MAH4546
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AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:40 pm

Heard a rumour from a respectable source that Aerolineas Argentinas is strongly considering Miami-Sao Paulo non-stops in summer 2007. The flights would operate as a daylight, MIA-GRU-EZE. Aerolineas Argentinas would like to increase utilization of their planes that are otherwise parked at MIA all day, and with the still limited capacity on Miami-Sao Paulo with Varig still not back, it seems like a good solution, even though Varig will likely be back by the time it get started. I do not how the Brazil-Argentina works with regards to allowing 5th freedom, but I do know that Brazil-USA allows 5th freedom carriers, such as JAL (JFK-GRU) and LAB (MIA-MAO; although currently not operating).

Offering a daylight will also be a good way of keeping up with the compieition. LAN Argentina will begin a daylight flight between Miami and Buenos Aires, via Punta Cana, next week, and American Airlines is considering a daylight flight to Buenos Aires via Asuncion.
a.
 
B752OS
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:42 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
Offering a daylight will also be a good way of keeping up with the compieition. LAN Argentina will begin a daylight flight between Miami and Buenos Aires, via Punta Cana, next week, and American Airlines is considering a daylight flight to Buenos Aires via Asuncion.

Is Asuncion year round out of MIA? Is the reason why they add the EZE tag on to help yields on the route?
 
MAH4546
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:49 pm

Quoting B752OS (Reply 1):

Is Asuncion year round out of MIA? Is the reason why they add the EZE tag on to help yields on the route?

It was year-round and tagged onto Sao Paulo. Yields are fine, but there is very little traffic between the US and Paraguay, so loads aren't. American Airlines has suspended service to Asuncion because Paraguay has imposed a mandatated travel agent commission. American Airlines has promised to resume service to Asuncion, non-stop from Miami, if the commission is lifted. Paraguay is strongly considering it.
a.
 
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Coal
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 3:17 pm

Out of curiosity, what are the fares like on JL on the JFK-GRU route compared to other carriers?

Cheers,
Coal
Nxt Flts: MI RGN-SIN | SQ SIN-RGN-SIN | CX SIN-HKG-PVG | SQ PVG-SIN
 
argento
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 9:58 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
I do not how the Brazil-Argentina works with regards to allowing 5th freedom, but I do know that Brazil-USA allows 5th freedom carriers, such as JAL (JFK-GRU) and LAB (MIA-MAO; although currently not operating).

AR has 5th freedom on Brazil-USA & Brazil-Europe(MAD & FCO).
During the 80s & 90s AR use it ,flying from EZE to MIA via GRU with 742 and EZE-FCO & MAD via GRU with 742.
For some period AR used the stop in GRU as a mini hub for connect flights to & from Europe to Cordoba .
 
Brasuca
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Tue Jan 02, 2007 10:57 pm

They're more than welcome!
Fares to MIA are absurdly expensive!
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
LipeGIG
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:37 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
Heard a rumour from a respectable source that Aerolineas Argentinas is strongly considering Miami-Sao Paulo non-stops in summer 2007. The flights would operate as a daylight, MIA-GRU-EZE

AR Brazil comment the same, some weeks ago, that their plans it's to fly some routes from EZE to MAD and MIA, thru GRU and in the future GIG. I have doubt about so much demand for another daylight flight as AA just changed their daylight in favor of a overnight flight. And we have very soon RG back to the competition probably with a daylight in the near future also.

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
I do not how the Brazil-Argentina works with regards to allowing 5th freedom, but I do know that Brazil-USA allows 5th freedom carriers, such as JAL (JFK-GRU) and LAB (MIA-MAO; although currently not operating).

Yes Mark, it's possible for Pluna, Aerolineas, Lan Argentina & Lan Chile to run flights with stops in Brazil to the US, the question is that, they just need to obtain the necessary slots at GRU.

Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
PavlovsDog
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:13 am

This this 5th freedom apply to all Brasilian airports or is it restricted by US-Brasil bilateral? I imagine there is sizeable demand from the large number of secondary markets.
 
LipeGIG
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:16 am

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 7):
This this 5th freedom apply to all Brasilian airports or is it restricted by US-Brasil bilateral? I imagine there is sizeable demand from the large number of secondary markets.

Not all airports, i have to take a look on the bilateral, but for sure it allows GRU, GIG, CNF, POA, SSA, REC and FOR.

Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
PavlovsDog
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:21 am

Thanks. I guess a Buenos Aires-Brasilia-Miami/Washington/New York flight is out of the question?
 
asuflyer
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:46 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):

It was year-round and tagged onto Sao Paulo. Yields are fine, but there is very little traffic between the US and Paraguay, so loads aren't. American Airlines has suspended service to Asuncion because Paraguay has imposed a mandatated travel agent commission. American Airlines has promised to resume service to Asuncion, non-stop from Miami, if the commission is lifted. Paraguay is strongly considering it.

This flight was carrying mostly cargo. It was never full. It's terrible here we only get TAM, GOL and Aerosur.
 
MAH4546
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 8):
Not all airports, i have to take a look on the bilateral, but for sure it allows GRU, GIG, CNF, POA, SSA, REC and FOR.

And Manaus.

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 9):
Thanks. I guess a Buenos Aires-Brasilia-Miami/Washington/New York flight is out of the question?

Well, any IAD/JFK-BSB flight is entirely out of the question. I think you will see someone - TAM or American - flying MIA-BSB sooner than later.

Quoting Asuflyer (Reply 10):

This flight was carrying mostly cargo. It was never full. It's terrible here we only get TAM, GOL and Aerosur.

Yup, cargo supported it. Decent yields, but not enough passengers. None the less, AA thinks a 757 will be better for it if they go a second time around.
a.
 
2travel2know
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 6:29 am

If I was Argentinian, I would be quite upset that AR chooses to fly MIA-GRU-EZE not to keep its aircraft in MIA, instead of a MIA-TUC-EZE or MIA-COR-EZE.
As for a Brazilian stop, sure GRU can provide good loads, but IMHO cities like POA and CWB are crying for non-stop MIA service.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
A388
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:34 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 12):
If I was Argentinian, I would be quite upset that AR chooses to fly MIA-GRU-EZE not to keep its aircraft in MIA, instead of a MIA-TUC-EZE or MIA-COR-EZE.

If MIA-GRU is (much) more profitable or if it has more potential than why not serve the route if AR can fly the route? Will MIA-TUC and/or MIA-COR be as lucrative as MIA-GRU? Even though I understand your opinion at the same time I can imagine AR choses for MIA-GRU as this route would have more potential because of bigger traffic volumes between the two cities. Especially if fares are very high on this route, the route becomes even more attractive if you can offer lower fares than the competition to gain marketshare in the early stages.

A388
 
Arcano
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RE: AR To Fly MIA-GRU?

Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:32 am

What a/c would be used? Are the 310s able to performe?

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
LAN Argentina will begin a daylight flight between Miami and Buenos Aires, via Punta Cana, next week, and American Airlines is considering a daylight flight to Buenos Aires via Asuncion.

The forth international destination for Lan Argentina, right? (SCL-GRU and MIA). I read yesterday that for domestic flights they became all 320 as in Peru. Impressive, considering that the good Chileans still fly 732s...
in order: 721,146,732,763,722,343,733,320,772,319,752,321,88,83,744,332,100,738, 333, 318, 77W, 78, 773, 380, 73G, 788, 789, 346