear that you are 100% sure of this, and thus you are asked from a source and some proof

I disagree. This is not a question of trying to prove that pixies stole my grapefruit or that The Second Coming is serving at KFC, but they are asking for proof of an indisputable fact. We don't ask for a source when someone asserts that the sky is blue.


Anyway, here are the results of a 10 second search on Google
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columbia107
Posts: 328
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 4:42 am

RE: BA. Huge Cost Increase....why?

Mon Nov 27, 2006 10:25 am

Quoting BAxMAN (Reply 14):
This is an absurd conclusion.

Perhaps my remarks were over the top and really what I meant was that BA manipulate prices.

Not being IT conversant, it appears that I have erroneoulsy assumed that one can manipulate one's PC through cookies (whatever these maybe). Evidently my assumption appears to be incorrect.
In God we trust

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