FlyEmirates
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Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:08 pm

Heard these rumours from a trustworthy source, NCL is pretty much confirmed and VCE confirmed although it would appear not to be selling to the public as yet. The indirect GRU would be a surprise as I would have thought EK would have gone for a direct GRU on the 777LR however a stop via BCN has been researched and appears favourable, 77W cattleship would be the likely choice.
 
DJ748
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:44 pm

And what is this about ADL via MEL or PER?

Quoting FlyEmirates (Thread starter):
Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Your subject mentions it but there is nothing in the posting. More information please......

EK to ADL would be very interesting, but it would undoubtedly have to be 8th and 9th freedom (as mentioned would go via PER or MEL) as they are already maxed out at their limit of 49 flights per week into Australia from DXB. My best guess would that it would go via PER as are already 20 return flights per day each weekday between ADL and MEL.
 
RCS763AV
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:09 pm

Quoting FlyEmirates (Thread starter):
The indirect GRU would be a surprise as I would have thought EK would have gone for a direct GRU on the 777LR however a stop via BCN has been researched and appears favourable, 77W cattleship would be the likely choice.

I thought they would fly non-stop.... confused 

Wouldn´t it make more sense via Africa???
 
EurostarVA
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:17 pm

A rumor is a rumor. I do know that this flight had BETTER be nonstop otherwise its appeal will be diminished. What's the point of starting the first direct flight from the Middle East to South America if the flight will be routed via Europe?? This is what passengers want to avoid from the first place, passengers like myself. I have been waiting for this service for a long time, and I won't fly EK if the flight passes through Europe (a detour anyways).
If there is a will, there is a way
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:48 pm

Quoting FlyEmirates (Thread starter):
The indirect GRU would be a surprise as I would have thought EK would have gone for a direct GRU on the 777LR however a stop via BCN has been researched and appears favourable, 77W cattleship would be the likely choice.

If become real will be a big surprise, but also could be a very smart decision to know better the size of the market. Also it will be the only available BCN-Brazil service.

Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
Neo
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Thu Dec 21, 2006 11:53 pm

Quoting FlyEmirates (Thread starter):
The indirect GRU would be a surprise as I would have thought EK would have gone for a direct GRU on the 777LR however a stop via BCN has been researched and appears favourable, 77W cattleship would be the likely choice.

What!!!??? There is zero chance of EK being sucessful in that route if not non-stop!!!!! Considering the majority of the traffic would be connecting pax, I doubt they would be willing to go to Middle East & Asia with 2 stops on the way, when they could easily go 1 stop through Europe. And routing the flight via BCN would be another big mistake!!!!

EK has one chance: Non-stop flight with whatever aicraft they choose! THat's it!!

I think this is a very lousy rumor!!!!
 
AF022
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 1:34 am

They probably don't see it working without a big plane like the 77W, and the 77W cannot make it without a stop. They'll never get 5th freedom rights at anypoint in Africa, so it has got to be via Europe.
 
PZ707
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:10 am

Don´t hurry for conclusions, try to get a single seat nowadays from Brazil or Argentina to Spain !!! I think EK flight GRU-BCN will do more than well. With Air Madrid out, and assuming that EK will not charge too much for Europe/Brazil, expect full or close to full flights. People form South America are flying with the lowest fares they can get, one thing is the bussines traffic but something totally different is the emigrants/inmigrants familys travelling all year round. With a good marketing campaing they can catch this market and later try to start a nonstop.
 
skyteam2000
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:09 am

EK to GRU via BCN perfect choice.
DXB - BCN - DXB will work for sure.
BCN - GRU - BCN will work.
DXB - GRU - DXB can be good choice to enter in Souht America.

Spain is good choice to stop before arrive in S. America. Air China just open PEK-MAD-GRU and is working very well.
 
EddieDude
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:16 am

Quoting AF022 (Reply 6):
They'll never get 5th freedom rights at anypoint in Africa, so it has got to be via Europe.

Can you please tell us more about this? If I am not mistaken, ME used to fly to GRU via ABJ with fifth freedom rights. Are the corresponding bilaterals very restrictive?

Quoting PZ707 (Reply 7):
try to get a single seat nowadays from Brazil or Argentina to Spain !!!

You have a very good point. With RG still recovering from its near demise and JJ expanding slowly, someone else could attempt GRU-Europe (specifically Spain) with a high degree of certainty for success. And your comment about cheap fares is also very true... one of the reasons why the NM debacle has been so painful to Latin Americans is that it mainly catered to VFR and ethnic travelers, who cannot spend more than 800EUR for a nonstop flight.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
cyba
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:23 am

Generally I don't like rumours but it's Christmas so I'll join in the fun!

Quoting FlyEmirates (Thread starter):
however a stop via BCN has been researched and appears favourable

So that would make BCN a new destination for EK. And ahead of MAD for that! This would be a surprise for me.

Quoting Neo (Reply 5):
Considering the majority of the traffic would be connecting pax, I doubt they would be willing to go to Middle East & Asia with 2 stops on the way, when they could easily go 1 stop through Europe

I don't think this is likely to have as much impact as you suggest for the following reasons:

(1) On a trip that long the additional time of the extra stop and distance will not increase the overall journey time by a huge percentage.

(2) There is a huge advantage of efficient connections in DXB. For instance someone wanting to fly GRU-BKK would likely have to land somewhere in Europe in the morning and wait quite a few hours until the evening when most flights to BKK leave. That would probably result in a journey time longer than EK via BCN and DXB.

(3) Fares: EK can compete quite well on price especially vs European airlines. And fares between Brazil and Europe are anyway quite high already so plenty of room for EK to undercut.
 
varig md-11
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/P

Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:22 am

Quoting Skyteam2000 (Reply 8):
EK to GRU via BCN perfect choice.
DXB - BCN - DXB will work for sure.
BCN - GRU - BCN will work.
DXB - GRU - DXB can be good choice to enter in Souht America.

Spain is good choice to stop before arrive in S. America. Air China just open PEK-MAD-GRU and is working very well.

I agree with Skyteam2000 fully

it has not to be seen necessarily as THE flight from DXB to South America, but more as a flight to break the knees of IB and replace Air Madrid on route BCN-GRU-BCN

DXB-BCN-DXB can work fine either with BCN flying to asia with all possible transfers @DXB
AF TW AA NW DL UA CO BA U2 TP UX LH SK AZ MP KL SN VY HV LS SS TK SQ PC RG IW SE LI TN
 
Neo
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:11 am

Quoting Skyteam2000 (Reply 8):
EK to GRU via BCN perfect choice.
DXB - BCN - DXB will work for sure.
BCN - GRU - BCN will work.
DXB - GRU - DXB can be good choice to enter in Souht America.

Spain is good choice to stop before arrive in S. America. Air China just open PEK-MAD-GRU and is working very well.

TBH I don't think it will work!!! First, EK always pointed DXB-South America flights to be a new option for passengers to go to Asia, Middle East & Australia.

Brazil_BCN market is very low yielding! They probably will be able to fill the back of the planes, but premium pax won't be in the same level!! Specially in a big 77W.

Besides, BRAZIL-Spain Market is just around the corner of over capacity!!

Why would they have problems using the 777LR's to GRU?? To me it seems to be the perfect seating capacity!!
 
skyteam2000
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:03 am

Neo

Why would they have problems using the 777LR's to GRU?? To me it seems to be the perfect seating capacity!!

Of course I agree. But as a first test and just to check how is the market BCN stop I think is the best option.

Brazil_BCN market is very low yielding! They probably will be able to fill the back of the planes, but premium pax won't be in the same level!! Specially in a big 77W.

It will be good market. For sure.
 
skyteam2000
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:17 am

2 Step.

DXB-GRU-DXB with 77W
DXB-BCN-DXB

That is clever.
 
6thfreedom
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:07 pm

Quoting Cyba (Reply 10):
So that would make BCN a new destination for EK. And ahead of MAD for that! This would be a surprise for me.

Interesting comment...
because SQ just launched SIN-MXP-BCN, and by all accounts this service is going very well, AND is being upgraded to the new B773ER.

So not really a surprise after all...
 
AF022
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:27 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 9):
Can you please tell us more about this? If I am not mistaken, ME used to fly to GRU via ABJ with fifth freedom rights. Are the corresponding bilaterals very restrictive?

My mistake. Perhaps the Ivoirians are more open minded, and perhaps the Ghanaians also. But the options are limited.
 
planemanofnz
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:58 pm

I don't understand.

Australia.
They don't have the rights to fly any more services at the moment to Australia. Where will they get ADL flights from? I don't know what the policy of the Australian government is when it comes to EK continuing one of their Australian services but all I know is that when EK tried to start DXB-PER-AKL this year, Canberra said no and now the route seems like it won't go ahead in the near future. Also, if ADL was to be served wouldn't it be via somewhere like SIN, BKK, CGK or DPS? Not PER! After all, EK is all about fifth freedom traffic. Their trans tasman ops reflect this.

Spain.
Why BCN? I would have thought that MAD would have posed a much better opportunity for EK? In fact it seizes to amaze me that EK hasn't even gone to Spain yet! SQ just launched BCN and I don't know whether there will be enough room for another carrier to come in and play the rigorous competitor. Remember, BCN works for SQ because they have the connections available to them through Star Alliance partner JK of whom is based in BCN. TG is the same with MAD. Nonetheless this route is more than welcomed by me.

Brazil.
Non stop - yes. One stop - no. I thought the majority of EK's potential pax on the Brazil routes would be pax transferring in Dubai onwards to Asia? This completely defeats that purpose. QR will be going non stop (I think) so who will want to take a big detour via Spain to fly on an airline which isn't even 5 star? In fact, I would be very happy if someone could tell me how long a non stop flight would take and how long the one stop flight will take. It will be an interesting comparison. Oh, and one more thing, wouldn't a 345 work better with this route or even a 772? A 77W might be a bit of an overkill to start off with, don't you think?
 
6thfreedom
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 1:47 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 17):
They don't have the rights to fly any more services at the moment to Australia. Where will they get ADL flights from? I don't know what the policy of the Australian government is when it comes to EK continuing one of their Australian services

EK could launch direct flight into ADL without a problem, as the 49 flight per week cap applies to MEL,PER,SYD, BNE only.

Perhaps with talks coming up in March, EK's strategy is to ask for additional rights, and will offer to launch ADL flights via another Australian city until such time that ADL can stanbd up on a daily basis on it's own.

Don't forget that SQ and QF serve SIN (10pw), MH serves KUL (4pw), and that both SQ and MH cover both Europe and Asia quite adequately. CX also has 4pw via MEL outbound.

Smart move if EK's strategy is to combine ADL with another city on the proviso that it receives greater access..
 
Malc
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:24 pm

Very interesting in that earlier this year EK said that ADL was 2 years off being serviced by them.
For interest ANZ used a 772 on their flight from AKL today to cope with the numbers of pax instead of the usual 320.
 
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SQ773
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:09 pm

Quoting Skyteam2000 (Reply 13):
Brazil_BCN market is very low yielding! They probably will be able to fill the back of the planes, but premium pax won't be in the same level!! Specially in a big 77W.

In fact the traffic Spain - Brazil is all but low yielding. On the contrary, the tickets are not cheap at all, specially now that RG is gone . I am not sure ik EK can fill up half the plane from BCN...Hope they will, although I would rather see TAM or IB doing that route.

Cargo wise it would be very succesfull, as the capacity to Brazil is always very limited in terms of cargo ( thus becoming high yield cargo ) don´t forget EK is flying to BCN with its own freighter service .
 
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Ryan h
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:25 pm

As I live in Adelaide I would love see Emirates fly here on a regular basis, but I doubt we would have enough passengers to keep their aircraft filled, unless they went via another city.
South Australian Spotter www.ryanhothersall.net
 
LIPZ
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:56 pm

http://www.emirates.com/EKSchedule/flightschedules.asp

Look at this link above, EK has loaded up in their timetable Venice (confirmed), Newcastle, Houston, Sao Paulo but nothing about Barcelona or other new stopover cities for the route to Brazil. Nothing as well for the rumored YYZ, but maybe it's too early. Anyway I guess EK is going to announce NCL, IAH and GRU in the following days or weeks.
 
Emirates Skies
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:28 pm

Here in Dubai, I've heard rumours about Emirates starting nonstop flights from Dubai to Sao Paolo (Brazil) and to Spain (initially Barcelona was mentioned, then Madrid, and lately, Barcelona was mentioned once again as being the preferred point), but Emirates on the Dubai-Barcelona-Sao Paolo run is completely new to me. I will definitely ask around about it though!
Take nothing but photos, leave nothing but footprints
 
RAFVC10
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:11 pm

Quoting Neo (Reply 5):
And routing the flight via BCN would be another big mistake!!!!

Hi Neo,

Why you think BCN will be a mistake? There are enough market here in Barcelona to add a new flight with a great airline to Brazil.

You don't know how many people need to fly to Dubai or to Sao Paulo without the mandatory IB flights via Madrid.

Thanks God to have another great airline in a near future landing here.

Regards,

Gerard
El dia que los gilipollas vuelen, no podremos ver la luz del sol!
 
dz09
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sat Dec 23, 2006 1:21 am

I think BCN is a good choice. It gives US travellers to DXB via europe an extra choice. I just hope that more EK flights from Europe to DXB become code share flights with CO. Currently, only EK flights out of LGW are codeshare flights with CO. For business travelers who care about elite miles, this can make a big difference.
 
planemanofnz
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sat Dec 23, 2006 8:52 am

Didn't IB once fly to Dubai?
 
jacobin777
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sat Dec 23, 2006 9:54 am

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 22):
Nothing as well for the rumored YYZ, but maybe it's too early.

Given that EK would only have 3x/weekly flights...they had the opportunity at 3x/weekly going up to 6x/weekly, but insisted on a daily and they were told to "go take a walk"...

With EY flying 3x/weekly to YYZ, I'm not so sure if EK are going to persue other destinations first..such as LAX, ORD, etc..

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 22):
Look at this link above, EK has loaded up in their timetable Venice (confirmed), Newcastle, Houston, Sao Paulo but nothing about Barcelona or other new stopover cities for the route to Brazil.

HOU is still a CO-based codeshare flight.....
"Up the Irons!"
 
skyteam2000
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sun Dec 24, 2006 4:27 am

IBERIA never got a MAD-DXB. There are only looking to S.America and Europe that is sad but...
 
SAOAP
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sun Dec 24, 2006 5:19 am

I know for a fact that we'll be seeing EK in GRU as of Oct. 2007... Still, from what I've been told this would be a direct flight: DXB-GRU-DXB. Which makes sense as the main aim is to get the traffic to/from Asia and the Middle East. According to the last update , the flight would initially be 6/7 and operated by 772.

Cheers!
"When it's dark enough, you can see the stars" - Charles A. Beard
 
stirling
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RE: Rumour EK To Start GRU Via BCN + ADL Via MEL/PER

Sun Dec 24, 2006 5:47 am

Quoting Cyba (Reply 10):
On a trip that long the additional time of the extra stop and distance will not increase the overall journey time by a huge percentage.

But sticking BCN in the middle of the route between DXB and GRU will add at least 3 hours (maybe even more) to the itinerary which is almost 1000nm longer than a nonstop.

Quoting SQ773 (Reply 20):
In fact the traffic Spain - Brazil is all but low yielding. On the contrary, the tickets are not cheap at all, specially now that RG is gone

Did Air Madrid fly to Brazil?
If they did....
That means with 2 carriers gone within the last 6 months, capacity is constricting in the Spain-Brazil axis rather than being awash in too many seats.

If Emirates needs a stop on the way to Brazil from the U.A.E., too bad they couldn't have chosen BEY...I know the joint isn't so great right now, but I know more than a few folks on the other end down south that might have found the service valuable.
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