juventus
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:29 pm

On SYD flights, SFO gains a bit on LAX.

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/061218/20061218005337.html?.v=1
 
adh214
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:56 am

According to the article, the flights arrive at SFO at 9:45AM and depart at 11:00PM. I wonder why Qantas does not switch the return to a day flight leaving SFO about noon.

I recently flew the day flight from LAX to SYD and thought it was much better than an overnight. We arrive in SYD in time to make it to a hotel and go to bed. The next morning (when those overnight flights are arriving) I wake up rested and ready to go.

This would also allow them to increase aircraft utilization.

BTW, I think Qantas has a great trans-Pacific product in coach. Thank you to for the FA's that make that long flight much more pleasant.

Andrew
 
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legacyins
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:24 am

Quoting Adh214 (Reply 1):
According to the article, the flights arrive at SFO at 9:45AM and depart at 11:00PM. I wonder why Qantas does not switch the return to a day flight leaving SFO about noon.

They are currently doing seasonal flights to Vancouver, BC. So the flight contiunes onto vancouver then returns to SFO in the evening.
 
wedgetail737
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:33 am

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 2):
They are currently doing seasonal flights to Vancouver, BC. So the flight contiunes onto vancouver then returns to SFO in the evening.

Flights to YVR end in January...then restart in May?
 
IAD380
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:59 am

QF only recently resumed flights to QF. I would not be surprised if QF upgraded it to daily service within a year or less. Will QF also offer flights throughout the year to YVR? As soon as QF takes delivery of the A-380s and other long haul aircraft, I expect that it will start flying nonstop to DFW or other cities in the central and eastern regions of the United States and Canada. Also does anyone know if there enough demand for QF to fly nonstop from SYD to JFK when it receives its new aircraft?
 
jacobin777
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:35 am

This is great to hear.....Hopefully QF starts daily services to SYD... checkmark 


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LAXintl
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:40 am

Quoting Adh214 (Reply 1):
I wonder why Qantas does not switch the return to a day flight leaving SFO about noon.

I recently flew the day flight from LAX to SYD and thought it was much better than an overnight. We arrive in SYD in time to make it to a hotel and go to bed. The next morning (when those overnight flights are arriving) I wake up rested and ready to go.

This would also allow them to increase aircraft utilization.

QF would be more than happy not to park aircraft all day long, however unlike yourself, the red-eyes are preferable for many. In addition the red-eyes offer much more connectivity on both the US and particularly SYD end.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
juventus
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:12 am

I read that SQ might go after SFO-SYD if they are turndown again for LAX-SYD in 2007. Maybe Qantas wants to discourage SQ?????
 
flydreamliner
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:18 am

I'm not sure about SQ on SYD-SFO, since Star Alliance partner UA is running 744s on this route - SFO being one of their hubs, and neither SYD nor SFO being SQ hubs, it's more or less UA's turf. My guess is that for SQ, it's SYD-LAX or nothing.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
 
juventus
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:37 am

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 8):
My guess is that for SQ, it's SYD-LAX or nothing.

Very good point. Hard to tell what will happen, one thing is for sure, in 2007 Singapore will try again.
 
Sydscott
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:03 am

Quoting Juventus (Reply 9):
Very good point. Hard to tell what will happen, one thing is for sure, in 2007 Singapore will try again.

With Virgin Blue's announcement that they will be establishing a long haul airline specifically to target the US routes, and their confirmation that they are currently sourcing aircraft for a 2008 start, SQ has between nil and no chance of getting into OZ-US Trans Pac now. Competition is already coming.  Smile


Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 5):
This is great to hear.....Hopefully QF starts daily services to SYD

So do I!!! The connections through SFO are much preferable to connecting in LAX.
 
anstar
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:08 am

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 10):
SQ has between nil and no chance of getting into OZ-US Trans Pac now. Competition is already coming

And aren;t Air Canada also due to start LAX-SYD sometime ine the next 2 years?
 
LAXintl
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:24 am

Quoting ANstar (Reply 11):
And aren;t Air Canada also due to start LAX-SYD sometime ine the next 2 years?

Indeed. Air Canada will be ready as soon as late Spring '07 pending approvals from Australian authorities.
As is AC has begun reshaping its LAX scheduled to provide a morning and evening mini-hub bank of flights that will connect its various Canadian destinations with the proposed SYD service.


"Air Canada to challenge Qantas on US-Australia services

Friday January 27, 2006

Air Canada intends to challenge Qantas between Los Angeles and Sydney next year, operating fifth freedom services as part of a daily Toronto-Sydney service that will commence during the first half of 2007 when its new 777-300ERs and dash 200LRs begin arriving.Air Canada said it will use authority contained in the recent open skies agreement between the US and Canada and will apply to Canadian and Australian authorities for permission to operate the route.

Air Canada flights will be timed to offer "convenient connection possibilities" from LAX to and from Montreal, Edmonton, Calgary and Vancouver as well as connections across the US via Star Alliance partners United Airlines and US Airways. AC already operates between the US and Australia on its Vancouver-Honolulu-Sydney service using existing route authorities.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
jacobin777
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:35 am

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 10):

So do I!!! The connections through SFO are much preferable to connecting in LAX.

 checkmark ...SFO is so much better than LAX.... yes 
"Up the Irons!"
 
QANTAS077
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:26 am

Quoting Adh214 (Reply 1):
According to the article, the flights arrive at SFO at 9:45AM and depart at 11:00PM. I wonder why Qantas does not switch the return to a day flight leaving SFO about noon.

because of the curfew in Sydney...flight arrives at 1020pm, curfew commences at 11pm, Qantas would end up with alot of pissed off passengers who've missed connections, mind you, they only have 1 flight to Melbourne between 10 & 11pm so it wouldn't work.
 
Gemuser
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:29 am

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 4):
As soon as QF takes delivery of the A-380s and other long haul aircraft, I expect that it will start flying nonstop to DFW or other cities in the central and eastern regions of the United States and Canada. Also does anyone know if there enough demand for QF to fly nonstop from SYD to JFK when it receives its new aircraft?

DFW as soon as it is technically & economially feasable, QF want that AA fortress hub working for them!

Anywhere else in the US is more problematic. JFK non-stop, I doubt. Loads seem to be fairly light LAX-JFK-LAX, with cargo supposedly making the flight profitable. If thats the case I would guess pax load would be insufficient to justify a non-stop, and cargo does not care if its non stop or not.

Anywhere else? Well SFO will go daily (i'd guess in 08) and I supect there will be movement in Canada, other than that I wouldn't think there would be much change in QFs US services. JQ is an entirely different question.

Gemuser
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flydreamliner
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:14 am

Look to the future

Star Alliance has some real strength - AC, New Zealand and UA running routes, OneWorld has Qantas dominating the US-OZ market. SkyTeam is missing. NW has been building up its ops out of LAX for some time now, as well as SEA. Once their 787s start arriving, I don't think it's at all out of the question to think they might try to open up an west coast to Sydney route, likewise DL has some 772LRs on the way that could certainly connect any number of their hubs or focus cities (again, a powerful LAX op for DL and a hub in SLC) to SYD. I expect one of them to give it a shot.

Qantas to DFW would be huge - it would put SYD within one connection of nearly everywhere in the US.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
 
jacobin777
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:06 pm

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 15):
DFW as soon as it is technically & economially feasable, QF want that AA fortress hub working for them!



Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 16):
Qantas to DFW would be huge - it would put SYD within one connection of nearly everywhere in the US.

Codesharing is one of AA's fasting growing revenues...

I think we'lll see SYD/MEL-DFW once QF gets their 787's...it will be perfectly suited for those routes...

Given how much QF-AA dominate SYD/MEL-LAX..it's going to be difficult for Skyteam to compete on the SYD-LAX route....I think Star Alliance would have a better shot with AC/UA-combo...
"Up the Irons!"
 
Sydscott
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:07 pm

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 12):
Indeed. Air Canada will be ready as soon as late Spring '07 pending approvals from Australian authorities.

Have they received government approval yet?? Just asking because I have been watching but haven't heard anything.

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 15):
DFW as soon as it is technically & economially feasable, QF want that AA fortress hub working for them!

Will one of the 787 derivatives have that sort of range??

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 15):
Anywhere else? Well SFO will go daily (i'd guess in 08) and I supect there will be movement in Canada, other than that I wouldn't think there would be much change in QFs US services. JQ is an entirely different question.

I'd have thought that SFO would be a priority to go daily 744 once the A380's free the aircraft up. If QF wanted to extend their LAX services elsewhere it would be interesting to see a Chicago vs Toronto calculation there somewhere. There were plans to fly to ORD that were shelved but I'm wondering if, like JFK, QF would extend the service there for presence and cargo purposes?? Or maybe they could kill two birds with one stone and extend a 744 service in to Ord via Hong Kong. I'll have to check the treaty to see if they can do that.  Smile That would solve a hole in AA's network and give a nice alternative to United.

As for JQ, I'd expect them to take over HNL completely when the 787's start arriving but other than that I'd have though services through to Rome, Athens and other destinations in Europe would be a priority over North America.
 
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RayChuang
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:11 pm

Quoting FlyDreamliner (Reply 16):
Qantas to DFW would be huge - it would put SYD within one connection of nearly everywhere in the US.

Given the range of the 787-9 (8,800 nautical miles still air range), QF could use the 787-9 (probably in a roomier two-class configuration) to fly between SYD and DFW nonstop.
 
LAXdude1023
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:17 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 13):
...SFO is so much better than LAX....

That depends on who you ask  Cool
It is what it is...
 
jacobin777
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:19 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 20):
That depends on who you ask  cool 

It's called "words of God"....don't blame me... Wink
"Up the Irons!"
 
bimmerkid19
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:41 pm

What are the outlooks on Qantas doing MSP-AKL-SYD or MSP-PPT-SYD. I have seen on many occasions in the Startribune, one of the two major papers in the MSP area, many advertisements in the Sunday Travel section that are by Qantas. That would be awesome to see the Kangaroo tail's at MSP, that'd be nice to have a second "red-tail" carrier in the MSP market  Wink
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
LAXintl
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:48 pm

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 18):
Have they received government approval yet??

No from what I gather the Australian's are dragging their feet and arguing about a technicality.

Apparently the Australia-Canada bilateral does not specifically mention Los Angeles as a stop over point for service between the countries. Off course, when the bilateral was written I doubt anyone envisioned AC would look to serve Australia directly with equipment that was capable of such long flights, instead using a hop and skip (Honolulu) routing via the US which is clearly less threatening then a nonstop flight to LA would be for an Australian carrier.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
bimmerkid19
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:51 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 22):

adding to that.... MSP-PPT is 4,838 nm and PPT-SYD is 3,308 nm, which I am sure is well within the reach of a Boeing B747-400ER, am I correct? *PPT it Papatee, Fiji



[Edited 2006-12-19 04:54:08]

[Edited 2006-12-19 04:55:46]

[Edited 2006-12-19 04:56:35]
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
copaair737
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:56 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 22):
What are the outlooks on Qantas doing MSP-AKL-SYD or MSP-PPT-SYD. I have seen on many occasions in the Startribune, one of the two major papers in the MSP area, many advertisements in the Sunday Travel section that are by Qantas

Not going to happen. Period.

-Copa
Livin' on Reds, Vitamin C, and Cocaine
 
777FlyGuy
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:57 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 22):
What are the outlooks on Qantas doing MSP-AKL-SYD or MSP-PPT-SYD.

I'm guessing this will start about the time JetBlue begins A380 service between LGB and OAK.  fever 
 
aussie747
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 22):
What are the outlooks on Qantas doing MSP-AKL-SYD or MSP-PPT-SYD. I have seen on many occasions in the Startribune, one of the two major papers in the MSP area, many advertisements in the Sunday Travel section that are by Qantas. That would be awesome to see the Kangaroo tail's at MSP, that'd be nice to have a second "red-tail" carrier in the MSP market

The market is too small, however MSP like a lot of cities would become more accessible say in about 2 1/2 years if QF decide to launch SYD - DFW and MEL - DFW then you could get one stop flights with their new 789's
 
bimmerkid19
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:59 pm

why? Because MSP needs diversity. We need more Foreign Airlines, MSP only has Air Canada Jazz, Icelandair, and seasonally KLM.

[Edited 2006-12-19 05:00:37]

[Edited 2006-12-19 05:01:49]
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
777FlyGuy
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:15 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 28):
why? Because MSP needs diversity. We need more Foreign Airlines

You are probably correct. However, as has been stated, Australia is pretty much a Oneworld destination, then Star Alliance. With MSP being Skyteam, and them having very little presence in that part of the world, it seems unlikely in the foreseeable future. But then again, it depends on who merges with who in the next few years. Maybe once the OneStarTeam Alliance is created, you'll get your wish  Smile
 
bimmerkid19
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:28 pm

Quoting 777FlyGuy (Reply 29):

I hope! I'll keep crossing my fingers, because I'd love to see jets arriving in MSP that say the spirit of australia on them. MSP needs diversity. I heard at one point that Lufthansa was in talks with Northwest to lease a gate at MSP. I heard this from my friend's dad who was in a high position at NWA on the ground handling side. He was one of the managers for a long time. His name is Dave Bates. He said that Lufty. had talked to NWA about a year ago wishing to seek rental of a gate in the G concourse within the next 3 years.
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
YULWinterSkies
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:50 pm

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 28):
why? Because MSP needs diversity. We need more Foreign Airlines, MSP only has Air Canada Jazz, Icelandair, and seasonally KLM.

I totally support that, especially as all are related to cold destinations! And Minnesota is a very cool place!
However, I wonder how many Aussies would trade their hot summer for a holiday in MSP winter!

Quoting Aussie747 (Reply 27):
The market is too small, however MSP like a lot of cities would become more accessible say in about 2 1/2 years if QF decide to launch SYD - DFW and MEL - DFW then you could get one stop flights with their new 789's

Is SYD-LAX-MSP not already doable with existing flights on QF/AA ? By combining QF / NW, in the wrong alliances, it certainly is, and checking in is likely a pain in the ***, but if really needed, it is possible.
When I doubt... go running!
 
SFORunner
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 4:06 pm

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 23):
Apparently the Australia-Canada bilateral does not specifically mention Los Angeles as a stop over point for service between the countries.

http://www.cta-otc.gc.ca/air-aerien/agreements/html/australia_e.html

CANADA
Points of Origin
Canada

Intermediate Points
San Francisco, Honolulu, Tahiti, Fiji, a point to be agreed

Points in Australia
Sydney. One other point in Australia to be named by Canada.

Any point or points specified above may be omitted on any or all services, but all services shall originate or terminate in Canada.

1. The additional point in Australia to be named by Canada and the additional point in Canada to be named by Australia shall be any point with an airport designated for international operations.

2. Points to be named by either Contracting Party may be changed on 6 months notice given to the other Contracting Party.
 
as739x
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 4:45 pm

BimmerKid19: Fail geography class?

PPT Its in French Polynesia

And MSP to SYD on QF is not going to happen.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
Gemuser
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 4:46 pm

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 18):
I'd have thought that SFO would be a priority to go daily 744 once the A380's free the aircraft up. If QF wanted to extend their LAX services elsewhere it would be interesting to see a Chicago vs Toronto calculation there somewhere. There were plans to fly to ORD that were shelved but I'm wondering if, like JFK, QF would extend the service there for presence and cargo purposes??

SYD/MEL-DFW would render most "tags" in the USA as redundent. After this the ONLY tags that MIGHT make sence are those to cities AA does not serve non-stop from DFW, LAX or SFO. Thats not a lot of cities I understand.

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 18):
Or maybe they could kill two birds with one stone and extend a 744 service in to Ord via Hong Kong. I'll have to check the treaty to see if they can do that.   That would solve a hole in AA's network and give a nice alternative to United.

That would certainly be within the Aust/USA bi-lateral. I do not know if would be within the Aust/Hong Kong bi-lateral.

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 18):
As for JQ, I'd expect them to take over HNL completely when the 787's start arriving but other than that I'd have though services through to Rome, Athens and other destinations in Europe would be a priority over North America.

Why? Unless QF establish a European or Middle Eastern hub I expect JQ to consentrate on the Pacific, Europe is just too far for the low cost model, requiring too many aircraft per frequency. I could see a HNL hub and even a HKG hub for JQ.

Quoting Sydscott (Reply 18):
Quoting Gemuser (Reply 15):DFW as soon as it is technically & economially feasable, QF want that AA fortress hub working for them!
Will one of the 787 derivatives have that sort of range??

Yes, so does the A380(although probabley not with 555pax, but undoubtly with more than a B787). The potential of the DFW hub is immense. I could see it needing A380s within a relatively short time span if it becomes the one stop shop for travel to Oz from EVERYWHERE east of the Rockies, that QF and AA hope for.

Gemuser
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HAWAIIAN932
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:04 pm

When I first started flying to Australia way back in 1979, QANTAS was the only game in town. I would be put on a National Airlines flight from LAX-SFO connecting to a 12 noon departure on QF that went SFO-HNL-SYD with an arrival in SYD around 9.00pm. That was the only choice you had. There was nothing directly out of LAX at the time.
 
Gemuser
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:32 pm

Quoting HAWAIIAN932 (Reply 35):
When I first started flying to Australia way back in 1979, QANTAS was the only game in town. I would be put on a National Airlines flight from LAX-SFO connecting to a 12 noon departure on QF that went SFO-HNL-SYD with an arrival in SYD around 9.00pm. That was the only choice you had. There was nothing directly out of LAX at the time.

Errr? PA 811/812 at that time was operating LAX-HNL-SYD, with B742s I think.

Gemuser
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aussie747
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:51 pm

I have just noticed on the new QF schedules, that these two new added services are at the expense of SYD-LAX losing two new services. So Adh214 you probably might be a bit dissapointed the two services to miss out will be the day time return service from LAX.
 
planetime
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:00 pm

As much I love LAX as an spotting airport SFO is much better airport for normal passengers to deal with.

Any new service for LAX for QF for the peak season?

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 5):
This is great to hear.....Hopefully QF starts daily services to SYD.

Hi Jacobin,
Hopefully soon we will see that. SFO is gaining some traction on LAX on S.Pacific flights.
 
jfk777
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:21 pm

About 15 years ago QF made the decision to concentrate at LAX and quit SFO. SFO was QF's first US destination back when 707 and Constellation flew. While LAX is bigger, SFO has a market and should have a 744 daily and soon an A380.
 
IAD380
Posts: 461
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 1:28 am

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 15):
JFK non-stop, I doubt. Loads seem to be fairly light LAX-JFK-LAX, with cargo supposedly making the flight profitable. If thats the case I would guess pax load would be insufficient to justify a non-stop, and cargo does not care if its non stop or not.

Would a nonstop SYD-JFK flight be profitable once QF takes delivery of its 787s? Currently, traffic is light on the LAX-JFK-LAX sectors because QF has no fifth freedom rights within the United States. Most passengers deplane in LAX, which is either their final destination, or transfer to domestic flights to other cities. If there was insufficient demand for direct flights to JFK, QF would have discontinued this route and transferred its passengers to New York on AA connecting flights in LAX. Perhaps, there are enough passengers to profitably operate SYD-JFK nonstop a few times a week on a 787.
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:34 am

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 39):
About 15 years ago QF made the decision to concentrate at LAX and quit SFO. SFO was QF's first US destination back when 707 and Constellation flew. While LAX is bigger, SFO has a market and should have a 744 daily and soon an A380.

I always found it odd, how QF just walked away from SFO. While we all agree the LA market is significantly larger than the Bay Area, QF had decades of service under its belt. I suspect UA's acquisition and running of Pan Am's Pacific network focused much on a SFO hub is something that played a part in the decision. I remember QF initially code shared with PSA for SFO connection pax following its pull out.
I also would not count on QF A380 service to SFO for a while. QF has stated its for plans for the type are on its LAX service followed by the Kangaroo route. SFO should look forward to a daily dedicated 744 first.

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 40):
Would a nonstop SYD-JFK flight be profitable once QF takes delivery of its 787s?

I'm not sure of the economics are quite there on such a super long haul.
Remember QF can operate LAX-JFK-LAX at relative low marginal cost utilizing and aircraft that would be sitting on the ground anyhow.

Operating a dedicated SYD-JFK service would mean the assignment of dedicated aircraft which could very well be operating other sectors producing more revenue (and potential profit) for QF than such an ultra long haul to JFK might.

Peoples comments are indeed right, that the JFK loads are not spectacular, and that is with feed from multiple QF LAX flights (AKL, SYD, MEL etc). So I'm not sure there is quite yet the demand either to fill a single JFK-SYD nonstop consistently.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
anstar
Posts: 2864
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Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:01 am

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 41):
Operating a dedicated SYD-JFK service would mean the assignment of dedicated aircraft which could very well be operating other sectors producing more revenue (and potential profit) for QF than such an ultra long haul to JFK might.

Given they already fly 5 x weekly (?) to JFK I can;t see how different it owuld be if they flew non stop. It would still utilise an aircraft for that whole period.)
 
Gemuser
Posts: 4295
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:07 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:17 am

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 41):
I always found it odd, how QF just walked away from SFO. While we all agree the LA market is significantly larger than the Bay Area, QF had decades of service under its belt.

Part of the reason is that QF could not get traffic rights at both SFO & LAX. I dont remember the exact sequence of events.

Quoting ANstar (Reply 42):
Quoting Laxintl (Reply 41):Operating a dedicated SYD-JFK service would mean the assignment of dedicated aircraft which could very well be operating other sectors producing more revenue (and potential profit) for QF than such an ultra long haul to JFK might.
Given they already fly 5 x weekly (?) to JFK I can;t see how different it owuld be if they flew non stop. It would still utilise an aircraft for that whole period.)

They don't really dedicate an aircraft to it, it's an aircraft that would otherwise be on the ground all day at LAX, in other words an aircraft thats already made its money Oz-LAX-Oz. Non stop would be dedicating an aircraft that would have to make all its money SYD-JFK-SYD, a different thing.

Also a non stop would basically only serve SYD-JFK, where as the current arrangement serves SYD, MEL, BNE & AKL one stop. None of the traffic from these would connect at SYD, BNE & AKL because it would be backtracking and MEL because they won't connect in SYD, they would rather connect in LAX!

So, all in all I think a JFK non stop is very problematic at this time.

Gemuser
DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 7:47 am

Quoting ANstar (Reply 42):
Given they already fly 5 x weekly (?) to JFK I can;t see how different it owuld be if they flew non stop. It would still utilise an aircraft for that whole period.)

As Gemuser has explained they are two quite different scenarios.

Currently QF managed to operate LAX-JFK-LAX with an aircraft that would otherwise be parked at LAX all day awaiting its evening return.
They are able to thus operate the service with no additional aircraft resources and with minimal cost except the direct operating cost associated with the JFK round trip, while revenues get channeled from the other QF connecting flights at LAX. Simply a cheap and efficient way for QF to serve JFK without a heavy financial burden while also maximizing JFK destined connections from other QF services at LAX.

Now on the other hand a dedicated SYD-JFK 787 service would require its own aircraft resources and would be solely dependent on SYD-JFK revenues to offset the total cost of supporting such a service.

Make sense?
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
airnewzealand
Posts: 2310
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2000 6:00 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:00 pm

QF107/108 does not get feed from QF25/26... the flight arrives too late...and departs too early.

Hope that helps.

Cheers
 
Sydscott
Posts: 3061
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:50 am

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:21 pm

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 34):
SYD/MEL-DFW would render most "tags" in the USA as redundent. After this the ONLY tags that MIGHT make sence are those to cities AA does not serve non-stop from DFW, LAX or SFO. Thats not a lot of cities I understand.

True although in a place like New York I'd imagine that Qantas would want to keep its own presence there.

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 34):
Why? Unless QF establish a European or Middle Eastern hub I expect JQ to consentrate on the Pacific, Europe is just too far for the low cost model, requiring too many aircraft per frequency. I could see a HNL hub and even a HKG hub for JQ.

Don't forget that QF have Jetstar Asia in Singapore and Allan Joyce said in Aus Aviation Magazine that he was actively looking at an asian hub that may not necessarily be Singapore. Jetstar also doesn't necessarily have to fly daily to a destination being primarily a leisure airline. We'll find out about the direction when the 2 new A332's join Jetstar next year but I think Athens and Rome come before the Pacific.

Quoting Planetime (Reply 38):
Hopefully soon we will see that. SFO is gaining some traction on LAX on S.Pacific flights

With United, then Air New Zealand, then Qantas adding flights to SFO from Australia and New Zealand connecting pax from down here will increasingly see SFO as a better place to connect than LAX. And LAX really doesn't need 3 daily flights to Sydney. I'd have thought 2 at the maximum would be sufficient once SFO goes daily and it looks like that is what QF is doing.
 
Australia1
Posts: 457
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:36 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:48 pm

Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 14):
because of the curfew in Sydney...flight arrives at 1020pm, curfew commences at 11pm, Qantas would end up with alot of pissed off passengers who've missed connections, mind you, they only have 1 flight to Melbourne between 10 & 11pm so it wouldn't work.

When arriving into SYD at 2220 you cannot connect to any other flight that night !!!
 
QANTAS077
Posts: 5169
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 5:08 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:13 pm

Quoting Australia1 (Reply 47):
When arriving into SYD at 2220 you cannot connect to any other flight that night !!!

no joke...read the last sentence of my post!
 zzz 
 
Australia1
Posts: 457
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:36 pm

Qantas Increases Flights To San Francisco

Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:17 am

Wish QF would look at operating BNE/SFO/YVR, esp. will AC coming online with SYD/LAX soon so they can they offer SYD/LAX/YVR & SYD/LAX/YYC etc. ( hopefully ) using same terminal at LAX.

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