MaverickM11
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PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:14 am

Simple enough....do any airlines see a revenue premium because they have PTVs in economy? My guess is no seeing as there has been no major rush to install PTVs and the vast majority of customers don't decide between airlines based on economy entertainment--even if they did have the information of PTV availability.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
andz
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:18 am

If I have to fly to Germany, which I do quite frequently, I will not fly LH for that precise reason.
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
 
tinpusher007
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:26 am

I don't think they see a revenue premium, but its all about offering what the competition offers. Jetblue for example offers low fares AND free live TV to boot. So from a pax standpoint, they are getting a cheap fare and more in the way of servvice by having a tv than most legacies offer. If legacies like DL can also offer that same product, it might keep certain pax from defecting and take away the percieved advantage offered by the likes of B6.
"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
 
jetstream1975
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:31 am

UK operator flyglobespan are testing portable IFE players on selected lowcost european services for a small fee.
 
antonovman
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:35 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Thread starter):
My guess is no seeing as there has been no major rush to install PTVs and the vast majority of customers don't decide between airlines based on economy entertainment--even if they did have the information of PTV availability.

You are talking pure USA and not world wide. Outside of the USA any decent carrier has PTV's
 
AEROFAN
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:40 am

Andz,

I'm with you on this one. Not that I often fly Y. I do my level best to avoid this like the plague. But if there is no PTV on a flight that will last more than 4 hours - I will not fly that carrier.
 
trekster
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:43 am

Hell yea, its so worth it.

12 Hour flight.

Pick your airline. IFE or no IFE

99% of people, IF there is a choice, will pick IFE airlines
Where does the time go???
 
FLY2LIM
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:48 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Thread starter):
and the vast majority of customers don't decide between airlines based on economy entertainment-



Quoting Trekster (Reply 6):
99% of people, IF there is a choice, will pick IFE airlines

Where do you get your statistics from? I know that, personally, I have considered Jet Blue many times over AA. What keeps me flying on AA is that B6 doesn't offer a non-stop SFO-MIA and I can maximize ff miles. However, this Christmas we are traveling on LAN via LAX to LIM. One of the reasons why we are doing this is because we feel LA will offer more entertainment, better meal service, and we can accumulate AAdvantage miles. We'll see.

FLY2LIM
Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:49 am

Quoting Antonovman (Reply 4):
Outside of the USA any decent carrier has PTV's

Lufthansa does not. Most narrowbodies still do not have PTVs in Y.

Quoting Trekster (Reply 6):
99% of people, IF there is a choice, will pick IFE airlines

99% of people will not realize the difference, and 99% of people will go for the lower fare, regardless.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
YULWinterSkies
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:50 am

Quoting Antonovman (Reply 4):
You are talking pure USA and not world wide. Outside of the USA any decent carrier has PTV's

He's talking long haul I imagine. For long haul, all US airlines have PTV in Y on their most modern a/c (777s + 330s yes, 767s + 747s no), but none of them with with the notable exception of CO has them in all the intercon fleet, and this is if you don't include the 757s.

PTV on shorthaul, worldwide, are still rare, AC's E190 being of one the few exceptions.

Some "Decent" carriers don't have PTVs outside the USA. Although they don't have PTV on the bulk of their long haul fleet, I still consider KL, LH, IB, AC, LA and more as "decent" carriers.
When I doubt... go running!
 
hb88
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:50 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Thread starter):
Simple enough....do any airlines see a revenue premium because they have PTVs in economy? My guess is no seeing as there has been no major rush to install PTVs and the vast majority of customers don't decide between airlines based on economy entertainment-

You surely have got to be joking. I don't know anyone who *doesn't* choose their airline for long-haul travel factoring in IFE/PTV. I wont travel LH for that reason.

I'm not sure about in the US, but apart from one LH flight (business, I had no choice), in the last 6 or so years, I have never flown long-haul in an aircraft without PTV in economy. Who doesn't have them other than LH?
 
MaverickM11
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:59 am

Quoting HB88 (Reply 10):
don't know anyone who *doesn't* choose their airline for long-haul travel factoring in IFE/PTV

How is the average person supposed to know on expedia/travelocity/even most airline websites/travel agencies that the flight they're taking may have IFE?

Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 9):
He's talking long haul I imagine.

I'm talking longhaul or shorthaul. I think there's zero reason to have IFE on a shorthaul flight but on longhaul I think the benefit at best is minimal, unless they charge for services.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
trekster
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:59 am

I said, IF there was a choice, and the sched was good (did not say if they did not care about price and all that stuff)
Where does the time go???
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:00 am

The last flight I took to Europe was on BA just so I could have the PTV in Y. After experiencing the tighter pitch, smaller coke cans (yeah, I know I can ask for 2 ) I decided I much Prefer United Airlines and my noise cancel headphones + IPOD. I'll never choose an airline again base on PTV, to me its all about PRICE, PITCH, Departure time, and arrival time (and in that order)
 
panamair
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:00 am

Quoting HB88 (Reply 10):
I don't know anyone who *doesn't* choose their airline for long-haul travel factoring in IFE/PTV. I wont travel LH for that reason.

Then you must not know a lot of people  Smile Every day thousands of pax. travel long distances without it. If it was so important for so many people, then LH wouldn't be around today...I've seen lots of Business Class passengers crossing the pond without ever turning their PTVs on during the entire 9-10 hour flight.

Quoting HB88 (Reply 10):
Who doesn't have them other than LH?

KL on their 747s; UA on their 747s; DL on their 763ERs; AA on their 763ERs....
 
MaverickM11
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:03 am

Quoting Trekster (Reply 12):
I said, IF there was a choice, and the sched was good (did not say if they did not care about price and all that stuff)

That's the whole point! Why should an airline bother with the costs of installing IFE if it doesn't bring in at least as much revenue?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
hb88
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:08 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 11):
Quoting HB88 (Reply 10):
"don't know anyone who *doesn't* choose their airline for long-haul travel factoring in IFE/PTV"

How is the average person supposed to know on expedia/travelocity/even most airline websites/travel agencies that the flight they're taking may have IFE?

Excuse my ignorance about US carriers, but if you fly long haul out of Asia, Europe or the Pacific, apart from KLM and LH, you can pretty much rely on any of the majors having PTV in economy. Those without are pretty rare.

In any case, if you look at any of the major carriers websites, they'll be publicizing their IFE for sure. I can't think of any non-US carrier other than those you mentioned that don't cover it on their websites.
 
desertjets
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:08 am

Even looking at only longhaul there is little or no information when one is searching for fares if there are PTVs/AVOD or whatever on that particular flight. So at the point of purchase the customer does not know, and presumably doesn't care about that.

Now the presence of PTVs/AVOD or whatever may encourage future business. Customer gets on board and likes the system and remembers that airline X has those TV thingees. But those once or twice a year pax aren't going to pay much of a premium to fly again.

It would be interesting to know if among frequent travelers if the presence of PTVs was a factor in gaining repeat business. But I would be willing to bet CDN$5.00 that more generous FF programs or better in-flight meal service would be something that regular fliers consider more highly in their choice vs. PTVs.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
 
reyes27
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:12 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 11):
How is the average person supposed to know on expedia/travelocity/even most airline websites/travel agencies that the flight they're taking may have IFE?

Experience.

The average consumer who flies long haul more than once a year knows something what airlines offer, they are not completely stupid in what they like and dislike.

While I believe entertainment is not the sole reason people choose to fly who they do, I believe it is one factor that goes into their choice along with price, schedule, comfort, frequent flier programs, etc.
 
hb88
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:13 am

Quoting DesertJets (Reply 17):
It would be interesting to know if among frequent travelers if the presence of PTVs was a factor in gaining repeat business. But I would be willing to bet CDN$5.00 that more generous FF programs or better in-flight meal service would be something that regular fliers consider more highly in their choice vs. PTVs.

In my experience, apart from some US airlines, the lack of PTV in economy for the major non-US carriers is so rare, that it is more that its absence would cause non-repeat business. In fact I heard this first hand on the unfortunate time I was compelled to sit for 10hrs on a LH A340 - nice new a/c, but no PTV. Ugh. People were surprised there was no individual IFE.
 
panamair
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:18 am

Quoting HB88 (Reply 16):
Those without are pretty rare.

In any case, if you look at any of the major carriers websites, they'll be publicizing their IFE for sure. I can't think of any non-US carrier other than those you mentioned that don't cover it on their websites.

Right, but I think the question is, will you be willing to pay a premium for the presence of PTVs? Let's say there are only two carriers on a route. All else is equal except one carrier offers PTV and charges a premium while the other doesn't offer PTV but is cheaper. Which would you choose?
 
MaverickM11
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:19 am

Quoting Reyes27 (Reply 18):
While I believe entertainment is not the sole reason people choose to fly who they do, I believe it is one factor that goes into their choice along with price, schedule, comfort, frequent flier programs, etc.

I agree with that; I just happen to think there is zero revenue premium for having PTVs, especially on short/medium haul.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
hb88
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:26 am

Quoting Panamair (Reply 20):
Right, but I think the question is, will you be willing to pay a premium for the presence of PTVs? Let's say there are only two carriers on a route. All else is equal except one carrier offers PTV and charges a premium while the other doesn't offer PTV but is cheaper. Which would you choose?

I might be crazy, but depending on the premium, I'd go with the IFE. I've spent waaay too many long-haul hours staring at the seatback in front of me.

In any case, it's not necessary to pay any such premium these days. As a rule, I never fly a US carrier unless there is absolutely no way of avoiding it, avoid LH where I can then choose: BA, followed by the good Asian carriers, QF or ANZ then consider the Middle Eastern carriers (who often have great deals anyway - with amazing IFE). It's often dependant on the routing, but as I fly mainly long-haul to the far east and pacific, there's a lot of choice.

There's no issue really. When buying, I flick between the major carrier websites, airlinequality.com, seatguru.com, my favourite cheap ticket website and away you go. Easy.
 
tommy767
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:29 am

I feel from a passenger's standpoint, they're pretty cool to have onboard. I had them on BTV-JFK on B6, LAX-EWR on CO, and MIA-ORD on UA. Personally, I'm used to flying on 757s cross-country so to not have one is not a big deal, and I usually listen to my Ipod or IFE radio. IMO, its not a nessessity, but its a competitive feature to have in the industry nowadays. Basically, I'm not a little bitch when it comes to airline IFE  hissyfit 
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
captaink
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:59 am

I will be honest. PTVs in Y (where I am stuck most of the time) is a blessing and well received. Would I book my flight just for IFE? NO.

For me?

1. Miles (Advantage/One World Carries that offer close to or 100% Advantage mileage accrual in Y)
2. Price
3. Departure times, connecting times and airports in which I will connect.
4. Aircraft type (the aviation buff in me)

As someone mentioned, I will be fine with my iPod, a book, look through the window, and sleep (my favourite thing to do on a long flight). Whats more airlines with the TV monitors in the aisle or wherever usually show ok moves, and the audio channels have pretty good entertainment.

Plenty Options.
There is something special about planes....
 
Daleaholic
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:16 am

My god, you'd have thought you would pass out if you didn't have a PTV!!! I really don't see it as a necessity. To me, a PTV is just an added bonus. Yes, flights can get boring, but you're still getting to your destination. To say you would avoid a particular carrier due to them not having PTV's is pretty pathetic if you ask me.

Just to add, I flew Delta MAN-ATL in August on a 767-300ER, with no PTV's, no electronics allowed on board, no liquids... Yes it was boring, but to be honest, I got to Atlanta. I didn't need a PTV! I look at the cheapest fare.
Religion is an illusion of childhood... Outgrown under proper education.
 
sstsomeday
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:29 am

Quoting Andz (Reply 1):
If I have to fly to Germany, which I do quite frequently, I will not fly LH for that precise reason.

Yes, for lang haul, a private entertainment system is pivotal to my choice of airline. That said, I don't know if the average person is coach is that informed as to which airlines have it.
I come in peace
 
swissy
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:33 am

Life is so sad... 12hrs. and no tv.....  Wink, I have more important issues in life than worry about a screen the size of a "fly sh.." on a aircraft, but hey we are in a "modern" world so if my flight has a "tv" bonus if not, so be it.

Just spoke to my paps in law and he flew in 1957 from YYZ to AMS and back
16-18 hrs. no tv at all but guess what he still talks about it...  Wink

Cheers,
 
PHKLM
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:40 am

Quoting HB88 (Reply 16):
Excuse my ignorance about US carriers, but if you fly long haul out of Asia, Europe or the Pacific, apart from KLM and LH, you can pretty much rely on any of the majors having PTV in economy. Those without are pretty rare

Well, IB doesn't, AZ not on 763, TP doesn't, SK doesn't, and so on.
I wonder where you get your info from when you make bold statements like this.
As a matter of fact, on European carriers there's most likely no PTV.
 
Xkorpyoh
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:23 am

I do choose long haul flights based on PTV. (For flights less than 5 hours: I have plenty of movies in my ipod).
I am now getting even more picky because I not only want PTV, but I want AVOD!!.. That is why a choose to fly NW via MEM to AMS instead of DL nonstop.
I don't think the general public knows about PTV or make decisions based on that. On one of those NW flights, the person next to me never used the PTV. He read a book during the whole flight. An old couple across from me didnt even know how to use the AVOD. I offered to help and she declined and just stared and slept through the flight. But, the majority of the paxs were enjoying the movies. It just makes the flight seemed a lot shorter. My return lasted almost 11 hours AMS-MEM because we had to take a longer route to avoid bad weather.
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:24 am

I appreciate your choices but this thread is about the airlines' choices....are PTVs worth the investment for the AIRLINES...not you.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
Sketty222
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:31 am

Quoting Trekster (Reply 6):
12 Hour flight.

Pick your airline. IFE or no IFE

99% of people, IF there is a choice, will pick IFE airlines

I completely agree. Some people only book because of the PTV. Working for BA I get to travel with different airlines on differet routes, some with PTV/IFE some without. On an 5+ hour flight......... I knwo which airline I'd be travelling on. One with PTV's

Lee
There's flying and then there's flying
 
Xkorpyoh
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:33 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 30):
I appreciate your choices but this thread is about the airlines' choices....are PTVs worth the investment for the AIRLINES...not you.

the message we are sending is that it DOES atract frequent flyers (not necesarily the general public).

The SONG AVOD system that DL is expanding has a lot of potentials to increase revenue because it is interactive and reads credit cards. So intead of being a cost item it should be treated as the revenue item. I dont know how much money they are making (if any) for the pay-per-view movies, but I think they could increase the offering of things to buy onboard with that system. (Casino?!, shopping?, discounted air fare for another trip purchased on board?, etc, etc). So it is not only about entertaining, but using the sophisticated system to get more revenue.
 
aerohottie
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:42 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Thread starter):
do any airlines see a revenue premium because they have PTVs in economy?

PTV's are not so much a revenue generating device, but more a revenue protection device. There are not many serious global players that don't have PTV's... they have almost become a bench mark to be taken seriously.
What?
 
FlyKev
Crew
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 7:57 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 30):
I appreciate your choices but this thread is about the airlines' choices....are PTVs worth the investment for the AIRLINES...not you.

I believe they are.
Airlines like to show off their IFE to customers, I remember an Emirates commercial advertising just their IFE.
It may cost to install, but I believe in many cases it does work as a benefit to the airline, else, why would so many airlines have it.
Customers want comfort, service and quality. Having a PTV is part of that experience and if you look at most the top rated carriers, they all have it.
All the 5 star skytrax rated carriers have it in all classes, and pretty much most of the 4 star carriers have PTVs.

Kev.
The white zone is for immediate loading and unloading of passengers only
 
richierich
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:07 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 30):
I appreciate your choices but this thread is about the airlines' choices....are PTVs worth the investment for the AIRLINES...not you.

Ask Jetblue if they are worth the investment. I'd say yes. In fact, I'd go as far as to say it helped shape the B6 brand.
People may not know which flights on NW, DL, AA, UA etc. have PTVs and which don't (*I'm not always sure...!), but everybody knows which flights on JetBlue have live television at every seat! It doesn't matter if I am in JFK flying to San Diego or in Boston flying to Rochester... I know every flight on JetBlue will have tv.

With that said, I don't know if there is a big revenue premium for selecting B6 over a non-PTV carrier. If there is, it might be no more than $5 for most passengers. But if your choice is a flight on a carrier with satellite tv versus a carrier that gives you nothing, price being equal, the tv wins most of the time. Maybe this says something about our society in general, but you have to agree that it is a great way to waste time while flying.
None shall pass!!!!
 
warren747sp
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:09 am

Definitely not for the A380. Maybe they would have a few delivered by now if not for PTV's in economy class.
It is probably not a good idea for most airlines, more weight, more heat and more fire hazard!
747SP
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:12 am

Quoting Warren747sp (Reply 36):
Definitely not for the A380. Maybe they would have a few delivered by now if not for PTV's in economy class.
It is probably not a good idea for most airlines, more weight, more heat and more fire hazard!

The ironic thing is if they could just wait a year or so 802.11 wireless IFE systems will be available, and with the delays they are waiting long enough that they can just install the wireless systems.
 
swissy
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:13 am

It clearly shows how easy people are influenced and airlines sure will try to use ptv's for their advantage..... it is a free market and it shows how people choose, like I remember being on a Pink Floyd concert in the 80's all my friends
could not stop talking about the "light show"..... I ask them what about the music???.... a big nothing....

If airlines see a way to gain more pax with ptv's sure they will install them.

Cheers,
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:20 am

Quoting Xkorpyoh (Reply 32):
the message we are sending is that it DOES atract frequent flyers

The message y'all are sending is that a.netters love PTVs, which I knew before starting this thread Silly.

Quoting Aerohottie (Reply 33):
PTV's are not so much a revenue generating device, but more a revenue protection device.

I can think of quite a few routes where the carrier with the PTV has the lowest average fare.

Quoting Richierich (Reply 35):
Ask Jetblue if they are worth the investment.

I've heard, possibly a rumor, that were B6 to do it all over again, they'd charge for PTV.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
captaink
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:29 am

I think we can see from this thread that PTVs are appreciated by some, whereas other don't give hoot whether there are PTVs or not. Considering the fact that we are aviation buffs and we know down to REG of the aircraft that has PTVs at times I don't think we are representative of the general flying public.

SO I would say, there are many people who would choose an airline because of its IFE, there are many people who go with price regardless of the IFE, there are those would be airline loyal, for miles or whatever other reason.

I don't think any of the above groups are even close to 99% of the flying public as many have claimed.

a.net?

80% of a.net users would choose an airline because of IFE.
65% of a.net users would choose an airline becuase of brand loyalty,
99% of a.net users would choose an airline because of airplane type flown. Big grin the only 99% survey result.
There is something special about planes....
 
richierich
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 8:32 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 39):
I've heard, possibly a rumor, that were B6 to do it all over again, they'd charge for PTV.

Well, I'm sure they'd love to, but doing it all over again and charging from day one? I'm not so sure. It helped define the JetBlue brand - an LCC with free television (something not offered by a competitor until 2002/3)....
If you are right, then it is not a rumor I've ever heard.
None shall pass!!!!
 
jetBlueNYFL
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 9:03 am

Quoting FLY2LIM (Reply 7):
What keeps me flying on AA is that B6 doesn't offer a non-stop SFO-MIA and I can maximize ff miles.

Not to get too off topic, but jetBlue flies nonstop OAK-FLL, two nearby, smaller, less delay-prone airports than the ones you mention. Also, keep in mind that in addition the the IFE, you'll enjoy ShutEye Service on the eastbound overnight flight.
jetBlue...Bringing Humanity Back To Air Travel!
 
fsimmer
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 9:12 am

Quoting Andz (Reply 1):
If I have to fly to Germany, which I do quite frequently, I will not fly LH for that precise reason.

Totally agree with you. LH among others is on my "No Fly List" for that very reason. Wonder if they will install PTV's on their newly ordered 748 or if they are planning on putting in an antique projector and a retro main screen from last century.
fsimmer
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 9:38 am

Quoting Fsimmer (Reply 43):
Totally agree with you. LH among others is on my "No Fly List" for that very reason. Wonder if they will install PTV's on their newly ordered 748 or if they are planning on putting in an antique projector and a retro main screen from last century.


Almost certainly they will intstall PTV's. If what I have read about the 802.11 systems is true they should totally dominate the IFE market. I think the only questions that remain are how many channels, how big of a screen, and how can they make the IFE a profit center.

http://www.flightglobal.com/Articles...es+turned+on+by+787+IFE+tests.html
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Fri Dec 08, 2006 10:19 am

Quoting Aerohottie (Reply 33):
PTV's are not so much a revenue generating device, but more a revenue protection device. There are not many serious global players that don't have PTV's... they have almost become a bench mark to be taken seriously.

It appears to depend very much on the level of local competititon. here in the Uk we have both BA & VS offering PTV's, thus it is pretty much expected. In addition with VS going over to AVOD BA feel the need to do the same in order to protect their market share.

LH have their national long haul market to themselves, as does KLM; as a rule the majority will fly with what they see as their national airline/s, so if an airline has no longhaul competition PTV's aren't such a priority.
 
bsbisland
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Sat Dec 09, 2006 12:02 am

You guys have to consider that 99% of people are not aviation freaks like you. Im sure lots of people would rather fly LH or KLM (on some flights) or whatever airline they are loyal to because of its good service and reputation, frequencies on flights and destinations, timings of flights, price or pontuallity instead of flying other carrier based on having or not PTVs in Economy. Business or First Class may be another matter.

In most cases I would rather fly an airline with PTV, but you have to consider the whole market. Maybe the expense of having PTVs (which I believe are quite expensive to operate) doesnt benefit of more profit to the airline. But as the trend now is to have PTV, there is a possibility it brings more high yield pax, but I dont think anyone here can be sure about that.

I have flown LH, BA and Tam from Brazil to Europe, all reputable airlines, and the latter two do have PTVs, but I would still choose LH, because the flights I had with them was impeccable and I just love their grey-yellow interiors :P

BTW my next long haul trip I will choose the carrier based on the aircraft type flown on the route. B773, A345, A342, B764, B747 classics are all missing on my list. I dont really care if they have PTVs or not.
 
sstsomeday
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Sat Dec 09, 2006 12:21 am

Quoting Swissy (Reply 27):
Life is so sad... 12hrs. and no tv.....  , I have more important issues in life than worry about a screen the size of a "fly sh.." on a aircraft, but hey we are in a "modern" world so if my flight has a "tv" bonus if not, so be it.

The issue is not that I can't be without TV, but that I am crammed into a crowded coach cabin, very uncomfortable, with 10 hours to kill and very few options. I can do a little work, sleep a little, but the distraction of the entertainment system is a big plus to help me anaesthetise myself to how uncomfortable I am sitting in one small seat with very little leg room for that long a period. It helps me pass the time during which I am confined; I find it a necessary distraction.
I come in peace
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Sat Dec 09, 2006 1:18 am

I find that the content shown on the ptv's generally fails to excite me, and never seem to be able to watch anything successfully, as I either miss the beginning, or get disturbed and miss the end. As a consequence I generally leave it on the moving map.

I haven't yet flown on a plane with AVOD, so perhaps my attitide might change at that point.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: PTVs In Y: Are They Worth It For The Airlines?

Sat Dec 09, 2006 1:30 am

I find that the content shown on the ptv's generally fails to excite me, and never seem to be able to watch anything successfully, as I either miss the beginning, or get disturbed and miss the end. As a consequence I generally leave it on the moving map.

I haven't yet flown on a plane with AVOD, so perhaps my attitide might change at that point.