mlsrar
Posts: 1384
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 7:41 am

ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 4:07 am

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"May 21, 2000


On May 4, Boeing confirmed that American Trans Air had signed an intent to order 10 Boeing 757-300s and 20 Boeing 737-800s. ATA plans to lease an additional 17 737-800s - 12 from ILFC and 5 from GECAS. The new 757-300s will replace 6 L-1011-50s. ATA plans to keep all long range -100s and -500s at least until 2005. The airline is considering the Airbus A330-200 or Boeing 767 as a future replacement for the L-1011s. "
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This was an excerpt from information from Lockheed's Tristar Alliance, a consortium whose genesis is based on operating the -1011s well into the twentieth century with proper maintenance, and the ability to convert 535-E4s to the #2 config on the tristar.

The enigma in my mind is based on this article, which seems implicitly hypocritical. To operate 738s, and 753s (with a tendency to replace the L1011-50s), why would they operate choose the A330 instead of a 764?

Regards,

Michael
I mean, for the right price I’ll fight a lion. - Mike Tyson
 
JumboClassic
Posts: 314
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2000 4:37 am

RE: ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 4:16 am

GECAS ordered 16 A332s on Apr 27th (for delivery between 2002-2005) which are rumored to be for ATA. Again operational economics (seat/mile cost) and not cockpit commonality is the prevailing factor for this decision.
 
mlsrar
Posts: 1384
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 7:41 am

RE: ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 4:57 am

I'm not trying to berate you, but where is the source of the ATA rumour? I have recollections from when ATA was planning to make MKE its base instead of MDW, and the agents and pilots were milling over an A320 purchase deal.

Did ATA purchase through ILFC or GECAS?
I mean, for the right price I’ll fight a lion. - Mike Tyson
 
User avatar
CV880
Posts: 964
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:56 am

RE: ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 5:12 am

To respond to the original question, the 767-400 cockpit is similar to the 777 rather than the 757/ 767-200,300, so the commonality of the -400 with the other Boeings in ATA's fleet is marginal. The decision will be made on the basis of other factors one suspects.
 
User avatar
GreenArc
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 10:59 am

RE: ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 6:54 am

CV880,

Although the 767-400 cockpit design is similar in appearance to that of the 777, it is also similar to the 737NG design and offers complete cross qualification with present 757/767 aircraft. Type rated 757 and 767 pilots will be able to fly the -400 with only minimal "differences" training (a few hours of ground school) and without operational restriction.

The 767-400 would be an excellent fit for ATA (as far as crew considerations go). Once the fleet revamp is complete, only two pools of pilots would be required: one for the 737 and one for the 757/767. Accelerated training would allow movement between fleets in less than two weeks.

Presently, the GECAS planes aren't earmarked for ATA, but that doesn't preclude a future lease. However, ATA would probably opt for RR rather than GE powerplants on potential 332 aircraft.

GreenArc
 
mlsrar
Posts: 1384
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 7:41 am

RE: ATA A330-200s

Thu Jul 13, 2000 9:29 pm

With ATA's pax config., 360 souls would be packed in a 764, wouldn't that restrict their range capabilities?
I mean, for the right price I’ll fight a lion. - Mike Tyson
 
User avatar
CV880
Posts: 964
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:56 am

360 Souls?!

Thu Jul 13, 2000 10:32 pm

A couple of things: Thanks, GreenArc, for the clarification about the cockpit. Mlsrar has just mentioned 360 'souls' on board a 764 (good terminology, they'd be better off dead). Anyhow, to get 360 pax into a 764, do you need to go to 8-across seating from the usual 7? Britannia packs them in that way on their -200s!

 
mlsrar
Posts: 1384
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 7:41 am

RE: 360 Souls?!

Fri Jul 14, 2000 5:34 am

Boeing states max cap. being 375 for the 764. ATA consistently uses around a 29-30" pitch, which is the defacto standard for charter configurations. At 2-3-2, you could fit 350-360 pax in a 764 with the loss of 2 galleys and 2 lavs.

Remember, the bulk of pax on airlines like Sun Country, and ATA aren't looking for creature comforts, they want to get to their destination expediently and at the lowest cost.
I mean, for the right price I’ll fight a lion. - Mike Tyson

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