aaden
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United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:14 am

Why does united send 777s to hawaii when no one else does this?

Also is it just me or does AA send it's oldest and most neat up aircraft to hawaii?
everyone else seems to send brand new A/c to hawaii, why does AA send it's 757s and older 767s when they are so uncomfortable?
 
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aloha73g
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:20 am

UA is and has been the largest carrier of Passengers to/from Hawai'i pretty much forever. They have 4-5 daily flights from HNL to SFO and LAX plus daily service to DEN and ORD, multiple dailies to OGG and KOA, and they have more mainland flights to LIH than any other airline. UA's presence in Hawai'i is quite large, which is why they send their domestic 772 here....they haul alot of people and need equipment which can do it.

-Aloha!
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LAXintl
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:25 am

United is the largest carrier to Hawaii, and has always been able to fill its largest aircraft to the islands. Prior to today's 777s, UAs mainstay on Hawaii routes was the DC-10 and classic B747s.

As far as other carriers and their 777s, none send them to Hawaii as all operate their 777s in premium cabin configurations and are limited by the lack of total airframes and their need for international flying. UA has a sub fleet domestically configured high-density 777s which are perfect match for the Hawaii flying.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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Stitch
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:53 am

Quoting AAden (Thread starter):
Why does united send 777s to hawaii when no one else does this?

As noted, they command a significant share of the Hawai'i market so they can justify large widebodies.

Quote:
Also is it just me or does AA send it's oldest and most neat up aircraft to Hawaii? Everyone else seems to send brand new A/c to hawaii, why does AA send it's 757s and older 767s when they are so uncomfortable?

Well AA's Hawai'i 767s are two-class birds with International Business Class which puts UA's domestic First Class seats to shame.
 
cedarjet
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:07 am

Yep, Hawaii is United territory. Think of those specially configured DC8s in the 60s, 747s in the 70s, 80s and 90s, and now it's fitting that they should operate the pride of the fleet, the 777, on much of it's Hawaiian flying.
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Boston92
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:43 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 3):
Well AA's Hawai'i 767s are two-class birds with International Business Class which puts UA's domestic First Class seats to shame.

You can say the same for UA's LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD, IAD-DEN, IAD-LAX, and others where UA takes their intl 777 with First suites, intl biz seats, on routes that AA would have an MD-80. Who is shameful now?  Smile
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bobnwa
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:50 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 5):
You can say the same for UA's LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD, IAD-DEN, IAD-LAX, and others where UA takes their intl 777 with First suites, intl biz seats, on routes that AA would have an MD-80. Who is shameful now?

The airline that is most successful financially is not the shameful one. Besides, what the h--- is a shameful airline? Does it go around with its tail drooping?
 
N231YE
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:12 am

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 2):
Prior to today's 777s, UAs mainstay on Hawaii routes was the DC-10 and classic B747s.



Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 4):
Yep, Hawaii is United territory. Think of those specially configured DC8s in the 60s, 747s in the 70s, 80s and 90s, and now it's fitting that they should operate the pride of the fleet, the 777, on much of it's Hawaiian flying.

My mom was a FA for UA back in the 1970s. Back in the day, First Class aboard the 741s was literally a "flying resort," especially for service to HNL.
 
aaflt1871
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:35 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 5):
You can say the same for UA's LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD, IAD-DEN, IAD-LAX, and others where UA takes their intl 777

That is just for repositioning of aircraft between it's hub's, it has to get from point A to point B, so of course they will sell seats on the flight. AA does the same on MIA to DFW and out to LAX, and I think there is a ORD to DFW on the 777 as well. I have been on a 777 on UA between IAD and DEN, and a 744 between IAD and ORD, don't think for a second that thing goes out full.
Where did everybody go?
 
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Stitch
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 7:21 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 5):
You can say the same for UA's LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD, IAD-DEN, IAD-LAX, and others where UA takes their intl 777 with First suites, intl biz seats, on routes that AA would have an MD-80. Who is shameful now?  Smile

I was just responding to AAden's claim that AA's Hawai'i 767s were old and uncomfortable to UA's Hawai'i' 777s, not making a general comment about either airline. I have never flown AA and pretty much exclusively fly UA, so my bias, if any, would be to the Tulip.  Smile

Now when it comes to comparing both in Economy, UA's planes are more comfortable as they have wider seats on both the 767 and 777 (18" vs. 17") plus, with Economy Plus, more legroom.
 
flydreamliner
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 7:43 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 9):
I was just responding to AAden's claim that AA's Hawai'i 767s were old and uncomfortable to UA's Hawai'i' 777s, not making a general comment about either airline. I have never flown AA and pretty much exclusively fly UA, so my bias, if any, would be to the Tulip. Smile

Now when it comes to comparing both in Economy, UA's planes are more comfortable as they have wider seats on both the 767 and 777 (18" vs. 17") plus, with Economy Plus, more legroom.

While the domestic 777s on UA are nothing to write home about, AA's 763s are a little bit beaten on, and while their int'l business class is superior to UA's domestic first, if you're back in cattle class, which most seats to hawaii are, UA is apt to give you a nicer ride.

It never ceases to amaze me how dirty and beat on some of AA's birds are... not to say the other airlines don't also have some sad metal flying around too, but honestly, I think NW's A330 service to hawaii is probably the best set up you are going to get mainland to hawaii.
"Let the world change you, and you can change the world"
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 7:47 am

I personally think that DL and CO have the best economy class to HNL. The 767-400ERs are modern and clean inside. UA's 777s also have a Signature Interior, but I am not much of a fan of the 2-5-2 seating. UA would be just as good as DL/CO if their 777s were in 3-3-3 configuration instead.
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IAD380
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 7:53 am

This morning, I flew from KOA to ORD on UA 3. On Friday December 22, I flew from ORD to HNL on UA 1. There were no empty seats on either flight. In Y class, there was not much leg room either. The 777s on UA's Hawaii flights are configured differently from its 777s on international flights and many domestic flights. Business class is not available on UA flights to Hawaii. In contrast, the 777s that UA flies internationally and on mainland routes have 3-class configurations. A flight attendant told me that UA uses a different fleet of 777s for Hawaii than on its international and mainland routes. The 777s that UA uses on its Hawaii routes seem older, and they do not have PTVs. Although the flights between ORD and Hawaii are eight or nine hours, meal service is not included in the price of a ticket for passengers who are flying Y class. A limited selection of cold, boxed meals are available for purchase at $5 each. Do AA, DL, CO, and NW provide meals to their passengers at no additional charge on flights between Hawaii and the mainland?
 
N231YE
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:13 am

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 12):
Do AA, DL, CO, and NW provide meals to their passengers at no additional charge on flights between Hawaii and the mainland?

CO...yes
NW...no (had to purchase the meals)
 
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Aaron747
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:14 am

The 777s that UA uses on its Hawaii routes seem older, and they do not have PTVs

This isn't correct unfortunately. Many of the tail numbers delivered as domestic birds for Hawaii service came after the bulk of the -222ER fleet deliveries.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
azncsa4qf744er
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:54 am

Like many have mentions UA B777-200 service to Hawaii is capacity only. It¡¦s pretty much like a B767-300 with more seats and larger engines, domestic cabin layout and design. The Domestic B777-200 UA operated on Hawaii route are configured for Domestic usage. Don¡¦t expect much on these birds. Given that UA/AA/CO offers non-stop flights into HNL from their hubs from the Far East coast its still consider domestic. Why? Must I explain? Flights from east coast to Hawaii are about 8 to 9 hrs but still domestic, so in-flight services are domestic style. BOB and two or three rounds of drinks for those of us that sit in the back Y class. However, often times UA will substitute in their XP¡¦s or XI¡¦s to Hawaii as their 200¡¦s are out of service or one of their (HNL-NRT, HNL-KIX) birds are out.

FYI, during summer months UA sent B747-400 to Hawaii from SFO/LAX. These birds are usually are for Sydney flights but they do one or two runs during the day time.
 
Australia1
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:56 am

Could these UA 777's make Australia from HNL nonstop ?

If so, then surely this is better option that UA 744 BNE/LAX ?
 
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Stitch
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:32 am

Quoting Australia1 (Reply 16):
Could these UA 777's make Australia from HNL nonstop?

The 777-222ER (XI and XP three-class) birds can, but the 777-200 (XA two-class and XC three-class) I don't believe have the legs.

Quoting Azncsa4qf744er (Reply 15):
If so, then surely this is better option that UA 744 BNE/LAX ?

There is more O&D demand LAX/SFO-SYD then LAX/SFO-HNL-SYD so the former makes more sense for UA then the latter.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 10:11 am

Quoting Australia1 (Reply 16):
Could these UA 777's make Australia from HNL nonstop ?

If so, then surely this is better option that UA 744 BNE/LAX ?

You are positively obsessed with this idea. Seriously, it won't happen.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
atlaaron
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 10:12 am

Quoting AAden (Thread starter):
Also is it just me or does AA send it's oldest and most neat up aircraft to hawaii?
everyone else seems to send brand new A/c to hawaii, why does AA send it's 757s and older 767s when they are so uncomfortable?

Can't be worse than the birds they send to SJU.
 
CroCop
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:30 am

Quoting AAden (Thread starter):
Why does united send 777s to hawaii when no one else does this?

United can fill a plane with 350 low yield passengers, thats why.

Quoting AAden (Thread starter):
Also is it just me or does AA send it's oldest and most neat up aircraft to hawaii?
everyone else seems to send brand new A/c to hawaii, why does AA send it's 757s and older 767s when they are so uncomfortable?

Are you new to aviation? or just this site?
Mirko "CroCop" Filipovic
 
mymiles2go
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:35 am

Quoting AAFLT1871 (Reply 8):
I have been on a 777 on UA between IAD and DEN, and a 744 between IAD and ORD, don't think for a second that thing goes out full.

Actually...they usually do, if they are attached to normal peak hub operations - which they are normally scheduled to do.
 
lorm
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:36 am

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 12):
This morning, I flew from KOA to ORD on UA 3. On Friday December 22, I flew from ORD to HNL on UA 1. There were no empty seats on either flight.

Absolutely gurantee you that they top the bird off with a bunch of non-revs. Most of F-class is. IMO UA 757 domestic F-class is the most comfortable and the least cramped. Then the domestic 777, and the 767 coming in a distant last.

UA 777s maximize the large volume of cargo that the islands bring in. UA was planning to use HNL as one of their United Cargo hubs, hence the large cargo handling facility on the north ramp. The huge refrigeration unit they have there is very impressive, one could easily drive a few trucks inside.
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jjeff
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:05 pm

Quoting Mymiles2go (Reply 21):
Quoting AAFLT1871 (Reply 8):
I have been on a 777 on UA between IAD and DEN, and a 744 between IAD and ORD, don't think for a second that thing goes out full.



Quoting Mymiles2go (Reply 21):
Actually...they usually do, if they are attached to normal peak hub operations - which they are normally scheduled to do.

Exactly. Have been on 744 more than a few times for ORD-LAX and IAD-LAX in the last ten years where the plane is either completely full or oversold and where willing passengers are turned away.
 
3201
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:22 pm

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 5):
You can say the same for UA's LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD, IAD-DEN, IAD-LAX, and others where UA takes their intl 777 with First suites, intl biz seats,



Quoting AAFLT1871 (Reply 8):

That's is just for repositioning of aircraft between it's hub's, it has to get from point A to point B, so of course they will sell seats on the flight.

That's not strictly true -- they need premium cabins on flights connecting to international hubs almost as much as on the international legs themselves, to offer a premium product over a larger portion of the total trip. LAX-IAD-Europe or LAX-IAD-South America for an international C or F fare is a lot more attractive if the LAX-IAD leg isn't in domestic F.
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aaflt1871
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:45 pm

Quoting Mymiles2go (Reply 21):
Actually...they usually do, if they are attached to normal peak hub operations - which they are normally scheduled to do.

The best I have seen on a 744 between IAD and ORD was about 60% load factor if that. When you have hourly service just about between the 2 hubs, it kind of makes it hard to fill up a 744 unless you are in Asia. And with DEN and the 777, it was no where near 50% any of the 7 times I flew that route.

Quoting JJeff (Reply 23):
Have been on 744 more than a few times for ORD-LAX and IAD-LAX in the last ten years where the plane is either completely full or oversold and where willing passengers are turned away.

If you would had read, you would have seen I said nothing of the IAD to LAX routing. I mentioned IAD-DEN and IAD-ORD. DC to LAX traffic will always go out near full.
Where did everybody go?
 
Australia1
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:52 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 17):
The 777-222ER (XI and XP three-class) birds can, but the 777-200 (XA two-class and XC three-class) I don't believe have the legs.

the aircraft that were used LAX/AKL/LAX before UA pulled out & codeshared with NZ ... where have they gone ?

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 18):
You are positively obsessed with this idea. Seriously, it won't happen.

no but next move won't be out of SYD, as SYD already has too much capacity, it will be BNE in 1 form or another. With current aircraft, no one can hub bust LAX or SFO unless stop at HNL.
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:09 pm

Quoting AAden (Thread starter):
everyone else seems to send brand new A/c to hawaii, why does AA send it's 757s and older 767s when they are so uncomfortable?

Hmmm...the only carriers that send "brand new" a/c to Hawaii are CO, DL (764s) and TZ (738s). How often do you fly on the mainland? Very few US carriers offer "brand new" aircraft, let alone ETOPS-configured models with the legs to not only get out to the Islands, but also do it at a profit.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 3):
Well AA's Hawai'i 767s are two-class birds with International Business Class which puts UA's domestic First Class seats to shame.

Totally irrelevant but, since you brought it up, how many pax actually pay for first class seats on Hawaii flights?! I'd be willing to bet the number is very, very low.

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 12):
The 777s on UA's Hawaii flights are configured differently from its 777s on international flights and many domestic flights

Yes - the domestic models offer only two classes and don't have the PTVs the international models tout. I don't claim to be a financial whiz but I'm guessing that UA does pretty well on these routes (all things considered) by offering a huge E+ section which appeals to semi-frequent fliers that value the legroom but aren't willing to cough up $2000 or more on a biz seat. I've found that flying to/from HNL is a usually a great way to rack up tons of FF miles. UA's longest flight to/from HNL is UA1 which takes about 9 hours flat. You tend to get a good bang for your buck (mileage accrual-wise) by spending $750 to get 9K miles roundtrip. I don't know of a single pax that flies to HNL in the hopes of having a PTV, "gourmet" meals and pimped out seats. They fly to HNL to experience Hawaii and will tolerate just about anything to escape a -10 windchill in Wausau, WI in January.

Quoting IAD380 (Reply 12):
The 777s that UA uses on its Hawaii routes seem older, and they do not have PTVs. Although the flights between ORD and Hawaii are eight or nine hours, meal service is not included in the price of a ticket for passengers who are flying Y class. A limited selection of cold, boxed meals are available for purchase at $5 each. Do AA, DL, CO, and NW provide meals to their passengers at no additional charge on flights between Hawaii and the mainland?

See above. FWIW, UA offers the usual complement of snack boxes ($5 - we go with the Right Bite option) in addition to a Trader Vic's sandwich or salad which are hit or miss (also $5). They used to offer a chicken fajita wrap that was pretty money; I'm not sure where it went but I'd gladly buy it again.

Quoting Azncsa4qf744er (Reply 15):
However, often times UA will substitute in their XP¡¦s or XI¡¦s to Hawaii as their 200¡¦s are out of service or one of their (HNL-NRT, HNL-KIX) birds are out.

I've only seen this happen once in nearly two dozen trips to/from HNL and the US mainland (namely SFO and ORD).

Quoting Australia1 (Reply 26):
the aircraft that were used LAX/AKL/LAX before UA pulled out & codeshared with NZ ... where have they gone ?

I think some of them were sent to the graveyard and/or repainted en route to finding their way in another carrier's fleet.


777fan
DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
 
TrijetsRMissed
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 6:00 pm

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 14):
The 777s that UA uses on its Hawaii routes seem older, and they do not have PTVs

This isn't correct unfortunately. Many of the tail numbers delivered as domestic birds for Hawaii service came after the bulk of the -222ER fleet deliveries.

Actually the -222ER's were delivered after the -222's. So he is correct in his assumption.

http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/United%20Airlines-active-b777.htm
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Aaron747
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 7:28 pm

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 28):
Actually the -222ER's were delivered after the -222's. So he is correct in his assumption.

http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/U...7.htm

airfleets.net has many mistakes in its database. UA's 777 listing is among them. N210UA-N215UA are not -222ERs as their list would suggest and are dedicated to 2-class domestic service, particularly Hawaii.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
HAWAIIAN932
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 10:50 pm

I think HA's mainland -Hawaii service is outstanding, even in coach. You're given a choice of 2-3 meal selections at no cost. I use my miles to upgrade always when I fly LAS-HNL and the First Class service is exceptional. Some of their 763's are a bit worn but when you get a newer one they're wonderful.
 
zvezda
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:00 pm

For a few years in the 1990s, UA had 3 747-100s fitted out with 26F in the nose and about 450Y (I don't recall the exact number) and these were used for SFO/LAX-HNL. It was the only time UA found they had put too large an aircraft on the route.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:19 pm

Quoting 777fan (Reply 27):
Hmmm...the only carriers that send "brand new" a/c to Hawaii are CO, DL (764s) and TZ (738s). How often do you fly on the mainland? Very few US carriers offer "brand new" aircraft, let alone ETOPS-configured models with the legs to not only get out to the Islands, but also do it at a profit.

DL is cutting back the number of 764s they are sending out to the islands, and perhaps could eliminate that fleet type for Hawaii service entirely. Word is they are reconfiguring their remaining non-ER 763s for island service and will be ETOPs certifying them for such uses. The 764s they've found to be more of a likely revenue generator in going to Europe from ATL or JFK.
Look for DL to defend what market position it holds in going to the islands from the mainland with some additional 752s they will be adding that were once part of TWAs fleet. These will be perfect for service from SLC-KOA or SLC-OGG in addition to possible service from LAX to Maui and the "Big Island." Aside from AA, CO and HA, NW offers service to Hawaii from SEA, and AC offers service to HNL year around from YVR, and seasonally to OGG and KOA from theri Pacific gateway at YVR.
UA however has long been the market leader for service to Hawaii from the mainland ever since I can remember with wide-body service from SFO, LAX, DEN and ORD. Has UA ever offered service to Hawaii from IAD?
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zvezda
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:26 pm

Quoting 777fan (Reply 27):
Totally irrelevant but, since you brought it up, how many pax actually pay for first class seats on Hawaii flights?! I'd be willing to bet the number is very, very low.

It would be the perfect Ted destination except that the Ted fleet is not ETOPS certified.
 
UAL777UK
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:27 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 11):
UA would be just as good as DL/CO if their 777s were in 3-3-3 configuration instead.

Whilst I accept the middle seat in the 5 at the rear is not the most pleasant, having flown BA on numerous occasions in Y, who offer a 3-3-3 config, you try getting out from a window seat whan the three seats in front of you are reclined on a red eye.......without actually stamping on the passengers sitting in your row its at best very, very difficult!!..........For that reason, I prefer the 2-5-2 config.
 
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Stitch
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:41 am

Quoting Australia1 (Reply 26):
the aircraft that were used LAX/AKL/LAX before UA pulled out & code-shared with NZ ... where have they gone ?

I am going to hazard a guess UA used 777XPs on that route. As to where they have gone, I have recently flown on them NRT-SEA and ORD-FRA.

Quoting 777fan (Reply 27):
Totally irrelevant but, since you brought it up, how many pax actually pay for first class seats on Hawaii flights?! I'd be willing to bet the number is very, very low.

I would be willing to bet that it's probably pretty decent, actually. Hawai'i is a popular honeymoon and "special" vacation destination and therefore people pony up the extra cash to fly in First Class.

I know many UA elites who prefer to buy an F ticket on AA rather then purchase a discounted Economy fare on UA and upgrade, especially since such upgrades are not a "sure thing" due to the pre-existing paid demand, which is probably well above the 3-5% that turns a "leisure" mainline destination into a TED one.

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 33):
It would be the perfect Ted destination except that the Ted fleet is not ETOPS certified.

TED uses the same mechanics and facilities that UA mainline does, so I see nothing preventing UA from launching a TED 767 or 777 except customer perceptions.
 
AADC10
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 3:15 am

I wonder if UA will continue to use 772s to HNL. Only ORD-HNL actually requires a 772 because of the distance while the others can be served by increased frequencies of 757s or 767s. The 2 cabin 772s (and perhaps some 2 cabin 767s) could be reconfigured with UA's new F and C seats then redeployed to Europe or Latin America.
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 31):
It was the only time UA found they had put too large an aircraft on the route.

I'm not so sure about that; I used to fly the ORD-HNL route quite frequently when I was a kid and can't remember there ever being an empty seat. I suppose it depends on the time of the year.

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 33):
It would be the perfect Ted destination except that the Ted fleet is not ETOPS certified.

Yeah, it probably would. I wouldn't put it past UA to certify at least some; other airlines are in the process of ETOPSing their A320s, are they not?

Quoting Stitch (Reply 35):
I would be willing to bet that it's probably pretty decent, actually. Hawai'i is a popular honeymoon and "special" vacation destination and therefore people pony up the extra cash to fly in First Class.

Yes, but a large number of them are FFs that will use their miles to either procure an F ticket outright, or use miles to upgrade. Ever try upgrading on a HNL-ORD flight?! It's impossible at both the Saver and Standard upgrade level. There's no doubt that a number of flyers purchase the ticket but, take one stroll through a F class cabin on those flights and you'll see that the majority of the pax are seasoned flyers that travel (many to Hawaii) regularly.

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 36):
Only ORD-HNL actually requires a 772 because of the distance while the others can be served by increased frequencies of 757s or 767s

Hmmm...how do you explain AA's 763 service between ORD and HNL?!  scratchchin 


777fan
DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
 
LAXintl
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 4:44 am

Quoting 777fan (Reply 37):
how do you explain AA's 763 service between ORD and HNL?!

Not all 763s are created equal. The UA 2-class domestic 763s are lower gross weight variants than the AA international configured 763 which are full ER versions.

UA could indeed use 763s between ORD and Hawaii however it would have to be its own 3 class international ER aircraft, which from a marketing point of view is clearly the wrong aircraft for the route.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
zvezda
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 5:06 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 35):
Hawai'i is a popular honeymoon and "special" vacation destination and therefore people pony up the extra cash to fly in First Class.

Very, very rarely. Nearly everyone in First going to Hawaii is either upgraded, on an award ticket, or an employee. Paid F to Hawaii is almost as rare as being invited to the lav by a hot stewardess.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 35):
TED uses the same mechanics and facilities that UA mainline does, so I see nothing preventing UA from launching a TED 767 or 777 except customer perceptions.

The Ted fleet is only A320s. UA could certify them for ETOPS, but it would cost money.
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 5:16 am

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 38):
Not all 763s are created equal. The UA 2-class domestic 763s are lower gross weight variants than the AA international configured 763 which are full ER versions.

Yes, this is true. I was responding to the earlier post that was ambiguous to the point of suggesting that 763s in general weren't capable of making the HNL-ORD trek.

FWIW, UA is wise to post a 777 on HNL-ORD; it's almost always packed to the gills (capacity is significantly higher than a 763) and can hold a butt-load of cargo. Oh yeah, 777s also kick ass (shameless plug).


777fan
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aaden
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 9:00 am

Quoting CroCop (Reply 20):
Are you new to aviation? or just this site?

why do you assume this

Quoting 777fan (Reply 27):
How often do you fly on the mainland? Very few US carriers offer "brand new" aircraft, let alone ETOPS-configured models with the legs to not only get out to the Islands, but also do it at a profit.

about three times a year to hawaii, It just seems like AA is a step behind.
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Tue Jan 02, 2007 10:00 am

Quoting AAden (Reply 41):
about three times a year to hawaii, It just seems like AA is a step behind.

AA is right in line with the other US majors. What you experience on AA may not necessarily be a problem that is specific to aircraft that fly to/from HNL, but rather symptomatic of their fleet as a whole. With the exception of their 738s and 777s, AA's fleet (IMO) appears to be tired in regard to its appearance. Then again, I don't fly AA very often and am limited to what I see and what others here and elsewhere tell me.


777fan
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aaden
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Wed Jan 03, 2007 5:31 am

Quoting 777fan (Reply 42):
AA is right in line with the other US majors. What you experience on AA may not necessarily be a problem that is specific to aircraft that fly to/from HNL, but rather symptomatic of their fleet as a whole. With the exception of their 738s and 777s, AA's fleet (IMO) appears to be tired in regard to its appearance. Then again, I don't fly AA very often and am limited to what I see and what others here and elsewhere tell me.

I fly AA a whole lot not just to hawaii, it seems like they just take a step down on the service level when going to hawaii.
 
DTWAGENT
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:34 am

UA is the only airline that does not charge for food on the ORD/HNL flights or from it DEN/HNL flights. AA and I believe DL charge Y pass. for food. I think that is so dumb. At the prices we pay in DTW to get to HNL is more the going over to Europe.

Chuck
 
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aloha73g
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:00 pm

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 44):
UA is the only airline that does not charge for food on the ORD/HNL flights or from it DEN/HNL flights. AA and I believe DL charge Y pass. for food. I think that is so dumb. At the prices we pay in DTW to get to HNL is more the going over to Europe.

Chuck

Last I heard DL offered complimentary meals (sandwiches on my HNL-SFO last year) on its HNL flights.

to quote www.Delta.com:
"Complimentary meal service is offered on select Alaska and Hawaii flights based on flight times and on international flights approximately five hours and longer."

Also, HA (choice of 2 hot entrees/1 cold sandwich)and AQ (cheeseburgers/sandwiches) offer meals on all Hawai'i-West Coast flights.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Wed Jan 03, 2007 5:01 pm

And as far as I can remember, I've paid for meals (not just snackboxes) on UA flights between HNL and ORD. The food on both AQ is supposed to be good but that's tempered by - GULP - having to fly a 737NG (don't get mad!). HA's meal service is supposed to be tasty but they - DOH - aren't a *A partner. Please, please jump to *A, Hawaiian!!!


777fan
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planecrazy2
Posts: 573
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Wed Jan 03, 2007 5:09 pm

Quoting DTWAGENT (Reply 44):
UA is the only airline that does not charge for food on the ORD/HNL flights or from it DEN/HNL flights

UA serves buy on board on these flights sadly.
United Airlines - Worldwide Service
 
777fan
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RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Thu Jan 04, 2007 3:01 am

Quoting Planecrazy2 (Reply 47):
UA serves buy on board on these flights sadly.

There's no reason to feel sad about it! The fact that you have to buy on board isn't bad (especially if you're flying on a HNL-ORD roundtrip for $549), it's just that the quality of the food isn't great. As mentioned earlier, I think UA could do a lot better than the Trader Vic's crap sandwich for $5. The Oriental Chicken Salad for $5 is prety decent, tho...is it a coincidence that it's not made by Trader Vic's?!


777fan
DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
 
ChicagoFlyer
Posts: 209
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 9:00 am

RE: United 777 Service To Hawaii

Thu Jan 04, 2007 9:12 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 39):
Quoting Stitch (Reply 35):
Hawai'i is a popular honeymoon and "special" vacation destination and therefore people pony up the extra cash to fly in First Class.

Very, very rarely. Nearly everyone in First going to Hawaii is either upgraded, on an award ticket, or an employee. Paid F to Hawaii is almost as rare as being invited to the lav by a hot stewardess.

I would agree--actually I'd say that First class does not have that high a % of employees. Hawaii flying is where the elites burn their miles on a family vacation, and even if they don't purchase economy they still get the upgrades. But definitely, if people "pony up" anything, it's much more likely to be the miles rather than the cash.

I also heard that it is relatively easy to get a capacity-controlled award ticket to Hawaii. Does UA actually offer a higher % of seats to the islands than to, say, international destinations (to keep its FF customers happy)?

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