jetjeanes
Posts: 897
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 6:42 am

Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:08 pm

Ok Lets look at some things here... Castro is obvious on his last leg and brother Rahul wants a dialog with the Us and we have agreed. Now will Cuba
be sending up a bunch of the old soviet built planes to America?? Will they meet our faa requirments or are we going to impound them and piss rahual off.. Any one have any idea what is really flying around down there Aircraft wise. Ive goggled maped the airport and there are some funky planes down there and i assume soviet built, they didnt look like they were fresh from boeing.
i can see for 80 miles
 
whappeh
Posts: 1058
Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2006 4:47 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:10 pm

Its unlikely I think, but would be awesome to go out to spot at MCO and see old Soviet Tupelovs and Yaks coming in to land.
-Travel now, journey infinitely.
 
jetjeanes
Posts: 897
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 6:42 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:20 pm

Yeah i just really would be concerned a 57 chevy with 2 cessna engines comeing in again as a flying boat with 20 passengers in the back seats
i can see for 80 miles
 
Vref5
Posts: 187
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:55 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:55 pm

Cubana's passenger aircraft fleet are mostly Russian planes -- Antonovs, Tupolevs, Yakovlevs, and Ilyushins along with one ATR-42. Nothing surprising.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubana_de_Aviaci%C3%B3n#Passenger_Fleet

Their cargo operation also reportedly has a leased Boeing 727-200F with a Tu-204 freighter on order.
 
RiddlePilot215
Posts: 280
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2003 2:19 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:10 pm

I do want to hear the sound of a TU-154 taking off... From what some of our Euro friends say...the sound is quite orgasmic...if not just downright loud...to say the least...

 cloudnine 
God is good, all the time. All the time, God is good.
 
Gemuser
Posts: 4348
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:07 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:15 pm

Quoting JetJeanes (Thread starter):
Now will Cuba
be sending up a bunch of the old soviet built planes to America?? Will they meet our faa requirments or are we going to impound them and piss rahual off..

Cuba is a member of ICAO and assuming the aircraft meet CUBAN standards and all the other details such as traffic rights, diplomatic clearance, etc are met why would there be a problem???

Gemuser
DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
 
broke
Posts: 1299
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 8:04 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:32 am

Before President Reagon put a stop to the practice, Cubana IL-62's used to fly into Miami regularly on charters taking expatriate Cubans back for a visit.
During one visit, a Cuban working for the Marriott aircraft servicing company rammed a Cubana IL-62 with his servicing truck. Depending on the level of your political fervor; it was either very funny or the individual is a great Cuban patriot.
 
RedChili
Posts: 1440
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2005 9:23 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:42 am

Quoting RiddlePilot215 (Reply 4):
I do want to hear the sound of a TU-154 taking off...

You would probably like to do it, but not the UN. Today's recommended noise regulations (I believe it's called category III), which were recommended by the UN and which the USA and the EU follow, basically means that all Tu-134s and older Tu-154s cannot land in the USA or the EU.

The only Russian passenger planes which are allowed are the Il-96, Tu-204, Tu-214, and newer versions of the Tu-154.
Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
 
AAtakeMeAway
Posts: 260
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 8:59 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:52 am

I saw a Cubana plane at the Key West airport a few months ago. What's up with that?
 
Gemuser
Posts: 4348
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:07 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:21 am

Quoting RedChili (Reply 7):
You would probably like to do it, but not the UN. Today's recommended noise regulations (I believe it's called category III), which were recommended by the UN and which the USA and the EU follow, basically means that all Tu-134s and older Tu-154s cannot land in the USA or the EU.

The only Russian passenger planes which are allowed are the Il-96, Tu-204, Tu-214, and newer versions of the Tu-154.

Sorta true. It is ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organisation) that set most (if not all) ICA (International Civil Aviation) standards. While today it is *administratively* a UN body is not a body formed under the UN Charter, but rather under its own international treaty, the "Chicargo Convention" which means a contry can be a member of ICAO and not a member the UN and vice versa.

The noise limits you refer to are "chapter 3", caterory III relates to weather conditions for take off and landings.

Gemuser
DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
 
User avatar
yowza
Posts: 4281
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 7:01 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:36 am

This is how I see this playing out

1) Castro pops
2) Raul takes over
3) Raul stumbles and the US pounce
4) US and Cuba kiss and make up (IL96 to JFK with dignitaries)
5) Lots of reunification flights (maybe Elian will come back  Wink ) on Russian metal
6) US makes the new government in Cuba an offer it can't refuse on some of Washington States finest metal. Not to be outdone the EU pounce and throw in a couple A330s for the hop across to BCN and MAD.
7) US carriers flood Cuba. Cubana becomes the Alitalia of the Americas.
8) Cuban entrepreneurs head for the US deserts and start buying up older metal. Next thing you know you will have double dailys HAV-JFK on AeroRevolucion - Cuba's Che Guevarra themed airline and hourly shuttles to MIA on Aero Libertad.

Capitalism at work.

YOWza
 
flydreamliner
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:05 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 7:46 am

Quoting YOWza (Reply 10):
1) Castro pops
2) Raul takes over
3) Raul stumbles and the US pounce
4) US and Cuba kiss and make up (IL96 to JFK with dignitaries)
5) Lots of reunification flights (maybe Elian will come back Wink ) on Russian metal
6) US makes the new government in Cuba an offer it can't refuse on some of Washington States finest metal. Not to be outdone the EU pounce and throw in a couple A330s for the hop across to BCN and MAD.
7) US carriers flood Cuba. Cubana becomes the Alitalia of the Americas.
8) Cuban entrepreneurs head for the US deserts and start buying up older metal. Next thing you know you will have double dailys HAV-JFK on AeroRevolucion - Cuba's Che Guevarra themed airline and hourly shuttles to MIA on Aero Libertad.

Capitalism at work.

Optimistic. My guess is that the current cuban regime may soften up a bit post Castro, i doubt it's going anywhere in a hurry. If the US gets a president a little lost hostile towards cuba than the current administration, we may see things ease enough as to allow trade to reopen and flights to start up again. I'd love to get to fly on an IL96.

And if anyone was going to sell cuba jets at a loss to play politics, it would more than likely be washington and not europe. The US has much more interest in Cuba than the europeans.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
 
Curmudgeon
Posts: 682
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 7:19 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:09 am

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 5):
Cuba is a member of ICAO and assuming the aircraft meet CUBAN standards and all the other details such as traffic rights, diplomatic clearance, etc are met why would there be a problem???

Because of the nature of the airplanes, Gemuser. There are many states that are banned from European skies, for example, based on their poor regulatory oversight of their aviation activities, and their poorly maintained fleet.

I don't know how things are now, but I used to to fly down there a bit in the 80's. Their airplanes looked pretty dilapidated back then...visible hydraulic and oil leaks running down nacelles and the like. I saw an AN-10 that had some cockpit windows patched with aluminium. Cuba is a poor country, and everything about the place illustrates that, including their civil fleet. The few military aircraft that I saw (Hips and Hinds, mostly) looked worse.
Jets are for kids
 
DeltaGuy
Posts: 3965
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2001 5:25 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:19 am

Quoting RedChili (Reply 7):
You would probably like to do it, but not the UN. Today's recommended noise regulations (I believe it's called category III), which were recommended by the UN and which the USA and the EU follow, basically means that all Tu-134s and older Tu-154s cannot land in the USA or the EU.

The UN can go fornicate themselves with an iron stick.

Noone should be standing in the way of quality jet noise  Smile

DeltaGuy
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
cardiffairtaxi
Posts: 298
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:08 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 8:30 am

After going on vacation to Cuba,it was great lying by the pool,and watching An-2's doing pleasure flights.Maybe a quick hop over to Miami on one of these beauties?
 
Vref5
Posts: 187
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 2:55 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:05 am

Quoting Curmudgeon (Reply 12):
Because of the nature of the airplanes, Gemuser. There are many states that are banned from European skies, for example, based on their poor regulatory oversight of their aviation activities, and their poorly maintained fleet.

Yeah, but I should point out that various Cuban airlines flies to these places in Europe:

Barcelona
Berlin
Brussels
Copenhagen
Frankfurt
Geneva
Las Palmas
Lisbon
London
Madrid
Manchester
Moscow
Paris
Rome
Santiago de Compostela
Istanbul
Vitoria

And in North America: Toronto, Montreal, Mexico City. And in other places (Central America, South America, etc.)

The only reason why I wanted to point this out is because many of the same places in Europe has fairly strict noise regulations as well as operator safety and maintenance regulations, but yet they still allow Cuban airlines to fly there.

Thus, the implication being that the Cubans apparently has at least some aircraft capable of meeting the Stage III (etc) noise regulations and in sufficient good standing for operating approval.

Might it be possible the Cubans had retrofitted their planes to comply with the noise regs? Not sure if the Russian aircrafts had hush-kits available like the older American aircrafts do.

Considering the Europeans are especially sensitive about noise pollution, I find it hard to imagine they would have had accepted non-compliant aircrafts after the legal deadline had passed.
 
tu154
Posts: 334
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 1:37 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:07 am

Quoting YOWza (Reply 10):
This is how I see this playing out

1) Castro pops
2) Raul takes over
3) Raul stumbles and the US pounce
4) US and Cuba kiss and make up (IL96 to JFK with dignitaries)
5) Lots of reunification flights (maybe Elian will come back ) on Russian metal
6) US makes the new government in Cuba an offer it can't refuse on some of Washington States finest metal. Not to be outdone the EU pounce and throw in a couple A330s for the hop across to BCN and MAD.
7) US carriers flood Cuba. Cubana becomes the Alitalia of the Americas.
8) Cuban entrepreneurs head for the US deserts and start buying up older metal. Next thing you know you will have double dailys HAV-JFK on AeroRevolucion - Cuba's Che Guevarra themed airline and hourly shuttles to MIA on Aero Libertad.

Miami will empty out, be cleaned up, trees planted and be english speaking again.
FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
 
User avatar
Buyantukhaa
Posts: 2290
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 5:33 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:23 am

Quoting RedChili (Reply 7):
The only Russian passenger planes which are allowed are the Il-96, Tu-204, Tu-214, and newer versions of the Tu-154.

And the Il-62 apparently, I saw it in LIS last year, and in the beginning of this year as well.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 10):
Cubana becomes the Alitalia of the Americas

That would require changing the Cuban law to allow strikes  duck 
I scratch my head, therefore I am.
 
jetjeanes
Posts: 897
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 6:42 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:32 am

The only possible drawback to all this could be chavez of venezuela throwing a wrench in this.
i can see for 80 miles
 
User avatar
csturdiv
Posts: 1623
Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:33 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:33 am

Quoting Vref5 (Reply 3):
Cubana's passenger aircraft fleet are mostly Russian planes -- Antonovs, Tupolevs, Yakovlevs, and Ilyushins along with one ATR-42. Nothing surprising.

Do they not still lease the A320s from TACA?
An American expat from the ORD area living and working in SYD
 
OB1504
Posts: 3019
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:10 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:07 am

Quoting AAtakeMeAway (Reply 8):
I saw a Cubana plane at the Key West airport a few months ago. What's up with that?

It was hijacked in 2003 and flown to Key West along with a DC-3.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Europix - AirTeamImages

 
albird87
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:15 am

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:33 am

Well when this all happens it looks like all the tourism of the carribean will go there- being soo close to it i think we will se a big difference in tourism!! Also watch out for all american carriers to begin flights there ASAP. Lets see:
AA- JFK and MIA (probs be eagle as well) maybe DFW for the west coast.
CO- EWR and IAH
UA- ORD and IAD
DL- ATL
NW- DET or MSP
also expect B6 and Spirit flying in there for the LCCs.

Looking at havana international on the google earth and looks like they have 3 Il-62s one Il-96 (a couple more on order) an AN-124 (possible cargo charter) and some Yak 40s plus some Tu-134s also 3 or 4 An-26s. Also there is a DC-10 and an MD-80 there. Any ideas on how these got there??
 
Gemuser
Posts: 4348
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:07 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:08 pm

Quoting Curmudgeon (Reply 12):
Because of the nature of the airplanes, Gemuser. There are many states that are banned from European skies, for example, based on their poor regulatory oversight of their aviation activities, and their poorly maintained fleet

There are "some" states that other states have banned airlines from their sky because of "poor regulatory oversight of their aviation activities" true. Cuba is not one of them. Cubana fly to the EU & Canada, why would you assume they are in the banned or potential banned catergory?

Gemuser
DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
 
fvtu134
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 1:11 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:16 pm

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 13):
The UN can go fornicate themselves with an iron stick.

Noone should be standing in the way of quality jet noise

haleluja ! Now that's a statement I can stand by. Smile
who decided that a Horizon should be HORIZONtal???
 
User avatar
zippyjet
Posts: 5089
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 3:32 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:23 pm



You'll see them tooling around the funky Florida skies if they can easily accomodate = sized wheelchairs, and aisle chairs, iron lungs for flights to SRQ, RSW.

The New Yorker, Barrons, Wall Street Journal and other snob appeal literature
for flights in and out of PBI.

If they can deck out the seats in Dolce and Gabana for MIA.
Abundant barf bags for MCO the kids and their mullet head parents, and for DAY for the spring break youth who get drunk fornicate and puke their way to having multiple litters of rugrats who then graduate to flying to MCO.

Talk about some beaucoup spotting opportunities!
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
SB
Posts: 152
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:29 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 4:39 pm

The Cubana flight to YUL is operated in with an A320 which is leased from TACA. Same goes for YYZ.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Vince Amato



In 2001/2002 we got a DC10 leased from AirLib and IL-62.

S.
"Confirm leave the hold and maintain 320kts?!"
 
RAFVC10
Posts: 1344
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2005 9:48 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:07 pm

Quoting Vref5 (Reply 15):
Yeah, but I should point out that various Cuban airlines flies to these places in Europe:

Barcelona
Berlin
Brussels
Copenhagen
Frankfurt
Geneva
Las Palmas
Lisbon
London
Madrid
Manchester
Moscow
Paris
Rome
Santiago de Compostela
Istanbul
Vitoria

Hi Vref5,

CU used to fly to Barcelona with D10 equipment wet-leased from the french airline and from JAT;

Vitoria sees so often Cuban planes but only operating as cargo. Many of the paper money of many countries is from a Basque company specialized in design and make it. Many, many years ago (I'm speaking of mid 90's), CU used to fly a seasonal charter with IL6; but only for summer.

Santiago de Compostela is a destination that UX, IB and CU has tried to add to the Cuba - Spain network due to the great community of Spanish people living in Havana, Santiago, Varadero, Ciego de Avila,... It's easy to see 763's (UX), 310's and 742's(A7) operating as charter flights or the regular flights from Madrid to Havana making an stop in SCQ, but not regular.

Is the same as Las Palmas. We can say that is the last scheduled city in Spain having a weekly flight operated with IL6 equipment. So nice and fascinating to fly with this aircraft. But now, only as seasonal summer flights.

Actually, Cubana de Aviacion only operates to:

- Madrid with 763 and 332 in codeshare with Air Europa and IL9.
- Paris with 767 wet-leased from Blue Panorama Airlines
- London with 767 wet-leased from Blue Panorama Airlines.
- Rome with 767 wet-leased from Blue Panorama Airlines.
- Milan with 767 wet-leased from Blue Panorama Airlines.
- Moscow with 763 in codeshare with Aeroflot.
El dia que los gilipollas vuelen, no podremos ver la luz del sol!
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24604
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Could We See Tupelovs All Over Florida

Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:43 pm

Quoting RAFVC10 (Reply 26):

Is the same as Las Palmas. We can say that is the last scheduled city in Spain having a weekly flight operated with IL6 equipment. So nice and fascinating to fly with this aircraft. But now, only as seasonal summer flights.

Cubana is no longer flying this route, not even seasonally, IIRC.
a.