zsx81
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DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:17 am

Roumor has it DL employees will be staging a large rally against US Airways merger on Wed this week. Lets see what Dougie thinks about that..
 
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foxecho
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:35 am

count me in!

Andrew
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Prinair
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:09 pm

Such a rally would be silly and childish. DL employees should just accept that another airline could possibly buy out theirs and if such were to happen, then they should work together to make the new airline a success. Watch this turn into a nightmare because of small minded minds and way of thinking.
PRINAIR : Puerto Rico International Airlines
 
USPIT10L
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:21 pm

Quoting PRINAIR (Reply 2):
Such a rally would be silly and childish. DL employees should just accept that another airline could possibly buy out theirs and if such were to happen, then they should work together to make the new airline a success. Watch this turn into a nightmare because of small minded minds and way of thinking.

I couldn't have said it better myself. While I admire DL employees for their loyalty, the fact remains, any public company is open to a hostile takeover. A public company is always up for sale, in effect. If someone buys a controlling interest, the other parties involved can get out, but that would only hurt the value of the company itself. I imagine most of the Delta employees feel the same way about US/DL that I did about US/UA in the beginning of that deal. This is my message to Delta employees, keep working hard, your airline has improved tremendously due to your hard work. Don't worry about the takeover attempt, just keep doing your jobs as you usually would. Let the judge and the creditors themselves work out what will happen.
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DTWAGENT
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:28 pm

Yes keep working hard at improving your airline. I still believe that DL will come out of this as a stand alone carrier. However, I do agree with the employees, US buying out DL would be a disaster. Do we not remmeber the NW and Republic merger/buy out?????

I say let DL stand alone and US get the H out of DL's way in getting out of chapter 11. The only reason US wants DL is because of all their international routes. And the larger long range planes. They don't care about anything else.

If I could I would be out their with the DL employees.

Chuck
 
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:28 pm

More power to them. There are some of "US" that may not want a merger with Delta. I for one think the company has its hands full already, and shouldnt be going after DL as it is. Their culture is far different than that of US, and a merger would not go well.
ABQ ops, Cactus 202 requesting you order 5 Green Chile Chicken stew for us to p/u on arrival. ;)
 
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foxecho
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:47 pm

Quoting PRINAIR (Reply 2):
Such a rally would be silly and childish. DL employees should just accept that another airline could possibly buy out theirs

With all do respect to PRINAIR and USPIT10L, heres my take on the situation

Its not going to happen.

I know that we (DL) does not have say, however I have seen things internally to indicate more creditors are hoping DL emerges as stand alone carrier, than creditors who want the quick money US is offering, I have worked too long and too hard and taken too many paycuts only to have US axe me.

Keep Delta my Delta!

Andrew
JFK/MEM/MCI
..uh, we'll need that to live......
 
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TVNWZ
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:56 pm

Quoting Zsx81 (Thread starter):
Lets see what Dougie thinks about that..

"Dougie" could care less.
 
dl757md
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 3):
Don't worry about the takeover attempt, just keep doing your jobs as you usually would

Thanks for the advice. But we are already doing that. Additionally we'll be damned if we're going to sit idly by and let US steamroll all of the hardwork we've put into turning this thing around.

DL757Md
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
Prinair
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:08 pm

Regardless of all the hardwork and good intentions, in the long run "Money talks and bull***t walks". This will come down to being a financial issue, if the creditors want money quickly or whatever the bankruptcy court feels is best.
PRINAIR : Puerto Rico International Airlines
 
silentbob
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:08 pm

I really don't get all of the hatred and venom I see here any time someone mentions this deal. Not to mention the fact that those people feel the need to weigh in, regardless of the actual theme of the topic.

This type of childish behavior doesn't happen in any other industry when there is a merger. Despite what so many people are going to say, the business of aviation is not radically different from the "real world."
 
ballsdeep
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:13 pm

Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground. That is who they should really be mad at. A merger was inevitable, whether it is US Airways, another airline, or going out of business, the old Delta is going down.
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:20 pm

Quoting Zsx81 (Thread starter):
Roumor has it DL employees will be staging a large rally against US Airways merger on Wed this week. Lets see what Dougie thinks about that..

Ain't no rumor about it...It's happening this Wednesday.

Quoting PRINAIR (Reply 2):
Such a rally would be silly and childish. DL employees should just accept that another airline could possibly buy out theirs and if such were to happen, then they should work together to make the new airline a success. Watch this turn into a nightmare because of small minded minds and way of thinking.



Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 3):
I couldn't have said it better myself.

The creditors WILL take an unhappy workforce into concideration. It won't be the deciding factor, but it WILL be a factor.

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 3):
This is my message to Delta employees, keep working hard, your airline has improved tremendously due to your hard work. Don't worry about the takeover attempt, just keep doing your jobs as you usually would. Let the judge and the creditors themselves work out what will happen.

No...Thanks for playing.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
db373
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:40 pm

Quoting USPIT10L (Reply 3):
This is my message to Delta employees, keep working hard, your airline has improved tremendously due to your hard work. Don't worry about the takeover attempt, just keep doing your jobs as you usually would. Let the judge and the creditors themselves work out what will happen.



Quoting Silentbob (Reply 10):
This type of childish behavior doesn't happen in any other industry when there is a merger. Despite what so many people are going to say, the business of aviation is not radically different from the "real world."

I understand what the two of you are saying, but you're failing to take into account the fact that most of DL's employees are non-union, which means their seniority is on the line here. Doug can sit there and talk all he wants about how labor will be integrated fairly and all that, but look at all the hell he's going through trying to integrate US and HP. Does anyone really think the US/HP integrated work force will then just sit there and let DL's workforce (Which is A LOT of people) be integrated in the same way?

Come on.
Keep Delta My Delta
 
dl1011
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 3:19 pm

"Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground. That is who they should really be mad at."

Bravo!!!!!
 
jumbojet
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 3:31 pm

Quoting Ballsdeep (Reply 11):
Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground.

maybe because it's not the current delta mgmt that caused delta the hardship that there in now?

Also, anyone read this article? It appears that if Delta mgmt doesnt want the merger then US Airways will back down.

http://www.news-press.com/apps/pbcs....le?AID=/20061209/BUSINESS/61209004
 
silentbob
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 3:43 pm

Quoting Db373 (Reply 13):
I understand what the two of you are saying, but you're failing to take into account the fact that most of DL's employees are non-union, which means their seniority is on the line here. Doug can sit there and talk all he wants about how labor will be integrated fairly and all that, but look at all the hell he's going through trying to integrate US and HP. Does anyone really think the US/HP integrated work force will then just sit there and let DL's workforce (Which is A LOT of people) be integrated in the same way?

The biggest issue with US/HP seniority (as I understand it) is that US workers tend to have more seniority and HP employees get screwed in a straight merge. While I don't have access to DL employee service info, I'm going to assume (because DL is a legacy) that their employees have more seniority than the average HP employees do. As such, they should fare much better in a merge than HP employees. If I am wrong, please correct me as I would like to know.

As a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if the sheer volume of DL employees was enough to decertify the union or at least get their own people into key union positions.
 
panamair
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:05 pm

Quoting PRINAIR (Reply 2):
Such a rally would be silly and childish. DL employees should just accept that another airline could possibly buy out theirs and if such were to happen, then they should work together to make the new airline a success. Watch this turn into a nightmare because of small minded minds and way of thinking.

Last I checked, DL is a US airline and in the US, there is something called freedom of expression. DL employees can rally, scream, shout, wear buttons, put up banners as long as they don't break the law, whether or not it has a bearing on the eventual outcome. Just like you and I can come onto a.net and spout all sorts of nonsense even though 99% of the junk we spew forth here goes nowhere.

They have legitimate concerns about this deal and they should have the opportunity to air those. Just because people might have no direct say on the outcome of a situation doesn't mean they shouldn't express their displeasure at it. Just like in the 'real' world, should we all just sit back and do nothing because we don't think we can make a dent in solving any of the world's issues?
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:12 pm

So is US trying to merge with Delta or acquire Delta?

Those are two different scenarios.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 9:29 pm

Quoting VonRichtofen (Reply 18):
So is US trying to merge with Delta or acquire Delta?

It's a hostile takeover.

Quoting Ballsdeep (Reply 11):
Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground. That is who they should really be mad at. A merger was inevitable, whether it is US Airways, another airline, or going out of business, the old Delta is going down.

Wow, welcome to 2004  Yeah sure .

As to all the folks on here who think that DL's employees are childish (yeah, fighting for one's well-being, how stupid is that  Yeah sure ?), consider if somebody was trying to take over the company you work for in a proposal that would destroy everything you and your fellow employees have worked for for the last years/decades in less than a year? I doubt you would react any different. That is, providing you are even old enough to work to begin with.
 
727LOVER
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 10:38 pm

Quoting PRINAIR (Reply 2):
Watch this turn into a nightmare because of small minded minds and way of thinking.

You mean, like here on A.NET

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 19):
As to all the folks on here who think that DL's employees are childish (yeah, fighting for one's well-being, how stupid is that ?), consider if somebody was trying to take over the company you work for in a proposal that would destroy everything you and your fellow employees have worked for for the last years/decades in less than a year? I doubt you would react any different.

DL employees is one thing.....Deltoids on A.net is another. There seems to be such a hositle reaction on here just to the idea that DL could be a takeover target. And by the way, if this is HOSTILE as opposed to UNSOLICITED, wouldn't US be buying gobs of DL stock? Or is that stock worthless now?
I don't see the value of this merger, but I'm not going to lose sleep over it.  zzz 
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MD88Captain
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 10:39 pm

At the meeting before the creditor's committee, Doug Parker expressed that the he had the experience to pull this merger off because he had already merged to different companies. Immediatedly the creditors in that room through the BS flag. They expressed to him that he had not yet merged anything successfully.

This rally shows the creditors the difficulty that Parker would have in merging 3 different employee groups. It is worth every employees time.

BTW. This think is apparently DOA as it basically makes no operational sense. But the NWA aspects are interesting.
 
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OA412
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:10 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 20):
DL employees is one thing.....Deltoids on A.net is another. There seems to be such a hositle reaction on here just to the idea that DL could be a takeover target.

You think some of the "Deltoids" on here are reacting in a hostile fashion to the idea of a merger? Why don't you saunter on over to flyertalk and have a look at what DL's most frequent flyers are saying about this merger. The VAST majority of them are diametrically opposed to this merger and have stated that they want nothing to do with the entity known as "New Delta". Believe me, the hostility toward this merger goes far beyond a few people on A.net!
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B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:14 pm

Quoting Ballsdeep (Reply 11):
Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground. That is who they should really be mad at. A merger was inevitable, whether it is US Airways, another airline, or going out of business, the old Delta is going down.



Quoting Dl1011 (Reply 14):
"Why don't the employees of Delta have a rally against there own management for running their beloved company into the ground. That is who they should really be mad at."

Bravo!!!!!

Yeah! Meet you at Leo Mullin's house this Saturday at noon!

Do yourselves a favor. Go to WalMart. Buy a clue. They're cheap nowadays.

Quoting VonRichtofen (Reply 18):
So is US trying to merge with Delta or acquire Delta?

Those are two different scenarios.

Aquire. This is a hostile take over, in spite of how Doug Parker spins it as a 'merger' to soft pedal it to DL employees. It takes two to 'merge'.

Quoting MD88Captain (Reply 21):
At the meeting before the creditor's committee, Doug Parker expressed that the he had the experience to pull this merger off because he had already merged to different companies. Immediatedly the creditors in that room through the BS flag. They expressed to him that he had not yet merged anything successfully.

haha yeah I read that and thought, wow, if that gives him the experience, what does that make Grinstein, who's done like three mergers successfully. (and completely I might add)
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
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longhauler
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:50 pm

I admire the DL employees for doing this. Everyone has the right of assembly and expression in the US, (Canada too), and if they feel this is worthwhile, then so be it.

But, if you look at airline mergers in the past, the difference between a good merger (Delta/Western) vice a bad merger (Northwest/Republic) has been the attitude of the employees toward the merge. Namely, if they don't want it, they will do all to resist its efficient occurrence. This is true in all large corporations, but especially true in airlines which have such a large percentage of customer contact employees.

Look at the Air Canada/Canadi>n merge. On paper, it looked like a good merge, with a near perfect mesh of routes, equipment and facilities. However, when Jerry Schwartz of Onex Corp, looked at the attitude of the employees and how they would view such a merge, he cancelled his offer at the first reasonable chance.

Good luck Delta, lets face it, you owe it to any external investors to understand it won't be easy!
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
FlyPNS1
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:11 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 23):
Yeah! Meet you at Leo Mullin's house this Saturday at noon!

You're missing the point. Where were all these loyal employees back in 2002, 2003 and 2004 when DL management was running the company into the ground? I didn't see any of them protesting then. Instead, some of them on this board were busy thumping their chests talking about how great DL was and looking down on carriers like US.

In fact, the only group that spoke out against DL's past crappy management was the pilots. Of course, the other employee groups attacked the pilots for doing so. Ironically, now the other employee groups are protesting, but only the pilots have any real say (as they are on the creditors committee and have a contract that US management must deal with).
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:36 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 25):
You're missing the point. Where were all these loyal employees back in 2002, 2003 and 2004 when DL management was running the company into the ground? I didn't see any of them protesting then. Instead, some of them on this board were busy thumping their chests talking about how great DL was and looking down on carriers like US.

I'm living in 2006, almost 2007 now, to bring you up to speed.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 25):
In fact, the only group that spoke out against DL's past crappy management was the pilots. Of course, the other employee groups attacked the pilots for doing so. Ironically, now the other employee groups are protesting, but only the pilots have any real say (as they are on the creditors committee and have a contract that US management must deal with).

Non pilot employees don't have any real say huh? You think the creditors believe they employees will accept this hostile takeover with a smile on their face? You don't think customer service will be effected? You don't think the non pilot employees can walk off the job if it goes thru?

You're interesting.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
zsx81
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:44 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 25):
You're missing the point. Where were all these loyal employees back in 2002, 2003 and 2004 when DL management was running the company into the ground? I didn't see any of them protesting then. Instead, some of them on this board were busy thumping their chests talking about how great DL was and looking down on carriers like US.

Becuause not every DL employee holds a PhD in being an arm chair CEO like you. Just like now they have to trust their management that it will make the best decision for the company, and at the time people running the company may have thaught they were doing the best for the company. Its very easy to look back and tell everyone what they should have done.
 
zsx81
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:48 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
You don't think customer service will be effected? You don't think the non pilot employees can walk off the job if it goes thru?

Thats why Dougie keeps mentioning there wont be any lay offs or furloughs, because of all the people that will be leaving in droves especially on the DL side.
 
ballsdeep
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:00 am

Quoting Zsx81 (Reply 27):
Becuause not every DL employee holds a PhD in being an arm chair CEO like you. Just like now they have to trust their management that it will make the best decision for the company, and at the time people running the company may have thaught they were doing the best for the company. Its very easy to look back and tell everyone what they should have done.

So because they ran the company into bankruptcy they should be let off the hook because they thought they were doing the right thing. Sorry pal, the real world doesn't work that way. If a company is ran poorly than it goes out of business or get purchased. This is what is happening with Delta, it is nothing personal, it is business and all the Delta people are making it personal.They don't get a reprieve because they thought they were doing the right thing. Damn capitalism.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:10 am

customers should hold a similar event. let them know that the millions of loyal, Medallion DL flyers who pump money into DL year in/year out are not happy and WILL not support the "new Delta" aka USAirways in a southern dress.

At the end of the day the success of the merger relies on one thing: Customers to continue flying. If we vote with our wallets, "Dougie" fails.

I'd rather see Delta shut down than become USAirways. And yes I am a Medallion member.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:17 am

Quoting Ballsdeep (Reply 29):
So because they ran the company into bankruptcy they should be let off the hook because they thought they were doing the right thing. Sorry pal, the real world doesn't work that way. If a company is ran poorly than it goes out of business or get purchased. This is what is happening with Delta, it is nothing personal, it is business and all the Delta people are making it personal.They don't get a reprieve because they thought they were doing the right thing. Damn capitalism.

Those people are gone. Welcome to 2006.

Quoting Zsx81 (Reply 28):
Thats why Dougie keeps mentioning there wont be any lay offs or furloughs, because of all the people that will be leaving in droves especially on the DL side.

Oh yea, I forgot about that line of redflag BS that he said.

There WILL be layoffs. It'll be the 'Hey we're closing the ATL headquarters, but we have jobs for you in Phoenix...Oh you can't just up and move out there? Oh well, we have no need for you, and we can still go around saying we never laid anyone off' type of layoffs.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
dutchjet
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:32 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 22):
Why don't you saunter on over to flyertalk and have a look at what DL's most frequent flyers are saying about this merger. The VAST majority of them are diametrically opposed to this merger and have stated that they want nothing to do with the entity known as "New Delta". Believe me, the hostility toward this merger goes far beyond a few people on A.net!

Why do you think that is? As an airline nerd, I dont think that the merger is a good idea for lots of reasons (many of which have been mentioned by others), but rarely has the ""public"" reacted so agressively against a deal. Delta was a great airline and Delta is trying to become a great airline once again, but there were some pretty lousy years inbetween where Delta did a lot of things very wrong......with that in mind, its amazing that so many pax feel so strongly that DL should remain independent and not taken over by US.
 
ballsdeep
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:36 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 31):
Those people are gone. Welcome to 2006.

Yeah and in 2006 Delta is still in bankruptcy. It doesn't matter if "those people" are gone. The company is in their postion because of the decsions that "those people" made and they have to deal with result, a hostile takeover. The company is bleeding money and market conditions dictate that there should be a merger/purchase.
 
FlyPNS1
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:54 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
Non pilot employees don't have any real say huh?

Yes.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
You think the creditors believe they employees will accept this hostile takeover with a smile on their face?

Most of the creditors don't care whether you are happy or sad. They are in it for the short-term money...not your long-term happiness. Did you care about whether the creditors had a smile on their face when DL went bankrupt and creditors saw millions go up in smoke? I bet you didn't.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
You don't think customer service will be effected?

Customer service may be hurt, but most of the creditors don't really care.

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 26):
You don't think the non pilot employees can walk off the job if it goes thru?

Sure they can. I'm sure a few will. However, most will continue doing their jobs just as they did before.

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 30):
I'd rather see Delta shut down than become USAirways. And yes I am a Medallion member.

I would say you are in the minority. Most customers don't care about the name on the side of the plane. They want cheap fares and reliable service.
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 1:56 am

Quoting Ballsdeep (Reply 33):
The company is bleeding money and market conditions dictate that there should be a merger/purchase.

Here's your chance to show some documentation of that statement before some people come in here and blow you out of the water.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:01 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 34):
I would say you are in the minority. Most customers don't care about the name on the side of the plane. They want cheap fares and reliable service.

You are right and wrong.

General customers who value price will not give a damn what's on the side of the plane.

Medallion members care, and the majority of them aren't happy about this prospect.
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:07 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 34):
Most of the creditors don't care whether you are happy or sad. They are in it for the short-term money...not your long-term happiness.



Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 34):
Customer service may be hurt, but most of the creditors don't really care.



Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 34):
Sure they can. I'm sure a few will. However, most will continue doing their jobs just as they did before.

You've completely missed the point, congrats.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
airlinespotter
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:14 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 30):
I'd rather see Delta shut down than become USAirways. And yes I am a Medallion member

Well, I guess it's time for you to pick another airline dude.
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:17 am

Quoting Airlinespotter (Reply 38):
Well, I guess it's time for you to pick another airline dude.

why?
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:26 am

Quoting Airlinespotter (Reply 38):
Well, I guess it's time for you to pick another airline dude.



i would expect nothing less from a US employee/fan.

[Edited 2006-12-10 18:44:38]
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
dl757md
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:44 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 25):
In fact, the only group that spoke out against DL's past crappy management was the pilots. Of course, the other employee groups attacked the pilots for doing so.

I'm sorry to say Sir, that you are dead wrong about that. Apparently you didn't talk to any mechanics. Your premise which you tout as fact is flawed because the pilots were the only voice that people listened to. Just because the other groups didn't have a union and weren't going through very public contract negotiations doesn't mean that they were all "thumping their chests about how great Delta was". Yes a few Deltoids were doing so but in any organization you're going to have people who drink the Kool-Aid without questioning why. In the time period '02-'04 you referenced remember that Delta non-pilot employees saw pay-cuts that put them in the lower tier of airlines pay-scales while for most if not all of that period the pilots enjoyed a pay-scale that not only was industry leading but unconscionably so. What were the pilots speaking out against? They were saying that THEY were not going to finance managements missteps. What they refused to acknowledge was the sacrifices made by other employees (admittedly the other employees had no choice but most didn't whine too much because they realized that it was necessary) and that they needed to contribute. What was the slogan?....Top pay till the last day. They wanted the company to go down thinking somehow that would show Leo and his boys how bad they had been. Well after Herculean efforts by the current management team they finally but somewhat narrowly accepted what was needed from them and we are where we are today. I wonder how the company might have been better off today if the pilots had gotten off their high horse and had initially trusted the management team that they stand side by side with now against US Air.

To add one more thing about your idea that non-pilot Delta employees didn't bitch during the time period you mentioned. I can see how you might think that because the bitching wasn't very public. Well, I guess we learned from that. It is the whole reason why there is going to be a rally on Wednesday. We don't want people like you thinking or saying we don't voice our opinion on issues we are against.

DL757Md
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
cubastar
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:54 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 39):
B777-700 From United States,



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 40):
litalia744 From United States

Don't waste your time with him guys. After all, he knows everything.....he's a student......(of what)?
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:57 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 40):
i would expect nothing less from a US employee/fan.

I liked your first reply better  Wink

Quoting Dl757md (Reply 41):
To add one more thing about your idea that non-pilot Delta employees didn't bitch during the time period you mentioned. I can see how you might think that because the bitching wasn't very public. Well, I guess we learned from that. It is the whole reason why there is going to be a rally on Wednesday. We don't want people like you thinking or saying we don't voice our opinion on issues we are against.

Owned!
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
N352SW
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:59 am

For those folks who just say it is childish to rally, all I have to say is that for you folks who have no connection with what will personally happen to you ( IE. Retirement, benefits, seniority, pay, and more ) really do not understand the situation. I had 11 years with Delta and my father had 35 years. Do you really think USAirways will take care of Delta people when they are having a hard time taking care of their own ????? I would say " HECK NO "
One other thing, Delta employees and retirees I would say have loyalty and a sincere feeling for THEIR company. More than USAirways has ever had and more than likely ever will.

[Edited 2006-12-10 19:13:50]
 
Alitalia744
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:59 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 43):
I liked your first reply better

I did too  Wink
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
FlyPNS1
Posts: 5272
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:14 am

Quoting Dl757md (Reply 41):
To add one more thing about your idea that non-pilot Delta employees didn't bitch during the time period you mentioned. I can see how you might think that because the bitching wasn't very public. Well, I guess we learned from that. It is the whole reason why there is going to be a rally on Wednesday. We don't want people like you thinking or saying we don't voice our opinion on issues we are against.

Grumbling in private goes on at pratically every company. However, it does nothing. As the old saying goes "Silence is consent."

The employees are rallying now, but you are a day late and a dollar short. You are in bankruptcy where the creditors and the court are in charge and you are simply along for the ride. You had your chance to speak, but instead chose to be silent and attack the one group that did speak out.
 
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litz
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:21 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 20):
And by the way, if this is HOSTILE as opposed to UNSOLICITED, wouldn't US be buying gobs of DL stock?

It's both HOSTILE and UNSOLICITED.

Because DL is in BK, buying stock is worthless (because the stock is worthless). In order for US to acquire DL, they have to win approval of the creditors ... essentially, they pay off the creditors, the creditors give them the airline.

The whole reason Parker wants this done during the BK process is that the cost of the acquisition would be far, far less than the cost of a traditional hostile takeover, where the acquiring company purchases a controlling interest of stock in the acquired company.

In a way, it's a helluva pat on the back to the DL team for their hard work : Parker realizes that once DL is out of BK, the value of the newly reorganized company will be far out of his price range.

Parker's gamble here is that the creditors are going to go for the quick buck now rather than the better returns later.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 22):
Why don't you saunter on over to flyertalk and have a look at what DL's most frequent flyers are saying about this merger. The VAST majority of them are diametrically opposed to this merger and have stated that they want nothing to do with the entity known as "New Delta"

And I'm one of those many. I've not YET met someone either crew or passenger on any of my flights who's in favor of this.

- litz
 
silentbob
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting N352SW (Reply 44):
For those folks who just say it is childish to rally, all I have to say is that for you folks who have no connection with what will personally happen to you ( IE. Retirement, benefits, seniority, pay, and more ) really do not understand the situation.

I'm screwed in a couple years regardless of what happens with this merger and I don't complain about it every day on here. In any case, pay isn't going to get worse. In situations where Delta employees get paid less than US/HP, they will get a raise. DL employees will fare better than HP employees as they have been around longer.

Quoting N352SW (Reply 44):
I had 11 years with Delta and my father had 35 years. Do you really think USAirways will take care of Delta people when they are having a hard time taking care of their own ????? I would say " HECK NO "

What hard time? There are some minor issues but US isn't actively trying to screw employees. The different unions are trying to screw each other, but the company isn't forcing those actions.

Quoting N352SW (Reply 44):
One other thing, Delta employees and retirees I would say have loyalty and a sincere feeling for THEIR company. More than USAirways has ever had and more than likely ever will.

Obviously you don't know anyone who works for US. My wife has relatives in PIT that still speak highly of the company despite having to take an early retirement package.

Before you start ripping into others for not understanding, you really should look into some of the facts yourself. Then again, facts can be so inconvenient when all you're looking to do is bitch and moan.
 
db373
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RE: DL Employees To Stage Rally Against US Airways

Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:30 am

Quoting Silentbob (Reply 16):
While I don't have access to DL employee service info, I'm going to assume (because DL is a legacy) that their employees have more seniority than the average HP employees do. As such, they should fare much better in a merge than HP employees. If I am wrong, please correct me as I would like to know.

DL's employees do have more seniority than HP, which is exactly my point. DL is non-union, meaning the employees have no protection if this merger goes through. Because only the pilots are unionized, the other employees have no guarentee that they're going to be integrated fairly. Like I said, Doug's word on this issue means nothing because I don't think the current employees at US/HP would want to integrate AGAIN and drop in the seniority list AGAIN.

I'd be protesting too if I though there was a chance of me losing all my seniority.
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