CX747
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Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:54 am

What does the future hold for the 747 with Air New Zealand? I know that they ordered 777s, but is there any chance for a 747-8I order?
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:47 pm

People seem to think there is but word right from the CEO's mouth is NO. Air NZ has options on 40 odd 777's and 787's and I personally feel there will be an announcement of a 773's order to be delivered around 2014 sometime in the next 12 months. We might also see an order for more 787's soon as well.

But as for the 748's NZ will NOT get them.
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NZAA
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:52 pm

I have a feeling that NZ will keep the four that they own,
BTW in the recent Aviation News (a NZ publication), Robby said something about getting 777-300ERs.

So I doubt there will be a 747-8 order
Planes Piloted Tecnam P2002 JF, Cessna 172R, Cessna 152, Airbus A320
 
darenw
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting TG992 (Reply 1):
I personally feel there will be an announcement of a 773's order to be delivered around 2014 sometime in the next 12 months.

2014? I thought they would be taking delivery before then.
 
planemanofnz
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:22 pm

77W's will be good. Only downside is the loss of the 34" seat pitch. Between now and 2010 I see them starting a route to either South Africa or South America. Also, I see them on 1 of the LHR flights and also maybe half of the SFO flights.
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:35 pm

NZ are monitoring 21 possible destinations now. South Africa is one I beleive. Part of the deal to fly into PVG was to have rights to fly from PVG to one European city. I think NZ will use this soon.

"Ground TG992"

[Edited 2006-12-19 06:00:26]
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TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:21 pm

-
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:34 pm

Quoting TG992 (Reply 1):
I personally feel there will be an announcement of a 773's order to be delivered around 2014

How do you expect they will cover off the -400's that the leases run out on around 2010?
 
cchan
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:49 pm

I am waiting for the day they announce the purchase of 777-300ERs. Any idea when?
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 3:20 pm

Quoting Cchan (Reply 8):
I am waiting for the day they announce the purchase of 777-300ERs. Any idea when?

I expect it will be when they need to firm up the delivery slots that they already have. Probably 24 to 30 months before hand.
 
ZKNBX
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:06 pm

The game is changing all the time... LH have now launched the 748i and NZ have ordered 4 more 787-9; Despite their aforementioned options, perhaps they are waiting to see what happens with the 787-10 and the A350-1000 before any final decision on the 77W.
 
ZKSUJ
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:28 pm

I know they won't but still hopeful to see any 747 in NZ's fleet.
 
koruman
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:51 pm

One of the best things about the inspired decision to buy the 777-200ER when they did was that they could re-fleet at amazingly good prices.

We all know that the 777-300ER is the best long-haul high capacity option and that the 747-8 is too big. We also know that the 747-400s are so expensive fuel-wise that if they could be palmed off tomorrow on Virgin Atlantic (which they could be) and replaced with 777-300ERs (which they can't be) they would.

But the sort of brilliant decision-making which led to the 777 being bought even though the airline had just acquired A320s could actually work here.

Airbus has just had Emirates cancel its A340-600s, which have similar size and slightly less efficiency than the 777-300ER. Airbus subsidises new buyers for lost fuel efficiency versus the 777: wouldn't it be inspired an inspired piece of business if Air NZ replaced its 747-400s very soon with those aircraft at a knock-down price, then traded them in to Boeing after just a few years for the 787-10!

Sure, the 777-300ER is better than the A340-600. But it is much more expensive, and delivery slots are difficult to obtain. And the A340-600 is still a much, much more efficient aircraft than the 747-400 which is what it would actually replace.

Now I must get back to reality....
 
cchan
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:02 pm

Quoting Koruman (Reply 12):
Airbus has just had Emirates cancel its A340-600s, which have similar size and slightly less efficiency than the 777-300ER. Airbus subsidises new buyers for lost fuel efficiency versus the 777: wouldn't it be inspired an inspired piece of business if Air NZ replaced its 747-400s very soon with those aircraft at a knock-down price, then traded them in to Boeing after just a few years for the 787-10!

Sure, the 777-300ER is better than the A340-600. But it is much more expensive, and delivery slots are difficult to obtain. And the A340-600 is still a much, much more efficient aircraft than the 747-400 which is what it would actually replace.

Introducing a new type for just a few years could be more expensive than keeping the 744s though. There is an extra maintainance and training cost for a start...then the problem of selling them off (possibly a problem with the 748 too).
 
jfk777
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:10 pm

Air New Zealand has such a great deal for 787 & 777 with Boeing, Airbus would have to give away the planes for ANZ to but them. 773ER are the future for ANZ, two engines is the way they are headed. Service to Chile or Argentina would be fascinating too. I would love to see them fly to Buenos Aires.
 
zvezda
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:15 pm

In my opinion, NZ don't need anything larger than a B787. A hypothetical 600,000 lbs MTOW B787-9ER would be perfect for AKL-LHR nonstop (flown eastbound, of course).
 
bennett123
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 10:45 pm

What about the return trip.  Smile
 
zvezda
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:04 pm

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 16):
What about the return trip.

LHR-AKL is even easier than AKL-LHR. Both are easier to fly eastbound than westbound.
 
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Stitch
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:32 pm

Quoting Koruman (Reply 12):
Airbus has just had Emirates cancel its A340-600s, which have similar size and slightly less efficiency than the 777-300ER. Airbus subsidises new buyers for lost fuel efficiency versus the 777: wouldn't it be inspired an inspired piece of business if Air NZ replaced its 747-400s very soon with those aircraft at a knock-down price, then traded them in to Boeing after just a few years for the 787-10!

My guess is that the 744's CASM is better then the A346's, so NZ is better off flying the 744.

NZ just doubled their 787 order (to eight), so looks like they are content to order Boeing without extra incentives.  Smile
 
zvezda
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:56 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 18):
My guess is that the 744's CASM is better then the A346's

Correct.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 18):
so NZ is better off flying the 744.

Not necessarily. The A340-600 offers higher RASM than the B747-400. On some routes the A340 will be more profitable and on some routes the JumboJet will be more profitable.
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 1:56 am

Quoting TG992 (Reply 1):
I personally feel there will be an announcement of a 773's order to be delivered around 2014 sometime in the next 12 months

Quoting Geoffrey Thomas from another list; he is expecting it in the next 6-months or so .
I believe if they order in that time frame it is for delivery to start when the leases run out on the -400's. Assuming 15-year leases, two of these will run out in 2009 /2010. At that time three of the four owned frames will be about 20-years old.
A recent quote attributed to Fyfe suggests that deliveries would start ahead of 2014. I believe he was saying that deliveries would be completed by 2014 not start in 2014.
 
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United787
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:26 am

I am surprised that no one has mentioned ETOPS. Although I know they don't fly to CPT, EZE, SCL, and JNB now, if they ever wanted to do these in the future, they would need a four engine plane although the range could easily be reached with the 772ER, 773ER, 788, or 789.

AKL - CPT 6356 nm
AKL - EZE 5580 nm
AKL - SCL 5223 nm
AKL - JNB 6583 nm
 
zvezda
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:41 am

Quoting United787 (Reply 21):
I am surprised that no one has mentioned ETOPS. Although I know they don't fly to CPT, EZE, SCL, and JNB now, if they ever wanted to do these in the future, they would need a four engine plane although the range could easily be reached with the 772ER, 773ER, 788, or 789.

ETOPS330 may be available soon. Also LROPS will place similar restrictions on quads that ETOPS places on twins.
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:42 am

Quoting United787 (Reply 21):
I am surprised that no one has mentioned ETOPS.

I have to assume you missed the most recent thread on this topic .See RE: Etops 330 Close To Approval? (by OldAeroGuy Dec 10 2006 in Civil Aviation)?searchid=3140644&s=ETOPS#ID3140644

Operation of quads on these routes will present bigger problems than the operation of modern twins if the standards governing their use are adopted. Of course that will be up to each country to decide.
 
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United787
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:53 am

Thank you for the link to the new ETOPS discussion, interesting...

To Quote Ikramerica from that discussion, it seems as though his discussion of QF and SAA would apply towards NZ...

"ETOPS 330 really only matters for certain routes in the Southern Hemisphere. For QF, which has committed to the 787, relaxed ETOPS is very important, though they can still cover all those routes with current quads and future quads. Rather than dump their newest 744s, QF can use those on ETOPS 207+ routes along with some A380s. The rest of their route system could function with the 787 even with current ETOPS rules.

But it does explain why SAA remains committed to the A340 and 747. It just makes their life easier. The new non-twin ETOPS rules will cause SAA some added concern. Wonder if they are fighting them??"
 
trex8
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:04 am

Quoting Koruman (Reply 12):
Airbus subsidises new buyers for lost fuel efficiency versus the 777:

there was talk they would do that but does anyone know if they actually have or will.RR has also been said to have "guaranteed" that mx costs for the A345/6 will be no higher than a twin, that could well be given most airlines are buying mx packages and essentially pay by the hour
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:29 am

Quoting United787 (Reply 24):
But it does explain why SAA remains committed to the A340 and 747. It just makes their life easier. The new non-twin ETOPS rules will cause SAA some added concern. Wonder if they are fighting them??"

Not picking on SAA, but ETOPS calls for pretty stringent maintenance standards
which some carriers might have trouble meeting and certainly some have had trouble maintaining. The same will apply to LROPS , I would expect.
 
jafa39
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:29 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 15):
AKL-LHR nonstop

With 32" of legroom?.......no way! I'd rather walk!!!  Smile
We, the undersigned, do hereby consent.....
 
zvezda
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:41 am

Quoting Jafa39 (Reply 27):
With 32" of legroom?.......no way! I'd rather walk!!!

An SKL-LHR configuration wouldn't have 32" pitch. It would probably have 35 to 38 inch pitch in Y. One reason is payload/range performance. Another is that they wouldn't be selling cheap fares on the nonstop.
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:26 am

Quoting NZAA (Reply 2):
I have a feeling that NZ will keep the four that they own,

But three of these are the oldest in the fleet. By about 2010 they will be 20-years old.
 
cchan
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:59 pm

Quoting SunriseValley (Reply 29):
But three of these are the oldest in the fleet. By about 2010 they will be 20-years old.

All the 744 flights NZ is operating can be operated by 772s. It is just that the planes will be fuller and the waitlist will be longer. I guess, they can use 772 in the interim before the 773s arrive, and get rid of the 744s.
 
RichardJF
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Wed Dec 20, 2006 7:56 pm

Highly leveraged QF you can expect rock bottom fares on LHR. Fyfe should be protecting NZ from what all these airline people think. Macquarie is putting their 15% of QF (other peoples money not theirs) in an unlisted fund????. I read somewhere that they would make 4-500m out of the deal (thats not the investment but the profit!). QF the business is in a disasterous no win situation .... If the Oz government (FIRB) blocked the deal the share price of course drops and then come all the questions for pg..... and then the share price really drops. QF won't have a listing but Allco will.

Quoting Koruman (Reply 12):
Airbus has just had Emirates cancel its A340-600s, which have similar size and slightly less efficiency than the 777-300ER. Airbus subsidises new buyers for lost fuel efficiency versus the 777: wouldn't it be inspired an inspired piece of business if Air NZ replaced its 747-400s very soon with those aircraft at a knock-down price, then traded them in to Boeing after just a few years for the 787-10!
Sure, the 777-300ER is better than the A340-600. But it is much more expensive, and delivery slots are difficult to obtain. And the A340-600 is still a much, much more efficient aircraft than the 747-400 which is what it would actually replace.

Good idea!.
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:06 am

Koruman,

I might just make your day but you might just see the 744 back on NZ1/2 at some point soon.
-
 
CX747
Topic Author
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:18 am

Why would they move the 747 back onto NZ1/2?
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:20 am

Quoting CX747 (Reply 33):
Why would they move the 747 back onto NZ1/2?

I believe the demand for business class on LAX-LHR outstrips the supply at the moment with the 777 - some good high value revenue is being missed out on
 
koruman
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Thu Dec 21, 2006 6:42 am

Thanks TG992.

I must emphasise that while I strongly criticise decisions which I think are wrong (or just plain disagree with!) I have exceptional loyalty to Air NZ's product, and I'd like to wish all the staff a Merry Christmas.
 
jafa39
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Thu Dec 21, 2006 12:42 pm

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 28):
An SKL-LHR configuration wouldn't have 32" pitch. It would probably have 35 to 38 inch pitch in Y. One reason is payload/range performance. Another is that they wouldn't be selling cheap fares on the nonstop.

Ah, now that makes perfect sense, thanks!
We, the undersigned, do hereby consent.....
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:44 am

Quoting Koruman (Reply 35):
Thanks TG992.

I must emphasise that while I strongly criticise decisions which I think are wrong (or just plain disagree with!) I have exceptional loyalty to Air NZ's product, and I'd like to wish all the staff a Merry Christmas.

It's in the schedules now
20AUG 26AUG MTWTFSS
REFER TO DAILY SCHED DISPLAY FOR OPERATING CARRIER INFORMATION
1 NZ 002 2145 1100*1 1234567 AKLLHR 3 CUY 744 1
2 NZ 039 2330 1435*1 1234567 I AKLLHR 3 CUY 744 1

And we wish you a safe and Merry Christmas as well Koruman. I look forward to more debates in the new year  

Ground TG992

[Edited 2006-12-21 18:45:58]
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darenw
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 1:09 pm

Quoting TG992 (Reply 32):
I might just make your day but you might just see the 744 back on NZ1/2 at some point soon.

But only until the end of October 2007. I see the 772 is back on that route from November 07. I think the 744 is just on for those 3 months to cover the 2007 Rugby World Cup.
 
StarGoldLHR
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:41 pm

Overall I'm not impressed by Air NZ. Given their HKG - LHR flies half full I dont think many others do either.
So far in 2008 45 flights and Gold already. JFK, IAD, LGA, SIN, HKG, NRT, AKL, PPT, LAX still to book ! Home Airport LCY
 
v2fix
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:55 pm

Quoting TG992 (Reply 37):
It's in the schedules now
20AUG 26AUG MTWTFSS
REFER TO DAILY SCHED DISPLAY FOR OPERATING CARRIER INFORMATION
1 NZ 002 2145 1100*1 1234567 AKLLHR 3 CUY 744 1
2 NZ 039 2330 1435*1 1234567 I AKLLHR 3 CUY 744 1

So - a chance to get a picture of two Korus side by side at Heathrow. Although in the last month I have been through LHR NZ1/2 and NX 38/39 have been at opposite ends of the Terminal 3.

Perhaps Air NZ could arrange a phot opportunity !!
742; 744; DC10, DC3, 321, 320, 319, 170,190, 772, 773,333, 346, 343
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:21 pm

Quoting StarGoldLHR (Reply 39):
Overall I'm not impressed by Air NZ. Given their HKG - LHR flies half full I dont think many others do either

It's been slow yes. somethinh to look at but it's growing!!

Like Koruman said, I would like to see a flight via BNE to HKG to connect.
-
 
koruman
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:54 pm

I'm glad that NZ1 will have a few months as a 747 again, and I hope that the experiment is extended.

I've now got 2 different trips on NZ38/39 booked, because it's so much easier to get availability in the right sub-class.

I still don't really see why, when distances and fuel costs are basically identical, the airline didn't make the new AKL-HKG-LHR flight the 777 and the established, succesful AKL-LAX-LHR into a 747 flight.

Mind you, I am unfortunately very close to having to give up flying Air NZ entirely. As anyone sad enough to follow my rantings knows, I like to stop off at Tahiti between AKL and LAX wherever possible. I had assumed that the new NZ-coded, TN-operated codeshare flights LAX-PPT would either

1) be Air Calin-style codeshares, in which Airpoints are earned at the NZ-operated rate, or
2) earn points at the partner airline rate, which applies either to flights on other Star Alliance carriers or on NZ-coded flights operated by other airlines.

But, to my horror, the new Koru Review says that TN-operated flights which carry the NZ-code won't earn Airpoints at all.

Which means my typical Australia-LAX Business Class return fare for $8000 will only
1) earn the short-haul Airpoints granted for an Australia-NZ flight, and
2) even those points for the Australia-NZ sector will be awarded only at the lower partner earning rate because some of the flights on my NZ ticket weren't operated by Air NZ.

In Australia you need to earn 1215 Airpoints per year to stay Gold Elite, 720 of which must be earned on NZ-operated flights.

Australia-LAX on an Air NZ-issued Business Class return flight will now earn:
1) Australia-LAX, no stopovers = 550 Airpoints
2) Australia-LAX, stopovers at APW or NAN or RAR = 550 Airpoints
3) Australia-LAX, PPT stopover in 1 direction = 295 Airpoints
4) Australia-LAX, PPT stopover both ways = 70 Airpoints
5) Australia-LAX, no stops, cheapest discount economy = 150 Airpoints

This is just unbelievable. I can buy an $8000 return Business Class ticket to Los Angeles from Air NZ, with every sector carrying an Air NZ flight number, and earn fewer than half as many Airpoints as I would on a $1300 discount economy ticket.

Even when LAX-PPT changed to a codeshare I intended to remain an Air NZ customer. But whereas I could previously requalify Gold Elite with 2.5 Business Class return trips to LAX, the new no-points-thru-Papeete rule means that I will need to fly 18 return Business Class trips to requalify, at a cost of $150,000 per year instead of $20,000 per year.

So my loyalty to Air NZ is under renewed pressure really.
 
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NZ107
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:53 pm

Quoting Koruman (Reply 42):
But, to my horror, the new Koru Review says that TN-operated flights which carry the NZ-code won't earn Airpoints at all.



Quoting Koruman (Reply 42):
This is just unbelievable. I can buy an $8000 return Business Class ticket to Los Angeles from Air NZ, with every sector carrying an Air NZ flight number, and earn fewer than half as many Airpoints as I would on a $1300 discount economy ticket.

Horror to my ears as well.. Does QF offer airpoints on TN codeshares?
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sat Dec 23, 2006 9:25 am

Quoting Kiwiandrew (Reply 34):
I believe the demand for business class on LAX-LHR outstrips the supply at the moment with the 777 - some good high value revenue is being missed out on

There would have to be a significant short fall in premium capacity on the LAX/LHR/LAX sector to make it worth while to put the -400 back on. Ten or a dozen seats is not going to pay the incremental fuel bill of the -400 in my view.
The AC seating arrangement in another thread makes a lot of sense to me. NZ has too many Y seats which if they are to get close to filling, dooms them to pretty low yields in my view.
 
koruman
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sat Dec 23, 2006 1:23 pm

Yes unfortunately TN flights with QF codes earn Qantas points but TN flights with NZ codes earn no points with anyone.

I wrote to Air NZ to ask whether it was a mistake, and if so that they could confirm that they just meant that TN-operated NZ-coded flights just can't be used to redeem rather than earn points.

But they haven't confirmed any such thing, so I'm going to have to cancel those 2007 flights unless they change this daft rule.

I HATE Qantas, but I think that Air NZ has just managed to transfer my custom to them.
 
RichardJF
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sat Dec 30, 2006 8:54 pm

The fuel efficiency or lack of it with the 744 shouldn't be overly worried about. Situation with EK on AKL-LAX-DXB is what I thought. Danger of AKL-EZE-DXB, AKL-MEX-DXB(772LR)....etc. QF probably feigning withdrawl. WLG is the salvation not the problem. Supercharged longhaul business case at WLG. AKL-KIX etc not much good because AIAL makes the money not NZ.
WLG is superb because you can create the entire tourism system making all the money and getting the flights underwritten from wcc. Have 1 772 operated by a Wellington based freedom crew with pilots paid less than AKL based crews
KIX-WLG, PVG, NRT etc is gold mine for Wellington because we don't have the hotels (they must be built). So what a KIX-WLG-NAN-KIX means is an instant hotel building boom because the occupancy rates go through the roof. property value's of the cbd would go up just from 1 daily flight. By providing a Wellington based holiday over 4-5 days with day trips to the South Island you could likely generate up to 1000 new hotel rooms. NZ could simply move the tourist industry around to a scenario where NZ and Infratil were making all the money and NZ's asia flights were all subsidised to the tune of millions by a booming Wellington.
 
nzrich
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:45 pm

Hopefully the airpoints situation with NZ codeshare on TN flights will be solved before mar when nz pulls out of PPT - LAX.. Im sure there will be airpoints available on those flights.. Probably just not signed of yet at airpoints hopefully...Otherwise it would be farcical that you could buy a NZ ticket on TN but get no airpoints..
"Pride of the pacific"
 
TG992
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sun Dec 31, 2006 2:32 am

Quoting Koruman (Reply 42):
I still don't really see why, when distances and fuel costs are basically identical, the airline didn't make the new AKL-HKG-LHR flight the 777 and the established, succesful AKL-LAX-LHR into a 747 flight.

It can not be a 777, due to the mountains below. If there was engine failure they would be buggered so that's why they use the 744 not the 772. This will not change.

Quoting Koruman (Reply 42):
Mind you, I am unfortunately very close to having to give up flying Air NZ entirely. As anyone sad enough to follow my rantings knows, I like to stop off at Tahiti between AKL and LAX wherever possible. I had assumed that the new NZ-coded, TN-operated codeshare flights LAX-PPT would either

1) be Air Calin-style codeshares, in which Airpoints are earned at the NZ-operated rate, or
2) earn points at the partner airline rate, which applies either to flights on other Star Alliance carriers or on NZ-coded flights operated by other airlines.

Hmmm interesting, I understand it's going to be Air Share so the same as Air Calin.
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RE: Air New Zealand And The 747's Future.

Sun Dec 31, 2006 8:22 am

Quoting RichardJF (Reply 46):
is gold mine for Wellington because we don't have the hotels (they must be built).

Wellington does have a good amount of hotels. There is a new hotel about to start construction on the waterfront. This is either a 4 star or a 5 star. A hotel overlooking Orential Parade has recently finished a multi-million dollar re-build, with about 100 new rooms also. A new hotel is being built close to me in Porirua City, opposite one of Wellingtons best shopping centres with a 5 minute walk to the bus/train inter-station. Not all of the tourists are after hotels, others are budget travellers after motels and back-packers. Over building hotels/motels/back-packers etc isnt good for the local economy because it forces the business to fight over guests which means lower prices (which in tuen is good for customers) but its bad for the business and will force businesses out of business.
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